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F-22 Pilots Donít Want to Fly the F-22
Gizmodo ^ | May 1, 2012 | Sam Biddle

Posted on 05/01/2012 11:25:46 AM PDT by Daffynition

Not exactly a grand gesture of confidence: some of the US Air Force's airmen, the world's most elite, want nothing to do with the Air Force's "elite" new fighter. Why? Because the only people it's threatening are its own pilots. ABC News reports, shockingly, that the admission came from within the Air Force itself—the Pentagon isn't usually a font of mea culpas:

Gen. Mike Hostage, commander of Air Combat Command at Langley Air Force Base in Hampton, Va., told reporters that a "very small" number of pilots have asked not to fly the fifth-generation fighter jets or to be reassigned.

(Excerpt) Read more at gizmodo.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Military/Veterans; Science
KEYWORDS: aerospace; f22
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To: saleman

Just need to get the right people working on a real solution.


21 posted on 05/01/2012 12:25:29 PM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves.)
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To: Daffynition

That picture was taken over the Sierra Nevada of California, just south west of the town of Big Pine. Boundary Peak 13,147’ (highest mountainin Nevada) and 14,282’ White Mountain Peak in California can be seen in the distance across the Owens Valley.


22 posted on 05/01/2012 12:42:48 PM PDT by Inyo-Mono (My greatest fear is that when I'm gone my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them)
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To: Osage Orange

Shhh! Don’t tell the Chinese that our “radar absorbing coating” is actually Duck tape!


23 posted on 05/01/2012 1:01:10 PM PDT by Boogieman
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To: saleman

Makes you happy it’s one of ours. :)


24 posted on 05/01/2012 1:02:12 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man (I can neither confirm or deny that; even if I could, I couldn't - it's classified.)
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To: Secret Agent Man

Yep. That was probably 15 years ago. It gave me chills writing about it. Awsome is not too strong a word. I just couldn’t believe that something that big could accelerate that fast.


25 posted on 05/01/2012 1:12:39 PM PDT by saleman (!!!!)
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To: Inyo-Mono

Cool. Isn’t that near where Steve Fossett met his end?


26 posted on 05/01/2012 1:13:55 PM PDT by Daffynition (Our forefathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: Hot Tabasco

Geez...I hope not!


27 posted on 05/01/2012 1:16:16 PM PDT by Daffynition (Our forefathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: longtermmemmory
is someone pushing drones?

I think drones are a HUGE improvement over manned fighters. 1) A HUGE part of the cost of a manned plane is the systems to keep the man safe. 2) Downed pilots can be a great source of POWs for an enemy. 3) Performance limitations are generally based on what the human pilot can endure, not the airframe.

28 posted on 05/01/2012 1:17:13 PM PDT by Onelifetogive (I tweet, too... @Onelifetogive)
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To: Taxman
I trust SG's opinion in matters such as this.


29 posted on 05/01/2012 1:20:13 PM PDT by Daffynition (Our forefathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: saleman
Wild Bill, is that you? :)


30 posted on 05/01/2012 1:27:32 PM PDT by Daffynition (Our forefathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: Daffynition
Cool. Isn’t that near where Steve Fossett met his end?

Yes, Fossett crashed about 45 miles north of there in the Minerets near Mammoth Lakes Ski area on the eastern border of Yosemite Park.

31 posted on 05/01/2012 2:09:34 PM PDT by Inyo-Mono (My greatest fear is that when I'm gone my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them)
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To: Daffynition
Not a whole lot of info out there on how the onboard system works and why the F22 might be different.

This is the best I've found so far. It is from a F35 special interest forum http://www.f-16.net/f-16_forum_viewtopic-t-15547.html and is worth reading. Has a fair number of links also.

32 posted on 05/01/2012 3:07:11 PM PDT by dickmc
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To: RexBeach

Before you get excited, look who the story is by. There are other reasons why young pilots might not want to fly the F-22, such as the next major combat mission will be in them.


33 posted on 05/01/2012 4:01:48 PM PDT by maxwellsmart_agent
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To: RexBeach
F-22s in the UAE May Just Be There for an Exercise, Really [honest, maybe]
34 posted on 05/01/2012 4:53:46 PM PDT by Daffynition (Our forefathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: saganite
O system getting a redo
35 posted on 05/01/2012 5:17:31 PM PDT by Daffynition (Our forefathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: Daffynition

Hypoxia kills. No pilot would knowingly or willingly fly an aircraft with an unpredictable fault in the cockpit pressurization/O2 system.

Jeez — we have been sending folks into space for a long time now. Seems reasonable to me that a “Murphy” proof cockpit pressurization/O2 system is within reach?


36 posted on 05/01/2012 9:57:49 PM PDT by Taxman (So that the beautiful pressure does not diminish!)
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To: Taxman
Seems that as of March, investigators were still puzzled about the problem.

I was thinking about Chinese made parts for the SNAFUs.

G-forces? This is like owning a Ferrari, but you aren't allowed to put it into 6th gear.:(

37 posted on 05/02/2012 12:56:51 AM PDT by Daffynition (Our forefathers would be shooting by now.)
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To: kosciusko51
Yesterday, it was how the F-35 is a terrible platform. Now, its the F-22. What the heck has happened to manned military aviation?

The F-35...I have a lot of doubts about it - I think they are trying to do too much with it and I think the costs are creeping far too high - we are truly headed towards the day we can buy only one plane, and the Air Force gets to fly it Monday-Wednesday, the Navy Thursday through Saturday, and the Marines on Sunday, but that's for another thread.

In general, the systems are getting more and more complex. I heard about this F-22 problem a while back through friends, but it was very hush-hush, and the AF was trying to work out the oxygen problems with some contractors without it getting out into the media. It was known within the AF community, but just not really public.

I'm very surprised that the AF would publicly admit it is having problems. I'm more surprised that it's still a problem at this point. While it's a very complex aircraft, they didn't exactly have to reinvent the oxygen/life support system. This is like the Army buying a $5 million vehicle and having tire problems a few years after it's in the field.

For those bashing the pilots, I don't think folks realize that for pilots to risk their careers over this, it must be pretty bad. If they ruin their careers over this, they can't just waltz into a cushy civilian job.
38 posted on 05/02/2012 1:13:18 PM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: maxwellsmart_agent
There are other reasons why young pilots might not want to fly the F-22, such as the next major combat mission will be in them.

You don't know what's going on, so I guess you automatically assume that you should bash the military. Nice.

Newsflash, they didn't join the AF and go through all of the training to become F-22 pilots only to decide it wasn't for them. Refusing to fly could potentially end their careers and lead to crappy careers in civilian life.

You've obviously never flown, but I'll give you the short summary: If a pilot encounters this problem, it doesn't matter whether they've been in 5 years or 20 years, it's a problem that kills all too easily. We've actually been very lucky so far not to loose more.

What bothers me most is that the AF grounded the F-22s last year because of an increase in incidents. I can't believe it's still a problem here in 2012. Like I said, they aren't exactly reinventing the wheel here.
39 posted on 05/02/2012 1:33:09 PM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: Taxman; Daffynition
Jeez — we have been sending folks into space for a long time now. Seems reasonable to me that a “Murphy” proof cockpit pressurization/O2 system is within reach?

Something weird is happening if they haven't been able to figure out the issue. It should not be that hard to debug the hardware, which makes me wonder about the software.

After all, we all remember back about 5 years ago, or maybe 6 years ago, when a group of F-22s flew across the date line and started having computer failures. I really wonder about the software. From what's been said publicly, they've looked at the whole system, top to bottom, looking for ways fumes could be introduced or oxygen restricted.

I'm surprised at how many times F-22s have been grounded for this issue over the past year.
40 posted on 05/02/2012 1:42:43 PM PDT by af_vet_rr
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