Posted on 11/03/2006 11:32:59 AM PST by dogbyte12
Yep. Absolutely! Nothin' worse than short toilet paper.
In the army we learned the art of leaves and woodcraft.
He would also be the first to tell you that sin is sin before God.
I have no doubt of it. I never heard Graham say anything that wasn't fully supported by scripture. I always considered him to be among the Christians who were the most loyal to the teachings of Jesus.
He was very gracious to me, an atheist. I met with him during the period when I was meeting with as many religious leaders as I could. I had an eye on writing a book about religion. I never wrote it, but I got to talk to some very famous religious leaders.
I wrote Billy Graham a letter, asking if I could have 15 minutes of his time while he was in Los Angeles to ask him a couple of questions. I explained that I was an atheist, who was writing a book about religion in general.
He was kind enough to agree to meet with me, and we had a very good conversation. I asked my questions, and he responded clearly and directly to them. He inquired as to the reasons for my atheism, and I answered him. He nodded and told me that he hoped I'd return to Christianity some day, but didn't preach at me.
He also had a firm, friendly grip in his handshake. He was a man worthy of anyone's trust, I am certain.
"He admits it's himself on the tape ordering "more" meth like the last time, but says that he keeps ordering it and not using it, and that Jones just gave him a massage.
I believe him. Not."
A very common behavior that goes with the addict/alcoholic is lying.
I expect he is lying. Likely to himself, his family, the media, his followers, etc.
Expect an announcement he will go to a rehab clinic.
Strongly held political or religious beliefs are a wonderful aspect of our culture that have been long expressed in our society without fear of retribution from official sources. The reverse side of that coin of freedom is what I view as the intelligent, humane and courteous act of listening, rather than viscerally reacting, and engaging rather than erupting with vituperative and pejorative responses. Yet, the very men and women who react in that detrimental fashion seem to be in the majority among those eventually found in their hypocrisy.
I have always been a firm admirer of Billy Graham. I have never met him.
I went to church with Teddy Haggard when he was in highschool and have kept up with him through the years although the last time I saw him face-to-face was at least 20 years ago. It was at his father's funeral. Because of the callousness being demonstrated in the forums (what's new) I'm sure I'll regret sharing that. But the Teddy I know is a good man. He has demonstrated his humanity and the frailty associated with that terrestrial status. I would never have equated him with Billy Graham and I don't intend to do that now. Nor do I intend to besmirch Mr. Graham's character in any fashion. He is by all accounts a man we should all strive to emulate.
I guess I shouldn't speak for Mr. Graham so I'll stop doing that. For me personally - there but for the grace of God go I as far as Teddy is concerned. He will certainly bear the consequences of his actions in ways I cannot imagine. But the only thing he deserves from me is grace and forgiveness. It's what I've received from God - I can do no less.
Fridays are good. We don't have to make sense. Kind a like an extra sabbath.
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
From New Life Church
Colorado Springs, ColoradoRev. Ted Haggard, Senior Pastor of New Life Church, stated today that he could "not continue to minister under the cloud created by the accusations made on Denver talk radio this morning." He, therefore, placed himself on administrative leave, pending investigation, spiritual counsel, and a decision by the church's board of overseers.
Pastor Haggard said, "I am voluntarily stepping aside from leadership so that the overseer process can be allowed to proceed with integrity. I hope to be able to discuss this matter in more detail at a later date. In the interim, I will seek both spiritual advice and guidance." Under the governing structure of New Life Church, there is a board of overseers consisting of four senior pastors of other congregations. Those overseers have authority to conduct an inquiry, to discipline the senior pastor, to remove him from his position, or to restore him to ministry.
The overseers of New Life Church are: Rev. Larry Stockstill, Senior Pastor of Bethany World Prayer Center, in Baker, Louisiana; Rev. Mark Cowart, Senior Pastor of Church For All Nations in Colorado Springs; Rev. Tim Ralph, Senior Pastor of New Covenant Fellowship in Larkspur, Colorado; and Rev. Michael Ware, Senior Pastor of Victory Church in Westminister, Colorado.
In the interim, New Life Church Associate Senior Pastor, Rev. Ross Parsley, will serve as Acting Senior Pastor of the church. Rev. Parsley has served in senior ministry positions at New Life Church for fifteen years. Rev. Parsley requested the community's compassion and prayers for the person who came forward with accusations, for the Haggard family, and for the New Life Church community. He also said, "New Life Church long ago adopted an overseer model of governance for situations just like this. People need to be patient and allow this process to unfold as it was designed to do."
Pastor Haggard also resigned today as President of the National Association of Evangelicals.
http://www.newlifechurch.org/nlcpressrelease110206.pdf
"Of course that is part of why the press is doing this and all the more reason why we should not care! My disgust for the media has now hit an all time low!!"
My disgust with television in general had gotten pretty bad. Then to watch FOXNEWS over this past year drift left, I stopped watching tv news altogether. Soon after that, one of our local tv stations broadcasted the "prideparade."
I turned my cable off the following day.
Mat 7:3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
= = = =
Absolutely.
I don't have trouble calling a spade a spade.
But every shred of hautiness and self-righteousness needs removed, first.
Otherwise, the judgmentalism WILL come back to haunt EVERYONE guilty of it REGARDLESS of how guilty the target person was, or not.
FACE IT, FOLKS . . .
ALL OF US . . . every last one of us . . . have plenty in our past genetics and conditioning--in addition to being simply born into a sin polluted world--such that
IF GOD CHOSE,
HE COULD ENGINEER ANY VARIETY of CIRCUMSTANCES
to bring out the worst in us . . . EQUAL TO OR WORSE THAN that of any of the folks we hear about in the news.
IT IS !ONLY! HIS !GRACE! that prevents us being the person in the news.
We like to think we are smarter than the average bear.
We like to think we are more righteous than the average bear.
We like to think that our used Kotex works of righteousness make us immune to such news paper articles.
We like to think that it will ALWAYS be the other guy caught in such stupid hideousness.
'Tain't necessarily so.
All God has to do is adjust circumstances sufficiently . . . a little tweaking of the Godly computer program here and there . . . and cess pool mud would be on all our faces by turns.
ONLY HIS BLOOD redeems any of us from any and every thing. And we earnestly must endeavor to cooperate with His ongoing cleansing else the skeletons in our personal and family history will have their way, regardless of our good INTENTIONS.
How does this happen?
[satire alert]
What unique sinful attitudes and willful wicked horrors in his life make him so much worse than !ME! . . .
WELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!
It's that very very very rare human phenomenon
P R I D E.
I realize that no one on FR has any such.
I realize that our snobbish priggy-ness is just because we're so saintly . . .
But if someone really wants to know how to go from no newspaper articles to such an article as this . . . the route is
P R I D E . . .
All God has to do is step back and allow satan to tweak it a bit here and there over time . . . and almost all of us are capable of about anything.
After reading his latest statements, neither do I.
Yes, there but for the Grace of God go I, however, this man should not be brought back...after rehab, etc...to lead his church. When he does face up to the truth and truly repents, he needs to get humble, get a regular job, and prove himself to God, his family, and fellows.
These statements are preposterous in light of what we know. I believe he is lying still...it's the old "I didn't inhale" and "I didn't have sex (depending on the meaning of the word "sex") with that..."
As for the gay escort failing the lie detector test, according to the article, the one who administered it said the results may be off because the subject was over tired, etc. There may be another test done next week. The fact that the accuser agreed right away to a test is telling...he felt he had nothing to fear.
It's a tawdry situation, but at least the majority of conservatives on this forum aren't defending the guy's behavior and are rightly suspicious. That's the BIG difference between the majority of conservatives vs. liberals. Conservatives don't condone such behavior. Yeah, we'll forgive, but only IF the sinner is repentant and tells the truth, the whole truth, and nothin but the truth.
Yes, pride - and moreover, ego.
True.
I think I tend to see ego in that sense as a subset of pride.
I hope he's arrested and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Possessing illegal drugs is a grave crime in this country that should not go unpunished.
"I hope he's arrested and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Possessing illegal drugs is a grave crime in this country that should not go unpunished."
He would have to have the drugs in his actual possession. He will not be prosecuted for saying that he did possess drugs at an earlier time.
Because messages to the children are important, at least that's why we in Colorado are supposed to be against the Amendment to legalize an ounce of pot here.
Thank you for that Scripture. An excellent text at any time, and very relevant here.
I bet Catholics in America are glumly saying to themselves ... thank God this one is not a priest!
Indeed. Thanks for the ping!
He DID repent and ask for forgiveness in a letter written to his church. My heart breaks for him. I'm sure he's devastated at his own failures. We pray for him. Any one of us is capable of the vilest sin. Remember, satanists and liberals pray for the destruction of pastors and evangelists. Wouldn't it be nice if Christians prayed FOR them for protection against these things.
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