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What Should I Do with Monies in Retirement Accounts
09.27.12 | Chickensoup

Posted on 09/27/2012 9:42:18 AM PDT by Chickensoup

I need some advice. I have a small amnount of money in two different brokarge Ira and rollover accounts. Both monies have been moved to cash assets. Not a lot int there but almost enough to pay off the mortgage.

I cannot access it without penalties until next May, which is when I plan to pay off the mortgage. I worry about that money with the way the world is, it may be a widow's mite, but it is the only thing that will let me payoff and keep my house.

If everything goes bad will the moneis evaporate or will it just not be worth anything. I can pay off with worthless moneis I assume?


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KEYWORDS: gold; ira; money; preciousmetals; retirementaccount
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I need some advice. I have a small amnount of money in two different brokarge Ira and rollover accounts. Both monies have been moved to cash assets. Not a lot int there but almost enough to pay off the mortgage.

I cannot access it without penalties until next May, which is when I plan to pay off the mortgage. I worry about that money with the way the world is, it may be a widow's mite, but it is the only thing that will let me payoff and keep my house.

If everything goes bad will the moneis evaporate or will it just not be worth anything. I can pay off with worthless moneis I assume?

1 posted on 09/27/2012 9:42:26 AM PDT by Chickensoup
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To: Chickensoup

why would anyone pay off a mortgage in a lump sum? unless the interest rate is horrendous, mortgage is probably the
lowest cost money available to regular folk. i’d pay off
higher interest debt first.


2 posted on 09/27/2012 9:46:25 AM PDT by RitchieAprile (my French needs no pardoning..)
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To: RitchieAprile

It is my only debt.


3 posted on 09/27/2012 9:48:03 AM PDT by Chickensoup (STOP The Great O-ppression)
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To: Chickensoup
If everything goes bad will the moneis evaporate or will it just not be worth anything. I can pay off with worthless moneis I assume?

If your mortgage has a fixed interest rate, a high-inflation, higher interest rate scenario would not be a bad thing. I would not pay mortgage off in lump sum...you'll still need cash for maintenance and property taxes.

4 posted on 09/27/2012 9:49:36 AM PDT by Lou L (Health "insurance" is NOT the same as health "care")
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To: Chickensoup
Give it to me. I know what is best for it. You didn't build that.
/barack
5 posted on 09/27/2012 9:50:00 AM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: Chickensoup
Read some Ann Barnhardt - America is going down the crapper what with QE1, QE2, Twist, QE3 to infinity. Watch out when the bond markets can no longer find buyers for US Bonds............

Personally I am getting out of all stocks, dumped by 401K and am liquidating my IRAs before the Government takes them. I am gladly paying the taxes upon liquidation - the proceeds are all going into gold and silver, leaving enough in bonds to live off the interest (and my paltry SS check).
6 posted on 09/27/2012 9:50:10 AM PDT by Cheerio (Barry Hussein Soetoro-0bama=The Complete Destruction of American Capitalism)
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To: Chickensoup

I would say that wait until the penalties are not applicable to you.........................


7 posted on 09/27/2012 9:50:36 AM PDT by Red Badger (Is it just me, or is Hillary! starting to look like Benjamin Franklin?.................)
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To: Chickensoup

Contrary to #2, if you don’t have other debt, I’d say paying off the mortgage make sense, depending on your situation. If you’re unemployed, retired, or may become such - there’s a big difference between paying a property tax bill and utilities vs. having to pay all that plus a mortgage payment every month. If you’re gainfully employed and feel you will be until the mortgage is paid, then I’d talk with a financial advisor about a way to earn some interest while not taking big risks. YMMV. But there’s something to be said for being debt-free in these uncertain economic times. Good luck.


8 posted on 09/27/2012 9:50:45 AM PDT by bigbob
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To: Chickensoup
Tough call, If Romney wins make payments and hold the cash. If zer0 pulls it off, pay off the damn house cause it might be worth nothing quick. At least thats a biil that will be gone. Now you just got to eat, heat and buy clothes.
I am in a similar situation but have a few more years to work. God Bless and best wishes
9 posted on 09/27/2012 9:52:00 AM PDT by reefdiver (zer0 One and Done)
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To: Chickensoup

You may be able to pay off your mortgage with inflated dollars.

That’s what the government is doing......................


10 posted on 09/27/2012 9:52:06 AM PDT by Red Badger (Is it just me, or is Hillary! starting to look like Benjamin Franklin?.................)
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To: Chickensoup

damned if you do and damned if you don’t

If you don’t take advantage of these types of accounts, you give up tax benefits. i.e. any money in a rollover that results in cap gains and dividends will result in TAXES if you withdraw and re-invest.

If you leave it in there, there is always some fear that the govt. may change the regs and rape your account.

Personally, I’m leaving everything in there and I’m totally MAXING MY 401K and HSA accounts to reduce my Adjusted Gross Income.

Do what you feel is right.

I’m rolling the dice.


11 posted on 09/27/2012 9:52:21 AM PDT by AdamBomb
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To: Chickensoup

I think the whole thing’s going to come crashing down and all IRAs, etc, will be eviscerated but you might as well just wait, IMO.


12 posted on 09/27/2012 9:53:26 AM PDT by Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America
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To: Chickensoup
Both monies have been moved to cash assets.
Both accounts are "fixed rate" and insured (I hope), so why worry?
Leave the money where it is until the withdrawal is penalty free.
And as another poster noted - why pay off the mortgage in May? You're payment is probably all principle at this point anyway, No real benefit for paying it off.
13 posted on 09/27/2012 9:55:02 AM PDT by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: Chickensoup

In order to answer your question properly one needs to have a complete understanding of your financial situation and prospects.

If you are worried about some near term cataclysmic event, you will have more options if you leave the money liquid.

If your retirement funds are in anything but a Roth, you are going to pay the regular tax on the income which could be 15% to 35%, state income tax - maybe 5%, and then early withdrawal penalty of 10%. Your withdrawal could cost you at least 30%.

If it makes sense to repay your mortgage with retirement funds then at least avoiding the additional 10% penalty by waiting a few months.

In order to maintain liquidity, it might be a good idea to secure a equity line of credit concurrent with the mortgage pay down.


14 posted on 09/27/2012 9:56:58 AM PDT by Raycpa
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To: Chickensoup; All

I already withdrew all of my IRA assets for a real estate purchase and put the rest in savings for now. I’m retired but my wife is still working. I am advising her to wait until November 7 and if 0 wins to pull it out. After that I’m not sure so I’m looking forward to the comments you get here. Also, does anybody here have an idea what the tax hit(%) is on the withdrawals? I’m pretty sure I had them take out enough but I’m just curious.


15 posted on 09/27/2012 9:59:25 AM PDT by Jaxter ("Pro Aris et Focis")
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To: Chickensoup
Consider that if you die, IRA monies can be passed on to heir's without tax.

As you mentioned, paying down a debt but I would not take a tax hit to do with an early withdraw; all proceeds are taxed upon withdraw at your current tax rate, therefore you may want to wait until your income drops from retirement....

For myself, I have bought Gold Mining Stocks, and a few Natural Gas oriented stocks and I take a nice profit on dips (so far this year I allowed 23K to become 37K in my traditional IRA and my Roth's play ca$h went from 53K to $69K. I am no longer considering paying down my home, but will allow my capital to grow and use some the dividends/proceeds to be drawn out.

Once your money is gone, so are your options. Keep your options open!

16 posted on 09/27/2012 10:05:05 AM PDT by Jumper
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To: Chickensoup

I agree with raycpa in that without a whole lot more information regarding age, expected life expectancy, income realities and the BIG one future events, our input is next to useless. However I did pay mine off (debt free!)and am living on peanuts (Going Galt baby!). I don’t regret my decision. I can’t go out to eat very often or buy some toys I’d like to have but I don’t regret my decision either. It is your decision though because you have to live with the consequences.


17 posted on 09/27/2012 10:07:58 AM PDT by BipolarBob (Biden: "HOPE and CHAINS for all 57 states".)
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To: Chickensoup

How old are you? How much time is left on the mortgage, as it is?

You will have taxable income to report for any IRA accounts (if not ROTHs), and may have penalties for early withdrawals.


18 posted on 09/27/2012 10:12:08 AM PDT by NEMDF
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To: Cheerio
Watch out when the bond markets can no longer find buyers for US Bonds............

Uh, that is already the case. 75% of federal debt is being bought by the FED and the rest by foreign banks. There is essentially no private buying of US Treasuries right now. Some of the FED buys are being done through surrogates to maintain the public fiction that there is any demand for US debt.

If a major player, say a ratings service, came out and said that publicly the house of cards would start coming down. But they won't. Like everyone else, they are scared sh*tless of what would happen. I guess the triggering event will be something else.

19 posted on 09/27/2012 10:13:48 AM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s....you weren't really there)
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To: Chickensoup
Paying off the mortgage isn't a good idea unless you have another source of income. You'll tie up everything in the house, and you can't easily convert it to cash if you need it.

You can always pay it in the future. Presuming it is a fixed rate, the payments won't change. You might as well let it ride.

If you are in cash, that money isn't going to evaporate. It may be worth less due to inflation, but your mortgage will will track along with it.

20 posted on 09/27/2012 10:15:55 AM PDT by justlurking (The only remedy for a bad guy with a gun is a good WOMAN (Sgt. Kimberly Munley) with a gun)
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To: Chickensoup

I understand...if O gets re-elected we are cashing in all our savings bonds, and liquidating all investments. When inflation hits it won’t amount to anything but at least it’ll be better than nothing.


21 posted on 09/27/2012 10:18:48 AM PDT by Jewels1091
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To: Chickensoup

If I am reading your worries correctly, take your accounts and move them to the bank that holds your mortgage. If the SHTF and the bank says the retirement accounts are nada, tell them, “So is my mortgage!”


22 posted on 09/27/2012 10:19:24 AM PDT by anonsquared
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To: Chickensoup

If you have no other debt pay off the mortgage then you have peace of mind and whatever your payment was extra every month and can start saving.


23 posted on 09/27/2012 10:23:08 AM PDT by tiki
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To: Chickensoup

The only real certainty here is the 10% early withdrawal penalty you would face.

A brokerage account is pretty darn safe if it a Schwab or a T. Rowe Price (or many others, those are just two top-tier names) UNLESS that brokerage is also engaged in futures trading for their own account (eg; like MFGlobal or PFGBest) or also runs hedge funds; in which case you have a small but not non-existent piece of worry about being hypothecated off your assets.

My suggestion would be to call a rep at the brokerage(s) and ask them if they hypothecate customer funds. Of course, if they do, they very well may not admit to doing so.

The other thing you might consider, and maybe this is the simplest bestest is buying an FDIC-insured certificate of deposit inside those accounts. Forget that the interest rate paid is negligable. You would be buying the CD strictly for the FDIC insured aspect. After all, you are already OK holding your funds in cash. But this specifically gets that cash OUT of the firm’s money-market “whatever” and into an FDIC insured status. I like that idea, given what you have stated about your situation.


24 posted on 09/27/2012 10:32:23 AM PDT by Attention Surplus Disorder (This stuff we're going through now, this is nothing compared to the middle ages.)
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To: tiki

I guess my question is SHould I wait until April?


25 posted on 09/27/2012 10:34:22 AM PDT by Chickensoup (STOP The Great O-ppression)
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To: Chickensoup

I’ve been thinking about this too. I am retired, have no debts, but have financial assets and a house. It seems nothing is safe even if you are willing to accept little return for risk. The value of fiat money, stocks, and bonds can all be eviscerated by government induced hyperinflation.(How else could the massive national debt be serviced let alone payed off?) Precious metals are attractive, but the government will just confiscate them if an underground economy emerges after a crash. They did so before, in 1933, excluding only coins with numismatic value. A virulent left wing regime headed by Obama would never observe such niceties as compensation for takings. It seems like our only hope, if Romney loses, is that somehow we will muddle through a decade of recession.


26 posted on 09/27/2012 10:42:34 AM PDT by Old North State
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To: Chickensoup

Take the money, buy a small gold dredge, move to AZ or CA and prospect for your future retirement. Your money will become increasingly worthless as libtards inflate the currency.


27 posted on 09/27/2012 10:44:28 AM PDT by 2nd Amendment
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To: Chickensoup

I assume that you are in or past your forties.

Consider instead of paying off your mortgage, OVER funding a whole life insurance policy. There are tax advantages for doing so, namely that in your retirement years, you may take money out tax free. Further, there are insurance programs that will provide benefit payment in the event of an incapacitating illness or injury even if you and/or your spouse dies.

If you are interested in hearing more, I can put you in touch with my licensed financial planner who goes to my church. Just drop me a private email.


28 posted on 09/27/2012 11:05:49 AM PDT by taxcontrol
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To: Chickensoup

Go to
www.morningstar.com

and click on the discuss button, find the proper topic and ask your question there vs a political site.


29 posted on 09/27/2012 11:06:31 AM PDT by CGASMIA68
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To: Chickensoup

I would say pay off your mortgage in May when you have no penalties.

As long as you have a fixed rate. You can predict what you will owe and unless you have your money in stocks you won’t loose it.

If the economy goes bust before then you will still owe the same and have the money to pay it and your bank will be super happy!

Even though this may be the cheapest loan you can get I personally am anti-loan of any kind. Believing it best to not owe anyone any money and especially not having to pay interest on it.

I believe this will ease you mind at night knowing you owe no one and no one can take your property from you. Just make sure you have a way to pay your taxes and put food on the table. =)


30 posted on 09/27/2012 11:08:05 AM PDT by the_boy_who_got_lost
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To: the_boy_who_got_lost; Chickensoup

I differ slightly on that one.

I suggest keeping the mortgage (for the present) and setting aside in a safe account at least 4 years of mortgage, taxes and insurance.

This allows an emergency fund that you wouldn’t have if you spent your entire savings paying off the mortgage.

I have the concern that when it gets really ugly, the local taxing authorities are going to raise taxes (even more!) and pursue unpaid property taxes with a vengeance because of their desperation for revenue.

A mortgage free home that is confiscated by the county for taxes is of no value to you.


31 posted on 09/27/2012 11:47:44 AM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s....you weren't really there)
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To: Cheerio
Gold and silver and probably some tungsten, it's even in coins now.See Zero Hedge-> http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-09-24/get-your-fake-tungsten-filled-gold-coins-here
32 posted on 09/27/2012 11:48:37 AM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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To: Red Badger

Paying off with inflated dollars only means something if your income is inflating along with expenses. Fixed incomes don’t do that. If one must depend on a fixed income and is facing a ramp up of inflation then it is better to get the thing paid off because expenses are going p while income is not. In fact, SS payments are going down because part of OBAMACARE is that your insurance premium is going up hard every year. It about doubles in 2014. I figure in 6 years SS will be billing me for the difference.


33 posted on 09/27/2012 11:53:24 AM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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To: Jumper
are taxed upon withdraw at your current tax rate

That current tax rate might just jump up pretty steeply on January 1.

34 posted on 09/27/2012 11:55:39 AM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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To: Chickensoup
I paid off my mortgage...and am still working...converting what's left in the 201k (sarcasm) to Roth and when you get to 70.5 you are not forced to make withdrawals from the company that you are working at....also SS payments go up as each years earnings are factored in.
35 posted on 09/27/2012 12:08:34 PM PDT by spokeshave (The only people better off today than 4 years ago are the Prisoners at Guantanamo.)
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To: reefdiver

my husband could take out his smallish IRA...but then do what with it?....besides forcing us into a much larger tax category for that year, we have no good ideas what to do with the money other than pay off our HELOC and let the rest sit in 0.5% savings acct....


36 posted on 09/27/2012 12:23:57 PM PDT by cherry
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To: cherry
.but then do what with it?

Buy silver coins and 1oz rounds on the dips and sell half each time silver goes up.

37 posted on 09/27/2012 12:27:01 PM PDT by spokeshave (The only people better off today than 4 years ago are the Prisoners at Guantanamo.)
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To: Chickensoup
Rental property will bring you a greater return on investment per annum than just about anything else you can invest in. There are also excellent tax breaks involved.

Read here for more information: http://www.lifestylesunlimited.com/

I'm a member, but I have no financial interest in passing this along to you. Best of luck!

38 posted on 09/27/2012 12:33:43 PM PDT by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: RitchieAprile

You would do that now, if you believe the money to do that would vaporize before you get it out down the road. Then you lose your home as well.


39 posted on 09/27/2012 12:38:08 PM PDT by SgtHooper (The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it's still on the list.)
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To: Chickensoup

I’d say most here are unqualified to give you advice as to what to do with your money. Most banks have financial planners that can give you some ideas, as well as the brokers with whom you have these funds could also give you advice. Beware of the brokers, as they have a vested interest in having you keep their money with them, but if you find an honest one, and he agrees with your bank’s counselor, I’d say you have some good advice.


40 posted on 09/27/2012 1:24:13 PM PDT by krogers58
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To: Chickensoup

Consider farm land. As my very wise father-in-law told me
many times, “They ain’t makin’ no more of it.”


41 posted on 09/27/2012 1:35:39 PM PDT by kawhill (kawhill)
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To: ChildOfThe60s
Uh, that is already the case. 75% of federal debt is being bought by the FED

The Fed held $1.643 trillion today.

http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h41/current/

They held $1.663 trillion on September 29, 2011.

http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h41/20110929/

My quick, back of the envelope, calculation shows they hold $20 billion less than one year ago.

42 posted on 09/27/2012 6:06:51 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Rather than get into a mathematical pissing contest, let me just say that your statistics come from the same bunch of clowns that give us the unemployment rate, the rate of inflation and the weekly jobs statistics.

There is no way in hell that the Fed can be QEing us to death and end up holding less than a year ago. They are reclassifying categories and moving stuff from one column to another. No less a slight of hand than a government that claims $1/2 Trillion in Fannie/Freddie liabilities aren’t part of the deficit. Or that there is some mythical “surplus” of SS funds because the money was loaned to and spent by the federal government and in return this “trust fund” is populated with a bunch of less than worthless IOUs that aren’t even required by law to be paid back.

Enough of my rant. The Fed is buying a shitload of Treasuries. They can call it want they want, it’s happening.

It’s like sticking a hose up your butt and breathing your own farts and calling it oxygen.


43 posted on 09/27/2012 6:36:03 PM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s....you weren't really there)
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To: ChildOfThe60s
your statistics come from the same bunch of clowns that give us the unemployment rate, the rate of inflation and the weekly jobs statistics.

No they don't. And keeping track of the amount of bonds you buy is a lot less subjective than estimating unemployment, inflation or weekly jobs.

There is no way in hell that the Fed can be QEing us to death and end up holding less than a year ago.

I see you've confused talking about QE with actually doing QE.

The Fed is buying a shitload of Treasuries.

No they aren't. Not today and not in the last year.

It’s like sticking a hose up your butt and breathing your own farts and calling it oxygen.

That may explain your poor math skills.

44 posted on 09/27/2012 6:58:03 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

LOL, Good comeback!

But I’m not convinced


45 posted on 09/27/2012 7:08:32 PM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s....you weren't really there)
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To: ChildOfThe60s

Yeah, who you gonna believe, the accountants who release a balance sheet once a week or some guy who thinks the Fed buys 75% of the federal debt, based on his imagination?


46 posted on 09/27/2012 7:16:04 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Yeah, that’s not what I mean and you should know it. If you know anything about accounting, particularly *government* accounting, the sleight of hand occurs not in subtracting 1 from 4 and getting 3. It’s in the definition of what each number is, how it is classified, where it should be placed, categorized and so on ad nauseum. My wife does accounting for a large corporation and works with some good sized numbers and multiple related corporations. It is often anything but straightforward. And she and her office are honest with no political agenda.

You can all me tin foil hattish if you like, it offends me not in the least. But don’t try to sell me the baloney that government accounting is anything straightforward. Or that I am somehow math challenged because I consider the highly politicized federal government and an entity like the Fed to be untrustworthy (har har). I will believe damn little those people say unless I am putting the numbers in the ledger myself.

Accountants or not, they have little credibility. Helicopter Ben says its sunny at high noon, I’m going to look out the window myself before I take his word for it.


47 posted on 09/27/2012 8:09:13 PM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s....you weren't really there)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

My 75% statement was incorrect.


48 posted on 09/28/2012 5:46:05 AM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s....you weren't really there)
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To: ChildOfThe60s
My wife does accounting for a large corporation and works with some good sized numbers and multiple related corporations. It is often anything but straightforward.

Absolutely! There are so many stupid government regulations telling companies how they have to account for inventory and allocating costs that I'm glad I never got into that end of the business.

Totally different than the Fed, which basically creates money out of thin air and buys a bond with the funds. That kind of accounting is very simple in comparison.

But don’t try to sell me the baloney that government accounting is anything straightforward.

I agree, government accounting (ha) is not straightforward at all. Again, very different than what the Fed does.

49 posted on 09/28/2012 5:01:49 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: ChildOfThe60s

What changed your mind?


50 posted on 09/28/2012 5:03:57 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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