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Unable to pay for husband's funeral, Apple Valley woman allegedy buries him in backyard
presstelegram ^ | 06/21/2013 | Beatriz E. Valenzuela

Posted on 06/21/2013 7:33:40 AM PDT by JoeProBono

APPLE VALLEY Calif- Unable to pay for a funeral, an Apple Valley woman reportedly told sheriff's deputies she was forced to bury her husband in a shallow grave in the couple's backyard weeks after the man died, according to San Bernardino County Sheriff's officials. Investigators are trying to determine if the man died of natural causes.

The identity of the deceased man has not been released. The woman has also not been identified but neighbors and San Bernardino County property records show they are Thomas and Yvonne Winn.

"She's a really nice lady," said Colin Wilson who lives behind the Winns. "She would always wave to me every morning."

Apple Valley deputies were called out to a home in the 16000 block of Navajo Road around 1 p.m. Wednesday for a welfare check on a 63-year-old man, according to authorities.

At the home, deputies found the man's 59-year-old wife who told deputies her husband, who has not been identified, had died weeks earlier, according to sheriff's officials. Unable to pay for a funeral, she reportedly told officials she buried him in the backyard.

"I saw her kneel down near where the cops started digging and she just broke down," Wilson said. "She was obviously devastated."

The man's body was found in a shallow grave and his body did not appear to have any obvious signs of trauma, sheriff's officials said.

The woman was not arrested pending a cause of death ruling from the coroner, according to Cindy Bachman, spokeswoman for the sheriff's department.

Neighbors said the 63-year-old man had been ill for some time.

Touched by the woman's situation, Wilson and his sister, Emily Wilson, decided to set up an online fundraising account through Fundrazr.com where people can donate to help bury the woman's husband.

"I just feel terrible for her," he said. "I can't imagine what she went through."

In the first hour, the online fundraising effort had already raised $120.

Phyllis Jerscheid, owner of Jerschied's Men's Apparel in Victorville, said she would donate a suit to the Winns so he could be buried.

"This story just broke my heart,"Jerscheid said from her busy store on Hesperia Road. "I wanted to help in some small way."

The couple had recently purchased the home in November but moved in early this year, said Wilson, after some repairs had been made to the property.

"She was out there almost every day painting and fixing up that house all by herself," Wilson said. "She's a really strong lady."

A day after their neighborhood was overtaken by sheriff's investigators, news vans now lined Navajo Road.

"It's really weird to think that she was able to do this and no one saw anything," said Wilson as he stood in his back yard which faced the rear of the couple's home. "We all have chain link fences here and we can see right into each others back yards. I can't believe no one saw anything."

It's a violation of the state's health and safety code to bury a human body anywhere other than an approved and recognized cemetery.

To donate, visit, www.fundrazr.com and search Thomas Winn.


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To: JoeProBono

All this remind me of this funny episode from Married with Children:

Bundy Family Barbecue
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inubkn_TmUs


51 posted on 06/21/2013 8:27:59 AM PDT by Patriot Babe
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To: JoeProBono

All this remind me of this funny episode from Married with Children:

Bundy Family Barbecue
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inubkn_TmUs


52 posted on 06/21/2013 8:27:59 AM PDT by Patriot Babe
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To: Salgak

But social security pays out $250 for death expenses, doesn’t that cover it?
The guy probably worked and paid into the SS system and then dies before he collected anything. So the gov’t gets to keep the money, prolonging the ponzi scheme and enabeling more redistribution.


53 posted on 06/21/2013 8:29:21 AM PDT by Rusty0604
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To: Vigilanteman
Yep. The industry-big government alliance still needs to get their cut. Still the average cremation is $1500 to $2000, still WAY less than the average funeral cost, especially when you add the costs of vaults, plots, etc.

I drove each of my cats' remains in their baskets to a local crematory (several years apart) and paid $100 apiece, but was subjected to the $200 sales pitch from the veterinarian for pick up and delivery of the body, etc. But then, I live in a populous region with options. Still, I don't think one could put Grandpa's fresh remains in the back of the SUV and drop him off at the crematorium to save money. I have read about cardboard coffins, though, dirt cheap.

54 posted on 06/21/2013 8:36:05 AM PDT by Albion Wilde ("Remember... the first revolutionary was Satan."--Russian Orthodox Archpriest Dmitry Smirnov)
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To: ZinGirl
I believe most of this is covered by state law. I noticed in NC there is a firm that covers the whole cremation including picking up the body and paperwork for around $800.00.
55 posted on 06/21/2013 8:42:47 AM PDT by Average Al
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To: Patriot Babe
I thought it was against the law to bury on a private property.

There are probably regulations that allow it if the acreage is above a certain amount and the depth of the grave, the liner, the marker and the tax bite meet certain requirements.

56 posted on 06/21/2013 8:43:30 AM PDT by Albion Wilde ("Remember... the first revolutionary was Satan."--Russian Orthodox Archpriest Dmitry Smirnov)
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To: JoeProBono
Desperate people do desperate things.

It's touching in this case.

57 posted on 06/21/2013 8:44:52 AM PDT by OldNavyVet
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To: ZinGirl
"but cremation usually still requires you buy a coffin. go figure."

HA....you can get a cardboard coffin for "viewing" if YOU ASK...(A family member did this)

58 posted on 06/21/2013 8:47:54 AM PDT by goodnesswins (R.I.P. Doherty, Smith, Stevens, Woods.)
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To: JCBreckenridge

Can you explain further how cremation contradicts the law of God?

Thanks, ‘Pod.


59 posted on 06/21/2013 8:53:05 AM PDT by sauropod (Fat Bottomed Girl: "What difference, at this point, does it make?")
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To: Patriot Babe

Usually requires a variance in the local zoning laws, which can be arranged; of course. It’s easier if you’re a celebrity and live in areas where zoning laws are lax to begin with (that is certainly the case in much of NC)

As I recall, Mr Griffith was buried on the day be died,’without being embalmed.


60 posted on 06/21/2013 8:55:26 AM PDT by ExNewsExSpook
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To: cuban leaf

In Connecticut, you can’t even bury your pet in your yard, any longer.


61 posted on 06/21/2013 8:58:40 AM PDT by Daffynition (Stand Your Ground)
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To: JoeProBono

If you can afford a house, you can afford a cremation. Maybe the reasoning is her and her husband had something against that. I feel bad for her either way. A loved one’s death can affect people in different ways.


62 posted on 06/21/2013 8:58:44 AM PDT by Durbin
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To: Average Al; JoeProBono
Quite a while ago, we had a thread about a family in the UK that made a coffin out of cardboard, a replica of the plane the deceased dad flew in WWII.


63 posted on 06/21/2013 9:04:54 AM PDT by Daffynition (Stand Your Ground)
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To: ErnBatavia

I got five from the town clerk when my wife died; additional notarized copies were $2/ea. Thd problem was, town hall was open 9:00-4:00 and no weekend hours. I thought I had all I needed and some places would take photocopies. I needed one more official, stamped copy and decided it wasn’t worth it to take time off work to get one more certificate.

I took a photocopy, a US silver eagle coin and a rolling pin. Voila, an official copy! It worked just fine


64 posted on 06/21/2013 9:06:23 AM PDT by muir_redwoods (Don't fire until you see the blue of their helmets)
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To: JCBreckenridge

I agree with your second statement; but, I (not being a Bible scholar) have no knowledge of a scriptural ban on cremation. Can you help me with that?


65 posted on 06/21/2013 9:09:18 AM PDT by MWestMom (Psalms 109:8)
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To: Vigilanteman

When my mother passed away recently the cost of “direct cremation” (no embalming, no casket, no viewing, no service), still came to over $2500 after they tallied up all the necessary items. She would have been irate.


66 posted on 06/21/2013 9:09:58 AM PDT by PLMerite (Shut the Beyotch Down! Burn, baby, burn!)
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To: Average Al

The thread: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1831844/posts


67 posted on 06/21/2013 9:10:10 AM PDT by Daffynition (Stand Your Ground)
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To: Daffynition

How would they know?


68 posted on 06/21/2013 9:13:14 AM PDT by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: goodnesswins
"a family member did this"

hmmm...was this question asked by the same person who ended up NEEDING a coffin? hahaha

this was in New Jersey. 'nuff said?

69 posted on 06/21/2013 9:20:45 AM PDT by ZinGirl (kids in college....can't afford a tagline right now)
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To: V K Lee

Question is. . .who are going to be the Sandmen ??


70 posted on 06/21/2013 9:20:52 AM PDT by Salgak (http://catalogoftehburningstoopid.blogspot.com 100% all-natural snark !)
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To: cuban leaf
They don't want you decaying into the water table.

Cremated you lack the nasty pathogens that a dead human body gives off.

71 posted on 06/21/2013 9:24:33 AM PDT by Harmless Teddy Bear (Revenge is a dish best served with pinto beans and muffins)
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To: ZinGirl

I read a story about someone that had died out of state. It was so expensive to ship the body home on an airline via the out of state funeral homes that the folks propped him up in the car and just drove him home for a funeral.


72 posted on 06/21/2013 9:28:58 AM PDT by Average Al
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To: JoeProBono

Right next to the hamster and the goldfish perhaps?


73 posted on 06/21/2013 9:35:04 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (The Civil Servants Are No Longer Servants...Or Civil.)
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To: Daffynition

That’s what the neighbor’s yard is for.


74 posted on 06/21/2013 9:35:23 AM PDT by reg45 (Barack 0bama: Implementing class warfare by having no class.)
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To: JoeProBono

While I’m sorry for her loss, there is another reason to bury a body in the backyard - and that’s to keep the checks coming in.


75 posted on 06/21/2013 9:42:15 AM PDT by RFEngineer
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To: JCBreckenridge

So apparently God is not big enough to put the body back together? If you can point to a Scripture, I’ll go along with you. Tradition doesn’t count.

Oh, and what about someone who dies a few hundred years ago, their body is dust. You might want to take a look at Genesis 3:19


76 posted on 06/21/2013 9:49:29 AM PDT by cyclotic (Hey BSA-NOT IN MY TROOP)
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To: Vigilanteman

When my dad died my mom couldn’t afford to pay for a funeral so my brother and I did. Cut rate and in an out of town cemetery.....$5k. My mom died 4 yrs ago and we pd to bury her. Same everything as my dad $5300.
People on limited incomes do NOT have that kind of money!


77 posted on 06/21/2013 9:54:54 AM PDT by sheana
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To: MWestMom

Again, look up at the defense for cremation a bit higher up in the thread.

“The spirit is everything. The body is nothing”. This is contrary to what Paul teaches. The body is important. If the body will be resurrected, then we have a duty to preserve the body. If the body is nothing, then cremate away.


78 posted on 06/21/2013 10:00:29 AM PDT by JCBreckenridge (Un Pere, Une Mere, C'est elementaire)
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To: sauropod; JCBreckenridge

“Can you explain further how cremation contradicts the law of God?”

I did my best to find scripture prohibiting cremation before originally asking that, could only find something externally explanatory to the effect that Saul and his sons had been cremated because the Philistines had defiled their bodies. I also remember that the Israelites burned the bodies of defeated peoples in Canaan.

I cannot agree that God prohibits cremation. I’m willing to believe it if anyone can provide a scriptural reference other than “Christian teachings”.


79 posted on 06/21/2013 10:01:21 AM PDT by treetopsandroofs (Had FDR been GOP, there would have been no World Wars, just "The Great War" and "Roosevelt's Wars".)
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To: Noumenon

I’m not sure if the meddling idiot lawyers in Raleigh have changed the rules, but a few years back I asked a local funeral director if we could be buried on our property. We are out in the country and have several acres.

“No problem!”

Do we need a vault?

“Nope.”

Special casket?

“Nope.”

Pine box OK?

“Yep.”

Hmmmmm.... Would a cardboard box and a little lime do?

“Sure, if you want to get fancy.”


80 posted on 06/21/2013 10:05:45 AM PDT by BwanaNdege ("To learn who rules over you simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize"- Voltaire)
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To: treetopsandroofs

I think the best argument is to look at why people defend cremation - it’s right up here in the thread. The concept that the ‘spirit is everything the body is nothing’, is being reinforced by cremation.

It’s one thing for a body to turn to dust by the passage of time, quite another to deliberately turn a body to dust. You wouldn’t dig up a body and cremate the body would you? Why not? If the ‘body is nothiing’, then there’s no reason not to dig up the body because you aren’t defiling anything.


81 posted on 06/21/2013 10:06:43 AM PDT by JCBreckenridge (Un Pere, Une Mere, C'est elementaire)
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To: JCBreckenridge

“Christians believe in the resurrection of the body, thus defilement of graves and bodies in graves is wrong.”

By this reasoning, only well-embalmed bodies older than a few hundred years will be resurrected.

So the poor schmucks who just buried their dead thousands of years ago are just SOL because the bodies have turned to dust?

I’m guessing Enoch is the exception because “God took him”?!


82 posted on 06/21/2013 10:09:55 AM PDT by treetopsandroofs (Had FDR been GOP, there would have been no World Wars, just "The Great War" and "Roosevelt's Wars".)
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To: cuban leaf

One of our friends said years ago, heck just dump me down the septic tank.....but the family buried him when he died...


83 posted on 06/21/2013 10:15:50 AM PDT by goat granny
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To: JCBreckenridge

“It’s one thing for a body to turn to dust by the passage of time, quite another to deliberately turn a body to dust.”

OK, since we aren’t going to discuss actual scripture, what about Christian contagious plague victims who were cremated to prevent spread of nasty pathogens?

Since God did a good job telling us what we could and could not eat, I would think he would have been similarly explicit with instructions if preservation of the deceased’s physical body is so important.

I’m sorry, I can’t agree that God prohibits cremation based upon some extrapolation and Christian teachings that can’t be backed up by scriptural reference.

I respect your belief but cannot agree with it.


84 posted on 06/21/2013 10:18:02 AM PDT by treetopsandroofs (Had FDR been GOP, there would have been no World Wars, just "The Great War" and "Roosevelt's Wars".)
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To: JoeProBono
I've already told my kids to cremate me, and let my ashes, and the ashes of my three cats blow with the wind.

When I was about 7 or 8 (in the 50's), I can remember a cemetery being dug up in Rochester, NY, to put in an expressway. From that day forward, I was determined to be cremated. I didn't want my bones being dug up 100 years later so they could put a road in.

85 posted on 06/21/2013 10:18:59 AM PDT by mass55th (Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway...John Wayne)
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To: ZinGirl

My sister was cremated in NY State in 2011. She’d already bought what she used to call her drawer (mausoleum) years before. The urn was included. I only paid for the actual cremation, which was arranged with a funeral director. He didn’t have his own crematory, but had an agreement with one. He picked her up at the hospice care home, took her to the crematory, took care of the obit, death certificates, and other paperwork, contacted the cemetery for internment, and brought her ashes to the cemetery the day of the funeral. I paid him about $1400 for everything. I had to pay an extra fee to the cemetery to open and seal the drawer.


86 posted on 06/21/2013 10:28:52 AM PDT by mass55th (Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway...John Wayne)
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To: Harmless Teddy Bear

Yeah. I understand the need for such rules in highly populated areas. Out where I live there is roughly one house per 60 acres.


87 posted on 06/21/2013 10:30:49 AM PDT by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: The Great RJ

My mother donated her body to the U Of R when she died in 1990. A funeral director had to be paid to retrieve her body from the hospital she had died in, and transport it to the U of R. When they were done with her, they called my sister to come pick up her ashes. We already had a spot for her next to our father, and had to pay the cemetery to take care of her internment.


88 posted on 06/21/2013 10:36:06 AM PDT by mass55th (Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway...John Wayne)
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To: Rusty0604
"But social security pays out $250 for death expenses, doesn’t that cover it?"

As far as I know, Social Security only pays if there is a living dependent. My sister died having never married, and had no dependents. Social Security didn't pay anything.

89 posted on 06/21/2013 10:39:23 AM PDT by mass55th (Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway...John Wayne)
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To: cuban leaf
Heck, even without cremation...

I hear wood-chipper rentals are cheap....

90 posted on 06/21/2013 10:40:43 AM PDT by Cyber Liberty (I am a dissident. Will you join me? My name is John....)
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To: Daffynition


91 posted on 06/21/2013 10:54:12 AM PDT by JoeProBono (Mille vocibus imago valet;-{)
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To: mass55th
I've already told my kids to cremate me, and let my ashes, and the ashes of my three cats blow with the wind.

I hope they aren't still alive when you pass....

92 posted on 06/21/2013 10:55:22 AM PDT by Cyber Liberty (I am a dissident. Will you join me? My name is John....)
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To: Patriot Babe


93 posted on 06/21/2013 10:59:07 AM PDT by JoeProBono (Mille vocibus imago valet;-{)
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To: Gay State Conservative

94 posted on 06/21/2013 11:05:30 AM PDT by JoeProBono (Mille vocibus imago valet;-{)
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To: ZinGirl

When my father died back in 1985 he was cremated. I think they had a provision for a rental coffin for the service. My dad in his best years had a terrific sense of humor, and didn’t mind occasionally offending others with it. He was probably looking down and getting great pleasure out of knowing his last home before that urn was a rented coffin!


95 posted on 06/21/2013 11:07:48 AM PDT by grania
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To: Cyber Liberty

The cats, of course.


96 posted on 06/21/2013 11:26:01 AM PDT by treetopsandroofs (Had FDR been GOP, there would have been no World Wars, just "The Great War" and "Roosevelt's Wars".)
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To: JCBreckenridge

Thank you!


97 posted on 06/21/2013 11:26:54 AM PDT by MWestMom (Psalms 109:8)
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To: Cyber Liberty

I hear wood-chipper rentals are cheap....


Too Fargo-esque. ;-)


98 posted on 06/21/2013 11:28:17 AM PDT by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: Cyber Liberty
"I hope they aren't still alive when you pass...."

Well I sure as hell hope they are, because there's no way I want to outlive my kids. Not only because it's not the normal cycle of life, but also because I don't want to have to clean out their apartments. My oldest son never throws anything away, and my youngest son is a slob. I've already told him that if he dies before me, I'm not cleaning his apartment out, but giving him a Viking funeral by setting his place on fire with him in it.

99 posted on 06/21/2013 11:35:10 AM PDT by mass55th (Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway...John Wayne)
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To: mass55th

That means killing them when you die... I’m not sure I can get 100% on board with that, but it’s your call. Any pets still alive when I croak will go to someone who will love them.

I can relate to the story of your younger son.


100 posted on 06/21/2013 11:49:06 AM PDT by Cyber Liberty (I am a dissident. Will you join me? My name is John....)
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