Posted on 01/20/2012 10:57:39 AM PST by GregNH
Defendant, President Barack Obama, a candidate seeking the Democratic nomination for the office of the President of the United States, has filed a motion to quash the subpoena compelling his attendance at the hearing on January 26, 2012.
(Excerpt) Read more at scribd.com ...
That would be plausible if it were not for the Newspaper birth announcements which came out of the Hawaii Department of health. Neither mom nor grandparents put those announcements there, the HDOH sent it to the paper as part of standard procedure.
Now the Birth announcements in the paper are working AGAINST Obama and his bastard theory.
Obama senior probably ‘reclaimed’ his namesake in 1971. The great Christmas meeting in Hawaii was not some casual trip.
SAD had come over from Indonesia, Obama Senior came over from Kenya and when the little event was done - Obama II is left with Gran and Granddad.
Would Gran and Granddad take custody of kid whose mother was a flake, married to foreign national and living in a foreign country and the father was father in name in only and a drunk and living in Kenya with no clear custody and guardianship?
Heck no. When SAD and BHO left in January of 1972 Obama II probably had gone through yet another citizenship/guardian ship change that probably started with Obama Senior reclaiming his son legally to terminate Lolo Soetoro’s parentage. Then he probably passed II over the gran and granddad. Thus for a week or 2 - Obama II was probably a 100% Kenyan. In 1971.
If the above is correct it is not the birth circumstance that is the worst problem - it is Indonesian adoption. And every time you mention Indonesia the Obots get worked up more than normal. Indonesia is a source of big problems here.
I’m not really seeing the point in discussing McCain any further. We could point to some Supreme Court cases that have cited Vattel specifically on the phrase about how the citizenship of children naturally follows the condition of the father. Second, the exclusions to the 14th amendment don’t make any sense unless those principles are applied to the children of our ambassadors and service men and women who are born abroad. Third, the Minor court said that in the Nationality Act of 1790 that “the children of citizens of the United States that might be born beyond the sea, or out of the limits of the United States, should be considered as natural-born citizens. These provisions thus enacted have, in substance, been retained in all the naturalization laws adopted since.” The court says these provisions have been retained. I think this is the basis for the argument that George Romney was supposedly a natural-born citizen. If we’re going to have consistency, then the Supreme Court has recognized principles from Vattel and natural law, plus statutory law on nationality that declares person born abroad as being natural-born citizens. There’s also a common law argument that supports this idea too. Is it conclusive?? No. Does it matter in regards to Obama?? Even less. Let’s focus on the guy who is the actual problem. McCain is a distraction and a deflection.
LOLZ (SPANK!!) LOL
I know how you feel, I JUST finished my Chemistry forum posts.... meh. I DREAD the other homework, I have to do schematic 3d Power point images of Hydrocarbon chains and a whole crapload of naming.... (((shudder)))
“I still believe he was born elsewhere and the grandmother walked into a local Health Office and filled out the paperwork and that is how he was registered into the system.”
You and me both. He got some kind of scrap of paper (Grandma submitted and Abercrombie referenced) that registered him into the system and they’ve been trying to build a birth certificate around for some time.
He’s got NBC problems and “birth certificate” problems.
I don’t have it here, but I’ve read that generally speaking, bastards are considered stateless. The important thing is what the founders would have believed. Legitimacy is an issue that Vattel discusses in regards to the monarchy, but I’m not up to speed on it.
The bastard angle is not a good one for Obama, because he has to come up with a good story as to why he’s deceived the American public about this angle. As the Obots like to say, it’s well-known that Obama is the child of foreign national who never immigrated. He’s using the man’s name, for God’s sake and was a legacy at Harvard on the same basis. Further, unless the marriage was officially recognized as illegitimate under British law, we are bound by how the marriage was formally recognized under U.S. law, plus if Obama EVER traveled on a British or Kenyan passport ... he’s toast. There’s no way around it. And of course, he STILL has to legally prove whether or not he was born on U.S. soil. If Obama takes this track, he’s vindicating the entire so-called “birther” movement and justifying all the questions that have been leveled at him the last four years. This is going to be a P.R. nightmare for the Kenyan. And there’s still Grandma Sarah.
So I see a need to settle this for all.
Glad you agree.
Breaking:
Mike Huckabee on O’Reilly tonight: Did Obama Get Foreign Student Loans In College?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Eb9sGq6Sfk&feature=player_embedded
“I’m not really seeing the point in discussing McCain any further.”
But how are the Obots going to keep on trolling without obfuscation and pointing to other people’s NBC status if they can’t reference McCain or Tebow or Rubio or Jindal or...
Obama is the focus here - legally. He’s the one usurping the presidency. They need to point fingers away from Obama.
Last time I checked McCain ATTEMPTED to become president. He did not succeed. The point is moot.
Obama has never proved that he “SHALL QUALIFY.”
I don’t think it’s hard to settle. Vattel is very compelling on the number of times it’s been cited for citizenship. Waite called it the “nomenclature” of which the founders were familiar. And the founders, in addition to rejecting common law, wrote a grandfather clause that bestowed honorary natural-born status on those who were NOT born in the United States but who came here to fight in the rebellion against Britain. It’s the rule that was going to make Alexander Hamilton eligible for office. They respected service to the country as the ultimate form of patriotism. Wasn’t there a French guy during the revolutionary war whose family was declared to be natural-born citizens in perpetuity (or something like that)?? As the Supreme Court said, the definiton for NBC is found OUTSIDE the Constitution, and it used the law of nations to define it. That same nomenclature would encompass McCain, IMO, but not George Romney.
Obama has a bad case of Cluster F**ked.
There were many of us that thought something was fishy about the marriage story.
If you recall, Michelle stated somewhere that Obama was born to a single mother.
If your read the Ulstermann Report - which Free Republic doesn’t like..there is an interesting story that is clearly talking about Dianne Feinstein who is the one who first announced Osama’s death - which was a signal to Obama to back off. She did it during the service of Kam Kuwata, who the insider apparently is claiming knew about some Obama stuff in Denver.
Ulsterman’s reading like Grisham.
Except it appears to be true....
And Issa’s going along with F&F?
I hope the WHI can stay among the living.
“bastards are considered stateless.”
“I am a citizen of the world.” Barack Hussein Obama, Berlin, 2008.
“Further, unless the marriage was officially recognized as illegitimate under British law”
You are incorrect in your hypothesis if you are indicating that Britain has to do some kind of act to make the marriage illegal. I am the first person that brought up this whole angle of the British law and marriage on this site and have been posting about it for some time.
One of the things that I kept telling the naysayers is that the law was to Obama’s advantage, and if necessary, he would use it .
On the face of the facts as we know them today as presented by Obama and family - Obama was born a bastard under British law...IF there was a marriage to Ann- which I don’t think there was- and IF Sr was married to someone else and not divorced.
I’ve never had a tagline but you’ve inspired me. LOL
“Obama’s got NBC problems and “birth certificate” problems - a bad case of Cluster F**ked.”
Oops let try that again.
Sispsey Street ( one of the breakers of F&F) seems to be indicating that Issa is caving. I haven’t given the site an in depth analysis as I was trying to figure out what the heck the “insider” site was saying about the various people involved.
From Orly’s FaceBook page:
The courtroom for the hearings on January 26 has been changed to courtroom 3E at 185 Central Avenue, Atlanta, Georgia 30303. It is still in the same Fulton Count”
Thank you!
A bastard child is still fathered by someone. That someone was a foreign citizen at the time of the Annointed One’s birth.
Then there’s the whole issue of knowingly and willfully deceiving the public (and consumers of his books) and political donors for seeking public office, etc.
I am sure there will be plenty of civil lawsuits forthcoming.
This comment is from Sipsey (I’d not read it much before now, so tnx.) The comment is about F&F, but it applies here, too. The corruption reminds me of how beautiful the egg looks from the outside, even if stinking rotten inside. If the millions and billions being thrown around 0bama end up in DNC and 0bama and Emmanuel’s coffers, who exactly is immune...and who canNOT be gotten to?
“Anonymous said...
OK.
It’s been my experience that if you are trying to pressure for activity and information, you do limited releases designed to create maximum pressure upon those you are attemptig to impact. That has apparently stopped which to my mind is not a good sign. It is a sign of defense, not engagement.
Considering the forces being dealt with here everyone conducting this inquiry should expect a white glove inspection followed by a rectal probing for an extended period. That’s the way it was set up to be, you don’t go after them and try not to become the taget of their attention because there is nothing you can do if they come after you. They will find something and failing in that, they will create it and destroy you and all those around you.
Government agencies are now weapons to be used against the enemies of the left. The media could stop that from happening but they won’t because it is their job to assist the left with whatever/whomever it is attempting to do. They are the left after all and they drive public opinion and responses. They are in charge of the whole business in cooperation with certain other persons who are essentially communists by belief and commitment.
If you then surmise that having the use of government personnel by hiring and promotion and their resources and facilities would help your seizure of power, you pretty much understand what is now happening.
This is not one man. This is many like minded men and women who believe to their morrow that Marx had better ideas and Stalin is superior to Washington.
Once this has happened you have only one recourse left because all fairness and equity, all legitimate debate, all opposition will be attacked and destroyed and never allowed to exist again. It is who they are and what they do and they do it time after time, world wide.
January 20, 2012 7:31 AM”
British law would not have conferred British citizenship to Obama as a bastard being born in this country.
The only argument you would have is that Obama’s father was a British Citizen.
For those that keep citing Vattel- you really need to LISTEN to the oral argument in Nguyen. This is not settled law.
This is how it works in recent decades for US child support, but it is not how it worked for making an illegitimate child a UK subject.
Read the 1948 BNA. It only passes UK citizenship to legitimate children, not any children whose birth certificates bear the name of a UK citizen. Big difference.
The US constitution and courts cannot declare Barry to be a dual citizen at birth just because a UK subject is on his (alleged) BC. Only UK law could do that and it explicitly excludes illegitimate children of UK subjects.
But what about the birth announcements? The birth announcements stated that a child was born to Mr an Mrs Obama. And their address was given, as well. The implication was that the parents were living at this address together.
What about the Governor of Hawaii (Abercrombie) claiming to have seen that boy born and seeing the family together in Hawaii?
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!!!!!!
“I won’t say that the fix is in, but the Committee seems to be buying into the ‘Made-in-Phoenix’ line pushed by the White House,” said one source with inside knowledge of the investigator’s work. This seems to be reflected in the subpoena letter from Issa to Cunningham”
http://www.sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2012/01/finally-fifth-amendment-time-in.html
Have you seen the INS files released by the author of best-selling “The Other Barack”? BHO Sr has been publicly exposes as having been expelled by Harvard and the US gov’t for strong evidence that he was a sexual predator and bigamist!
The dream of “Dreams” is now dead, so the Obama campaign has come up with a new narrative for 2012: Born to a single mother (like all of you in the hood!).
Below is what the Attorney named Butterfly Bilderberg posted over at FogBow about this. She plans on being there according to her posts. She says she has access to the courtroom thirty minutes before the Court opens it’s doors. Several other FogBow members say they also will be in attendance.
Butterfly Bilderberg wrote:
Which raises an interesting question — what if the GDP simply withdraws its designation of Obama for the PPP? That ends this challenge, and with no other candidate on the ballot in March, the Georgia delegation goes to the convention uncommitted to any candidate. By September, when the DNC certifies Obama as the party’s nominee, we can expect there to be a general election challenge, but there will likely be persuasive case law from other states that settles the issue.
What is the downside? The PR, of course. But already this is getting PR. Does this give momentum to challenges in other states? I would argue that it does not. Many states do not have a legal mechanism for challenging the PPP, a number of states rely on party caucuses or state conventions. It seems that every other state places the burden on the challenger, so I don’t think withdrawing from the Georgia primary would have any impact at all on other primaries.
This may have been Plan B from the beginning.
In his book he talks about it being strange that there were no photos of the wedding, etc. I dont remember exactly what he said but the gist of it is that the marriage claim was fishy.
British law would not have conferred British citizenship to Obama as a bastard being born in this country.
The only argument you would have is that Obama’s father was a British Citizen.
For those that keep citing Vattel- you really need to LISTEN to the oral argument in Nguyen. This is not settled law.
That is my contention - Obama’s father was a British Citizen. He was not a test tube baby, right? There was a biological father, correct. And what is the nationality of the father? Therefore, baby Barry was not born to parents which were US citizens.
At birth such a child would have the unitary US citizenship of the mother because it would have no legal father for citizenship purposes (different from legal child support purposes introduced into the law in recent decades).
Whether such a child would be NBC has not been declared by SCOTUS under Minor v. Happersett, IMO. But not being subject to, for example, being drafted to fight in a war against the US if the child visited the country of his biological father would negate the long-standing concern regarding dual citizens, which bastard children are not.
There are residency requirements for being POTUS so a child of UBL would have to return to the US for the specified number of years and reach the specified age. At least the mother would have to be a US citizen, unlike anchor baby Anwar al-Awlaki.
Yeah, and the ABC story has "9" comments and the Boston Globe one has "0" comments. Given the explosive nature of the news, that is statistically impossible unless they are deliberately censoring.
One can argue that both parents have to be US Citizens AND be born in the US.
HOWEVER, this is not settled law and one could very well lose that argument - AS CAN BE SEEN IN THE ORAL ARGUMENT OF NGUYEN.
Usually people submit certified copies of the original longt-form (that was filled out at the hospital), and usually that’s enough because the agency that holds the records doesn’t mess with them but simply stores them so certified copies can be provided when requested.
But the HDOH has messed with the records. We know that already because their 1960-64 birth index includes at least 2 different names from BC’s that are not legally valid, mixed together with legally-valid ones with no way to tell them apart. That was not a straight-out print-out of all legally valid birth records from 1960-64. It was a manipulated print-out.
And the supposed long-form that Obama supposedly scanned and posted online as a PDF has vestiges of a seal that is the wrong size so that it could not be from a legally certified copy of an original birth certificate. The HDOH would have known on sight that what Obama posted was not what they sent him if they did send him a legally-certified copy of his long-form. So only a few possibilities exist:
1) Fuddy didn’t sent Obama anything and sat by while Obama fabricated the whole episode.
2) Fuddy sent Obama BC’s that were not legally certified.
3) Fuddy sent Obama BC’s that were legally certified and then watched while Obama posted a forgery instead.
No matter how you slice it, Fuddy is wrong, wrong, wrong in how she treated Obama’s PDF posting - either by saying she sent a certified copy when she didn’t, or by letting Obama fabrications be accepted by the public without a peep to the public, to federal officials, or to law enforcement.
So anyway, between the HDOH’s illegal behavior and Obama’s 2 public BC forgeries, neither Obama nor the HDOH can be trusted. By giving people in their office a falsified 1960-64 birth index the HDOH showed that they are willing to lie through their official records for Obama’s sake, so nothing they certify can be trusted.
What needs to be seen is anything which tells us whether or not the HDOH has fabricated or falsified Obama’s record just like they falsified the birth index. That’s why people are asking to inspect the ORIGINAL long-form, the microfilm roll with Obama’s BC on it, etc - to do forensic testing on these things to see if they are fabrications.
Way back when in April when the HDOH decided they would have a policy of breaking HRS 338-16 by refusing to issue certified copies of actual long-form (the rules call them “standard”) BC’s on request, there was an article where they claimed that even Obama himself would not be able to see the original. (Funny, though, that HI State Senator Will Espero proposed a bill that would allow people to pay to get a one-time view of a specially-made-up BC just for Obama. Makes me think of the Lord hiding Moses in the cleft of the rock and then passing before him while his eyes were shaded and then finally letting Moses see his back...)
That was staging for them to claim that nobody can EVER see the original. They don’t want anybody to see the original - even supposedly have it tucked away in a locked safe - because if anybody saw it they would be able to do forensic analysis on it.
What the HDOH will allow people to see is what one of Jerry Corsi’s sources says is a forgery that has been placed in the HDOH files. The age of the paper, ink, etc can’t be evaluated on that because it’s basically just a photocopy. But the HDOH will happily put their seal on it even though they know it’s a forgery - just as Chiyome Fukino had her people tell visitors that the book on the shelf was the 1960-64 birth index even though she had to have a special printing done to get the legally non-valid names put into that list so she knew the thing was a fabrication.
What I fear is that the judge will accept a certified copy of a long-form and call that enough - not realizing that the HDOH has been falsifying other records for Obama and would easily certify what they knew to be a forgery as well. Heck, Fuddy knew Obama’s PDF is a forgery and she made it appear to all the world that it was what she had actually sent him. If she would commit misprision of Obama’s felony of forgery then why the heck wouldn’t she commit misprision of her own office’s felony of forgery, since she is the fox guarding the henhouse to keep anybody from being able to see and do forensic testing on the forgery anyway?
That is not quite what the judge ordered. The judge actually held a huge barn door open with a kick in the pants to Obama’s attorney for a reminder that the judge must first be in receipt of the points of law necessary to rule in favor of the motion to quash. In other words, the judge is receptive to a properly made motion to make this all go away and relieve him of the responsibility for covering up for BHO and his negligent minions.
Watch for a last hour Hail Mary play by the Obama legal team to frustrate the plaintiffs.
“She says she has access to the courtroom thirty minutes before the Court opens it’s doors.”
Uh... and how is that possible?
The INS documents... heck, the forged BC’s themselves claim that his mother’s name was Obama. The passport records.... everything. It’s all fabricated if the story is reversed at this point.
Sort of like the claims of a Queens birth must have been fabricated if he now supposedly had a Kapiolani birth...
Well considering there is a divorce decree for Ann and Obama Sr. that is gonna be a tough row to hoe.
“The bastard angle is not a good one for Obama, because he has to come up with a good story as to why he’s deceived the American public about this angle.”
Obama can claim that until the INS records were released with the publication of the book “The Other Barack” he had no idea that his father was a bigamous sexual predator at the time he was born, and, as he said in the Ayers scripted “Dreams,” he relied on his mother's stories about his father and mother's “hopes for the future” and their “improbable love.” It is obvious to the whole world that somebody lied (Stanley Ann or Barry) and Stanley Ann is dead so why not blame her and claim innocence if you are Barry?
Bastards (children of unmarried women, whether or not their father is on the BC or not) are not stateless and never were in the US back to the beginning. They have the “unitary” citizenship of their mother when born in US jurisdiction. This is especially true after WWII when international treaties and laws were pretty much universally changed to prevent stateless births around the world, IIRC.
Contrary to what we’ve been told, those announcements were probably reported by the hospital at the request of the parents. Not by the HDOH. And there’s pretty good evidence that Obama’s announcement was actually forged even at that, since the microfilms were manipulated. I know for sure that the stories we were told by the people who supposedly “found” the announcements at the Hawaii State Library are false. So why did they lie about that, if they could have actually gone to the HSL and taken copies of the announcements from the microfilms there?
Uh... and how is that possible?
She's really the cleaning lady....
I would LOVE to show up with a Name Tag on my jacket saying, “I am FReeper Danae. Bring it! Momma gonna knock you out!” FUN!!!!
Minor V. Happersett 1875 says otherwise. It has NEVER been overturned, instead it has been cited dozens and dozens of times in 136 years.
I just have to say that we have no genuine evidence that Obama was born in Hawaii. Nearly every agency that claims to have any records on Obama has been caught falsifying or fabricating records on Obama’s behalf. That being the case, none of the evidence can be presumed to be genuine without first looking into the provenance of the documents on which they rely.
Sorry, but the law is not to Obama's advantage. First, he's going to have to produce a verifiable LEGAL record that his father was previously married ... you know, like a legal marriage certificate from Kenya. Personal claims and speculation are NOT going to supercede the alleged Long-Form Birth Certificate showing Stanley Ann OBAMA as the mother and Barack Hussein Obama (SR.) as the father, plus the Dunham-Obama divorce records, Barak Sr. immigration records, HI DOH Index Data, etc. Obama didn't have a copy of his own long form birth certificate until April 2011. How is he going to legally document that his father was previously married by Thursday???? It ain't gonna happen. As far as the law is going to see, Obama's parents were legally married and his father was a British subject when Obama was born. By principles discussed aplenty here and the nationality act that Obama himself has posted STILL at his Fight the Smears site, he is acknowledging himself as a British subject at birth. s advantage. First, he
Bawahahahaha! That was a Real LOL!!!! heh heh heh!
That is what I have been trying to tell Leo Donofrio for two years, and I am not the only one. Leo would not put up comments on his blog that undermined his NBC complaint...a totally justified one, considering the blatant violation of the Constitution Barry was claiming in front of everyone, but no one cared.
BTW, Hat tip to you, RummyChick, for first putting me on to the Kezia marriage in Kenya, IIRC!
Leo claims that since Obama made a legal "statement against interest" that he was "governed by the 1948 BNA," his mere statement was sufficient to go full bore against him. But, as I wrote to Leo in comments, Barry lies all the time twisting things cynically to his advantage. With a $billion in cash for his campaign and lawyers why would Barry admit to something (non-NBC status) that could bring down his presidency if true...if he didn't have a Plan B???...exactly as you suggest.
I told Leo that Barry had an out of simply revealing his father's bigamy. If Barry's Factcheck legal team was citing the 1948 BNA I would expect them to have read it, including the provision that illigitimate children do not become UK subjects.
I am not a lawyer but have been following this thread all night. I would love to see the Obamunist kept off the ballot.
So, let’s say no one shows up with documents the judge ordered and the judge decides to keep Obama off the ballot.
Wouldn’t they just judge shop and have a higher judge reverse the decision?
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.