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Biographer: Jobs refused early and potentially life-saving surgery
cBS news ^ | 10/20/11 | Staff

Posted on 10/20/2011 8:45:49 PM PDT by SaraJohnson

(CBS News) Apple CEO Steve Jobs refused to allow surgeons to perform what could have been life-saving surgery on his pancreatic cancer, says his biographer Walter Isaacson...

"I've asked [Jobs why he didn't get an operation then] and he said, 'I didn't want my body to be opened...I didn't want to be violated in that way,'" Isaacson recalls. So he waited nine months, while his wife and others urged him to do it, before getting the operation, reveals Isaacson. Asked by Kroft how such an intelligent man could make such a seemingly stupid decision, Isaacson replies, "I think that he kind of felt that if you ignore something, if you don't want something to exist, you can have magical thinking...we talked about this a lot," he tells Kroft. "He wanted to talk about it, how he regretted it....I think he felt he should have been operated on sooner."

(Excerpt) Read more at cbsnews.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Computers/Internet; Health/Medicine
KEYWORDS: cancer; ceoliberalism; healthcare; magicalthinking; stevejobs
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We always ask ourselves how CEO's could support Marxists in power and political correctness.

It is shocking that someone trying to run a major operation like Apple could be so out of touch with the most basic aspects of reality. So much so, it may have killed him.

1 posted on 10/20/2011 8:45:57 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: SaraJohnson

On the other hand, I have yet to hear of anyone surviving pancreatic cancer. Earlier surgery might not have made a difference.


2 posted on 10/20/2011 8:50:25 PM PDT by exDemMom (Now that I've finally accepted that I'm living a bad hair life, I'm more at peace with the world.)
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To: SaraJohnson
I think they call it denial. As said in the article:

Asked by Kroft how such an intelligent man could make such a seemingly stupid decision, Isaacson replies, "I think that he kind of felt that if you ignore something, if you don't want something to exist, you can have magical thinking...we talked about this a lot," he tells Kroft. "He wanted to talk about it, how he regretted it....I think he felt he should have been operated on sooner."

I think this is understandable. People deal with incredible blows differently and I think we all agree Steve Jobs was a mind of a unique mind and way of seeing things. Thus it doesn't surprise me at all that he processed this sort of news differently and even had magical thinking. It shows he lives in a much more creative reality more often than many.

He gave many a great gift. He is allowed to be human. He has given more than most to the earth before passing. I applaud his humanness. We got the best part of the deal.

3 posted on 10/20/2011 8:59:31 PM PDT by GOP Poet (Obama is an OLYMPIC failure.)
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To: exDemMom

You might be right. I have not researched the latest treatment for the disease.

Magical thinking - that you can avoid making the decision or put off the decision when you have cancer, is nutz. If you decide the odds of treatment are too low for the amount of pain and suffering treatment will exact, that is rational.


4 posted on 10/20/2011 9:00:08 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: exDemMom

I know someone that had her pancreas removed, oh... Must be over twenty years ago. Sometimes it works.


5 posted on 10/20/2011 9:00:44 PM PDT by Ramius (personally, I give us... one chance in three. More tea?)
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To: exDemMom

exactly.


6 posted on 10/20/2011 9:01:40 PM PDT by GOP Poet (Obama is an OLYMPIC failure.)
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To: GOP Poet

One of his “smart” gifts was supporting socialists and socialism. Socialism is based on magical thinking and a committed denial of human nature, history and reality. Political correctness is magical thinking which adds up to a pack of dangerous lies.


7 posted on 10/20/2011 9:02:43 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: exDemMom

It can be cured if caught very early, which it usually isn’t.


8 posted on 10/20/2011 9:02:51 PM PDT by Williams (Honey Badger Don't Care)
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To: exDemMom

pancreatic cancer is a death sentence


9 posted on 10/20/2011 9:03:23 PM PDT by faucetman (Just the facts ma'am, just the facts)
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To: SaraJohnson

So refusing anything that could prolong life a couple more years is “stupid”. Interesting value judgement -


10 posted on 10/20/2011 9:13:30 PM PDT by expat1000
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To: SaraJohnson

I agree with you on all those points and am impressed with your point. I’m just willing to give him a pass regarding his reactions to finding out about his cancer. Politics and political philosophy fall into another category however.


11 posted on 10/20/2011 9:16:18 PM PDT by GOP Poet (Obama is an OLYMPIC failure.)
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To: SaraJohnson
I had a close friend who had breast cancer. She had a double mastectomy, chemo, the works, she was feeling much better. Four years she went in for a check up and walked out with a clean bill of health. The fifth year she refused to go in. Nothing we could say would make her go in. Until the day almost a year later when she almost passed out at her daughter's recital.

That was in July. We buried her before Christmas. She knew she was sick she just hoped that if she ignored it it would go away. It didn't.

What makes people do the things they do? Beats the hell out of me.

12 posted on 10/20/2011 9:18:19 PM PDT by Harmless Teddy Bear (*Philosophy lesson 117-22b: Anyone who demands to be respected is undeserving of it.*)
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To: faucetman
pancreatic cancer is a death sentence

Yes and even Steve Jobs could not come up with the ipancreas. Life is also a death sentence and not to many people deal with that straight up and all perfect when they come to realize that means none of us get out of here alive.

13 posted on 10/20/2011 9:21:19 PM PDT by GOP Poet (Obama is an OLYMPIC failure.)
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To: SaraJohnson

Surgery might’ve extended his life another year or two. Most pancreatic cancer isn’t diagnosed until it has already spread to other organs. My dad died 2 months after he was diagnosed.


14 posted on 10/20/2011 9:24:07 PM PDT by toothfairy86
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To: faucetman

pancreatic cancer is a death sentence

Not necessarily anymore. They are using new techniques all the time now. There is the cyberknife surgery (laser) that has been very effective on those with certain types of pancreatic cancer, and there is a new type of treatment, similar to the cyberknife laser surgery, only using electrical pulses of some sort (being done at a hospital in Louisville, KY). One of my relatives had this surgery, and has been told that his cancer is totally gone, using this new method).

There are Ads currently running on TV that feature a woman named Peggy speaking about the cyberknife laser surgery and how it cured her type of pancreatic cancer, and it is five years now since she had her surgery (she’s a real person, not a TV model). So, as more attention is being paid to pancreatic cancer and how to cure it, more and more new methods are hitting the market that will provide a much better survival rate for these types of cancers and others.


15 posted on 10/20/2011 9:26:25 PM PDT by flaglady47 (When the gov't fears the people, liberty; When the people fear the gov't, tyranny.)
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To: SaraJohnson
Apparently, Steve Jobs opted out on certain treatments. Why 'analyze' motive or reason? It was his decision; period.

No doubt, throughout his illness, he was given advice on what or what not to do and what the various consequences of his decision would be.

He chose. With that...it should be left alone ...period.

16 posted on 10/20/2011 9:28:53 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Country Folks can survive....can you? Are you ready?)
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To: Outlaw Woman

BUMP what you said. Great post.


17 posted on 10/20/2011 9:31:23 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: SaraJohnson

If the surgery was a Whipple procedure, look it up....it carries lots of risks and side affects....many people would not opt for it.....pancreatic cancer for the most part is still terminal....very few people survive it for more than a couple of years, although there are people that do....


18 posted on 10/20/2011 9:31:35 PM PDT by cherry
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To: toothfairy86

The article claims his cancer was found early enough to make surgery worthwhile.


19 posted on 10/20/2011 9:32:04 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: SaraJohnson

Steve supported socialism? When and where? The guy didn’t do non-anonymous charitable donations. You have to prove it to me.


20 posted on 10/20/2011 9:35:23 PM PDT by Aqua225 (Realist)
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear
I think it has a lot to do with an overwhelming feeling of lacking control. Some people deal with that by going to the doctors and getting treatment etc.. For others it is too much internally to comprehend. Sort of like PTSD. Some are more likely to get it than others.

The fact that she knew she would be leaving a child behind so early may have been too much to bear. So she acted like it wasn't happening. Very sad. I am so sorry for your lost. Truly.

I have a MIL going through the same. Each time it returns it is that much harder on all of us. Each time it returns it is that much widespread and she has more and more physical repercussions from the chemo.

Life is such a fragile gift. My heart goes out to you. How hard that must have been to have someone you care for ignore it all and then pass so quickly.

21 posted on 10/20/2011 9:37:04 PM PDT by GOP Poet (Obama is an OLYMPIC failure.)
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To: SaraJohnson

Seems he wasn’t as smart as people thought.


22 posted on 10/20/2011 9:37:28 PM PDT by BigCinBigD
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear
and then there's the story of a friend who did everything right after breast cancer...all the appointments etc...except they didn't always check everything in those 5 yrs and now a few years after the magical 5 yrs, she is deathly sick with extensive cancer everywhere...

sometimes, when your time is up, its up, and no medical intervention is going to really change the outcome....having said that, I wish my own mother had agreed or been encouraged to fight her diagnosis...I would have wanted her around another year or two if posssible...

23 posted on 10/20/2011 9:38:49 PM PDT by cherry
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To: flaglady47

P.S., the cyberknife surgeries are non-invasive, they do not cut you open. However, on certain types of pancreatic cancer, they may do a combo of both cyberknife techniques along with what is called a “Whipple” or partial “Whipple” surgery, where they go in and remove and/or bypass certain organs in the area of the pancreas to increase the ability to remove all possible satellites for the cancer. Usually, it is part of the pancreas, the gall bladder, part of the duodenum (sp?), and whatever else will help to make sure the cure is a complete one.

In my relative’s case, luckily none of the cancer had travelled to other organs in the area, and it was caught early in the game, although it was more problematic because of the location in the pancreas of the cancer growth. But all’s well that ended well, thank goodness.

So, if any of your relatives or friends end up with pancreatic cancer, make sure that they do a lot of research into the new methods of treating it, as it has moved into the category of curable cancers if caught soon enough.


24 posted on 10/20/2011 9:41:25 PM PDT by flaglady47 (When the gov't fears the people, liberty; When the people fear the gov't, tyranny.)
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To: GOP Poet

I give him a pass, too. Everyone has the right to make their own decisions about cancer treatment.

It is the magical thinking of his thought process described in the article that struck me as it relates to his political philosphy. Socialism and political correctness is an ideology of magical thinking.

Magical thinking is fine until you are facing real life and death danger...like turning the country over to a racist Marxist with no experience during an economic crisis or sticking your head in the sand when faced with cancer treatment decisions.

He regreted putting his decision about treatment for nine months after they discovered his condition and they found the cancer early. For a “smart” and successful guy, this just struck me as odd. It may explains the CEO socialist disease.


25 posted on 10/20/2011 9:41:53 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: expat1000

You are the idiot who used the word “stupid”, not me.


26 posted on 10/20/2011 9:42:58 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: faucetman
pancreatic cancer is a death sentence

So is Communism: and Socialism is just Communism which hasn't metastasized yet.

Cheers!

27 posted on 10/20/2011 9:44:05 PM PDT by grey_whiskers (The opinions are solely those of the author and are subject to change without notice.)
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To: SaraJohnson; All
He had the surgery in 2004, that means he lived 7 years after he did get the surgery.

Waiting 9 months to do the surgery wasn't wise but, in his case, probably had little or no determining effect on his longevity. He was closely monitored that whole time.

His doctors thought he was "cured" in 2004 when they removed the tumor. Clearly his cancer returned.

28 posted on 10/20/2011 9:44:28 PM PDT by newzjunkey (Republicans will find a way to reelected Obama.)
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To: Outlaw Woman

Why ‘analyze’ motive or reason? It was his decision; period.


If you read the article you will see why I analyzed his treatment decisions and regrets in light of him being attracted to the magical thinking of a politically correct socialist. It might be too complicated.


29 posted on 10/20/2011 9:46:46 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: toothfairy86

I have a friend who died very quickly from that cancer, too.


30 posted on 10/20/2011 9:47:50 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: newzjunkey

If you read the article you will see he regreted waiting 9 months to decide on surgery when they had caught the cancer early and he lied about being cured in 2004. He was saying he was cured while he was undergoing treatment. He did not want anyone to know.


31 posted on 10/20/2011 9:50:30 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: Outlaw Woman

Amen,
The man lived his life as he chose. Screw all this hindsight talk about what he should or should not have done with his life. After all, the man accomplished mountains more than most of us reading this `shoulda-coulda` stuff. Let the man rest.


32 posted on 10/20/2011 9:50:30 PM PDT by myheroesareDeadandRegistered
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To: Outlaw Woman

Amen,
The man lived his life as he chose. Screw all this hindsight talk about what he should or should not have done with his life. After all, the man accomplished mountains more than most of us reading this `shoulda-coulda` stuff. Let the man rest.


33 posted on 10/20/2011 9:50:44 PM PDT by myheroesareDeadandRegistered
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To: Aqua225

Are you kidding? The culture and personna of Apple is as socialist and politically correct as it gets in the corporate world.


34 posted on 10/20/2011 9:52:45 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: Aqua225

Are you kidding? The culture and personna of Apple is as socialist and politically correct as it gets in the corporate world. It would not be a big deal for you to do your own research, but I did it for you.

http://blogs.seattleweekly.com/dailyweekly/2011/01/bill_gates_tops_steve_jobs_in.php

Most of Gates’ contributions—$192,000—went to Republicans. All of Jobs’ donations went to Democrats.


35 posted on 10/20/2011 9:56:42 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: BigCinBigD

Seems he wasn’t as smart as people thought.”

I don’t think people’s decisions about how to handle an issue always has anything to do with smart versus not smart. Seems to me that if the person with the decision to make is someone we love very much, admire or need in some way we want them to make the decision that best fulfills our needs. The sentence that comes to mind is “If I were you, this is what I would decide to do”. But we are not them and it really is their choice. Hopefully it will always be an informed one.


36 posted on 10/20/2011 9:57:24 PM PDT by Grams A (The Sun will rise in the East in the morning and God is still on his throne.)
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To: SaraJohnson
Oh...you wrote the article? You did the analysis? So sorry...I bow to your busybodiness.

It all boils down to that it's none of your business...period.

Steve Jobs made his decision. He no doubt had the best medical advice that money could buy. But wait...there is a FReeper named SaraJohnson that could have shed new light on everything that was told to Steve Jobs and could have saved him.

do I need the tag? ... really?

37 posted on 10/20/2011 9:58:21 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Country Folks can survive....can you? Are you ready?)
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To: cherry

My mom had whipple surgery. She lived 15 years after it. Not fun, but she got to be with meet all her grand children before the cancer came back and she died. She had a great attitude and love for life and family.


38 posted on 10/20/2011 9:58:54 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: SaraJohnson

With that type of cancer, there is no cure surgery or no surgery....When I worked at the hospital I asked one of our surgeon’s that went through the chemo for pancreatic cancer, he was sorry he did, but went back to work until it killed him....


39 posted on 10/20/2011 9:59:59 PM PDT by goat granny
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To: myheroesareDeadandRegistered

Exactly


40 posted on 10/20/2011 10:00:16 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Country Folks can survive....can you? Are you ready?)
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To: Outlaw Woman

And there’s always outlaw woman who doesn’t always quite get it and should just ride off on her high horsey when she’s confused. :)


41 posted on 10/20/2011 10:01:06 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: SaraJohnson; Aqua225
In SaraJohnson's derangement against the late Steve Jobs she gets it wrong. While he did support the DNC and a few candidates in the late 90s and early 2000s, like Bill Bradley against Al Gore, he was not a reliable big money donor and donated absolutely nothing after 2006.

Was he the whacko marxist-socialist CEO she describes? Let's look at his views on education. He blamed the unions for destroying it, for high costs, for robbing it of market competition, he believed in vouchers, in merit based promotion, in teachers not technology. He believed in equality of opportunity, not outcome.

Here's a 1995 in depth interview where you'll see those views: Smithsonian Oral History Interview with Steve Jobs

It seems to me he could best be described as an old line Democrat, one who believed in markets, in opportunity, a kind of Democrat which is effectively extinct today.

42 posted on 10/20/2011 10:03:25 PM PDT by newzjunkey (Republicans will find a way to reelected Obama.)
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To: Outlaw Woman
Apparently, Steve Jobs opted out on certain treatments. Why 'analyze' motive or reason? It was his decision; period. No doubt, throughout his illness, he was given advice on what or what not to do and what the various consequences of his decision would be. He chose. With that...it should be left alone ...period. Exactly.
43 posted on 10/20/2011 10:04:52 PM PDT by GOP Poet (Obama is an OLYMPIC failure.)
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To: Outlaw Woman
Apparently, Steve Jobs opted out on certain treatments. Why 'analyze' motive or reason? It was his decision; period. No doubt, throughout his illness, he was given advice on what or what not to do and what the various consequences of his decision would be. He chose. With that...it should be left alone ...period.

Exactly.

44 posted on 10/20/2011 10:05:08 PM PDT by GOP Poet (Obama is an OLYMPIC failure.)
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To: goat granny

Yeah, it is a nasty cancer. The article claimes Jobs regreted his decision to stick his head in the sand for nine months after they found it. My mom had to have whipple surgery. She lived for fifteen years.


45 posted on 10/20/2011 10:06:45 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: SaraJohnson

Ahhh but my dear, there seems to be a few others on this lame thread that agree; it was Steve Jobs’ decision.


46 posted on 10/20/2011 10:09:25 PM PDT by Outlaw Woman (Country Folks can survive....can you? Are you ready?)
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To: newzjunkey

I heard him talk on a number of occasions and he was a socialist. There are socialist Republicans, too. That is our major problem right now. But Jobs was mainly a politically correct democrat liberal.

I don’t have any hatred towards the man. I just find it amazing that someone that successful would be buying into the magical thinking of socialism and political correctness.

I can tell this really shook ya! You appleites!


47 posted on 10/20/2011 10:10:12 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: SaraJohnson
Your Mom sounds like a wonderful lady and you were blessed with the many years you had.

Steve Jobs had his trajectory as well. May he RIP and may this thread as well.

48 posted on 10/20/2011 10:13:46 PM PDT by GOP Poet (Obama is an OLYMPIC failure.)
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To: SaraJohnson
You are the idiot who used the word “stupid”, not me.

1) When you post an article, you should READ it first!
2) The comment was posted to you as the poster of the article - standard practice here. Nobody said anything what you personally said or didn't say
3) Ad hominem attacks can get you banned. Lighten up and stop being so defensive.

Asked by Kroft how such an intelligent man could make such a seemingly stupid decision, Isaacson replies
49 posted on 10/20/2011 10:26:26 PM PDT by expat1000
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To: SaraJohnson

I don’t think it has to do with accepting reality.

He wouldn’t have survived, anyway. And facing cancer and immortality his way was his right. Ultimately, it was the most private and personal decision he ever made. And even if we don’t agree with it, we must admit that it was his call and no one else’s.

No one has the right to force their medical opinion upon the ultimately life-or -death decisions of a person who has a cancer that is this deadly. It’s impossible to force someone into treatment.

Thank God!


50 posted on 10/20/2011 10:34:22 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife ("Real solidarity means coming together for the common good."-Sarah Palin)
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