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Widow receives accidental-death benefits in auto-erotic electrocution case
nypost.com ^ | April 21, 2012 | BRUCE GOLDING

Posted on 04/21/2012 12:45:48 PM PDT by Free ThinkerNY

A widow has won a bitter victory — her husband’s death by electrocution to the genitals has to be revisited by their insurance company.

Paul Martin, 35, was found lying naked from the waist down in his upstate basement in December 2008 after hooking himself up to an electrical contraption made of purple wire with a bare loop on one end.

“The other purple wire ‘handle’ end was held in the victim’s hand, and the center ‘live’ wire appeared to be a possible switch, which was held in his other hand,” said a police report.

Widow Amanda Martin sued The Hartford life-insurance company after it denied her claim for accidental-death benefits because it said her hubby, an electrical engineer, died from “a deliberate act on his part.”

A federal judge in Rochester sided with The Hartford and pulled the plug on Amanda’s suit last year.

(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: napl

1 posted on 04/21/2012 12:45:50 PM PDT by Free ThinkerNY
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Imagine all the crap we’d be hearing if they did this to Islamoterrorists down at GITMO.


2 posted on 04/21/2012 12:49:40 PM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (It's time for the 47% to start paying their "fair share" of income taxes.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Why should they have to pay benefits when someone kills themselves from stupidity and why would she admit to being married to this guy?


3 posted on 04/21/2012 12:50:10 PM PDT by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: Free ThinkerNY; MeekOneGOP; Conspiracy Guy; DocRock; King Prout; Darksheare; OSHA; martin_fierro; ..
I'm shocked.


4 posted on 04/21/2012 12:52:13 PM PDT by Slings and Arrows (You can't have Ingsoc without an Emmanuel Goldstein.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Did it cure his ED?


5 posted on 04/21/2012 12:53:13 PM PDT by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: GeronL

Well you know they paid the premiums.

To me it would depend on a couple of things. One is the language of the policy. Did it pay for suicide or not?

Also, was this a suicide or an accident. I’m thinking accident because it doesn’t seem likely that a person would chose to kill themselves this way.

The Ins. Co. said “deliberate act” but there are many acts that we make that we don’t think will kill us but do. So I don’t know if by saying “deliberate act” they mean he committed suicide, or should have expected to die.


6 posted on 04/21/2012 12:53:54 PM PDT by jocon307
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To: Free ThinkerNY

The appellate courts usually favor the criminal element, the negligent, the incompetent or other wrongdoers. This principle seems to favor the widow in this case.


7 posted on 04/21/2012 12:58:51 PM PDT by AEMILIUS PAULUS (It is a shame that when these people give a riot)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Goodness gracious great balls of fire.

This certainly was no suicide, nobody would choose such a method. What an embarassing way to die. What do you say to St Peter.....what does he say to you?


8 posted on 04/21/2012 1:00:18 PM PDT by HerrBlucher (FUBO GTFO ABO......RUN BO!)
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To: GeronL
An accident is an accident...it wasn't a suicide after all. If they disallowed every death due to rampant stupidity on the part of the deceased there would be damn few accidental death benefits ever granted.
9 posted on 04/21/2012 1:04:35 PM PDT by hinckley buzzard
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To: GeronL
Why should they have to pay benefits when someone kills themselves from stupidity and why would she admit to being married to this guy?

Beats me and $$$$$$.

Still I can't imagine any amount of money being enough to make someone admit that was her husband.

I suppose it being an embarrassing way to die is eclipsed by the embarrassing fact that now EVERYBODY knows it.

10 posted on 04/21/2012 1:08:16 PM PDT by metmom ( For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: SWAMPSNIPER

LOL. Permanently-cured. The gene pool is a little bit happier, this week.


11 posted on 04/21/2012 1:08:19 PM PDT by carriage_hill (I'd vote for a "orange juice can", before 0bummer&HisRegimeFromHell, gets another 4yrs. Can-> later.)
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To: SWAMPSNIPER

he’s stiff now.


12 posted on 04/21/2012 1:09:34 PM PDT by digger48
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To: HerrBlucher

That’s a “conversation” which I don’t ever want to hear.


13 posted on 04/21/2012 1:09:34 PM PDT by carriage_hill (I'd vote for a "orange juice can", before 0bummer&HisRegimeFromHell, gets another 4yrs. Can-> later.)
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To: carriage_hill
IBTZ!

uh, wait, ummm *nevermind*

14 posted on 04/21/2012 1:11:43 PM PDT by null and void (Day 1187 of America's ObamaVacation from reality [Heroes aren't made Frank, they're cornered...])
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To: GeronL

Stupidity is the root of almost every accident. It’s pretty his going while coming was not intentional unless they were trying to preserve the pelt for sale.


15 posted on 04/21/2012 1:12:54 PM PDT by Steamburg (The contents of your wallet is the only language Politicians understand.)
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To: Steamburg

They need to change their policies so that deaths from auto-erotica doesn’t count.


16 posted on 04/21/2012 1:16:46 PM PDT by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: hinckley buzzard

In future their policy should spell out that auto-erotica deaths aren’t covered.


17 posted on 04/21/2012 1:18:40 PM PDT by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

The few times I’ve been bitten by a faulty outlet or exposed wire tell me that I’d not want to hook it up to my bidness for fun.


18 posted on 04/21/2012 1:21:49 PM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: GeronL

They need to change their policies so that deaths from auto-erotica doesn’t count.


I didn’t know there was an epidemic.
I think a no perverts clause is a little overboard. They still insure people who drive cars and own cell phones...


19 posted on 04/21/2012 1:24:04 PM PDT by Steamburg (The contents of your wallet is the only language Politicians understand.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Why would the insurance company even challenge payment? They can’t possibly believe the guy was TRYING to commit suicide by that method. Duh!


20 posted on 04/21/2012 1:38:35 PM PDT by wildbill (You're just jealous because the Voices talk only to me.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Bodie: He said he didn’t feel like it. And I said, you’d better! And he said, or what? And I said, or else you’re gonna be in trouble. And he said jam it.

Professor Hathaway: That’s a wonderful story, Bodie. I noticed you’ve stopped stuttering.

Bodie: I’ve been giving myself shock treatments.

Professor Hathaway: Up the voltage.
-Real Genius(1986)


21 posted on 04/21/2012 1:41:06 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: HerrBlucher
[Peter Boyle as] Clyde Bruckman: You know, there are worse ways to go, but I can't think of a more undignified way than autoerotic asphyxiation. /X-Files

I think there IS a more undignified way to go...

22 posted on 04/21/2012 1:48:20 PM PDT by Calvin Locke
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Christmas already? “Chestnuts roasting on an open wire”


23 posted on 04/21/2012 1:49:05 PM PDT by cumbo78
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Everyone knows death by erectocution is not a covered event.


24 posted on 04/21/2012 1:55:56 PM PDT by Raycpa
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To: Free ThinkerNY
Did a Google images search.
Seems this is pretty popular these days...and with the ladies too!?

Shocking! ZZZZZZZZZOT :-)

I'm an embedded systems guy, maybe this could be a lucrative sideline....Lol, nah...


25 posted on 04/21/2012 2:02:29 PM PDT by Bobalu (It is not obama we are fighting, it is the media.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Did he get a Darwin award?


26 posted on 04/21/2012 2:04:36 PM PDT by golf lover (going)
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To: SWAMPSNIPER

Yeah, permanently....


27 posted on 04/21/2012 2:07:42 PM PDT by ExNewsExSpook (uoted)
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To: metmom

I’m unclear as to what the wife should be embarrassed about. She was not the one playing around in the basement. Perhaps you think she went knowingly into a relationship in which her life partner preferred painful electric shocks to female companionship. Odds are she didn’t. Men w this type of foible are very good at covering it up. He would not have mentioned, when he proposed, that she would be a lonely wife while he pushed the envelope in his solo ventures.

This woman likely had a rough time of it, whether she ever found out [prior to his death] why he shunned the marriage bed or not. If Hollywood ever made a movie about this type of man he would be funny and fun to be around [what perversion has Hollywood ever not loved?]. In real life they’re horrible partners, as the wife probably learned the hard way.

I don’t understand the thinking on this thread. This woman almost certainly endured a lousy marriage. Her husband’s ‘hobby’ resulted in his death, which as many have pointed out is not the desired result of these autoerotic obsessions. Why should she be penalized all over again, just because she married a screwed up man? Short of a crystal ball, there’s just no way to know w certitude what the spouse is going to be like, and that is just a fact.


28 posted on 04/21/2012 2:13:06 PM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: Free ThinkerNY

When I was an ambulance medic, I actually had such an ambulance call. The deceased was in the basement dressed in a bra and panties and had shocked himself to death using an old fashioned electronic tube tester and wires attached to his nipples. The coroner also ruled this was an accidental death. I felt very sorry for the teenage son who discovered the body.


29 posted on 04/21/2012 2:24:34 PM PDT by The Great RJ
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To: Fantasywriter

I don’t doubt that you are right about the situation she found herself in.

However, I just could not imagine telling people my husband’s cause of death, much less pushing a lawsuit over it.

OTOH, if I was in a marriage in such rough shape, maybe I would do the same thing.


30 posted on 04/21/2012 2:43:46 PM PDT by metmom ( For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
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To: metmom

The lawsuit is about $. A policy was paid into that didn’t exclude accidental death, regardless of how the accident came about. In typically dysfunctional relationships, not a lot of provision is made against such eventualities. I.e.: the man was not planning to die, and probably made no other financial provision for his survivor/s than the ins. policy. The wife probably needs the money for a variety of compelling obligations. I.e.: she isn’t pursuing the policy for publicity, but because she’s desperate to pay bills, mortgage and/or other items.


31 posted on 04/21/2012 2:56:18 PM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: Free ThinkerNY

Spark imagination and a lot of balls whut could go wrong.


32 posted on 04/21/2012 3:30:57 PM PDT by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: Free ThinkerNY
A colleague and I were discussing embarassing ways to die and several were mentioned:

Various rockers who choked on their own vomit
An extremely overweight singer who choked to death on a hero sandwich
Dying while on the toilet, pants around ankles
Several deaths by drowning, whether it's falling off a boat at sea or passing out in the tub at home
Autoerotic strangulation gone wrong

Never got a concensus on which circumstance was most embarassing for those left behind, but this seems to be a contender.

33 posted on 04/21/2012 3:31:41 PM PDT by ZOOKER ( Exploring the fine line between cynicism and outright depression)
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To: RegulatorCountry

My husband and his country cousins as young boys, would always challenge the city cousins who came out to the farm to a pi$$ing contest..to see who could hit the (electric) fence with a stream. Of course the city cousins always won and were proud of being champs.
Some folks are just dumb.


34 posted on 04/21/2012 3:41:08 PM PDT by ruesrose (It's possible to be clueless without being blonde.)
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To: Free ThinkerNY

He was an electrical engineer. Therefore the insurance company could have refused to pay on grounds that it was an intentional suicide.

To require them to pay in such a case defies logic. If a “licensed gun expert”, died while allegedly “cleaning” a handgun, with the bullet entering his right temple and leaving through his left, the assumption must be that he knew what he was doing and intended to commit suicide.

In this case, in that he *might* have been trying to sexually stimulate himself does not overcome his learned knowledge that to do so *that way* could likely be lethal.

And insurance companies have long be excused from paying claims based on suicide.


35 posted on 04/21/2012 4:06:55 PM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy ("It is already like a government job," he said, "but with goats." -- Iranian goat smuggler)
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To: The Great RJ

I know it’s easy to roast perfectly good tubes if the voltage settings aren’t correct. Do you recall the make and model? Hickock made some of the best.

While a tube may test “weak”, it can still work OK in circuit. Similarly, a tube that tests “good” may not. The best test of a tube is whether or not it works in the equipment.


36 posted on 04/21/2012 5:25:55 PM PDT by Freedom4US
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

Just be thankful you were never the wife of a man w a serious sexual perversion. It’s no coincidence that a man who is fascinated w/obseessed by the auto-eroticism of applying electrical jolts to his genitals would become an electrical engineer. On top of which, neither of us knows how well off or desperately in need this man left his wife, or if there are children involved. [I didn’t read the article. Did it specifically mention children as survivors?]

It would be great if there was some kind of premarital test to reveal deep-seated sexual perversions. A lot of agony could be avoided thereby. People who harbor these fundamental disorders are nothing if not brilliant at covering them up. It would be fascinating to find out if or even when [prior to his death] the wife found out about her husband’s ‘hobby’. Sometimes if the revelation comes post-children, the wife will try to stick it out for their sakes. It’s a sad, hard, no-win situation.


37 posted on 04/22/2012 8:12:05 AM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: Fantasywriter

While ultimately sympathetic to the wife, and possible children, the issue remains, are they so sympathetic that you are willing to give them $80,000 of your own money?

This is what The Hartford Insurance Company’s underwriters are being asked to do.

Thus my argument is that Insurers need some way to avoid paying off on “illegitimate” insurance claims, no matter how sympathetic the survivors. Otherwise it is “free money” to all the “puppies and kittens” out there, *at the expense* of those with “legitimate” claims, as well as those whose premiums are increased to pay for kindness to others.


38 posted on 04/22/2012 8:27:55 AM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy ("It is already like a government job," he said, "but with goats." -- Iranian goat smuggler)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
Sympathy has zero to do w the claim itself. That issue is based solely on whether the man intended to auto-erotically stimulate himself or commit suicide. The activity in which he was engaged at death is well known in the realm of auto-eroticism, but is statistically non-existent as a method of suicide per se.
39 posted on 04/22/2012 8:39:26 AM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: Fantasywriter

Well, each of us can claim agreement with at least one federal judge. I doubt the case will be appealed, because by now, the expense of the case already probably exceeds the original judgment.

The Hartford does not want the legal precedent, so they might appeal, but the widow will likely not get any amount of money after the lawyers bills.


40 posted on 04/22/2012 1:27:58 PM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy ("It is already like a government job," he said, "but with goats." -- Iranian goat smuggler)
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Yes the couple had sex issues... BECAUSE THE MAN HAD HYPERTENSION AND DIABETES!

Dude’s junk didn’t work. He was an engineer. He tried to make his junk work himself.

Good initiative, bad judgment. We got an app - er, PILL - for that!

Although perhaps his heart was too deemed too delicate for the little blue pills, so back to the drawing board - which I guess someone beat him to (pardon the pun), going by the items shown in post #25.

Death by stupidity, or too embarassed to order a device, but not suicide. Insurance should pay, IMO.


41 posted on 04/22/2012 1:54:46 PM PDT by Titan Magroyne (What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
On the surface Hartford took an incredible position. They posited that this man's choice of suicide methods was unspeakably painful, and would necessarily and intentionally result w him being known to posterity as the man who was found dead, half naked in the basement w his genitals hooked up to a lethally sadistic electrical device. Anybody who sincerely believes that is either gullible or just plain clueless [about not only human nature, but about auto-eroticism as well].

The insurance co. doesn't care if their narrative is plausible or not. Their goal is simply to protect the bottom line. I.e.: rather than admit the obvious: that a sexual deviant accidentally killed himself, they threw everything they had at the widow and children. From a secular perspective, such a business plan certainly makes perfect sense. I wouldn't personally want to answer for it on Judgment Day, however.

42 posted on 04/22/2012 4:25:43 PM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: Fantasywriter

Two bits about insurance companies. The first from Katrina, where if a home had wind insurance, the company would not pay, claiming the damage was from the flooding; and if the home had flood insurance, the company would not pay, claiming the damage was from the wind.

The second was of a particularly vehement lawyer working for the insurance company of a power company. Some guy had the brilliant idea to lean his very tall, aluminum ladder against a tree branch he was cutting. When the branch was cut, it no longer supported the ladder, which fell forward into power lines.

After he had won the case, that this was not the fault of the power company, he volunteered to sue the estate of the dead man, for “misappropriation-theft of electricity”. The power company wisely told him no.


43 posted on 04/22/2012 5:10:28 PM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy ("It is already like a government job," he said, "but with goats." -- Iranian goat smuggler)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

Those are two very interesting stories. I had my own personal, extremely vile experience w an ins. co. I try not to extrapolate from that one single experience to the entire industry, however. There are good and bad in every walk of life.


44 posted on 04/22/2012 5:21:50 PM PDT by Fantasywriter
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To: jocon307

Did David Carradine’s life insurance policy pay out?


45 posted on 04/24/2012 4:11:04 PM PDT by a fool in paradise (Barack Obama continued to sponsor Jeremiah Wright after he said "G.D. AMERIKKA!"Where's the outrage?)
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To: a fool in paradise

“Did David Carradine’s life insurance policy pay out?”

I have no idea. Most life ins. policies have a suicide clause that excludes pmt for suicide for at least a few years, some might always exclude it, I don’t know.

That makes sense to me, but even though it is gross, if you kill yourself in some stupid sex game, by accident, not on purpose, how is that different from falling off a ladder, etc.?

And wasn’t there some question that Carradine was murdered? I don’t know if that was ever a serious question or just the family being in denial.


46 posted on 04/24/2012 4:45:41 PM PDT by jocon307
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To: jocon307

I think the murder inquiry came from leaked details (true?untrue?) that David Carradine was tied up, unable to have choked himself to death with oxygen deprivation even if he was engaging in auto-erotic asphyxiation.

Probably paid someone (or met someone socially) who offered to play along and ran out when things required the authorities to step in.


47 posted on 04/24/2012 4:52:54 PM PDT by a fool in paradise (Barack Obama continued to sponsor Jeremiah Wright after he said "G.D. AMERIKKA!"Where's the outrage?)
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To: Fantasywriter

You make a lot of sense.


48 posted on 04/24/2012 4:57:52 PM PDT by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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