Posted on 09/22/2022 9:53:45 PM PDT by Antoninus
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I wish I had not read it.
I’d forgotten just how barbaric such tribes were back then.
But then, human being still are quite capable of treating each other in horrible ways.
The difference tween these Indians back then and MS13 gang members today, stemming from Guatamala, and now in parts of the USA, is that the MS13 gang members tend to hide from the law. The Indians of that place and of that time had nothing to flee from except the occassional Colonist, who carried weapons not known to these Indians.
I have heard of the barbarity of many Native American tribes.
So much for the peaceful, happy savages myth.
Man without God, in the hands of Satan are neither peaceful not happy, no matter what the race or nationality.
Gruesome and cruel indeed
Thank you for sharing
True words
It got better for them after the pale faces showed u? Overwhelmingly the Indian tribes were destroyed by the blessings of civilization and what was called Christianity. The first physically destroyed the Indian tribes the latter destroyed the Indians psychologically. We pale faces can enjoy the fruits of our victory without a lot of sanctimonious psalm singing and self congratulation on our great virtuousness.
Europeans were just as brutal. A lot better at toning down descriptions of their brutality though, since there weren’t outside observers recording the atrocities, but only fellow Europeans:
Esch, Voes, and Thorn, still held in custody, were questioned again by the ecclesiastical inquisition court, but they refused to recant. They were then handed over to the secular court and sentenced to death. They were taken to Brussels and held until the appointed day of execution on 1523 July 1. New attempts were made meanwhile to get them to renounce. Voes was brought first to the inquisitors, but he refused to recant. Esch also refused to renounce Lutheranism. Thorn asked for an additional four-day period to study the scriptures with respect to his views, and thus he was not executed then with Esch and Voes. Esch and Voes were summarily delivered to the executioner, brought to the marketplace in Brussels, and burned alive.
Stories such as this one is why I am an adamant supporter of the 2nd amendment. The invention of gun power and the rifled barrel created a weapon that allows the individual to have the ability to repel the mob.
What an amazing story. The Indian Pierre was given great strength and comfort by his faith and became a great witness for Christianity to his fellow prisoner and to his enemy.
We are not superior to these depraved, ignorant savages who knew nothing but evil. Our society participants in the brutal killing of thousands of innocent children every day despite having knowledge of Christianity and Western Civilization. Our society knows good and evil but still chooses evil.
Even in modern times. Socialism is a modern European religion that takes brutality to an industrial scale, killing by the millions and tens of millions.
In the late 1660s the Iroquois village of Oneida--still pagan at the time--had become an absolute mess. Drunkenness, violence. Torture of captives not unlike the scene narrated above. Even measured by pagan morals, they clearly had fallen from the noble example of their ancestors.
A few Oneidas converted and founded a new Iroquois village near Montreal. They basically kept their Iroquoian culture, but they also made a rule that to live it this village, you had to give up your vices and live Christian morality....and they actually expelled other Indians for not upholding it.
Long story short, this village attracted so many Iroquois over the next few years that the original Iroquois villages got jealous and complained they would be entirely depopulated.
Christianity helped save Iroquoian culture. From itself.
As Will Durant stated in the 1st volume of his "Story of Civilization," the collectivist movement sprang up when the first human tribes and families were formed.
It was a knee-jerk reaction to the meritocracy of successful hunter-gatherers.
The collectivists, just as they did in Jamestown in the early 1600's, demanded an equitable sharing of goods for those less fortunate. And they didn't just demand a share. They demanded that the entire system be constituted as a commune wherein successful individuals were subordinated to the group. In other words, a system in which there was no reward for success.
Though there are no first-hand accounts from the first tribes and families, we can safely surmise that those pushing collectivism were cut from the Bernie Sanders mold, in that though they were quite capable of working, they instead preferred to take a sizeable share of the goods set aside for the "poor."
A “simple” European burning at the stake was a walk in the park compared to how you’d be treated by an Iroquois mob out for vengeance. The latter is the stuff of nightmares...and they would actually try to keep you alive as long as possible. Also, burning at the stake came after a trial and conviction of a capital crime...it wasn’t practiced on those captured in war as it was among the Iroquois.
I am not sure why people think we are automatically favoring Europeans by bringing this stuff up. We tell the stories of the Roman martyrs in the same way, and for the same reason—to fortify ourselves against persecution. And to show what happens to *any* group of people if they let the devil have sway over their culture.
Exactly.
The book of Judges is an historical account of the following cycle: Israel is in bondage and cries out to God. God sends a Judge to deliver them by way of His power. Israel prospers and turns away from God. God turns them over to themselves. They deliver themselves back into bondage. There are variations, but the cycle is clear and instructive.
The only difference is that the Iroquois had always been turned over to themselves. God delivered them from their self imposed bondage.
I have a concern regarding your statement, "they clearly had fallen from the noble example of their ancestors." It directly implies that there was a prior time when Iroquois behavior was noble. I don't know, but I sincerely doubt it. The general history of native Americans tribes is that they treated each other with utter cruelty and barbarism. It is complete fiction to believe North America was some sort of Shangri-La before outside influence. It was Lord of the Flies on a continental level.
Regardless, the facts we know indicate that Robowombat's statement is well rooted in revisionist history. Dances with Wolves is fun to watch, but it is fiction.
Bump for later.
Your example doesn’t even compare to the cruelty of the original story. Also, there’s no evidence those inquisitors enjoyed condemning the heretics. The indians enjoyed their cruelty and made it last as long as possible.
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