Free Republic
Browse · Search
Bloggers & Personal
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

U.S. Army: M9 Berettas Suck. Glock? M&P? H&K? ^ | 29 Aug 2011 | Robert Ferago

Posted on 09/03/2011 12:42:43 PM PDT by smokingfrog

“The M9 is at the end of its lifecycle,” declared Maj. Art Thomas [not shown], small arms branch chief at the Maneuver Center of Excellence at Fort Benning, GA. “It is an old weapon.” Pig pile on Beretta! True story: comes not to praise the Beretta M9. They come to well and truly bury the Maryland-made 9mm handguns. Here’s the bullet point version of why our men in uniform need to ditch the b*tch for something better . . .

• The[M9's] slide-mounted safety. When solders rack the slide to alleviate a jam or stovepipe in the M9, they often inadvertently engage the safety — and won’t realize this until they reacquire and squeeze the trigger.

• The open-slide design, which allow contaminants and dirt into the system.

• The lack of a modular grip, integrated rail and night-sight capabilities.

• The inability to suppress.

• Limited service life — replacement should have a service life of at least 25,000 rounds.

That last one really sticks in the Army’s craw. “Service life is a key issue,” Daryl Easlick told the times. The project officer for close effects (“How was work today honey?”) reveals that the M9 is only required to fire 5,000 rounds. “We are looking for a threshold capability in the magnitude of five times better than that.”

But wait M9 fans! There’s less!

(Excerpt) Read more at ...

TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Government; Military/Veterans
KEYWORDS: banglist
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-8081-96 next last
To: The Pack Knight
I think the issue ammo was a big part of the problem in those days.

I never considered that. Produced by the lowest bidder. Plus, who knows how old some of that stuff was? We know McNamara tried to save a few bucks by using dirty ball powder to manufacture ammunition for the M16 back during the Vietnam era.

61 posted on 09/03/2011 5:35:08 PM PDT by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open ( <o> ---)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 58 | View Replies]

To: taxcontrol

I had considered getting the MP5 rechambered to 9x21 a few years back.Is the 9x23 the same round that Mauser chambered some of the broomhandle pistols for when they filled some export orders before WW1?

62 posted on 09/03/2011 5:44:11 PM PDT by Farmer Dean (stop worrying about what they want to do to you,start thinking about what you want to do to them)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: yarddog

I have a old 92fs and it is a great shooter. Loaded with Hydra-shocks and it should bring down anyone.
The military cannot issue hollowpoints or high power 9 MM rounds.
I also have a Colt Commander that is a sweet pistol, but I like the 15 rounds for the 92.
Glocks may be good{I wasnt really impressed with the one I fired}but it didnt feel right.
SIG is good but a little pricey. But the one thing the Germans know about is making firearms.

63 posted on 09/03/2011 5:45:30 PM PDT by Yorlik803 (better to die on your feet than live on your knees.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: yarddog

I have a 1911A1 that I’ve put 60,000 rounds through.No jams,and never had any part break.I did replace the 50 year old recoil spring because I though it was getting a little weak,but the old spring was still working OK.

64 posted on 09/03/2011 5:49:34 PM PDT by Farmer Dean (stop worrying about what they want to do to you,start thinking about what you want to do to them)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: smokingfrog

This isn’t from personal experience, mind you - my time was in the late 90s when the Army had long since gone to the M9.

However, from talking to my uncle and other guys who served in the 70s and early 80s, I always heard that the ammo was old, cheap, and beat up. My uncle used to say shots were going all over the place like out of a smooth bore musket. I’m no gunsmith, but I suspect that means the barrels were in need of replacement in addition to the need for higher-quality cartridges.

As an aside, I actually liked shooting the M9. It was easy to handle, had a comfortable trigger pull, and I thought the sights were ok. My problems with it were reliability, durability, the safety, and the lethality of the 9mm - all stuff I’d rather not worry about if I’m in such dire straits that I’m using a sidearm in combat.

65 posted on 09/03/2011 6:55:00 PM PDT by The Pack Knight (Laugh, and the world laughs with you. Weep, and the world laughs at you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 61 | View Replies]

To: smokingfrog

I really love my Springfield Armory XDm .45...14 rounds as opposed to 8 in the 1911’s.

66 posted on 09/03/2011 7:20:02 PM PDT by mozarky2 (Ya never stand so tall as when ya stoop to stomp a statist!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Steel Wolf

USAF won’t let pilots carry personal side arm even if they supply own ammo. True? Why?

It would seem that when it is your own life on the line what you carry should be your decision.

67 posted on 09/03/2011 9:30:08 PM PDT by Sequoyah101 (Half the people are below average.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: yarddog
They fixed the problem and I suspect Glocks are now as reliable as any.

You're right. There were a few generations of Glock magazines. The later ones with the full metal lining are superior, and solved those early problems. There were feeding issues, but also issues with the failure to drop a loaded magazine. Before the metal lining, they would bulge and seize in the grip.
68 posted on 09/04/2011 12:35:17 AM PDT by andyk (Income != Wealth)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: mozarky2

There are double stack 1911’s with similar capacity

69 posted on 09/04/2011 6:42:22 AM PDT by Mount Athos (A Giant luxury mega-mansion for Gore, a Government Green EcoShack made of poo for you)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 66 | View Replies]

To: harpseal; TexasCowboy; nunya bidness; AAABEST; Travis McGee; Squantos; wku man; SLB; ...
Click the Gadsden flag for pro-gun resources!
70 posted on 09/05/2011 5:14:21 AM PDT by Joe Brower (Sheep have three speeds: "graze", "stampede" and "cower".)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: thefactor


71 posted on 09/05/2011 6:45:50 AM PDT by Pharmboy (What always made the state a hell has been that man tried to make it heaven-Hoelderlin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 70 | View Replies]

To: RC one


I just wish I could find a reliable extended mag like using a G18 mag in a G17 or G19.

72 posted on 09/05/2011 6:51:17 AM PDT by FreedomPoster (Islam delenda est)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: Domalais
I love my M92FS and it is suppressed with an SWR Trident 9 designed for the H&K MP5. Awesome combo. But I can see how the safety setup could be a drag in combat. I think the US Armed forces should issue the H&K45. The weak 9mm is just not the right medicine for frequent house to house confrontations. Such is the face of terrorism.
73 posted on 09/05/2011 7:39:33 AM PDT by ExSoldier ("Life without God is like an unsharpened pencil: It has no point.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Yossarian

>>> “Any opinions on the Beretta PX4 Storms, either the .40 or 9mm, now that they’ve been out for a while?”

My fullsize .40 came used from an FFL. I cannot afford to shoot as often as I wish (then again, who can?), but so far it’s performed at 100% with a variety of ammo. The only oddity was the one time the slide didn’t lock back on empty, and I blame that on the original regular-capacity magazine that was in it at the time.

I liked it enough to get the matching CX4. Recoil on that is nothing to the shoulder, but I need more range time to train out of flinching at the snappy (to me) response.

I familiarization-fired both the 1911 and the Beretta 9mm at separate occasions in the military. So brief waere the encounters that I can hardly recall my impressions.

While I really like my P-and-CX4 pairing, I wish I had known to look into the Beretta 96 combined with the matching-magazine KelTec Sub2000 in .40 cal. While not a slander on the CX4’s performance, the KelTec carbine is cheaper and folds in half. Coolness! Their guns are fugly, but I admire KelTec’s innovative designs.

Thanks for the opportunity to comment. The PX4 is the one that goes on every shoot with me & is kept handy by the door.

74 posted on 09/05/2011 7:48:20 AM PDT by Titan Magroyne (What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: Mr Rogers

My choice! lol

75 posted on 09/05/2011 7:52:23 AM PDT by US_MilitaryRules (Where is our military?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]

To: Domalais
You're way off track. Women HATE the M9 due to its size.

Freakin'-A correct! That huge magazine for those 15 rounds is also compromised by the looooonng trigger pull, which is supposed to enhance safety. Anybody remember the scene from Black Hawk Down where the Delta operator was chewed out by the Ranger Captain for having a "hot" weapon inside the cantonment area? The Delta guy showed his trigger finger and said This is my safety, sir! Well that is spot on correct. Ladies with smaller hands have to sometimes shift their grip on the M9 to get enough strength in the trigger finger to pull the trigger. What pray tell happens when one shifts his grip on the weapon in this fashion? If you answered the point of impact also shifts you're sadly correct.

When I first met the gal who became my wife exactly 23 years ago last month, our first date was to church and the second date was to the range. She had already handled firearms in her past (being the daughter of a combat decorated WWII USMC Colonel) so I broke her in on my customized 1911 Remington Rand, affectionately known as Betsy. She did very well but waited wisely until the nuptials were over before declaring my beloved Betsy, HERS. To keep the peace I had to immediately buy her a 1911 45 Combat Commander and it's been wedded bliss ever since.

76 posted on 09/05/2011 8:07:34 AM PDT by ExSoldier ("Life without God is like an unsharpened pencil: It has no point.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: Pharmboy

Yeah, the open slide is just weird. I heard just yesterday that the Army is getting rid of the M9. But with the speed the Army goes, I’m not sure I’ll use anything else before I retire.

77 posted on 09/05/2011 8:09:34 AM PDT by thefactor (yes, as a matter of fact, i DID only read the excerpt)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 71 | View Replies]

To: US_MilitaryRules


78 posted on 09/05/2011 8:40:38 AM PDT by Mr Rogers ("they found themselves made strangers in their own country")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 75 | View Replies]

To: ExSoldier; Domalais
I'm a guy, but I have small hands. Great for working on Japanese cars, not so great for a lot of handguns. With the M9, I just had to let my thumb take the recoil - which is not a good way to shoot.

OTOH, with my Ruger Alaskan, a switch to the GP100 compact grips has allowed me to fire 50 rounds one-handed from a 44 Mag snubbie & do just fine.

79 posted on 09/05/2011 8:49:52 AM PDT by Mr Rogers ("they found themselves made strangers in their own country")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 76 | View Replies]

To: smokingfrog

Why not stick with the tried-and-true 1911?

80 posted on 09/05/2011 8:52:46 AM PDT by wastedyears (Of course you realize, this means war.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-8081-96 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Bloggers & Personal
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794 is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson