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NASA's Controversial Gravity Shield Experiment Fails to Produce
space.com ^ | 10 Oct 01 | Jack Lucentini

Posted on 10/10/2001 12:45:11 PM PDT by RightWhale

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To: RightWhale
It’s worth trying again with an improved setup, said the NASA paper.

The Michelson-Morley experiment is a famous non-result. Michelson didn't believe his first non-result in 1881, and so repeated it (with a granite block table, floating in mercury) in 1887. Again, there was no difference in the measured speed of light -- which ultimately led to Einstein's work on relativity.

This current non-result is potentially interesting, too:

First is a rather striking apparent coincidence: Podkletnov’s findings appeared to match phenomena earlier predicted independently by a University of Alabama at Huntsville scientist, Ning Li. Second, many renowned physicists believe nature has an underlying unity, by which all its forces are fundamentally connected. This means electromagnetism and gravity are somehow linked. The "gravity shield" could conceivably operate at the bridge between the two forces, interacting with both.

A non-result with better equipment may show that there are difficulties with the theory; OTOH, you would be hard-pressed to complain about a positive result with better equipment.

But of course, your real problem is with NASA, and not this particular experiement.

21 posted on 10/10/2001 1:17:33 PM PDT by r9etb
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To: RightWhale
This looks silly on its face. But the work should continue. New propulsion technologies are the key to interstellar travel. In order to perform meaningful exlporation beyond our solar system, we need radical new means of propulsion. Right now, we can barely travel in space at tiny fractions of 1% of the speed of light. Roundtrips to an from the nearest stars will take many hundreds of years. At that rate, everyone on earth who would care would be dead before a mission returned. Even at the speed of light, the nearest stars are years away, let alone other galaxies.

In essence, mankind is completely stranded on Earth (or at least in our solar sytem), until we can travel at many times the speed of light, without high energy (i.e. fuel, weight) costs. This will require a completely new physics.

The cost of ths effort is currently very small. I see keep at it - if we really want to explore beyond planet Earth.

22 posted on 10/10/2001 1:19:22 PM PDT by Earl B.
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To: RightWhale
After a second round of tests, NASA researchers have failed to detect signs that a machine can weaken gravity’s pull.

(Eager-beaver rocket scientist): Sore-prize, sore-prize, sore-prize!! Sarge, I was looking through this comic book, and in it was this man, and he could leap tall buildings, and what if we made a machine that could do that, just think what it would mean, why, I could have rescued that cat that got stuck in Mrs. Appleby's tree the other day....

(Old hand): Awww, Pyle, shut up!!

23 posted on 10/10/2001 1:19:58 PM PDT by KellyAdmirer
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To: Ranger
I'm sure there is some sort of antigravity thing working to support that new Vulcan chick.

Yeah, but the technology only works on Vulcan mammary glands.

24 posted on 10/10/2001 1:20:41 PM PDT by longshadow
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To: RightWhale
A time machine would be much more useful and no more impossible.

All this money could be much better spent on invisibility lotions.

25 posted on 10/10/2001 1:20:47 PM PDT by dead
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To: RightWhale
I'm starting to believe they really didn't go to the moon.
26 posted on 10/10/2001 1:21:25 PM PDT by Prodigal Daughter
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To: Willie Green
This has already been produced by Diet Smith Industries in the private sector.

Oh sure, rain on their parade.

Pruneface.

27 posted on 10/10/2001 1:21:32 PM PDT by Octar
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To: Willie Green
No no, Smith's contraption manipulated MAGNATISM, not gravity. "The nation that controls magnetism controls the Earth" "Moon Valley" "Mile High Moon antenna"
28 posted on 10/10/2001 1:22:27 PM PDT by DManA
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To: RightWhale
Shades of Lysenko ...
29 posted on 10/10/2001 1:30:55 PM PDT by Junior
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To: Aric2000
And $600,000,000 is not much, when you consider the total budget...

It's $600,000, but what's a few decimal points amongst friends?

My quarrel with NASA is that it is a bastard offspring disowned by the White House, Congress, and the Pentagon, and is trying to make its way in a hostile world relying on the generosity of strangers. At first it was the champion coming out of nowhere to put men in space and land on the moon. But then it was realized that NASA was not entitled to the inheritance, and it is permanently down on skid row doing antigravity experiments. Better to put it out of its misery.

30 posted on 10/10/2001 1:35:17 PM PDT by RightWhale
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To: Gordian Blade
N-Rays

Mon Dieu, even the French haven't fallen for this antigravity chimera.

31 posted on 10/10/2001 1:39:00 PM PDT by RightWhale
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To: DManA
No no, Smith's contraption manipulated MAGNATISM, not gravity.

From the article:

"He claimed to have measured a weakening of Earth’s gravity by 2 percent near a specialized superconductor spinning in a magnetic field."

32 posted on 10/10/2001 1:39:09 PM PDT by Willie Green
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To: longshadow
I understand that in the politically correct Afro-centric studies programs, they teach that the ancient Egyptians knew how to fly, and they built the pyramids with anti-gravity machines. If they could do it, so can we. Let the research continue!

I myself tried to defy the law of gravity the other day, using a bananna-peal device. Alas, just as I had slipped the bonds of gravity, I fell on my tush. But this negative result will not discourage me.

33 posted on 10/10/2001 1:41:20 PM PDT by PatrickHenry
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
I have two science degrees (not bragging), and zero point energy and hyperdimentional physics is utterly facinating. The potential of this fiels of research is great.

Remember scientists throughout history have been laughed at, imprisoned, and killed for their beliefs/research. At one time, everyone thought the world was flat.

34 posted on 10/10/2001 1:42:02 PM PDT by jbstrick
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To: r9etb
This current non-result is potentially interesting, too:

Graham Bell, sponsor of Michelson, was interested in testing the new Maxwell equations. The non-result forced a modification. But this case is different in that there is no Maxwell putting forth a new set of equations. This is a stab in the dark.

35 posted on 10/10/2001 1:46:31 PM PDT by RightWhale
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To: general_re
Gravity is actually very well understood, at least until you get down to time/distance scales and energy levels not seen in the universe since the first microsecond of the Big Bang, or perhaps at the centers of black holes. Unlike the electromagnetic force, which has positive and negative charges so there is a possibility of shielding one sign of charge with the other, gravity is caused by mass-energy density which is always positive, according to Einstein's theory. So by everything we know as it applies to ordinary matter, including superconductors, gravity can't be shielded. Einstein's theory of gravity has passed every test so far, at least as it applies to the ordinary objects in the NASA study.

There has been some theoretical discussion of exotic matter that has negative energy density. It's fun to play around with the possibility and construct (in imagination) things like wormholes that you could walk through to transport instantly to another place and time. However, no evidence of exotic matter actually existing has ever been found.

Gravity is the weakest force in the universe, so it is very difficult to measure directly. The only reason we feel gravity at all is that the other forces tend to cancel out at large distances (compared to the size of an atom or molecule). Small changes in gravitational force are even harder to measure.

Like Cold Fusion, the supposed gravity shield experiments depend on measurement of very small quantities in the presence of a lot of experimental error. It's easy to make a mistake and see something that isn't there because you want to see it. There are lots of examples in the history of science: N-Rays, Canals on Mars, Cold Fusion, etc. (Dare I add the Face on Mars?)

I once had a proud inventor send me a motor design that he claimed put out 100 watts of mechanical power for 99 watts of input electrical power, giving you 1 watt of power for free. It turned out he had a very efficient design so that the mechanical power output was almost (but not quite) equal to the electrical power input. His methods for calculating and measuring the respective powers were inaccurate enough so that it looked like the output power was slightly greater than the input power, but the difference was smaller than the errors in his methods.

It may seem like traditional physicists are too quick to dismiss things that don't fit their narrow worldview, but it's actually just a function of the checks and balances at work when scientists verify each other's studies. Occam's Razor applies unless definitively ruled out. As the late Carl Sagan liked to say, "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof."

36 posted on 10/10/2001 1:48:25 PM PDT by Gordian Blade
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To: jbstrick
Remember scientists throughout history have been laughed at, imprisoned, and killed for their beliefs/research.

Ain't that the truth!

37 posted on 10/10/2001 1:50:18 PM PDT by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Gordian Blade
N-rays, yes; but not cold fusion which has been confirmed by US Navy Labs and US national labs.
38 posted on 10/10/2001 1:54:30 PM PDT by Diogenesis
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To: RightWhale
Hypothesis: "...flicker in and out of existence in what we normally think of as empty space. "

Example: (from NASA brainstorming session) "Ooh, ooh, Mr. Goldin, I have an idea!"

39 posted on 10/10/2001 1:56:42 PM PDT by mrsmith
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To: imd102
are the ufo's fallin'...or goin' up?

bet they're fallin'...ain't no setch thang as "anti-gravity"

well at least they didn't waste $6 Billion like they did on the mars landers...

40 posted on 10/10/2001 1:58:07 PM PDT by hoot2
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