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Apple unveils new iMac with next-gen quad-core processors, graphics and Thunderbolt I/O technology
Mac Daily News ^ | Tuesday, May 3, 2011 8:38 am

Posted on 05/03/2011 9:03:20 AM PDT by Swordmaker

Apple today updated its signature all-in-one iMac with next generation quad-core processors, powerful new graphics, groundbreaking high-speed Thunderbolt I/O technology and a new FaceTime HD camera.

(Excerpt) Read more at macdailynews.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Computers/Internet
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1 posted on 05/03/2011 9:03:24 AM PDT by Swordmaker
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To: ~Kim4VRWC's~; 1234; 50mm; Abundy; Action-America; acoulterfan; AFreeBird; Airwinger; Aliska; ...
Apple refreshes the iMac line with i5 and i7 Quad processors, Thundebolt and HD FaceTime camera—PING!

Please, No Flame Wars, Discuss technical issues, software, and hardware.
Don't attack people!

Don't respond to the Anti-Apple Thread Trolls!
PLEASE IGNORE THEM!!!


Apple iMac update Ping!

If you want on or off the Mac Ping List, Freepmail me.

2 posted on 05/03/2011 9:06:08 AM PDT by Swordmaker (This tag line is a Microsoft product "insult" free zone.)
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To: Swordmaker

Looks sweet. Shame I’m not in the market for a new desktop, though.


3 posted on 05/03/2011 9:11:13 AM PDT by kevkrom ("Winning The Future" = WTF = What The F*** / "Kinetic Military Action" = KMA = Kiss My A**)
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To: Swordmaker

iMac with next generation quad-core processors>>>>>>>

AKA Sandy Bridge. Apple has them and so do Windows machines. They run cooler on less wattage http://computers.shop.ebay.com/Computer-Components-/3667/i.html?_nkw=I5+SANDY+BRIDGE&_catref=1&_dmpt=Desktop_PCs&_fln=1&_ipg=&_trksid=p3286.c0.m282


4 posted on 05/03/2011 9:24:37 AM PDT by dennisw (NZT - "works better if you're already smart")
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To: Swordmaker

Should be interesting to see what the first Thunderbolt peripheral will cost.


5 posted on 05/03/2011 9:26:28 AM PDT by VeniVidiVici (The last Democrat worth a damn was Stalin. He purged his whole Party.)
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To: Swordmaker

I’m looking at my dual-core i3 iMac and reflecting on the fact that the best time to buy a computer is always six months in the future. Oh, well, by the time I’m due for an upgrade, there will be a lot more Thunderbolt peripherals available.


6 posted on 05/03/2011 9:27:54 AM PDT by ReignOfError
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To: Swordmaker

After having my POS HP desktop crash on me twice last night, I am so tempted!!! That or dock my MacBook to a bigger monitor.


7 posted on 05/03/2011 9:31:53 AM PDT by Chipper (You can't kill an Obamazombie by destroying the brain...they didn't have one to begin with.)
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To: Swordmaker

Figures. Three months after the guy in the Apple store swore they had no information about an impending upgrade to the iMac. And I bought one. (In his defense, he probably didn’t know, given how close to the vest Apple plays this stuff.)

Anyway, glad to see the upgrades are significant and not just incremental.


8 posted on 05/03/2011 9:36:53 AM PDT by newheart (The trouble ain't too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right. -Mark Twain)
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To: Swordmaker

yawn... I built my quad-core PC two years ago for less than $1,000.


9 posted on 05/03/2011 9:37:00 AM PDT by BubbaBasher ("Liberty will not long survive the total extinction of morals" - Sam Adams)
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To: BubbaBasher

Software, Monitor, Cost of your time - All included in that price? Would you build me a comparable one to the iMac for under $1000?


10 posted on 05/03/2011 9:49:23 AM PDT by Chipper (You can't kill an Obamazombie by destroying the brain...they didn't have one to begin with.)
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To: newheart

http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/

Never buy an Apple product without first checking that buyer’s guide. The check historical release timelines and all the rumors to come up with what is usually a pretty accurate suggestion.


11 posted on 05/03/2011 10:00:53 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: antiRepublicrat

Yeah, I bought it just as they updated the MacBook Pro. I would have waited but it was a must-buy situation with my old iMac dying in the middle of a big project.


12 posted on 05/03/2011 10:15:18 AM PDT by newheart (The trouble ain't too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right. -Mark Twain)
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To: dennisw
AKA SandyBridge.

AKA current generation.

13 posted on 05/03/2011 10:21:51 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: Chipper; BubbaBasher
> Software, Monitor, Cost of your time - All included in that price? Would you build me a comparable one to the iMac for under $1000?

Sure, no problem! What's time worth, $2/hr? Piece of cake. And good anti-virus software is free and never ever slows down the system, and Windows Updates only take 15 seconds or so, and never cause system problems. And... and...

I actually like Windows 7, so I'm not griping about that per se. But as one who has a few of each (Mac and Win/PC) and uses them all daily, it really is the case that the "cheap PC" ends up costing just as much as a Mac by the time it's all factored in.

The only thing cheaper about a cheap PC is the initial purchase price of the hardware. So I suppose all these "mine is cheaper" folks drive Yugos? The logic is the same.

It's good to live in a country with lots of choices. Everybody should be happy.

14 posted on 05/03/2011 10:23:51 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored
Everybody should be happy.

It makes some people happy to build their own computer.

15 posted on 05/03/2011 10:27:30 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: tacticalogic
>> Everybody should be happy.

> It makes some people happy to build their own computer.

Oh, I know. I've been doing that since 1976 - 35 years.

Trust me, I know the true cost of a homebrew personal computer just as well as a slick pre-assembled one. :)

16 posted on 05/03/2011 10:46:05 AM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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17 posted on 05/03/2011 10:46:26 AM PDT by TheOldLady (Almost as evil as the Freeper Criminal Mastermind)
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To: dayglored

If it’s such a financial drain, why do you keep doing it?


18 posted on 05/03/2011 10:50:03 AM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: antiRepublicrat
Never buy an Apple product without first checking that buyer’s guide. The check historical release timelines and all the rumors to come up with what is usually a pretty accurate suggestion.

Thanks for the link. Mac mini probably due for a refresh this summer. I wonder if they will wait until the release of Lion? At any rate, I will wait.

19 posted on 05/03/2011 11:02:30 AM PDT by stripes1776
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To: dayglored

processor $200
mobo $100
memory $50
video card (good one) $150
power supply $50
case $20
22” monitor $150
Windows 7 Pro $50 (if you know where)
AVG - free
Under $800 for a good pc that will game, assembly time less than an hour.
Not interesting in gaming? Use onboard video and knock $150 off the price.
Of course, not everyone is comfortable with technology, or building their own computer.
I’m wondering what these “hidden costs” are that need to be factored in?


20 posted on 05/03/2011 11:16:21 AM PDT by astyanax (Liberalism: Logic's retarded cousin.)
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To: tacticalogic
> If it’s such a financial drain, why do you keep doing it?

Who said it was a financial drain? It's a question of what satisfies the requirements of the task at hand.

When I have a task that can use something available commercially, I buy it pre-built. OTOH, when I need something that's not available commercially, I build it myself. Simple. I have no agenda -- I only do what's necessary to get what I want to do the job I have to do.

My point was that adding up the initial acquisition cost of a batch of inexpensive PC hardware, and comparing that price to that of a pre-built high-end Mac that comes with support, etc., is a silly comparison that misses some important factors, that's all.

21 posted on 05/03/2011 12:07:12 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: astyanax
components gaming computer good internet and office computer
processor 
mobo 
memory 
video card (good one) 
power supply 
case 
22” monitor 
Windows 7 Pro $50 (if you know where)

$200
$100
$50
$150
$50
$20
$150
 $50 (if you know where)
AVG - free

Under $800 for a good pc that will game, assembly time less than an hour.
Not interesting in gaming? Use onboard video and knock $150 off the price.
Of course, not everyone is comfortable with technology, or building their own computer.
I’m wondering what these “hidden costs” are that need to be factored in?

$70
$70
$45 (4gb) $60 (8gb)
$0 onboard video (Radeon HD4200)
$25
$20
$135  (23" monitor)
 $50 (if you know where)
Microsoft security essentials (free)

$280  Computer
$135  monitor
$405  total


22 posted on 05/03/2011 12:20:17 PM PDT by dennisw (NZT - "works better if you're already smart")
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To: astyanax
> (... list of components and prices...) Of course, not everyone is comfortable with technology, or building their own computer. I’m wondering what these “hidden costs” are that need to be factored in?

For you, or for me, the system you describe is a good deal. You forgot a hard drive, so I mentally added $75 for a good 1TB HD.

Now find the average Win/PC consumer, sit them down, and describe the process to them:

- determining the proper technical specs
- verifying compatibility (e.g. CPU to mobo to memory)
- checking half a dozen vendors to see who has the best prices on ten or so items
- placing orders
- waiting for delivery
- assembly
- checkout/debug

and explain that they can save a few hundred bucks compared to a pre-built system, by doing all those things.

The vast majority will tell youthat a) they can't do it, and b) even if they could, it's not worth the time and hassle.

For you and me, homebrew makes sense.

But my FRiend, we are in the vast minority. The fact that some people can build their own computers (or cars, or houses) does NOT mean it is a useful or viable option for the vast majority of people. For those folks, a pre-built Win/PC or Mac makes much more sense.

Side comment: I used AVG free anti-vir for a couple years, and decided I was tired of the slowing effect on my work. And the free versions of AVG (and Avast, etc.) are not as effective as the paid versions.

23 posted on 05/03/2011 12:20:54 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dennisw

You’ll need a hard drive on that computer.


24 posted on 05/03/2011 12:23:45 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored

$45 for 1 terabyte Samsung eco-green 5400RPM ..saw at New Egg Yesterday. It had a minimum of pissed off reviewers compared to others


25 posted on 05/03/2011 12:25:58 PM PDT by dennisw (NZT - "works better if you're already smart")
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To: dayglored; astyanax
> ...we are in the vast minority...

Oops, that was supposed to be "tiny minority". Majority can be vast (as later in same sentence).

26 posted on 05/03/2011 12:26:29 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored

Add hard drive-— $450 total


27 posted on 05/03/2011 12:27:05 PM PDT by dennisw (NZT - "works better if you're already smart")
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To: dennisw
> $45 for 1 terabyte Samsung eco-green 5400RPM

Surely you jest, 5400 RPM? You must have much more patience than most people. I consider 7200 RPM a minimum, and occasionally have paid a little extra to get 10K RPM for good disk performance (e.g. WD Velociraptor).

Overall, I've been very disappointed in the performance of the "green" drives. They sacrifice too much in the name of smaller energy drain. They do have their place, say in point-of-sale or other low-demand applications. But a system I use daily for real work or play? No way. I replaced the 5400 hard drive in my portable with a 7200; made a noticeable and pleasant difference there too.

28 posted on 05/03/2011 12:32:11 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored

Samsung eco-greens are “fast” 5400 RPM. I have read many review where people say this. Find it more responsive than their 7200RPM

Of course all things being equal 7200rpm drives are faster but...


29 posted on 05/03/2011 12:37:46 PM PDT by dennisw (NZT - "works better if you're already smart")
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To: dayglored

HDD! Oops, yes, I forgot.
I’d spend $100 and pick up a 2 TB Seagate.
Hard drives and power supplies are two items I’ll spend a bit extra on. Worth it in the long run.
(I also forgot a CD/DVD writer. $20)
The main factor in price is if you need one “now” or if you can wait until a deal comes along.
Just last week I picked up an i3 processor and mobo combo for $99. Added $40 in memory, used an existing case and power supply and my daughter has a huge upgrade at minimum expense.
Granted, that wouldn’t be possible if I didn’t have hundreds of dollars in “parts” around from prior upgrades, but with 6 computers in the house, “homebrew” is the only reasonable option if I want to stay current (and solvent) ;)


30 posted on 05/03/2011 1:07:01 PM PDT by astyanax (Liberalism: Logic's retarded cousin.)
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To: dayglored

“Sure, no problem! What’s time worth, $2/hr?”

Man, did you wonder here from the DU? Time only worth $2/hr??


31 posted on 05/03/2011 1:08:52 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: dennisw
> Samsung eco-greens are “fast” 5400 RPM. I have read many review where people say this. Find it more responsive than their 7200RPM Of course all things being equal 7200rpm drives are faster but...

I'm sure their Marketing Department has come up with some inventive way to demonstrate that "less is more", such as carefully selected test results that work on having data in a local cache, etc. Or they've got some very intelligent controller that optimizes for certain conditions common to (say) Microsoft Office tasks. You are correct to say that "all things being equal 7200rpm drives are faster"... marketers don't bother with such technical details. They're only interested in headlines.

But as we all know, rotational speed and seek times are based on physics, not marketing. :)

And while you -can- find dumb 7200 RPM drives that have slower response than intelligent 5400 RPM drives, that's not "all things equal".

And as an aside, you'd be surprised how many people think that because their SATA drive has a 3Gbps serial interface, that they'll get 3Gbps of data from the drive. 20% of that is more realistic. Yet the marketers will quote the interface speed as if it means anything... *sigh*

32 posted on 05/03/2011 1:13:51 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
> Man, did you wonder here from the DU? Time only worth $2/hr??

Hardly. My point was that "saving" $20 of price, by spending 10 hours fussing with something homebrew, is an effective rate of $2/hr.

If you have more time than money, such "savings" can perhaps be justified. But for most people, paying somebody else $20 to do something that would otherwise take you 10 hours, is a bargain.

33 posted on 05/03/2011 1:17:46 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dennisw

Comments:

What’s with the love of cheap cases? Are you guys masochists? Minimum $50 for something halfway decent.

For the office computer, get a CPU/mobo combo deal at Newegg, pretty cheap.

The PSU prices are for the absolute worst garbage you can find on the market. It will have low efficiency, produce unreliable voltages and will be loud. Don’t think of spending less than $50 for a “good” office computer, and expect to spend over $100 for a good gamer PSU.

“If you know where” for Windows 7 Pro is cheating. You should be paying retail. Add at least $100 even if you claim OEM.

Monitor, $150 is fine for office, but for gaming you want better. LED backlight and IPS with a fast response make a gaming monitor, start at over $200 at 23”.

Keyboard/mouse? Cables? Hard drive?


34 posted on 05/03/2011 1:56:17 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: dayglored

Thanks for clarifying that! I was worried about your financial security at $2 per hour!


35 posted on 05/03/2011 1:57:40 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: antiRepublicrat

-It’s a case. You push a button or two on it. Yes, if you want lights and pretty colors, you can pay more.
-Cheap, noisy power supplies can be picked up for $20. You can find a good one for well under $100.
-All my copies of Win7 I picked up for $50. All are registered with Microsoft. Not sure why that’s “cheating”.
Amazon has a Win7 family pack (3 licenses) for $125.
-Samsung 23” monitor (8ms, LCD) $150 at Microcenter.
If you want 5mS response and LED, it’s $180.


36 posted on 05/03/2011 2:35:51 PM PDT by astyanax (Liberalism: Logic's retarded cousin.)
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To: Swordmaker

Still enjoying my 2010 iMac. Expect to be using it for 3-5 more years at least.


37 posted on 05/03/2011 2:52:10 PM PDT by TheStickman
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To: antiRepublicrat
> “If you know where” for Windows 7 Pro is cheating.

Especially if "where" is some fly-by-night internet outfit who is selling stuff that "fell off the truck". Sure, it'll pass WGA and Activation -- it's not a pirate -- but it might be a little bit warm to the touch...

OTOH, all my copies of Windows are strictly legal, no hassles, no worries.

> You should be paying retail.

For most people, yes. In my case, I run so many copies of Windows, between the "on-the-metal" native installs, the three Macs that are BootCamped, and a pocketful of VMs, it turned out cheapest to get an MSDN subscription at the "Operating Systems" level. Pretty much have access to everything, all the latest releases. And I have clean, up-to-date installation ISOs of everything back to Win 3.11, should my little heart desire it.

Obviously, I'm not the average case... :)

38 posted on 05/03/2011 3:12:16 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored
My point was that adding up the initial acquisition cost of a batch of inexpensive PC hardware, and comparing that price to that of a pre-built high-end Mac that comes with support, etc., is a silly comparison that misses some important factors, that's all.

Why is it silly? That's like saying comparing the cost of any DIY project to the cost of contracting it out is silly.

I don't see anything in your criteria for whether to build or buy that involves any cost consideration. You'll build computer, but only if you can't buy one with the required specs, regardless of how much it costs.

In that environment, Macs are probably great. How many people operate in that environment?

39 posted on 05/03/2011 3:28:19 PM PDT by tacticalogic
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To: astyanax

Don’t know where you are getting your parts, but I pay a lot less for a motherboard/cpu combo than you do. Last one I made was over a year ago, I got a quad core amd mobo combo for about $115. Memory is about right. I got 4 gb last time, now would get 6 or 8.Not sure what video card you are using, i would get a 1 gb model for under $50. Gaming, real gaming, is different. Case with power supply is under $50. Monitor is about $30 high. I get stuff on sale at fry’s or geeks, and when i have everything, i put it together. Made about 8 or so computers over the years. The savings is not so much any more.


40 posted on 05/03/2011 3:35:27 PM PDT by Defiant (When Democrats lose voters, they manufacture new voters instead of convincing the existing voters.)
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To: dayglored
Just a couple of notes on some of the stuff guys have been pitching here. The Win7 Pro for $50 (claimed on Amazon could get a 3 pack for $125) was actually a three pack of Windows Home 7, not Pro, and it was for an upgrade, so you would already need to have XP or Vista installed.

Which brings me up to the next thing: Somebody follows the advice and does this and starts to build their own system and gets ready to install their copy of Windows and "Oh, sorry, you must have Vista or XP installed to run this update." This means the poor guy who followed the advice given earlier in this thread either has to track down copies of Vista or XP to install BEFORE installing his Win7, or he can buy Windows 7 Home ($179 or Pro for $265 on Amazon.) Undoubtedly, someone will be along to explain how to fool the installation into thinking you've already got XP installed.

The Samsung monitor one of them was talking about happens to be the one I use for a second monitor with my iMac setup. It's fine for holding the palettes and Photoshop and Aperture control boxes and playing a book on iTunes while I work on photo editing, but I would NEVER use it for the serious photo editing necessary to make sales. The image being edited is ALWAYS on the iMac screen.

So much of the advice given here on building your own box is just garbage.

41 posted on 05/03/2011 3:41:02 PM PDT by Richard Kimball (Proud member of the Keepers Of Odd Knowledge (KOOK))
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To: antiRepublicrat
“If you know where” for Windows 7 Pro is cheating. You should be paying retail. Add at least $100 even if you claim OEM.

On this one I just copied the guy I was responding too. He said you can get Windows 7 for $50. I figured it must be an academic edition. Ask him >>>> astyanax <<< where that $50 copy exists :)

42 posted on 05/03/2011 3:41:42 PM PDT by dennisw (NZT - "works better if you're already smart")
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To: All
So you guys are talking about an $800 computer to build with just the OS on it? Are the Live Essentials comparable, quality-wise to iLife? I didn't see a web page creation software on there (please don't say I can get some freeware/shareware, tried them and iWeb is much easier). Is MovieMaker comparable to iMovie? The last one I used wasn't worth much. Is the Photo Gallery able to do the same things iPhoto is? Just asking because any upgrades over the OS software should be taken into account?

Let's assume 1 hour to put together for someone experienced equal what 3-4 hours for normal people? Last time I installed an OS on to clean HD took at least an hour (XP Media Center). I'm up to 5 hours of my time. My hobby makes me money, so for me it is much more worthwhile to pay for what I need and use the other 4 1/2 hours to put money in my pocket.

43 posted on 05/03/2011 4:00:11 PM PDT by Chipper (You can't kill an Obamazombie by destroying the brain...they didn't have one to begin with.)
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To: antiRepublicrat
What’s with the love of cheap cases? Are you guys masochists? Minimum $50 for something halfway decent.

Cases are 0$. Already have some. 
You can spend $800 on a computer case if you put your mind to it
Or about $35   shipped for one that is functional

For the office computer, get a CPU/mobo combo deal at Newegg, pretty cheap.

That usually works out. You can get a good CPU/mobo combo for $90-$120. You can get cheaper than that but is usually is VGA out on the motherboard. But my minimum requirements are DVI or HDMI out onboard video

The PSU prices are for the absolute worst garbage you can find on the market. It will have low efficiency, produce unreliable voltages and will be loud. Don’t think of spending less than $50 for a “good” office computer, and expect to spend over $100 for a good gamer PSU.

My personal experience with ~$25 ThermalTakes and CoolerMaster has been zero problems

Monitor, $150 is fine for office, but for gaming you want better. LED backlight and IPS with a fast response make a gaming monitor, start at over $200 at 23”.

What I see is an LCD sweet spot of ~$130-140 for 23".
Peeps have been gaming for years with 2-4ms response time LCDs

Keyboard/mouse? Cables? Hard drive?

Does Apple include those things? Not on a Mac-mini
Samsung 1TB eco-green is $45 at New Egg right now but I see deals all the time for 500GB-1TB in the $40-$60 range shipped to your door

44 posted on 05/03/2011 4:04:03 PM PDT by dennisw (NZT - "works better if you're already smart")
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To: dayglored
Here is a NewEgg comment/review on how fast the Samsung 5400RPM eco-green is--->>>

Pros: Silent, very cool running, large capacity and good performance. It's obviously not a screamer at 5400 RPM but unless you're working with exceptionally large files you won't notice it in day-to-day use. I use Eclipse, Netbeans and Sparx Enterprise Architect and even on very large commercial projects (5000+ classes) it's impossible to tell whether I'm running them on a 500GB or 640GB 7200 rpm Samsung drive or this 1TB drive. The only way you'd know it's slower is to measure it very precisely because on small/medium sized files the difference in speed is going to be found to the right of the decimal point.

45 posted on 05/03/2011 4:11:57 PM PDT by dennisw (NZT - "works better if you're already smart")
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To: Defiant
The prices I listed were to build a current (here referred to as “next-gen”) machine with high-end (intel, nvidia) off the shelf parts (i7 processor, mobo with 6gb/s SATA and USB 3.0, etc.)
As for where, mainly Microcenter when they have good deals ($150 GTX 460) and Newegg. I do game so I have way more horsepower than I need. But every couple of years or so when I build the next one, my current unit gets handed down to one of the kids and is good for several additional years. (Daughter has an i3, 9 year old son is using a core 2 duo, and 5 year old is stuck with a p4 and agp card, but it's more than enough for what he uses it for.)
46 posted on 05/03/2011 6:22:51 PM PDT by astyanax (Liberalism: Logic's retarded cousin.)
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To: dennisw
> ...unless you're working with exceptionally large files... on small/medium sized files the difference in speed is [small]...

Like I said, they're doing their "disk" performance testing with a large RAM-based disk cache enabled in the computer. That doesn't measure the speed of the drive, it measures the speed of RAM and software. It's not unreasonable, since RAM disk cache is fairly standard, but it's cheating with regard to rating the performance of the disk.

The true performance of a disk is measured with a setup that exercises the disk, not memory. Modern disks have internal cache in the drive, but it's typically 64MB or less, not 500MB or 1GB like a RAM-based disk cache can have.

The reason that difference matters is that if you're running a lot of programs concurrently, you can't allocate lots of RAM to the RAM-based disk cache, or else you end up swapping running tasks to disk, in which case you're even worse off than before.

You can spend another $40-80 on more RAM (assuming your mobo can hold it) but then you've lost the cost advantage of the "cheap disk".

Lesson: There is no such thing as a free lunch.

47 posted on 05/03/2011 6:25:18 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: tacticalogic
>> My point was that adding up the initial acquisition cost of a batch of inexpensive PC hardware, and comparing that price to that of a pre-built high-end Mac that comes with support, etc., is a silly comparison that misses some important factors, that's all.

> Why is it silly? That's like saying comparing the cost of any DIY project to the cost of contracting it out is silly.

It's silly if the two things being compared are not comparable, other than the one characteristic being compared.

For example, some of the cost of a pre-built computer is the warranty service and follow-up support that comes with it. That doesn't come with a homebrew computer -- you built it, you support it. So how much money do we put in the "price list" of the homebrew, to allow for your time when it goes bug-frack and there's nobody to call? Is your time free? Really?

> I don't see anything in your criteria for whether to build or buy that involves any cost consideration. You'll build computer, but only if you can't buy one with the required specs, regardless of how much it costs.

Perhaps I didn't state that well. Specs cost money, and so does my time. If the specs I want are available pre-built, then I weigh the price of the pre-built machine against the cost of my time building it myself in addition to the component costs, and determine which makes more sense.

Note: Sometimes the experience gained in DIY is very valuable -- might be hard to quantify, but it can argue in favor of DIY too, especially when acquiring a new piece of technology.

48 posted on 05/03/2011 6:34:13 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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To: dayglored

Speaking of things that can’t be compared, you hit the nail on the head with “DIY experience”. If I build it, I know what’s in it. For example, the daughter has an i3, when i7’s drop in price I swap the processor and the box is good for a couple extra years. How do you weigh that value?
As I initially stated, it’s not for everyone. But if you are comfortable with building your own, then repairing your own is just as easy. If mine goes down, I fix it. No need to bring it to an “expert” or drop it off somewhere. It’s up and running again in hours, not days. No labor charge, just parts (on sale) whether it’s a week old or 10 years old. Definitely cheaper in the long run, it’s just the initial (one time) “price” of time that may be costly for some.


49 posted on 05/03/2011 6:55:14 PM PDT by astyanax (Liberalism: Logic's retarded cousin.)
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To: astyanax
> If mine goes down, I fix it.... No labor charge, just parts...

As I stated above, that works if you do not value your time. You work for free. That's okay, but it's not for everybody.

> If I build it, I know what’s in it.

Yep, and that's sometimes the most important thing. My daughter and I put together a series of desktop computers for her over the years, the last of which was a dual-boot Linux/WinXP box. She learned a lot. She also decided, when it came time to get a portable, to get the small Macbook (about $1000) and VMware Fusion to run Windows and Linux as VMs. So she has effectively three computers, portability, plus the high quality and support of an Apple product.

It's great to live in a country and time with lots of choices.

50 posted on 05/03/2011 7:11:39 PM PDT by dayglored (Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government!)
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