Free Republic
Browse · Search
Smoky Backroom
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Can You Change America? Part 2
Self ^ | 12/08/2002 | B4Ranch

Posted on 12/08/2002 4:40:39 PM PST by B4Ranch

The majority of the replies to the original Can You Change America were repeated complaints about what our elected officials did, did not do, should do, or could do to clear up the nations illegal alien problem. This was well known history by amongst all of us. The solutions that were shared with us frequently rely on these same elected officials to aid us in the remedy.


I guess my question is; What makes you continue to think that our leadership is going to aid in the dismantling of programs that they put in place. None of these programs came solely from the Democrats, nor were they solely supported by Democrats? More and more Republicans are walking to the left of center when it comes to these "undocumented migrants".

President Bush is refusing to discuss his policies with the voters on this subject. I think that he is holding off on implementing amnesty until the war with Iraq is finished or at least solidly underway. He could be afraid that we, the people will revolt by withdrawing our support for the war if he slams the door in our face refusing to acknowledge our opinions on illegal immigrants, immigration numbers, open borders, welfare policies, etc. The Enhanced Border Security Act of 2001 was a farce.

We have an environment where "personal responsibility" are dirty words.We can preserve our country. Fight political correctness mind control. Do not celebrate diversity when it means turning a blind eye to immorality, laziness, etc.

So, once again I will promote going against standard procedure and suggest that we the people show our independence by:

We must seek out and elect better leaders by effectively changing the political discourse and taking command of the terms of political debate and the ground upon which political debate occurs.

It's what political movement is all about, and we have the best incentives, motives, and ideas behind us.

Do you have questions about the Immigration and Nationality Act? Look at the INS web page for answers.

TOPICS: Heated Discussion
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-72 last
To: Landru
I'm well aware of your point and I don't expect this to be an easy win anywhere, the courts, the county commisioners, the city councils or awakening the people to what is coming.
51 posted on 12/10/2002 9:14:44 AM PST by B4Ranch
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
Does any know of a Sheriff who is unsatisfied with the Illegal alien situation in his/her County. I'm looking for someone, preferably in a Western State who is open to new ideas. Someone who will speak with common folks like myself and keep an open mind to a new radical, non-violent program. Someone who has never had a budget large enough to do what he needed to do. Someone with enough self worth to tolerate being ostracized in the press.

Sounds like you're talking about Larry Dever, Sheriff of Cochise County, Arizona. Look him up.

52 posted on 12/10/2002 9:19:10 AM PST by Spiff
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
I'm glad to see you are waiting around to see if someone else is going to fight for you

Wow I think this is a unearned insult! I am deep in the trenches working on a variety of causes, including educating people about sustainable development, the communist curriculua in our schools, and local attacks on our property rights. I have written articles and submitted story ideas for national conservative publications on problems with our schools. I am speaking at the "Bill of Rights Day" rally on sunday, helping to inform people that their rights are daily undermined by our elected officials.

Thats the short list. What do you think I should be doing?
53 posted on 12/10/2002 9:26:00 AM PST by hedgetrimmer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: hedgetrimmer
I certainly didn't mean to insult you. Please don't believe that I did in any way shape or form! I was congratulating you without saying, "CONGRATULATIONS". You are one of the very, very , very few who are in the foxholes fighting to preserve America. The majority of people are waiting around for the elected officials to correct the problem. They refuse to see that these are the people who got us into this situation. Why should they get us out? It won't happen unless individuals such as yourself keep fighting.
54 posted on 12/10/2002 9:40:56 AM PST by B4Ranch
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 53 | View Replies]

To: nicmarlo
Yes, I saw the program. The Board od Directors wasn't happy with it I'll bet.
55 posted on 12/10/2002 9:43:07 AM PST by B4Ranch
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 50 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
I believe our government is "by the people". Elected officials will only do the will of the people if the people have the ability to make critical assessments based on a sound knowledge of the principles of government formed by the Founders, and have the will to follow through on it. I believe overcoming the insults to freedom promulgated by our public education system, the media, and the infiltration of our institutions by socialists, communists or globalists(whatever you want to call them) needs to be done and done soon.
56 posted on 12/10/2002 9:57:10 AM PST by hedgetrimmer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
LOL; nope, I bet not, but it serves them right. You do things in secret and they'll always come out.
57 posted on 12/10/2002 10:10:02 AM PST by nicmarlo
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 55 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
Sadly, I agree ith your sentiment. But the good that came out of Klamath occurred because the government was forced to, albeit unwilling and albeit not to a full measure.

I believe the same thing can happen here if enough people raise enough cain and if the issue becomes heated and politcally liable enough.

Unfortunatly, what Landru said is correct, they will try and make this a race issue and that's a heavy burden to overcome in the current environment and on their playing table. That's why it can't be allowed to play out exclusively on their playing field. Klamath diddn't, it as grassroots and the internet that made a HUGE difference. I do not believe we can understimate or neglect that.

In addition, the poers that be are also underestimating, IMHO, the general feeling of most of the population on this issue. They are fed up.

Finally, I also believe that there is a God in Heaven and He can work miracles ... in fact, He will work His will. It is Him ultimately that I place my trust. We have to work hard and work smart in accordance with that IMHO.

Our founders worked against even more overwhelming odds (IMHO) in their day and won out. Klamath was a small but important example IMHO of the same principles. Those same principles can (and I believe they are) being applied here. That is the basis for my hope ... not that there are many in the government who would do so for the right reasons. But that through these methods they might be brought to it. If not ... then God be with us all.

I might add, that there are some good people in government and we need to support and grow them in every way we can.

Gotta go.

58 posted on 12/10/2002 10:12:22 AM PST by Jeff Head
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: hedgetrimmer; Jeff Head; Landru
The problem with the recent administrations is they have forgotten the words, "FREE AND INDEPENDENT STATES". Bending to the will of the United Nations has convinced Washington that they shall control and remove our freedoms if deemed necessary in order to get "The New World Order" in place.

NAFTA wasn't understood by the majority of our elected officials, it was read by even fewer but they signed it believing that the leaders were correct in advocating the globalistic goals. Now, the idea that something is amiss and I was involved in it is too much for them to admit. The political backlash of this convoluted reasoning would expose the corruption and Heaven fobid they might be held accountable. Yes, we are being sabotaged from within by politicians who continue to espouse that this action will our serve the national interests.

59 posted on 12/10/2002 10:41:11 AM PST by B4Ranch
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 56 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
60 posted on 12/10/2002 9:17:00 PM PST by mafree
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

Comment #61 Removed by Moderator

To: 6ta60; luv2ndamend; T Lady; CreekerFreeper; LBGA; DandG13
Lynne, hope you are feeling better.

All, Here's the update.

62 posted on 12/11/2002 3:25:21 PM PST by B4Ranch
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 61 | View Replies]

To: Ol'Grey Head
(snipped from Link to law Statutes (mid page) and website.

How Do I Report Suspected Illegal Aliens or Suspected Illegal Immigration Activity?

What Is Considered An Illegal Activity Under Immigration Law?
Where Can I Find the Law?
How Can I Report Suspected Illegal Alien Activity or a Suspected Illegal Alien?
How Will My Information Be Used?


The main thrust of the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act (IIRIRA) of 1996 was on illegal immigrants. Indeed, most of its provisions were aimed at improving the ability of law enforcement agencies, including the enforcement units of the Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS), to deter illegal migration and combat illegal immigration activity. Therefore, the INS is interested in identifying, and then removing, illegal immigrants from the United States, and in prosecuting those caught pursuing criminal immigration activities.

The United States, as a nation of immigrants, is an ethnically and religiously diverse country. In the years since our establishment, we have become a country with a large number of ethnically diverse native born groups. To this diversity we must add the annual arrival of hundreds of thousands of additional immigrants – including those coming in through the Diversity Lottery Visa Program -- authorized by the Immigration Act of 1990. People will look and act differently because of this rich diversity. Not everyone who looks or acts different is here illegally. Most of the neighbors and friends and people encountered during daily living will be Americans or aliens here legally for short- or long-term reasons. It is virtually impossible to know the immigration status of people in the United States just by looking at them or listening to them speak. And, as is well known, it is illegal to discriminate against people on the basis of race, religion, national origin and so on.

While identifying and dealing with illegal immigration activities is an important element of the INS core mandate, safeguarding the civil rights of all Americans and aliens is also important. The procedures below detail ways for people to report suspected illegal aliens or suspected illegal immigration activities to the INS. INS professionals are the ones with the training and information needed to determine whether or not these suspicions might warrant further investigation.

Therefore, while we appreciate the tips, INS will investigate and follow up according to its internal policies, priorities and procedures. Persons reporting such activities should not expect to see immediately any particular action one way or the other. Even in those cases where further investigation is warranted, it takes time for the facts to be known, true status determined, and action authorized.

What Is Considered An Illegal Activity Under Immigration Law?

Here are some examples of the most common violations of United States Immigration laws:


(This is not a complete list of violations.)

Each INS field office has a specific process for reporting suspected illegal alien activity. You should first decide where the suspected illegal alien activity or illegal alien is located. Our offices have areas of jurisdiction that are generally determined by state boundaries. Please see our field offices home page to find the location of the immigration office that will need the information you can provide. Each field office home page has a section entitled "About Us." Within this section, look under "Contacting Us" and then scroll down to "Enforcement Activities." Here we explain how to report suspected illegal alien activity or illegal aliens.

How Will My Information Be Used?

The Immigration and Naturalization Service receives hundreds of notifications of suspected illegal alien activity and suspected illegal aliens each year. We use this information in planning our enforcement efforts. The INS does not provide status on specific reports of illegal activity. Many enforcement actions occur as a result of several sources of information.

Normally, the person that provides the information will not be contacted after the initial report is filed nor kept informed of any actions by INS. The person providing the information is not required to give his/her name or other personal information.

We greatly appreciate the assistance of the public in identifying possible suspected illegal alien activity and suspected illegal aliens. If you provide information, it will be evaluated and used to help us better enforce our immigration laws.

63 posted on 12/11/2002 3:48:04 PM PST by B4Ranch
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
Thanks for the update!
64 posted on 12/11/2002 5:20:21 PM PST by luv2ndamend
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 63 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
Good ideas, but I have the sinking feeling that our only hope is if we can come to critical mass with these type folks:
Ranch Rescue
American Patrol
Tombstone Tumbleweed

Another viable option is to start filing lawsuits against local, state, and federal government like this org did:
California Coalition for Immigration Reform

Other active and somewhat effective organizations:
Federation for American Immigration Reform (largest lobbying group)
Americans for Immigration Control
Other links

65 posted on 12/12/2002 7:24:52 PM PST by A Navy Vet
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: A Navy Vet
This is one of the few things done by INS for which I applaud them,

Family of 4 deported to Poland

66 posted on 12/12/2002 8:12:46 PM PST by B4Ranch
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 65 | View Replies]

To: B4Ranch
Looks like Simcox of Tombstone Tumbleweed is turning up the heat. This is going to come to a boil sooner or later. Any ideas on how to show soidarity?
Tombstone Citizens Border Patrol pledging to conduct citizens' arrest on those who hire illegal aliens. Also, petitioning the AZ governor to sanction CBP as states militia.
67 posted on 12/13/2002 12:02:40 AM PST by A Navy Vet
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 66 | View Replies]

To: A Navy Vet
Citizens Border Patrol Raising the Stakes in Arizona (Threatened Inaugural Protest Set for Jan 6) Report by J.J. Johnson Published 12. 11. 02 at 16:14 Sierra Time

The Sierra Times has learned that Chris Simcox, founder of the Citizens Border Patrol, is preparing to take the border battle to the next level, including protests and a pledge to conduct citizens' arrest on businesses that hire illegal aliens. Simcox told The Sierra Times, "I have been in contact with Governor elect [Janet] Napolitano's office; we are attempting to schedule a meeting when we will petition her to recognize, sanction and give power to our groups as members of the state militia."

Napolitano, a newly elected Democrat, has recently criticized the activities of Simcox and others along Arizona's southern border, and has joined the call for hearings on the matter which are scheduled for January 6. Simcox is also asking for for funds with which to train new members of the Civil Homeland Defense.

"We are also applying for a grant to receive some of the $400,000 FEMA (Federal Emergency Management Agency) has allocated to Arizona for homeland security," said Simcox.

If Napolitano does not agree to a meeting, according to Simcox, a peaceful yet vocal protest is being planned during the swearing in ceremony for Napolitano on January 6. The ceremony will be held in Phoenix.

"We have told her that we will also begin a sweep of citizen's arrests on businesses that violate U.S. criminal codes involving hiring/harboring or transporting illegal aliens into this country," said Simcox.

Simcox warns law enforcement and businesses owners that they will also begin holding them accountable for criminal activities involving illegal employees.

US Code Title 8, section 1324a states "Any person who hires/harbors/transports any illegal alien, regardless of his knowledge of their immigration status, is guilty of a felony punishable by 10 years jail + $2000 fine per illegal alien + forfeiture of the vehicle or property used to commit the crime". Section 1324c states, "All officers whose duty it is to enforce criminal laws shall have authority to make arrests for a violation of any provision of this section" (affirmed US v Perez-Gonzalez 2002 Fed App 0360, 6th Circ.). Section 1644, same title states, "No local ordinance, rule, or measure shall stop law enforcement officers from enforcement of this section" (affirmed Southern District Court of NY, US v Rudy Guiliani,1996).

Any false ID shown to "prove" immigration status is a separate felony, anywhere in the United States. Simcox stated, "...Ask them for [identification], if none, make the arrest based upon 'information and belief' that they have entered the U.S. at other than an official Border crossing station. If they trespassed private property, that is yet another felony." Simcox also calls for full video coverage of events, even "video the video operator."

On Tuesday, the FEMA Region IX notified the governor's office that Arizona will receive a grant of nearly $400,000 to support the growth of Citizen Corps activities, including the formation of Citizen Corps Councils and the expansion of FEMA's Community Emergency Response Teams (CERT) program, which trains individuals in emergency response skills. The funds are being provided through the fiscal year 2002 Supplemental Appropriations Act For Further Recovery From and Response to Terrorist Attacks.

The Arizona Division of Emergency Management has been delivering the Citizen Corps message across the state and many Arizona communities are joining and expressing interest in the program," said FEMA Regional director Jeff Griffin. "This grant will give Arizona and its local communities a down payment on plans to have all citizens better prepared to respond to disasters of all kinds and to build a nation prepared."

In his 2002 State of the Union Address, President George W. Bush issued a call to all Americans to engage in volunteer service, and announced the creation of USA Freedom Corps to help individuals answer that call to service.

President Bush established the Citizen Corps initiative, a component of the USA Freedom Corps, to provide individuals with opportunities to volunteer in a range of homeland security measures within their communities.

Citizen Corps' mission is to make communities safer, stronger and better prepared to respond to threats of terrorism, crime, public health issues, and disasters of all kinds by engaging individuals in emergency preparedness and response through education, training, and volunteer service. The Citizen Corps initiative includes programs administered by the U.S. Departments of Justice and Health and Human Services, as well as FEMA, which is also responsible for coordinating Citizen Corps nationwide.

FEMA is the federal agency that coordinates response efforts to federally declared disaster. The agency's 10 regional offices work directly with states to prepare for, prevent, respond to and recover from disaster. The agency's number one goal is to reduce loss of life and property. FEMA Region IX serves the states of Arizona, California, Hawaii and Nevada, as well as the territories of American Samoa and Guam, the Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana Islands, the Republic of the Marshall Islands and the Federated States of Micronesia.

68 posted on 12/13/2002 12:06:08 AM PST by A Navy Vet
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 67 | View Replies]

Comment #69 Removed by Moderator

Comment #70 Removed by Moderator

To: B4Ranch
71 posted on 12/16/2002 6:38:31 AM PST by firewalk
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: BeforeISleep
72 posted on 12/20/2002 11:31:31 AM PST by madfly
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 71 | View Replies]

Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-72 last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Smoky Backroom
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794 is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson