Skip to comments.Thoughts on a good carry gun (caliber, make) and holster type.
Posted on 08/13/2010 9:46:25 AM PDT by Pessimist
Seems like a bit of a slow news day, so I thought I'd crank out my first vanity.
I've been shooting for a couple of years now (since around October of '08 - go figure) and I'm looking at getting my CCW. I'd like some opinions of caliber / make and also holster options and ramifications.
I have one of those myself, got it from my grandfather, but it sure as heck isn't a carry weapon, IMO.
Great shooting gun, though.
Also, if you go to the website you will see it has several barrles that are interchangable, .45, .38.
ER stats have contradicted this. Yes, my favorite Carry piece is a Colt CC MKIV in stainless. But in Summer, it's the Sig 232 w/ Hydrashocks. I just cannot hide the Colt well, and it gets tiring after the major part of a day.
The jokes about "File the site off so after you shoot the perp, and he gets mad and stuffs the gun up you, it won't hurt as much" are really for the .25 and .32.
The BEST carry gun and holster is the one that you can:
1) get to quickly
2) hit a 2” target consistently at 10 feet (if you cant, you need either a smaller gun or more practice)
3) and perform #1 and #2 under high stress
A .22 revolver that is fired accurately at a vital spot is a whole lot more devastating to an opponent than a .50AE or .45ACP fired in the wrong place, or misses entirely.
Other additional considerations:
How do you plan to carry? All the time, for work, weekends, restaurants? It’ll make a difference on what and how you carry. I used a .38 S&W snubbie with a modified hammer and a paddle styled holster. I actually liked carrying the Beretta 92 and the compact EAA .40 better but the snubbie left less of a bump for concealment purposes.
Think about why/what purpose you want to carry and go from there. It might make sense to get a smaller gun. Then find a comfortable holster (you very well could go through a few before you find one that works.)that fits your body and allows you to draw safely. I always loaded self defense ammo and my buddy used the frangible stuff for his .40
Suggest to look at the entire decision pragmatically and not get too hung up on caliber and looks but focus in your own comfort and security and confidence. A .45 is a great caliber but it does you no good if you miss and hit a kid in the next room. Dead from a .38 or 9MM to the sweet-spot is the same dead as from a .45 or larger. I’m no expert but my dad was (Army MP and NYPD weapons instructor)and that was the advice he gave me.
once you start carrying one all day, everyday, you may start to appreciate the lighter weight.
as for holsters, i like desantis.
A 1911 is a model of .45 semi auto pistol. The Army commisoned them in 1911, I belive, hence the name.
Several manufacturers make them. They are tried and true to this day.
(Admittedly, it’s kind of a cult thing too!)
I carry an S&W model 36, which is a 5 shot with a 1 3/4” inch barrel. If I use a holster, it’s an inside the waistband, but the gun fits nicely in a pocket where I can put my hand on it without drawing any attention. The FBI says most gunfights involve fewer than 3 shots at less than 7 meters.
I plan on an inside the belt back holster for summer wear. For winter I have a tactical jacket with a velcro inside pocket that easily handles my 1911, two mags, a novel, and a turkey sandwich...or two.
Glock 30 45acp and sherpa holster for me
But ... ER stats notwithstanding, that perp in NY got hit 22 TIMES and lived ... to sue the NYPD most likely. Those were not .45 ACP self-defense rounds being removed from his body.
Betcha those were 38s and 9s.
Just my 2 cents.
My P220 rides OTW on a Blackhawk Serpa during suitable jacket and overshirt weather. I find the weight in the Serpa to be ‘un-noticed’ after a bit.
I keep my gun ITW behind the back during the summer. Either way it requires a shift in/out of the vehicle.
“How do you plan to carry?”
Good question. I should have mentioned, I actually intend to carry pretty rarely. Mianly I’m excercising my right, etc.
The problem is there are so few places I got that you ~can~ carry.
Work? Nope. Bar / Restaurant? Nope? Store? Usually nope.
And I live and work in very safe neighborhoods.
To be honest, I’ll probably carry a few times a year. We go to tea parties here in Cleveland Oh (not all that hospitable to conservatives), so I’ll probably carry there, just in case...
And I bet they were FMJ's that drill a neat clean hole.
This is a 1911. It shoots .45ACP. The greatest handgun of all time.
Although it is large, it actually has a narrow grip because it only holds 7 rounds. The narrow grip makes it a very comfortable gun for most women.
They are available in compact versions better suited for concealed carry.
It all depends upon your needs. I prefer the 1911 & carry it in a shoulder holster, belt, inside my waistband under my shirt (cross draw), & occasionally in a pocket. For church & a couple other times I carry a 5-shot .38 in an ankle holster. I don’t like moving my guns around so much, but clothing changes, DEFCON & “mission” necessitate it.
Don’t discount a .22 mag. The gun can be VERY small & light & still pack an unexpected wallop.
I clean after each use, as well.
Just my little experiment.
Not sure ya need TWO INCH accuracy as a spec, particularly in a high-stress, perp-in-motion, self-defense shooting scenario.
If I am hitting roughly center mass, particularly upper torso, with 6 - 12” (picnic plate outlines on the Barney Fife target) 3-round quick-fire groups, at 12 - 15 feet, I am happy with that, and pretty certain the .45 rounds WILL stop the threat.
I too love them.
Ran into a guy at the range that plumb crazy. For Kimber’s that is.
He had the bottom of the well enlarged so magazines slip in easier and his reloading is faster.
I haven’t go around to doing that.
The colt .380 Mark IV is a VERY good CC weapon. It fits in a back pocket, ankle holster or under the arm very very well. Some good Yellow Jacket, hollow points with steel core and 3/4 jackets will have serious knock down when needed. It’s my alternative to my 1911 big’un.
The current rotation of my carry guns are:
Springfield XD-9 Sub-compact carried OWB in a Fobus paddle holster with a shirt cover (cold season)
S&W 642 .38 carried OWB in a Fobus paddle holster -or- pocket carry in a Desantis Nemesis pocket holster (warm season and BUG)
Kel-Tec PF-9 carried in a Desantis Nemesis pocket holster (warm season and BUG)
Can't do IWB.....just not comfortable for me.
I hadn’t heard about that...I will check into that.
Can’t go wrong with a Ruger LCP.
The real point about of lot of this IMO...
You need less than 6 rounds to protect yourself.
So why pick a weaker smaller caliber weapon to carry more than a few rounds.
You can get ultra-compact weapons of much more lethal caliber.
You hit someone with one critical defense 45 round they have a greater than 80% chance of dying - PERIOD.
So my view is to pick a weapon that can deliver the stopping that will work with one bullet if necessary.
Look at the CZ-82's on the C&R list. They're running around $220 a copy or so and the ammo is cheap. Ballistically it's roughly equivalent to a .38 spl. Better than a .380 but not as powerful as a 9 mil.
They're chambered in 9 x 18 Makarov.
That’s purty. Mrs. Liberty and I just got his and her Taurus .380s. Hers is Barbie-doll pink.
Look at the 000 buckshot patterns. Big holes, about 2.5 inches pattern.
“Can’t do IWB.....just not comfortable for me.”
Man, that’s what I’m thinking too.
I guess I’ll have to try one on, but it seems like it would have to be uncomfortable.
And the reason for the implementation of the 1911 in the first place is because of the Phillipine/American war. This conflict happened as America colonized the Phillipines after the Spainish American war. The Army was fighting Phillipine Guirillas named the Morros. These Phillipinos would get all worked up on drugs and charge the American positions. The Officers found that their .38 service revolvers would take multiple shots to put the Moros down. After that, the Army was in search of a round that would have more stopping power.
Two inches is what I train to perform. Don’t always get it but I can hit in regularly on the range in no stress and about 50/50 on speed drills. I stress 2” because most people under stress will increase that radius 2x or even 3x. I figure 6” in close quarters battle will be good enough to hit the heart or head.
If I did force myself to go IWB, I would have to consider a Crossbreed SuperTuck in horsehide. More of a rig than just a holster...could be comfortable.
They are rated very well, have a smooth trigger pull, and since the PT145 is a 45ACP it packs a punch.
I put a ArmaLaser red dot on mine (it is made just for the PT145 front rail) and use 230gr +P Hydra-Shok ammo. It will put down an attacker ASAP.
I like the Taurus Millennium series so much that I just replaced my wife's carry weapon with the PT111 MilPro (9mm). Load that with the 124gr +P Hydra-Shok ammo and she can do what is needed too (my wife is a GREAT shot even under pressure).
The Taurus Millennium series are built very well and are not hard on the wallet. I got mine via one of the auction web sites and saved a ton of money, even with the transfer fees. The PT11 cost me $370 with shipping and all fees while a local store wants $435 just for the pistol alone. An ArmaLaser costs about $175.
I used to carry either a Colt Gold Cup Int’l Match MkIV (top line 1911) or a Dan Wesson 15-2V with a 2” barrel (revolver). They are both great but the Colt is big and the Dan Wesson is thick, being a revolver. The Taurus is a smaller frame and light weight.
I do not work for, or have any financial dealings with Taurus. I just like their prices and quality. I have expensive weapons too but most are too large to carry and I just do not want to fork over over $1000 for a handgun right now; especially since you can find some great ones at a better price point.
No worries. Two inch groups at 10 - 12 feet, no stress *SHOULD* be doable ... with two hands, ‘rapid’ fire.
See you at the range.
For caliber, there is a good discussion here:
The consensus seems to be that there is no proof that any of the major calibers is better than another at stopping a man.
For carry, think light. The smallest gun I can comfortably shoot accurately is a S&W Model 60. I use 38+P ammo because it has a long record of success with 158 grain bullets, and is a little easier on follow-up shots than when loaded with 357 Mags.
But since you seem to like semiautos OK, I’d say you have a choice of several hundred excellent guns in multiple calibers...
If your size makes concealability difficult, you may have to settle on something like a fanny pack. I don't like them myself. Cross draw can be very difficult for those with a large belly, so consider your physical limitations as well
I’ll have to check on of those out at the range.
Sounds just about right for me.
I looked at the site.
Is that circle leather? Almost looks like wood! :)
So if you wear this on the side, don’t you need pansts with a bigger waist?
I should recuse myself from these things, really.
I reload, and shoot a lot. A lot, for free, because I have a life membership at our range. My wife is a Certified Instructor.
We don't miss. Especially at powder burn range. So maybe our situation is not normal...
I have low caliber weapons for the range that I love to shoot a lot and it definitely is cheaper.
I was referring to being in a situation where you need to use it outside a range...my view is that a larger caliber is better than smaller in that situation.
I have the original shoulder holster and cartridge loop holder. It is a Navy pilot version.
I have been looking at the Taurus 24/7 Compact in .45. I like the rubber grips like on my Judge and the 12+1 capacity is nice. Anybody have any experience with this?
I have a belt holster - likewise, Navy pilot issue (my grandfather was on a carrier on WWII, and got it from a pilot). But IMO it was meant for external carry, not concealed - that big honkin' hammer would catch too easily on clothing.
btw...picked these up for the Judge...they are great and really well made.
I agree. It was over the neck and shoulder over the flight suit. Only problem with it is that it isn’t a +P capable one, otherwise it’s tight, accurate and damn well made.
Bersa Thunder 380 cc
I have a standard Thunder 380 and the cc version is a bit more tapered and comes with a holster.
It’s helpful to me to have two guns that don’t create two learning curves for me.
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