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To: Ramius; g'nad; osagebowman; Lost Dutchman; Squantos; Corin Stormhands; JenB; TalonDJ; ExGeeEye; ...
I hope this week's Saturday Night Gun Pron has a bit more content than the usual thin offerings of the last few weeks.

Let me start with an item rarely seen in normal times, much less in this era. Up until last week, Uncle Joe was the world's authority, and he guaranteed that nobody needed more than a double-barrel shotgun, fired from the upstairs balcony (for those who have balconies and upstairs) to scare off any bad guy. Or a pump shotgun, which might not even need ammo, since the sound of the pump handle being worked also carried his personal guarantee to scare off the bad guy.

So, taking the best of both his worlds, I bought the Kel-Tec KSG:

It's a pump shotgun with two magazines holding six 3" shotshells each, selectable by a lever in the loading port. I can't really tell if the "business end" would be sufficiently threatening to deter the average bad guy.

I felt my left hand would be too close to the muzzle to use those factory sling loops right next to the muzzle, so I added a Magpul angle grip/hand stop and a QD sling swivel on the bottom rail, and a Magpul quick/change single/double point sling, rather than the simple nylon strap provided. The BUIS are there simply to be prepared for the rare situation where I might have to fire it like a rifle.

And behind the pistol grip is a typical 2-3/4 inch shotshell, and a now-rare Mexican half-size shell. With vey limited testing, it is possible the little guy might work, allowing for about 24 rounds in the tubes. I know it is far above state and federal magazine capacities for hunting.

All-in-all, an effective conversation-starter, and (I hope) effective confrontation-limiter.

Based on my own lyin' eyes, I'm beginning to believe there really is some evidence of holding back product in the firearms industry. Not just guns, but even the nickel-dime accessories. I didn't see MTM ammo boxes fly out of the store as fast as AR15s, but they've been impossible to find for months. Now, BLAM! they're in the store by the pallet, including new models I never save before. I went crazy and bought a bunch of the new ones, simply because I have more ammo that should be stored in moisture-resistant, stackable boxes.

Same thing for holsters, with my MSR store getting in several hundred from three manufacturers in one week. Coincidence?

Getting to know the owner is paying dividends. His store, which is heavily armed, armored, and monitored, is also the vault for much of his personal collection, too. He's been showing me some of the goodies that appear as special deals for attendees of the SHOT show, and are never seen again as commercial products. He's started to bring out stuff I never saw except in advertising, and one item I wished I had never seen.

This is the Australian L2(???) which may or may not have been a candidate to replace the Vietnam-era M16 with something cheaper, and a source of pride for Oz.

This stock photo does not do justice to how cheap and ugly it appears in real life. I didn't even want to hold it, because I was so offended by it, it was like trying to hold a turd by the clean end.

Looking at the picture, I believe the design is based on the plain-but-efficient Armalite AR18, but was severely worked over with an ugly stick. Then it was given to some high school kids as a makeup project to make it look even uglier and cheaper. They probably saved themselves from flunking with this project.

The Australian company probably realized their own hope of survival was to sell this on the American commercial market (as Steyr did with their GB pistol), and, during the Reagan golden years, it was imported by a California company in just enough numbers for the store owner to score one for himself. In reality, it is probably as dependable and serviceable as the AR18. In my own opinion, after shooting and maintaining lots of military weapons, some of which where downright fugly, this would destroy my morale, no matter how sterling is was on the battlefield. I'd consider airdropping this rifle on the enemy as a war crime, much less giving it to someone's own troops.

Australia stumbled along with the M16, Enfield, and AUG. All were/are expensive, a genuine POS as far as the Enfield went, and pricey when the AUG is fully tricked-out like ozzies tend to do. They were all vast improvements over this justifiably forgotten weapon. :)

4,052 posted on 05/05/2013 2:42:05 AM PDT by 300winmag (Whatever CAN go wrong has already happened. We just don't know about it yet.)
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To: 300winmag

Oooo. I’ve been eyeballing the KSG for a while. I;m glad to see it’s real not vaporware.

Have you shot it yet?


4,053 posted on 05/05/2013 7:15:06 AM PDT by Professional Engineer (No one expects the Sephardic Invitation!)
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To: 300winmag

Great report as usual..... Beware too much wear and tear aka force on that lower plastic rail ....

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2012/02/daniel-zimmerman/pump-gun-problem-kel-tec-ksg-rail-ruptures/

Might be worth using an end mill and removing the plastic rail and replace / reinforce with a aluminum one.... I have Surefire M900 I want to put on mine when one shows up at local shop for sale..... May need to leave accessories off shy of a X400 surefire and leave it alone.

Ya may consider using that sling as a single point transition style rig versus nuts to butt attachment points. Just a thought.....

Stay safe !


4,055 posted on 05/05/2013 9:09:13 AM PDT by Squantos ( Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everyone you meet ...)
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To: 300winmag

Glad to hear stuff is surfacing there... cuz there ain’t nuthin’ in this neck of the woods... my only score this month is a 1 lb can of Varget...

beauty scattergun, nice boxes...


4,063 posted on 05/21/2013 10:38:52 PM PDT by g'nad (guns don't kill people... I kill people...)
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