WWIII is coming, 'I'm sure,' high-level Sharon aide says

To: Nathan _in_Arkansas

I like the way you think. I can't believe that the ruler of a flea bitten little country like Saudi Arabia finances the destruction in NYC and DC, comes into our nation, threatens our President and our nation in our president's home, and lives to tell the tale.

61 posted on 05/02/2002 4:13:48 PM PDT by MissAmericanPie

To: Ancesthntr;BJClinton

The Electronic Intifada - Historical myths - The Arabs started all the wars: 1982

The Arabs started all the wars: 1982

Written by Arjan El Fassed. Edited by Laurie King-Irani.

Myth

Since the establishment of Israel there have been five major wars between Arabs and the Israelis. These wars occured in 1948, 1956, 1967, 1973 and 1982. Israel claims that the Arabs started all the wars. Although there has been low-intensity conflict in the intervening years and major conflagrations during the "War of Attrition" in 1969-1970 and the 1978 invasion of Lebanon, massive civil disobedience during the Uprising of 1988, and in 2000-2001 during the Al-Aqsa Intifada, it is these five wars Israel refers to when it makes its claims, creating the impression that Israel has only acted "in self-defence".

In 1982, Israel claimed that its military objective was to attack, not Lebanon, but the Palestine Liberation Organisation (PLO) in Lebanon in order to 'safeguard the Galilee region from enemy artillery and infiltration'.

Facts

The facts are that Israel invaded Lebanon on 6 June 1982 in order to totally destroy the PLO, not only its insignificant military capability, but also all of its civilian functions. The other basic war aim was described by Israeli Minister of Defense Ariel Sharon:

"The bigger the blow and the more we damage the PLO infrastructure, the more the Arabs in Judea and Samaria, [the Biblical name for the West Bank used for obvious political reasons by Israel] and Gaza will be ready to negotiate with us"
-- The Times, 5 August 1982 --

Israel had hoped that, with the destruction of the PLO, Lebanon could be ripped from its Arab moorings in order to create an Israeli puppet regime of pro-Israeli Maronite Christian Lebanese, a minority of the population. As early as 1954, David Ben-Gurion had urged that one of the "central duties" of Israel's foreign policy should be to push the Maronite Christians to "proclaim a Christian state". Moshe Dayan had said that:

"[the] Israeli army will enter Lebanon, will occupy the neessary territory, and will create a Christian regime which will ally itself with Israel"
-- Livia Rokach, Israel's Sacred Terrorism, op.cit., pp. 24-30.
Also see, Laura Zittrain Eisenberg: My Enemy's Enemy: Zionist Intentions in Lebanon.

The Israeli claim that it had invaded Lebanon "in self-defense" is false. Between August 1981 and May 1982 the PLO maintained a truce, sponsored by the United States and Saudi Arabia, on Lebanon's southern border. Israel, on the other hand, violated the truce 2,777 times (United Nations records cited by Robin Wright in the Christian Science Monitor, 18 March 1982; Alexander Cockburn and James Ridgeway, Village Voice, 22 June 1982). [For the most thorough, as well as the most compelling treatment of Israel's invasion of Lebanon, see Robert Fisk, Pity the Nation]

Once again Israel only needed an excuse to make war. This time the casus belli was the attempted assassination of the Israeli ambassador to London, an act determined by Scotland Yard to have been conducted by the PLO-dissent Abu Nidal group. In any case, Israel's excuse was so flimsy that, for the first time in the Arab-Israeli conflict, Israeli propaganda was not taken on board without question by the international community.

At first the Israelis operated under the pretense that they were only securing their borders and stated that they did not intend to go beyond a 25 mile limit. But the truth was very different as described by the former chief of Israeli military intelligence, Aharon Yariv:

"I know in fact that going to Beirut was included in the original military plan"
-- Jerusalem Post, 24 September 1982.

Israel's invasion of Lebanon has no validity in international law. Israel thus had no grounds to rely on the provision of the Charter of the United Nations concerning self-defense, while the means used to effect the invasion clearly lacked proportionality. The cease-fire of July 1981 had been observed scrupulously. The objective of the 1982 invasion and war, therefore, was to achieve certain political and strategic aims at a high cost, which included breaches of some of the most fundamental rules of international law.

As for the Israeli justification for the conduct of hostilities, the principle of military necessity cannot excuse the massive number of civilian casualties which resulted from Israeli attacks on refugee camps, hospitals, schools, cultural, religious and charitable institutions, commercial and industrial premises, Lebanese government and PLO offices, diplomatic premises and urban areas generally.

Particularly heinous was the August 8th bombardment of Beirut by the Israeli Air Force, which some correspondents compared to the WWII bombing of Dresden in its ferocity. Hundreds of innocent Beiruti civilians died as a result of this war crime. [See Thomas Friedman, From Beirut to Jerusalem; Robert Fisk, Pity the Nation; Jean Said Makdisi, Beirut Fragments; Chris Giannou, Besieged: A Doctor in Lebanon.]

[Historical Myths]

62 posted on 05/02/2002 4:15:52 PM PDT by ThreeOfSeven

To: Nathan _in_Arkansas

As long as Powell has the command of GW's ear, you can expect that we will never strike preimptively.

63 posted on 05/02/2002 4:32:54 PM PDT by Godfollow

As long as Powell has the command of GW's ear, you can expect that we will never strike preemptively.

When you think of Powell negotiating with terrorists remember this.

64 posted on 05/02/2002 4:35:40 PM PDT by a_witness

To: Nathan _in_Arkansas

I'm in the Army, I'll fight it. I just don't want it to be like the first two World Wars. Two puny nations igniting the world. If WWIII is to happen, let us be the agressors. No more Pearl Harbors, Twin Towers, or Pentagons. Let us strike quick, silence our enemies in a matter of months, not years. Hooah!!!

Well, at least you aren't an officer....

65 posted on 05/02/2002 4:40:50 PM PDT by DAnconia55

Well, at least you aren't an officer....

That is a hell of a lot kinder than what I decided not to post.

66 posted on 05/02/2002 5:43:18 PM PDT by jo6pac

To: ThreeOfSeven;Lazamataz;dead;

MAPS!!

"... Not so. Israel started the '67 war with a surprise attack, though you can quibble about earlier hostilities. The only Arab-Israeli war clearly initiated by Arab nations was the '73 war..."

You see through a glass darkly, ThreeOfSeven, and insist that the world be viewed through 'Palestinian-Eyes'. There is NO SUCH THING as Palestine, and there never was!

When the British left the area, it was every man for himself, and devil take the hindmost! Israel was created when Israelis took, held, and defended land, against ALL the so-called Arab Nations, and formed a Nation of their own.

Israel will assimilate the West Bank and Gaza, and enforce peace in the regions by force-of-arms.

The good and decent people will stay and enjoy the fruits of Democracy and free enterprize, and the rude and violent and homicidal people will be driven out of the land, or killed!

This has been going on for Millenia, and will continue forever. If those wogs in the Middle-East were not sitting on a puddle of oil that they didn't even create, we wouldn't give a shit what happenned to a bunch of towel-headed camel-jockeys!

When I see Arafatt impaled on a sharpened post by his 'own people', then, they will have a chance at peace and prosperity. That's why Israel hasn't killed this rotten corksucker. They have to figure it out for themselves, or it won't work.

Stay well and vigilant, kids........FRegards

68 posted on 05/02/2002 6:32:31 PM PDT by gonzo

To: Nathan _in_Arkansas

Let us strike quick, silence our enemies in a matter of months, not years. Hooah!!!

That last word brought out the vet in me.

HOOAH!

Okay. I'll go back to silly-vilian mode. My jumping days are over. ;^)

69 posted on 05/02/2002 6:37:55 PM PDT by rdb3

70 posted on 05/02/2002 6:59:04 PM PDT by sarasmom

I am just sick when reviewing the 9-11 catastrophy, and hearing how Powell speaks... makes me sooo mad... he may as well of been a Clinton pick.

71 posted on 05/02/2002 7:28:37 PM PDT by Godfollow

If the Arabs in the area really cared about the Palies, and they were really peace loving as stated, anyone of the countries surrounding the tiny state of Israel would take them in.
Since they won't, we can conclude two things.

1) The Palies are such a violent disagreeable group that no one else wants them around.

2) They don't really seek peace, but the end of Israel, period.

Because of the above reasons, and any number of other things, there will be another all out war involving most of the world.

72 posted on 05/02/2002 7:33:55 PM PDT by ladyinred

To: Nathan _in_Arkansas

Careful what you ask for:).

"Let 'em have it. Remember this: never maltreat your enemy by halves. Once the battle is joined, let 'em have it. Having begun, we must go on to the end. Stop at nothing."

-Winston Churchill September 1940 - on the Dakar Operation Menace.

Heartfelt thanks for serving. You guys will be our 'greatest generation', i'm sure.

73 posted on 05/02/2002 7:45:15 PM PDT by swarthyguy

"The West Bank and Gaza are only 22 percent of the geographic area of Palestine, and it's all the Palestinians are asking for. They want a place to call home."

Israel and Jordan together is the original mandate of "palestine".
Odd how that palestine was intended to be 50-50 Arab and jew, which means Israel is still missing a whole lot of Land.
Muslim Arabs have this selective memory about things like that. Too bad.

Yes, I know the limeys screwed things up, but still... the arabs have this peculiarly selective memory.

74 posted on 05/02/2002 7:45:30 PM PDT by Publius6961

Palestinians had a state on table August2000. Sharon agreed to a state on Sept 23, 2001. If the Saudi's had whispered to Yasser in 2000, take the offer, a lot of lives would have been saved.

But he'll lose his glory with a state; he is the proto-terrorist and either cannot or is afraid to evolve beyond that.

75 posted on 05/02/2002 7:48:38 PM PDT by swarthyguy

Ah, well the British have left of messy borders across the world.

76 posted on 05/02/2002 7:49:29 PM PDT by swarthyguy

To: ThreeOfSeven

the Zionists wished to establish a Jewish state on their land.

Dear three-sevenths,
Which is it?

The "palestinians" refused the UN partition plan, thence had no country.
So how could the Jews do anything to "their" land?
Before UN partition the land belonged to either the Turkish Empire or effectively to the British to do with as they wished.
And most of "palestine" had previously been given to the arabs as Transjordan. I don't believe the Jews have ever made any claims there.

77 posted on 05/02/2002 7:51:53 PM PDT by Publius6961

The original mandate included current Jordan. However, i think the 50/50 split applied to present day Israel, WB and Gaza. No nation should have to put up with the barrage of deadly attacks that Israel was subjected to this past winter. ALso notice, there have 'only' been a couple of successful attacks since this operation began.

78 posted on 05/02/2002 7:52:27 PM PDT by swarthyguy

Frankly, the Saudis could use an injection of fresh genes from outside of their own inbred society.

80 posted on 05/02/2002 8:42:03 PM PDT by TN Republican

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