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Dealing with "No Weapons on Allowed on Property" (Vanity)

Posted on 04/30/2012 1:22:04 PM PDT by Sopater

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To: Sopater
Here in Ohio we have pre-printed laminated cards to leave at such establishments reading:

"We have noticed your sign, and are going to respect your wishes by shopping elsewhere ... You lost our business today and in the future". The opposite side reads "As an Ohio Concealed Handgun License Holder, I

. Have no felony convictions (lifetime)

. Have never been convicted of any drug offense

. Have passed a criminal history background check

How much do you know about your other customers?"

Immediately after CCW was passed in Ohio signs prohibiting weapons carry could be seen in the windows of many if not most stores in this part (northeast) of the State. Now they are a rarity. I doubt these cards had very much to do with the change but in a small way they may have helped.

51 posted on 04/30/2012 2:35:25 PM PDT by katana (Just my opinions)
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To: Hot Tabasco

Your limp may be a give away.


52 posted on 04/30/2012 2:36:00 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: muir_redwoods
"I taught martial arts for 15 years and I can make a deadly 'weapon' out of a rolled up magazine."

But an armed and trained property owner doesn't have to consider that as being a weapon. I've done martial arts for many years, too, along with personal security, establishment security, police work, warfare (service) and more. Everyone's vulnerable and fragile to something or other, but people can always improve their odds.

History shows us that as the economic and moral situation gets poorer for many, property rights will be more well upheld (Fourth Amendment, others) along with the Second Amendment.


53 posted on 04/30/2012 2:36:00 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of rotten politics smelled around the planet.)
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To: Sopater
What is the fine for exercising your right to free speech on private property? For demanding a fair and speedy trial? For denying illegal searches and seizures?

Our Second Amendment rights are no less than those. Why should a property owner be allowed to deny the one and not the others?

Our right to keep and bear arms does not disappear when we step over some arbitrary threshold.

54 posted on 04/30/2012 2:37:22 PM PDT by IronJack (=)
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To: muir_redwoods

Deadly weapons are also defined in statutes.


55 posted on 04/30/2012 2:41:30 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of rotten politics smelled around the planet.)
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To: Lazamataz

The bomb, the rifle, the grenades and the pistol don’t make you look tough.

Allowing that eagle to put his talons in you bare shoulder is what makes you impressive.


56 posted on 04/30/2012 2:42:41 PM PDT by 353FMG
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To: CodeToad
Funny, while you are on your highhorse about private proeprty rights you don’t seem to mention the person as private property and the rights of that property, such has the right to self defense and private concealment. What’s next, the right to search my wallet?

Nothing funny about it. Any private property owner has the right to prevent firearms on their property, whether you like it or not.

And to answer your really stupid question, no, the private property owner has no right to search your wallet nor your personal body..........

It might help if you just stick to the issue of private property owners having the right to restrict firearms on their premises without bringing bogus arguments of wallets and body searches into the equation......Sheesh!

57 posted on 04/30/2012 2:45:01 PM PDT by Hot Tabasco (My 6 pack abs are now a full keg......)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies

“A property owner is within his natural rights to make your entry conditional on you submitting your wallet for inspection - and you are within your natural rights to decline those terms and not enter.”

It’s not that simple. At the least there is a conflict of rights.

People have a right “...to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches...” The Constitution/Bill of Rights secures that right against government (theoretically at least). Governments are to secure that right against other people (”...to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men...” and all that).

You do not lose all your rights just because you are on the property of someone else. If you did, you wouldn’t even have the right to leave without permission.


58 posted on 04/30/2012 2:46:41 PM PDT by KrisKrinkle (Blessed be those who know the depth and breadth of their ignorance. Cursed be those who don't.)
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To: familyop
What is the fine for exercising your right to free speech on private property?

So it's your "right" to walk into a house of worship, or the local Atheist Club, and denounce the beliefs proclaimed there - and the owners will violate your rights by ejecting you? No sale.

59 posted on 04/30/2012 2:51:32 PM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: KrisKrinkle
Governments are to secure that right against other people

If it's my property, your only right is to decline the search and promptly leave. I didn't have to let you in at all, so of course I get to let you in or let you stay only on conditions specified by me.

60 posted on 04/30/2012 2:56:14 PM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: Last Dakotan
Respect property rights

My thoughts 'zackly.

61 posted on 04/30/2012 3:00:44 PM PDT by Cyber Liberty (Obama considers the Third World morally superior to the United States.)
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To: CodeToad
"Funny, while you are on your highhorse about private proeprty rights you don’t seem to mention the person as private property and the rights of that property, such has the right to self defense and private concealment."

There's the right to transport that person/property off of my property at my discretion. Any unwelcome person is a trespasser. Moreover, there's a "No Trespassing" sign at every (private) entrance several miles away in this case, so any uninvited person within several miles is a trespasser. Even my "highhorse" is secure. You've disregarded some pertinent and important constitutional rights.


62 posted on 04/30/2012 3:01:58 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of rotten politics smelled around the planet.)
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To: Sopater

Have a look at the no trespassing sign at the following site.

http://www.narlo.org/sign.html


63 posted on 04/30/2012 3:05:44 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of rotten politics smelled around the planet.)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies
"So it's your "right" to walk into a house of worship, or the local Atheist Club, and denounce the beliefs proclaimed there - and the owners will violate your rights by ejecting you? No sale."

You quoted someone else's comment and attributed that comment to me. That wasn't very nice. I did not write the comment that you quoted and argued against.


64 posted on 04/30/2012 3:11:12 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of rotten politics smelled around the planet.)
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To: mamelukesabre

Private property that is within 1000 ft. of school grounds is exempted in Wisconsin.


65 posted on 04/30/2012 3:15:10 PM PDT by Sopater (...where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. - 2 COR 3:17b)
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To: 353FMG

Actually, the WI CCW law does address that in the way post #47 describes it.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2878243/posts?page=47#47


66 posted on 04/30/2012 3:19:57 PM PDT by Ladysmith (The evil that's happening in this country is the cancer of socialism...It kills the human spirit.)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies

“If it’s my property, your only right...”

At least your saying I have some right. At least your not saying like some folks do, that property rights (whatever they are) trump all other rights. That’s good.


67 posted on 04/30/2012 3:25:47 PM PDT by KrisKrinkle (Blessed be those who know the depth and breadth of their ignorance. Cursed be those who don't.)
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To: Sopater

Stick with the law. Shop somewhere else.

We need a WI version of this to drop off at No-Gun businesses: http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/publicfiles/pdf/NGNM-card.pdf


68 posted on 04/30/2012 3:30:02 PM PDT by Ladysmith (The evil that's happening in this country is the cancer of socialism...It kills the human spirit.)
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To: Sopater
The Madison PD Faq says:
What are the requirements of the sign?

The sign must be at least 5 inches by 7 inches and indicate that weapons are prohibited on the property. Signs must be posted near all entrances to the building where the restriction applies.

If the sign complies with the law (5x7 or bigger) and is on every entrance, then you should comply with the law, not give the business your patronage, and tell them why.

If the signage is not in compliance with the law, then it's not in compliance. I would recommend you take a camera-phone picture of the non-compliant sign and transmit it to your email as a record of it before deciding to ignore it.

69 posted on 04/30/2012 3:35:55 PM PDT by PapaBear3625 (In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - George Orwell)
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To: Ladysmith

Very nice.


70 posted on 04/30/2012 3:40:07 PM PDT by Sopater (...where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. - 2 COR 3:17b)
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To: Sopater
As a comfort, off-duty and retired police are under the same restrictions as CCW holders, as far as carrying into posted businesses. WI Senate Bill 555 was introduced to give off duty cops special privileges to ignore No Weapons signs, but it failed to pass. (Heh!)
71 posted on 04/30/2012 3:43:22 PM PDT by PapaBear3625 (In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - George Orwell)
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To: Sopater

Not only am I exempted, but so is anyone going to or from my house. In other words, its a stupidass law that is un enforceable and every cop, lawyer, and judge knows it. Just don’t walk INTO a school with a gun and you’ll be fine.


72 posted on 04/30/2012 3:58:02 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: Lazamataz

Those crotch chompers and Johnson are an accident waiting to happen.


73 posted on 04/30/2012 4:12:08 PM PDT by Rebelbase
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To: CodeToad
you don’t seem to mention the person as private property

You're a century and a half off. 'Persons' haven't been private property in this country since December 6, 1865.

74 posted on 04/30/2012 6:13:29 PM PDT by PAR35
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To: muir_redwoods

75 posted on 04/30/2012 8:53:46 PM PDT by Oztrich Boy (This world is a comedy to those that think, a tragedy to those that feel - Horace Walpole)
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To: Oztrich Boy

“What about pointed sticks?”


76 posted on 04/30/2012 8:54:48 PM PDT by dfwgator (Don't wake up in a roadside ditch. Get rid of Romney.)
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To: familyop
You quoted someone else's comment and attributed that comment to me. That wasn't very nice. I did not write the comment that you quoted and argued against.

D'oh! I apologize - I meant to reply to the post immediately above yours.

77 posted on 05/01/2012 11:41:13 AM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: IronJack
What is the fine for exercising your right to free speech on private property?

So it's your "right" to walk into a house of worship, or the local Atheist Club, and denounce the beliefs proclaimed there - and the owners will violate your rights by ejecting you? No sale.

78 posted on 05/01/2012 12:05:57 PM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: CodeToad
"Funny, while you are on your highhorse about private proeprty rights you don’t seem to mention the person as private property and the rights of that property, such has the right to self defense and private concealment. What’s next, the right to search my wallet?"

Obviously, you did not read my post. If you did, then you did not comprehend it. The owner of property has the legal right to prohibit others from bringing firearms on to his property. The gun owner, while he has a right to carry, does not have a right to bring his gun onto the private property of another where that property owner has given notice that firearms are not permitted on his property. How you jump to the "right to search my wallet" line, I can not figure out. As I stated in my post, the gun owner has the choice of either leaving his gun behind to enter that property or not enter it at all. If it is a business establishment, the proprietor is doing two things... he's turning away business and he's putting a big target on his back. As for getting down off my "high horse", I'll do that once you pull your head out of your behind.

79 posted on 05/01/2012 12:16:45 PM PDT by RayBob (If guns kill people, can I blame misspelled words on my keyboard?)
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To: JustSayNoToNannies
"D'oh! I apologize - I meant to reply to the post immediately above yours."

Now that's honor. I respect you more than most now. :-)


80 posted on 05/01/2012 4:28:27 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of rotten politics smelled around the planet.)
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To: bolobaby

>>You could lose your right to carry forever.<<

A right is NOT something that you must pay cash for and renew every five years. Your God given rights don’t require you to approach bureaucrats on your knees with a handfull of cash dollars.


81 posted on 05/02/2012 9:11:59 PM PDT by B4Ranch (There's Two Choices... Stand Up and Be Counted ... Or Line Up and Be Numbered .)
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To: B4Ranch

While I agree with you in principle, that’s not the way it works in reality.

The gubbermint will happily take away your right to bear arms. If you disagree, you will spend many long years in jail until you are forced to agree.


82 posted on 05/03/2012 5:46:50 AM PDT by bolobaby
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To: bolobaby

Yes, if you rub it in their faces, act like a fool and force the cops to take action they will but if you carry concealed, don’t inform anyone that you are armed for self defense, guess what, they’ll walk on by.

How do I know? 45 years of practicing what I preach. I conceal carry 100% of the time I am outside my home.


83 posted on 05/03/2012 8:03:40 AM PDT by B4Ranch (There's Two Choices... Stand Up and Be Counted ... Or Line Up and Be Numbered .)
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To: familyop
I have no choice but to apologize for my mistakes - I make so many, there's no time to defend them all.
84 posted on 05/03/2012 2:35:21 PM PDT by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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