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Doctor insists parents choose starvation and slow death for baby born with cleft lip
lsn ^ | Kristi Burton Brown

Posted on 01/31/2013 6:12:37 PM PST by Morgana

January 31, 2013 (LiveActionNews.org) - I first heard about the Peterson family in what you might call a “chance meeting.” (Of course I don’t believe in chances; I believe that there is Someone who has a plan and a purpose behind the random occurrences in our lives.) And I firmly believe that this amazing family’s story needs to be told. It’s scary. It’s shocking. And its implications are dangerous. How many other hospitals starve babies to death, simply based on a “defect”? How many other doctors instruct new parents to leave their newborns to die or wallow in an institution for the rest of their lives?

We’re aware that many doctors in the United States recommend abortions for babies whose potential disabilities show up on ultrasounds or in prenatal testing. We’re also aware that, sadly, all too many parents choose abortion in these cases. And all too often, their babies are discovered to either be perfectly “normal” or the parents later on discover that the disability or defect was one they definitely could have lovingly dealt with, had they only beengiven accurate and complete information.

Our society has become consumer and product focused in an ultimately dangerous way. When we, the consumer, discover the news that our child, the product, is not quite up to par with our expectations, we are given the choice to end an innocent life. Perfection – though impossible to define – is the standard demanded. And who among us truly meets it?

Here are the Petersons – Quentin, Adian, and Jodi – and here is their story:

1) What condition was Aidan born with?

Aidan was born with a bilateral cleft lip and palate. This affects about 1/700 children. We had no family history of this condition. All babies at some point in their early development have a cleft, but it spontaneously “knits” together (bringing to mind the Scripture, “You knit me together in my mother’s womb”), unless there is a genetic issue, if the mother is deficient in folate and from certain ethnic groups, or if the mother suffers certain viral illnesses at the time of gestation. In our case, Jodi had contracted the flu very early in pregnancy with a high fever.

2) When did you/the doctors discover his condition?

On October 7, 1997, our 8 pound, 14 ounce son Aidan was born at a hospital in Modesto, California. Immediately after he was fully delivered, we knew something was wrong. The doctors lowered him out of our sight instead of putting him on Jodi’s stomach and began whispering to each other. That’s when they told us he was born with a bilateral cleft lip and palate. It did not show up on an ultrasound. We were shocked.

3) What advice were you given?

The day after he was born, Aidan was taken into the NICU (Neonatal Intensive Care Unit) because he was unable to breastfeed, and was becoming dehydrated and weak. The hospital did not have the type of bottles babies with a cleft use to feed. The hospital pediatrician called my husband into the nursery and advised us to sign Aidan over to the hospital. He told us that we were still young, we could still have other children, and that these kids (kids with cleft lip and palate) tend to have neurological problems, he would require many surgeries that could bankrupt us, and that if we were foolish enough to ignore medical advice and take our baby home he would end right back at the hospital as a “failure to thrive.”

The “treatment plan” the doctor told us was that they’d give our son pain medicine, and let him die (of starvation and dehydration). Jodi began to cry and refused, at which point the doctor turned to Quentin and said, “Get her out of here, she’s being irrational.” He thought he would have a better chance at convincing Quentin to leave the baby.

He was wrong. Quentin also refused to sign the papers. We didn’t have a plan, and didn’t know where to find help, but we could not fathom abandoning our son to a certain death alone. It had to be the grace of God, to give us courage to choose life when the hospital authority was telling us otherwise. It was for both of us, the absolute scariest time in our lives.

4) What choice did you make and why?

We chose to fight for our son and love him, and we never regretted that decision.

We couldn’t believe they were giving Aidan this death sentence, but we would not abandon him. We could not imagine anything more heartbreaking than to have a helpless child left alone for the brief entirety of his life. Even if he had one day to live, he would spend that day being loved by us.

Then God’s providence stepped in. A nurse contacted a woman who herself was born with a cleft lip and palate who ran a local support group. She brought us the cleft palate nurser bottles. (These are supposed to be in every hospital, and all nursing and medical staff are to be trained to use them since it’s a fairly common birth defect.) This meant that our baby was finally able to eat. That hungry baby took his first bottle and rested in our arms. This was an unbelievable blessing. We did take him home, and he thrived. He has had eight surgeries to correct his lip and palate and associated difficulties like ear tubes, bone grafts, and scarring, and we’re anticipating a few more in the future.

5) Can you tell us about Aidan? What are his interests, what does he like to do with his free time?

Aidan is now 15 years old and in his freshman year of high school. He is a big brother to 13-year-old Devin (brother) and 10-year-old Kiera (sister). They’re homeschooled, and his studies include Latin, logic, literature, and math. Aidan’s a typical teenager and an avid reader, and his interests include animation, writing, history, the military, and aviation. He’s involved in his church’s teen group, and is a member or 4H. He loves going out and playing paintball with his buddies. His pets include a dog and eight chickens.

6) Looking back on the time before Aidan was born and the advice you were given and seeing him now as a 15-year-old, what advice would you give parents in a similar position?

Love your child with complete abandon, every moment that you are blessed to be with him. Love your child for who he is, and don’t let anyone scare you about future issues. No one knows what the future holds – not for us or for our children – but we know that love is eternal. Learn everything you can about whatever ails your child (the internet is a wealth of knowledge).

Fight for your child’s healthcare. No one will have their best interest at heart but the parents; God has given you the opportunity and responsibility to be their advocate. Every person on this earth has two things in common – we’re all made in the image of God, and none of us are perfect. We all have challenges, but do they diminish our ability to give and receive love? No. So don’t put too much faith in what doctors say – they can be wrong – but put your faith in God who is never wrong.

7) Does Aidan have any advice to give? What’s his perspective on this whole situation?

First off, I’d like to speak to everyone with a bilateral cleft lip and palate. You’re normal. The fact is that you’re just like everyone else, but you look somewhat different. I personally like to think it’s an improvement that God bestows on the lucky few and everyone else is just jealous (grinning here).

Looking back on my life, I’m very glad that my parents fought so hard for me, and disappointed that life seems to be so cheap in this generation – much like a passive waste to be disposed of if it doesn’t meet the irrationally perfect standards set forth by today’s murderous society.

What is my perspective on the situation? As I said, the world today disappoints me, and I pray it will soon end its ways. For any and all parents who are stuck in the same or similar situation that my parents were, listen up. Your kid is worth it, be he or she mentally or physically disabled. And as my mom said, if your kid only has one day to live, spend it loving your child. Put yourself in your kid’s shoes. You have one day to live, no two ways about it.

Which is better, to spend that day with your loving parents or starve to death while uncaring doctors simply pass you by, not caring at all for your plight? Answer that question and THEN make a decision on your kid’s life.


TOPICS: Health/Medicine
KEYWORDS: abortion; lifeisbeautiful; moralabsolutes; prolife

1 posted on 01/31/2013 6:12:42 PM PST by Morgana
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To: Morgana

What a wonderful story. Sadly most Americans are so obtuse that they wouldn’t make any attempt to save a child with any disability.


2 posted on 01/31/2013 6:22:43 PM PST by Theodore R. ("Hey, the American people must all be crazy out there!")
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To: Morgana

I am more than skeptical about this story. I am unaware Idespite the writer’s claim) of ANY doctor who would advise a woman to abort a child. This is not only against the canon of ethics it is also AGAINST the law and is an actionable item that the medical board would love to know about.

Further there is no name of the hospital in Modesto where this so called incident took place. IF in fact a doctor made the recommendation to ‘sign over’ the baby there is no actual ability for a hospital to take charge of such a child.

Nothing in this story rings true. Cleft palate has been well understood for over 50 years and has been handled seamlessly since the 60s.

I am ringing the dumb bell because this story is entry made up. It is so far outside the norms of medical practice in the US as to be laughable


3 posted on 01/31/2013 6:33:47 PM PST by Nifster
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To: Nifster

Maybe you are right but I didn’t see anywhere in the story where a doctor advised the couple to abort their child.


4 posted on 01/31/2013 6:38:14 PM PST by vbmoneyspender
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To: Morgana

Hell, I can remember a kid in my highschool decades ago that had a hare-lip that looked EXACTLY like this kid’s, and the kid I’m talking about was from a wealthy, upper-middle class professional family. The general consensus was that his hare-lip was kinda cool, and it made him different, but different in a cool way.There was no ostracism, no shunning, no talking behind his back. He was accepted. As was the ONE black kid, named Willis, ONE black kid in a school with a student body of 2000) whose father was a Baptist preacher in a nearby town (Northern suburbs of Chicago) in a tiny storefront church that serviced a small totally black population who were arrayed throughout a number of local towns.Guess what-—everybody liked him too!This was in a highly-rated High School whose student body was at least 50% Jewish, and the sons and daughters of dentists, doctors, lawyers, engineers,etc.


5 posted on 01/31/2013 6:42:32 PM PST by supremedoctrine
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To: vbmoneyspender

The article starts off by saying ‘we are aware ...’ No documentation just a baseless claim. The story CLAIMS that a doctor (unnamed) at the hospital (unnamed) told the parents that they ought to turn the child over to the hospital....as I stated in my original response-—that is so far outside the norms of care in the US that I do not believe it. This comes from a site and is by a writer who uses hyperbole and half truths to make her points. THAT is NOT the way to win the battle against abortion. It turns people against the pro life movement and makes us look desperate and stupid


6 posted on 01/31/2013 6:42:43 PM PST by Nifster
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To: Morgana
And as my mom said, if your kid only has one day to live, spend it loving your child.

Just remember as far as we know, we all have but one day to live; today.

Make the best of it, love those you are with.

Eat, drink, and be merry. For tomorrow we die.

7 posted on 01/31/2013 6:43:41 PM PST by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: Nifster
I have been hearing more and more stories about abortion being encouraged for every little birth defect from Downs to cleft lip. Trust me I read them all.

I was a bit shocked this story happened 15 years ago but then again they did say it happened in Kalifornia and that is lib land. Lib things do then to happen their first, then slowly spread to the rest of the country.

What shocked me if true is the hospital had no way to feed the baby? “The hospital did not have the type of bottles babies with a cleft use to feed.” What kind of hospital is not prepared? Even if that is the case then transfer the baby to a hospital that does. That would have been my question.

The other thing was.....”He told us that we were still young, we could still have other children, and that these kids (kids with cleft lip and palate) tend to have neurological problems, he would require many surgeries that could bankrupt us, and that if we were foolish enough to ignore medical advice and take our baby home he would end right back at the hospital as a “failure to thrive.” “

I have never heard of such a thing!! I did a report on cleft lip/plate in biology class while in college. I don't ever remember researching that! As for cost? Bankrupt? Well I am sure obozocare covers that! If the doctors told them this they need to go back to what ever third world crap hole they came from and practice medicine there.

8 posted on 01/31/2013 6:45:44 PM PST by Morgana (This space for rent.)
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To: Nifster

I’ve heard enough stories about doctors advising women to abort, that I believe many of them - they do ring true.

And my MIL, a nurse in the early 60s and later a physician, told me that they did use to let severely deformed and handicapped babies die then, give them a little sedative to keep them comfortable.

But cleft palate is so routinely fixed, and while there is an association with neurological defects, the neonatologist can do a neurological exam, there are brain scans, that I cannot believe any doctor in the country would say of a full term, otherwise healthy looking baby with a cleft palate, just throw him away and try again.

Why no complaints to the hospital board, the medical board, their clergyman, their congressman? Show me the documentation from the time, name names, and I’ll believe them.


9 posted on 01/31/2013 6:46:00 PM PST by heartwood
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To: Morgana; RIghtwardHo; Reaganite Republican; Clintons Are White Trash; HerrBlucher; mgist; ...
+

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Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.

10 posted on 01/31/2013 6:46:32 PM PST by narses
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To: Morgana; RIghtwardHo; Reaganite Republican; Clintons Are White Trash; HerrBlucher; mgist; ...
+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:

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Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.

11 posted on 01/31/2013 6:47:05 PM PST by narses
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To: Morgana; RIghtwardHo; Reaganite Republican; Clintons Are White Trash; HerrBlucher; mgist; ...
+

Freep-mail me to get on or off my pro-life and Catholic List:

Add me / Remove me

Please ping me to note-worthy Pro-Life or Catholic threads, or other threads of general interest.

12 posted on 01/31/2013 6:48:08 PM PST by narses
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To: Morgana

Hearing stories and having proof are not the same thing. I have read some of these stories and it always comes out when read that the doctor explains all possible options to a mother. This has been standard practice since doctoring began. To be told that abortion is an option is NOT the same as advising it. I know many OB/GYNs. Not a one has EVER recommended or even hinted that an abortion would be the best option.

Retelling stories that are non verifiable does nothing to help the cause.


13 posted on 01/31/2013 6:51:44 PM PST by Nifster
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To: Morgana

Please tell me this was a Khmer Rougue doctor, or a Nazi concentration camp doctor.


14 posted on 01/31/2013 6:56:43 PM PST by gitmo ( If your theology doesn't become your biography it's useless.)
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To: heartwood

Again I suggest to you as I did to Morgana that you actually ask for details of exactly what the doctor said....precisely and specifically. If on the other hand you are just reading these stories from varoius websites you have NO factual information to offer.

It is AGAINST the cannon of ethics for a doctor to advocate (ie advise a mother) for abortion. As to the comments from your mother-in-law please put them into perspective. Premies in the 60s had almost no hope. There was very little that could be done for them as medicine did not have some of the wonderful tools they have today. There were no good ways to set IVs. There were not incubators readily available. And staff was not trained for the intensive care needed by such babies.Some of them survived but not many. Today’s medicine provides a much better level of care for such babies.

One of the reasons why I called dumb bell on this story is precisely because there is no traceable information about hospital or doctor. Do not always make the assumption that these stories are correct. They are not. Parts os them may be but the whole of this story is bogus as the day is long


15 posted on 01/31/2013 6:58:07 PM PST by Nifster
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To: Morgana; Nifster

Doctors do this all the time these days.

My daughter went to see the doctor when she was pregnant with her first child a few years ago, and had an ultrasound. The doctor said that the baby MIGHT have Down’s Syndrome, and recommended that he should be aborted. My daughter refused. Her son, now about three, is normal. But so what if he had been a Downe’s syndrome baby? They are very special people, from all I have seen of them, and I’ve known a fair number of Downes people, of all ages.

Similar experience with my mother, who was in a nursing home for quite a while. Occasionally she’d be sent to the hospital, with breathing problems from pneumonia or the like. Almost invariably, the doctors in charge at the hospital would try to get me to agree to have her taken off food and medication. I refused. I think she lived a difficult but happy life in the nursing home, until her end finally came, and she died peacefully.

No hearsay about it. The medical profession no longer takes the old Hippocratic oath in some medical schools. Not all doctors, but too many of them, have that sort of attitude.


16 posted on 01/31/2013 7:05:00 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Nifster

I’m with you. I have a cousin that was born with cleft palate and that was back in the early 50’s and they fixed it. I get envelopes all the time asking for donations to fix cleft palates of people around the world.

This one.

http://www.smiletrain.org/


17 posted on 01/31/2013 7:06:23 PM PST by Netizen (Path to citizenship = Scamnesty. If you give it away, more will come.)
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To: Morgana

While the parents were obviously focused on saving the life of their son, they could have helped a lot of other people by noting which doctors wanted their baby dead.

If other parents can just find out about medical people with attitudes like this, they can avoid them. And eventually it is going to “leave a mark” on their career. Hospitals and HMOs start to notice if more than a few patients start avoiding certain medical people.

Importantly, no one has to give a reason, nor should they, of why they refuse the services of a particular doctor. They have a legal right to ask for a different doctor.

What really sends up the red flags is when being referred to a particular kind of doctor, like an OB/GYN, they request “any doctor, except for Smith or Jones.” Rejecting a doctor when you haven’t even met them definitely attracts attention.


18 posted on 01/31/2013 7:08:00 PM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy (Best WoT news at rantburg.com)
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To: Nifster

Saul Alinsky lives!!!


19 posted on 01/31/2013 7:24:55 PM PST by E. Pluribus Unum (TYRANNY: When the people fear the politicians. LIBERTY: When the politicians fear the people.)
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To: Nifster
Hearing stories and having proof are not the same thing.

As the Kenyan Marxist has stated -if even saving one life is possible THEN no proof is necessary.

Regardless, the cause -that is how the left operates. As such of what purpose is the PROOF you cherish? Those who promote the slaughter of innocents, those who promote the death culture could care less about proof -those slaughtered could as well care less about proof.

Terri Schiavo ring a bell? Many 'doctors' and medical 'experts' supported that imposed death sentence. Just as it is 'doctors' who perform abortions. There are many 'doctors' that are simply leftist death technicians executing the plan to promote the collective ideology that is the enemy of life.

What about the Nazis? How long did it take to convince the proof seekers -many still in denial?

What about the "Liverpool Care Pathway"? Plenty of proof there as to what humans are quite capable of ESPECIALLY when empowered by a collectivist ideology.

20 posted on 01/31/2013 7:34:55 PM PST by DBeers (†)
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To: supremedoctrine

That was how it was before political correctness took over.


21 posted on 01/31/2013 8:30:24 PM PST by ELS (Vivat Benedictus XVI!)
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To: supremedoctrine

New Trier


22 posted on 01/31/2013 8:41:16 PM PST by ladyL
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To: Cicero

I told my doc not to bother with the Down Syndrome test because I wasn’t going to do anything about it


23 posted on 01/31/2013 8:45:55 PM PST by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: heartwood
Maybe they wanted the baby for something else, like body parts, or who knows what, and the cleft lip thing was an excuse to give to the parents so that they could get their hands on a living baby.

The parents were to never see the baby again, so who is to say what would have happened to the baby once there wasn't anybody who cared watching out for it. Evil things are able to happen when nobody thinks that such evil can take place. The hospital, if this is a true story, needs to be investigated.

24 posted on 01/31/2013 9:10:38 PM PST by Bellflower (The LORD is Holy, separated from all sin, perfect, righteous, high and lifted up.)
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To: ladyL

Highland Park.


25 posted on 01/31/2013 10:06:23 PM PST by supremedoctrine
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To: Cicero

That doctor should have been reported. Your daughter was remiss in not doing so


26 posted on 01/31/2013 10:18:30 PM PST by Nifster
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To: ELS

Exactly right.
People, even kids, behaved this way naturally, w/o having to be threatened or lectured that they’d BETTER behave that way,
OR ELSE! This was 50 years ago ,when there was STILL such a
worthwhile construct as “The Liberal Conscience”, which has by now turned totally rancid.
PC is a deep perversion that originates in a completely unearned moral authority:Lib/Lefties search every nook and cranny of the behavior of their political opponents to find “proof” of small-minded bigotry, because without it, how could they feel righteous, bold, brave and “progressive”? Frankly there’s been nothing more maddening in my lifetime than the toxic growth and instutionalization of PC.Left unchecked, it’s the first phase of mind control, and a jackboot on the face of free speech.


27 posted on 01/31/2013 10:23:43 PM PST by supremedoctrine
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To: Nifster; Morgana

I agree; this story seems so absurd that it is pretty unbelievable. The surgery for cleft palate is so simple, apparently, that American doctors regularly go to third-world countries to fix up kids who have this condition (and how did those kids manage to eat, eh?).


28 posted on 01/31/2013 10:42:26 PM PST by Hetty_Fauxvert (FUBO, and the useful idiots you rode in on!)
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To: Hetty_Fauxvert

Like I said I did a report on this in Biology class back in college. Now this was a LONG time ago, but as I recall those women are able to feed the babies but only little bits of milk at at time like with a medicine dropper. It would take a while to feed the baby but it can be done.

If this story is true it just means either the doctors were afraid of being sued for not finding on the ultra sound or they really hate deformed kids.


29 posted on 01/31/2013 10:49:14 PM PST by Morgana (This space for rent.)
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To: Hetty_Fauxvert

I get frustrated when nameless doctors at nameless hospitals are cited. This hurts the pro life cause as much as anything. It makes others discount what we have to say.


30 posted on 01/31/2013 10:50:14 PM PST by Nifster
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To: Nifster

I have never heard of anything like this happening in America, either. Never heard of turning a person over to a hospital so they can kill. Maybe it’s something new that came in with Obamacare?


31 posted on 01/31/2013 11:48:16 PM PST by SaraJohnson
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To: Morgana

America has teams of docs who go to India and Africa just to do cleft lip surgies as service projects.


32 posted on 01/31/2013 11:51:02 PM PST by SaraJohnson
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To: Theodore R.

That is one of the easier things to fix isn’t it?


33 posted on 01/31/2013 11:58:31 PM PST by GeronL (http://asspos.blogspot.com)
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To: Morgana
Well, just deny food and water for the child.

After all, it's a very pleasant and peaceful way to die, isn't it?.

Ask Terri Schiavo

34 posted on 02/01/2013 3:00:29 AM PST by eCSMaster (Palin was correct!)
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To: Nifster
I am unaware despite the writer’s claim) of ANY doctor who would advise a woman to abort a child.

You haven't been around very much. Besides the abortionists themselves who break numerous rules of conduct besides the actual action itself (medicare fraud, diagnoses of women as being pregnant when they are not), you have the well-documented high rates of misconduct by shrinks with attractive female clients. These sorts of misconduct are unlikely to be reported, or to get a sympathetic ear. The patients don't usually use a hidden tape recorder.

For something inside the purely professional realm, you have doctors at the WI union protests signing sick notes by the dozen for teachers who decided to play hooky. Many of today's doctors do not belong on a pedestal.
35 posted on 02/01/2013 3:48:32 AM PST by Dr. Sivana ("C'est la vie" say the old folks, it goes to show you never can tell. -- Chuck Berry)
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To: SaraJohnson

I guess you missed all the stories about Terri Schiavo then! They allowed/demanded that she be starved to death. Get your head out of the sand....this is happening all the time.


36 posted on 02/01/2013 4:13:29 AM PST by 2nd amendment mama ( www.2asisters.org | Self defense is a basic human right!)
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To: supremedoctrine

The actor Stacy Keach was born with this condition. He’s had corrective surgery, looks fine and usually wears a mustache. If this story is true, the doctor was as mad as a hatter.


37 posted on 02/01/2013 4:17:56 AM PST by miss marmelstein ( Richard Lives Yet!)
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To: Nifster

It’s setting off my BS meter as well. I can believe some doctor (who’s not God but plays Him on TV) presented the option to basically starve their baby to death. However, that the couple received pressure to do so strikes me as untrue. Or else, the doctor had some serious emotional issues and would have many documented complaints against him. I don’t believe starving a baby with a cleft palate is best medical practice. I’d have reported some doctor to the hospital and the medical board who tried to tell me it was.


38 posted on 02/01/2013 4:21:25 AM PST by old and tired
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To: Netizen
i routinely donate money to smiletrain. they are a boon to those parts of the world without the medical expertise to repair these kind of defects.the before and after photos are simply amazing.the story above must be a distortion of truth. smiletrain can do a complete surgery with first class results for about $250.be generous and give a kid a smile!!!
39 posted on 02/01/2013 5:13:11 AM PST by Movemout ( all it takes for evil to succeed is for good men to look away and do nothing-FUBO)
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To: Dr. Sivana

I have been around plenty. You have mixed so many issues in this one post it is unbelievable.

There are not that many abortionists in the US any more. Moreover one does not go to an abortionist with their Ob/GYN concerns (unless sent by planned parenthood.... a misnomer for an evil group if there ever was one).

You cite no data just the occasional story we read of doctors who do horrible things. By your logic there should be no teachers in the US because a few are disgusting individuals. You have painted not with a broad brush but the kind of if one does all must do it that say Alex Jones and Prison Planet does.

The doctors in the unions ( an entirely different issue all together) who broke their own canon of ethics looked to number about three or four on the video tapes of the time. I do not know how many were actual MDs. I do know that some were disciplined after their mugs appeared on the news.

And finally, your comments did not address my actual statement (which you kindly quoted). Ad hominem arguendo is not sufficient


40 posted on 02/01/2013 8:46:23 AM PST by Nifster
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To: old and tired

Thank you. You said precisely what I was trying to say and in a much more elegant and concise fashion


41 posted on 02/01/2013 8:47:46 AM PST by Nifster
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To: Nifster

I was not speaking of just abortionists. I am speakinh of the medical profession as a whole. On an iPod Touch at work I cannot do my normal citing. But are you really unfamiliar with the studies that demonstrate an shrinks abusing ethical standards with women patients in large numbers? A well executed Google should answer that. Do I REALLY have to cite evidence aboht the fraudulent doctors in Madison? They only got a slap on the wrist. but they are on Project Veritad for crying out loud. And no, I am not going to cite chapter and verse of family members and close friends’ private info. These related first hand experiences from different parts of the country are frequent enough, that I could only presume you do ‘t get around much. The medical establishment doesn’t like abortionists personally, but they certainly tolerate them and certainly did nothing as efforts were made in


42 posted on 02/01/2013 11:16:08 AM PST by Dr. Sivana ("C'est la vie" say the old folks, it goes to show you never can tell. -- Chuck Berry)
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To: Morgana

I’m commenting on the basis of having been an NICU nurse for many years. There is a huge difference between a “cleft lip and palate” and a “bilateral cleft lip and palate” that this infant had. A bilateral cleft takes multiple, expensive surgeries as the infant grows so this isn’t a simple, surgical fix. Secondly, I am aware of ethics panels advising and pressuring women to abort. I’ve seen it. Also, when I got pregnant at 35, my Ob’s office nurse repeatedly tried to pressure me into having AFP screening done, to the point of having a screaming tirade. At least as a nurse with experience in the area I could defend my position and have the strength to not be intimidated and back down. This story neither surprises me or sets off my “BS meter.”


43 posted on 02/01/2013 11:42:54 AM PST by pops88 (Geek chick standing with Breitbart for truth)
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To: Morgana

Beautiful story. Some people think they are god and will make choices reserved for the real God.


44 posted on 02/01/2013 11:50:06 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
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To: Dr. Sivana

and most of what you just said is undocumented and or conflated. It has nothing to do with the specific case which was cited with a clear lack of information to be able to confirm it. You can dislike psychiatry all you want but to say that one equals all or that some equals all defeats the argument immediately.

Done


45 posted on 02/01/2013 2:12:47 PM PST by Nifster
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To: Nifster; old and tired
It’s setting off my BS meter as well. I can believe some doctor (who’s not God but plays Him on TV) presented the option to basically starve their baby to death. However, that the couple received pressure to do so strikes me as untrue. Or else, the doctor had some serious emotional issues and would have many documented complaints against him. I don’t believe starving a baby with a cleft palate is best medical practice. I’d have reported some doctor to the hospital and the medical board who tried to tell me it was.

I will tell you that when my niece and her husband found out not only were they pregnant again, only a few months after their first daughter was born via cesarean after a difficult labor and pre-eclamsia, but this time with triplets, my niece’s then OBY (not the one who delivered their first child BTW) told her it was very risky, too risky in his opinion and that she should either abort or have a “selective” reduction, i.e. abort, i.e. kill/ murder two out of the three babies and that if she didn’t she was likely to die…he didn’t “pressure” them per se but advised them to do this and then admitted that neither his experience nor that of his hospital’s facilities were equipped to deal with this type of high risk delivery.

Of course this was very upsetting to my niece and her husband, but rather than panicking based on what he told them, they instead searched out and found an OBY specializing in high risk pregnancies at Penn State Hershey Medical Center (something their first doctor should have advised them to do IMO and was negligent for not doing so). This new OBY not only said that while there were very real risks, he was confident that if she was closely monitored and cared for, she had a very good chance of delivering all three and healthy and that their first doctor, who was at a small regional hospital without a NICU BTW, was probably too scared and possibly too incompetent to want to take on a case like hers. (This new doc BTW, was already semi-famous for delivering the sextuplets of another PA family who went on to have a TV show, and for him, triplets were a cake walk and nothing from what I understand compared to dealing with that diva mother who’s name rhymes with “Skate” - LOL). And my triplet great nieces are nearly 5 years old and their “big” sister nearly 6 and although they are wearing out their parents, mentally, physically and financially, all are healthy and thriving :) and my niece and her husband wouldn’t nor I would want it any differently.

It should also be important to note that my niece had to be hospitalized in the high risk maternity ward a full month before the scheduled c-section at 32 weeks and my great nieces spent nearly a month in the NICU before coming home but more importantly, they all received excellent care. And the delivery was a carefully planned and coordinated event with a team of NICU nurses assigned for each of the three babies and more than one doctor attending. The triplets were rather good sized for being multiples and at 32 weeks but spent their first weeks in incubators and on nasal feeding tubes and the littlest one had a lot of breathing problems and a heart valve closure problem that thankfully was treated with medication. But the care they all received was beyond excellent and I fear that sensational stories like this make some distrust not only the very few bad eggs in the medical profession but also discourage people from getting good medical care out of often unfounded fears that all doctors and all hospitals want to kill them which more often than not is simply not the case.

So with all that being said and knowing there are some “bad” doctors out there, I’m also having more than a bit of a hard time believing the story as written.

The day after he was born, Aidan was taken into the NICU (Neonatal Intensive Care Unit) because he was unable to breastfeed, and was becoming dehydrated and weak. The hospital did not have the type of bottles babies with a cleft use to feed. The hospital pediatrician called my husband into the nursery and advised us to sign Aidan over to the hospital.

First of all it is or at least should be SOP to take a baby with a problem as severe as bilateral cleft lip and palate to the NICU right away, not a day later. Secondly I find it rather hard to believe that a hospital large enough to have a NICU wouldn’t have on hand or be able to quickly obtain the specialized feeding bottles or were completely unprepared to deal with bilateral cleft lip and palate since it effects 1/700 children. And lastly I find it very difficult to believe that any parents could, even if they wanted to or a doctor wanted them to, simply “sign over” their child to the hospital for any reason. For one thing, surrendering parental rights is not something that can typically be done by a single stroke of a pen; there are many legalities involved. For another thing, I’ve never heard of a hospital taking “full parental custody” of any baby, even of abandoned children. In those cases of abandonment or in cases of severe abuse or neglect, CPS and the courts get involved, the abandoned child is appointed by the court an advocate and temporary foster parents. Hospitals simply do not have parents sign their children over to the hospital voluntarily or involuntarily.

and that these kids (kids with cleft lip and palate) tend to have neurological problems, he would require many surgeries that could bankrupt us, and that if we were foolish enough to ignore medical advice and take our baby home he would end right back at the hospital as a “failure to thrive.”

That’s another thing that doesn’t ring quite true. First of all, kids with cleft lip and palate do not “tend to have neurological problems” and even if that was a real possibility, some very simple tests could be performed to either confirm or rule that out shortly after birth.

Next it doesn’t make sense that a pediatrician would on one hand recommend “starvation” but on the other hand express concerns that if they took their baby home that he would be brought back as a “failure to thrive.” It seems perhaps more likely that the doctor advised the parents not to take their baby home right away and against medical advice to keep him in the NICU until he gained weight.

Next it would be very highly unusual for any doctor to express concerns about financial considerations or “possible” future bankruptcy over patient care. And interestingly the article says nothing about this couple’s insurance or financial situation at the time their son was born. Going back to my niece and her husband, they both had excellent insurance with their employers and it paid for a good deal of their triplets’ delivery but it still left them with a considerable amount of uncovered hospital expenses and debt. Some were written off (their OBY, a good doc and a good person for instance simply wrote off his bill) but 4 years later, they did file for bankruptcy but not only because of uncovered hospital bills - two student loans also contributed to that decision but the possibility of them not being able to pay all their doctor’s and hospital bills simply never factored in to the care my niece or my great nieces received at Penn State Hershey Medical Center. In fact the hospital through their patient advocacy and social work department and the NICU support staff, put my niece in touch with several NFP orgs that are involved in helping families with multiple births and premie births - she received a lot of help and support from these orgs and from other multiple moms with whom she was put in touch with both in moral support but also financial help, and that included many discounts and coupons from many retailers who give unadvertised discounts to multiple birth moms including Macy’s, Target and Babies R Us and diaper and formula companies. And she also has nothing but good things to say about the Ronald McDonald house where she stayed for a time while the triples were still in the NICU.

And finally and perhaps the most important inconstancy in the Life Site story as published is that a single doctor would not only not have the authority to have the hospital he worked for take custody of a baby by having the parents sign a piece of paper surrendering their custody to the hospital, but that even in cases of withholding extreme measures and only providing palliative care in cases where there is no absolutely no hope for the infant’s survival; and here I’m talking about very extreme cases like Anencephaly, that decision is never (at least in any hospital I know of) left to the sole discretion of one single doctor.

This story, while compelling and on the surface makes for a compelling pro-life story, simply doesn’t pass my BS meter either. Life Site News while on the “right” side on the pro-life cause, often publishes sensational stories absent any fact checking or vetting and even worse, all too often publishes outright false or incomplete information, it often inadvertently only serves ultimately to hurt and damage the pro-life cause.

46 posted on 02/01/2013 7:56:58 PM PST by MD Expat in PA
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To: Morgana

I remember an article from several years ago from the UK about aborting or advising abortion for cleft palate babies.

It was not hearsay.


47 posted on 02/01/2013 10:35:52 PM PST by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: MD Expat in PA

Thank you for you thoughtful reply. And congrats on your great nieces what a joy. You described perfectly what happens in high risk pregnancies. Also you noted an NICU should be prepared for a cleft palate baby (and double is not the term though used in the article it is properly called bilateral). There are many ways to feed cleft babies that do not require special equipment of any kind just some adjustment in the way one feeds from a bottle and a slightly different opening in the nipple. But that is way more information than most need.

I agree with your take that the Life page over dramatizes stories....too often to the point of unbelievability


48 posted on 02/01/2013 10:40:18 PM PST by Nifster
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