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I made a very short comment and you went bananas on me.

No, you made a very stupid comment and I asked for your experience and perspective to second guess the pilot in the seat from behind your keyboard.

Fortunately losing an engine upon takeoff for me would have been a first.

Fortunately, for you. However, that does precious little to bolster any credibility to your initial statement.

If an engine fails upon take off, you use all the power available from the live engine. Climb performance reduces by nearly 80%. We must make full use of the live engine in the right way.

Exactly what the pilot did as evidenced in photos of the exhaust nozzle configurations.

Engine failure after takeoff (EFATO) is therefore the worst moment for an engine failure to occur since you’re slow, flaps and gear may be still down, flight controls are still a bit sloppy. When an EFATO occurs, you should first counteract the yaw with rudder, and then bank to a maximum of 5 degrees to the live engine. This is how you get the most out of the live engine. When climbing, cruising, descending or on approach, just the rudder will be sufficient and no bank is required.

Fantastic! Now, what about that small matter of a full load of JP-5 or 8 that you have sitting underneath you? Do you dump it? What did the Air Force/Navy teach you to do?

After the failure, keep an eye on your ammeter, since you’ve lost one alternator. Same applies to your vacuum pumps when flying in IMC; you’ve only got one left.

Alternator? Vacuum pumps? Exactly what kind of jet aircraft did you fly for our country?

The details of this particular crash will remain rather sketchy for weeks, perhaps even months

The details will, but the circumstances won't: Catastrophic engine failure at takeoff, full load of fuel, heavy population area between you and the ocean, not enough altitude or airspeed to make it to open water.

but there is always something one can do in the event of ditching.

Like what?

That being said neither of us were there and it would seem to me that something could have been done. You had to be there; I had to be there, but without the ability to make a quick decision we won’t know if that was, indeed, possible.

Oh, no, it doesn't work that way. You waded into this, waving your e-wang, and have been called on your BS. While I have not flown a fighter aircraft, I do know a bit about gas turbine engines and what makes them go "pop-pop-pop" and trail smoke. I also know that exhaust manifold positions are directly related to how much fuel you're trying to shove through them. I am also a bit familiar with casualty control procedures as they apply to gas turbine engines.

You have held up the mantle of jet aircraft fighter pilot in Korea and as such I would think you might be able to explain, with some detail and authority, what exactly it was that you were trained to do in the event of catastrophic engine failure, at takeoff, over a populated area.

Surely someone with your breadth of experience and knowledge can tell us exactly why it is you feel this pilot screwed up so badly.

I’m not your sweetheart, but I do sense it is you that is full of manure.

You were a jet jock but you can't even answer a simple question about what procedures you were taught in the event of catastrophic engine failure over a populated area? That's pathetic, sugar, and it makes me think "poser" more than anything else.

Since this is the hill on which I don't wish to die, I must do something that's against my oath: surrender.

Oh, no, sweetheart, you don't get off so easy. You lay claim to flying fighter aircraft during the Korean War, so you can answer a simple question generated by a simple scenario: The port engine of your fighter aircraft ate itself on takeoff (end of the runway) and you don't have enough altitude nor airspeed to make it to the ocean so you can properly "ditch" your dying plane without hitting an apartment complex that is less than two miles from the end of the runway.

So, Chuck Yeager, what do you do?

Believe me, whoever you are, intelligent discussion is not what we have both regurgitated on this site. Rather we have engaged in picayune sophomoric twaddle.

And you, sir, are full of manure.

Not a good, nor an honored way, to ditch your fighter plane!

Okay, Chuck Yeager, what would you have done? Please do enlighten us and feel free to add the perspective from which you speak.

Agree 110%. Gas turbine mechanical failures are normally rapid and catastrophic. From one comment on the va beach local news, someone said the plane was flying low over 264 and trailing smoke. That tells me that the compressor section of that turbine ate itself and the nozzle configuration seems to support that the pilots attempted to gain more speed and altitude by putting the starboard throttles to the firewall.

God bless these guys, they did the best they could.

And a BTTT to keep it rolling....

You really think it stops at Holder?

Really?

I'm pretty sure that in your fevered head, obama himself ordered Seal Team Six to go to the Virginia Tech Campus with guns bought by the Chinese govt and travel funded by George Soros to kill a campus police officer just to make sure the headline heat was taken off of his main man at the DOJ.

Kinda odd, you seem to have Hillery pegged.

I'm sorry, what?

It seems the conspiracy theory isn’t cutting it.

Yeah, no kidding.

Local news is reporting the second “victim” was actually the shooter and it is possible the traffic stop was related to an earlier armed robbery.

Shhhhhhh! Don't say that too loud, you wouldn't want to upset those who are looking for a political axe to grind in all this tragedy.

Seriously, thanks for the update.

Sorry that it is possible that such a thing exists as an intentional, premeditation action/distraction of this nature.

However, it does.

So the govt arranged a black bag shooting op on a college campus to save Holder's bacon, huh? Amazing.....

To not raise and discuss such issues is irresponsible, not to mention outright reckless.

Sure, bubba.

How lucky is that for Eric?

How unfortunate for the victims and their families. How much more unfortunate that several on the premier conservative website look at it through a political prism instead of a human one.

And here I thought we were better than the DUmp monkeys who make everything about politics.

Curiosity satisfied now?

Yep, satisfied in full and exactly what I thought.

Did you land on this thread to add anything of value to the discussion or were you just trying to be a whiny, disruptive, bitch?

Seriously, I'm genuinely curious.

I generally agree with your post except that I think Joe lost his principles and he knows it and that will be what will kill him.

That's kind of the whole point I was trying to make. The allowance of those principles to be compromised and doing nothing to salvage them killing him, I mean.

You know what, I have no dog in this fight whatsoever. I have been a life-long WVU fan and had watched many a PSU game simply because they were PSU.

Being a big college football fan, I was crushed when I first heard about this because of the type of program that Joe Paterno ran. I didn't want to believe it, but he was an enabler of Jerry Sandusky. The more that comes out, along with the revelations (at least to me) about PSU being socialized into a queer haven, the sicker it makes me that Paterno ever allowed himself to be put in a position where his morals and standards could be compromised.

No matter how angry I am at him for doing nothing, I truly believe that he was pushed into a corner on this by the PSU faculty. I believe that his coerced compliance and the 02 incident may be a reason for Spanier wanting him gone in 04 and Paterno turned it around on him to stay 5 more years. It would have been dirty and crappy, especially for a man of morals, but I think that may have happened. No proof, just a hunch.

I also believe that Joe Paterno wants to talk. He wants to get in front of microphones and let all of the butterflies out of the envelope; the closed door meetings, the hush-hush deals, the cover up by the queer lovers on the staff, why he truly fired Sandusky in 99, all of it. If not, I do believe the weight of all of it will kill him soon as it would any other man who has principles.

Truly the god that failed.

Nah, they're all over here in this thread "waiting for more to come out".

According to the investigative reporter I listened to yesterday, Paterno knew nothing about the 1998 incident. His name is mentioned nowhere.

I have a quote for you, Lancey:

Paterno’s son, Scott, has said that lawyers for Penn State assured him his father was never told about the 1998 report — investigated by university police.

I am sure all of us can rest assured that since a lawyer said it, it must be true. < /s >

I also have one more:

“And you’re going to tell me that Spanier and Paterno weren’t informed of something that was that huge that Ray Gricar was in on it but Spanier was kept in the dark?” she said. “I’m just not that stupid. I’m so upset I just can’t believe it.”

That's from the mother of Victim 6, he of the 1998 incident. It would seem that she would disagree with your assessment that Paterno was somehow left in the dark. You can read about it yourself here.

According to the investigative reporter I listened to yesterday

Nope, you didn't read it.

Paterno knew nothing about the 1998 incident. His name is mentioned nowhere.

He knew nothing of it? Sandusky was fired in 1999 which, incidentally was not long after Sandusky's admission to the mother of Victim 6 that he had indeed molested her son in a shower at Pedo State's facilities. Also, it was not long after the mother of Victim 6 went to the Pedo State faculty which spurred the investigation of Sandusky and you would have us "cretins" believe that the "TITAN" of college football was not made aware of what was going on in his facility?

Yeah, you keep waiting...

Does that clear it up for you?

Heh....

You haven’t bother to read the grand jury report, have you?

If you would have heard this report (and even taken it as completely true) and then jumped up and pointed a finger at Sandusky and hollered, "Gay pedophile rapist!", then you would have fit in very nicely in Nazi Germany.

Were you in this much denial when Mike Vick was playing with the doggies?