FReeper Advice on Divorce

Buy into what she loves. Obviously you've both stopped working at the marriage, and marriage IS work if you want the awesome benefit. It is so worth it when both parties commit to the responsibility -- and so easy to get complacent and take each other for granted. You both need to buy back in, and it starts with YOU, not her. Buy into what she loves. Be good to her -- better than she "deserves." Figure out what that is that makes HER happy and be a part of it, make it happen. Study, focus, figure her out. Your marriage isn't over. You've hit a flat spot and both stopped pedaling. You can go on being lazy and end up getting a divorce, devastating your children; or you can decide to put some effort in and have another wonderful 10 years to life. I'd start with that stupid book, Men are from Mars, Women from Venus. It's a baby step and entertaining, informative. Start there, and be good to her. You'll be amazed how being overtly, ridiculously good to your mate will come back to you in spades. Try it. And find your "people" in church. That's what brought me and my husband back together for another 20 years and counting. Be good to her, be persistently good to her. It WILL come back around.

INFLUENCE is the word and concept you want to focus upon to rectify this sad situation.

The burbs of San Francisco is my first and most important clue.

The left coast is notorious for all manner of strange (to a lot of flyover America) things and life-styles and if you work in the city, you pass by a million strange characters every day ... and they no longer phase you ... if they ever did.

The influence of the environment has been so effective in dulling your senses, you accept without thinking any subliminal; is it right? is it wrong?

Influenced is the evil Satan uses against us.

God gave him power over us, but he can't actually touch us (kill us) .. (btw .. I get this from the book of Job)

So Satan works using influence.

Lemmee try this;

A good little boy, properly reared and mannered goes to school with girls that wear clothing that sparks purient interests ... perhaps at an age we might think is inappropriate.

He starts to masturbate and chases girls early in life, gets one pregnant, marries 'cause it's the right thing to do, and has a miserable life

(of COURSE I invented that story)

No little girl MADE him masturbate ... but the INFLUENCE of sexuality was all that is needed.

You live on the left coast and I'd look in the mirror for anything that isn't USA, apple pie and Chevrolet ... and get rid of it ... even if it's stuff YOU like.

There WAS a time you looked into each others eyes with love ... SOMEthing influenced that look away ..

Find the influence and trace the steps from that influence.

Pray and hang in there.

Just wanted to add on one more thing. Your children are 6 & 2, I think. I know when our twins were smaller, I was ready to just off a ledge (well, almost!) more than once, and my husband was not much help with them at that age (from birth to about 4). She’d probably love to “fly the coop” and do some fun things with you, if they are HER definition of fun things. For instance, I don’t care for hiking with my husband (one of HIS favorite things) because he’s long-legged and won’t slow down. No fun for me. But if you can do things with her that SHE likes (and find some child care for the littles that she really trusts, so she won’t be stressed by worrying about them while you’re out on the town), that may loosen her up a little.

So arrange the child care yourself, and then do some stuff that SHE likes with her. Find or create a “special” occasion (your first date? first kiss? Full moon?) and take her out shoe shopping to celebrate, or to an art museum, or to a weepy chick flick, or to a concert, or anything that you know SHE likes. (Tip: Don’t expect any nookie afterward!!! That’s not the point of the fun expedition. It’s just to provide her with some innocent fun while in your presence, so she can remember what it’s like to have fun WITH you. The nookie will hopefully return later, when your emotional relationship is back on track again.)

Moms of little ones need some time off without their husbands, but we also need fun time WITH husbands! Both are important. If she starts getting both of these, maybe she will lighten up, and things will get better all around. Best of luck!!

Dear wac3rd

I’ve been married to my sweetheart for 35 years. Every couple has their own issues to deal with but I would humbly offer the following advice:

- if you are a Christian, remember that as her husband, you are to love your wife as Christ loves His Church - and how much love was that? He gave His life for it! We are instructed to cherish and nourish our wives.

So, what does that mean on a practical level (first read I Corinthians 13):

- do acts of kindness for your wife everyday
- leave a note or card for her to find expressing your love for her and how much you love the good times you’ve had in the past (think back on good memories you have both had - surely there are some - bring those up and help her to remember those times when you were both close and had fun together).
- verbally tell her that you love her everyday
- is there anything you both still enjoy doing together? If so do it more often.
- do little things for her that demonstrate your love for her (maybe do some household chore that she usually does - don’t make a big deal out it - just do it unexpectedly)
- unexpected gifts or flowers - romance her like you did before you were married
- is there a special place you both enjoy or enjoyed that you could get away for a weekend together?
- others have mentioned a good heart to heart talk - but wait until you’ve implemented all the things discussed above and have made a practice of them for a few months - and don’t turn it into a “our marriage would be better if only you would do this” - rather a general discussion about how you would like to be a better husband for her and that you miss the closeness you once had - ask her what could you do to help remedy that?
- you mentioned that you still do things together when it’s family related - try to embellish those moments with going out for ice cream together or to a favorite kid friendly restaurant.

Remember to be patient. Remember the good times you’ve had and do what you can to bring those memories back for your wife as well.

Keep on praying that her heart will soften toward you and toward God.

Howdy Wac3rd! :)

Your wife has been mommy for the last 8 years. Of course you want affection and attention from her, but after focusing all her energy on the kids day in and day out... she may just feel too darn tired to also cater to YOUR needs. She may even be looking to YOU to show HER some appreciation. The last thing you want to do is make her feel she has to keep 3 kids entertained and content. Does she know you appreciate her?

I married my high-school sweetheart right after graduation. Still best friends 16 years later. To me he is the perfect guy. He's a simple man. A good southern redneck. He's hard working. Sometimes he's mischievous and silly. He is kind, and slow to anger but treat him badly and he'll never give you a chance to do it again.

We keep everything REAL simple. If he comes home from work frowning I can almost always fix it by asking, "Hungry? Sleepy? Thirsty?" Just getting him an ice tea, a nice dinner or letting him take a nap usually works just fine. Occasionally he'll have something else in mind and he just lets me know. "Back hurts" or "Upstairs time?"

I do the same for him. I tell him what I need. "Tell me I look amazing in this dress! Yeah, you know I do!" or "I require a hug now." I even tell him when he messes up that I will complain about it at least 2 more days. He'll either nod and count down days or try to negotiate. He's an excellent negotiator.

I don't know if my post was helpful or just annoying. But I highly recommend no stress, simple talk.

Tell her, "I see all the things you do every day for our home and our kids and words can't say how much I adore you. Bottle of wine? Movie night cuddled up on the couch? Back massage? Hotel Jacuzzi weekend? You deserve some stress free pampering and I would love to just spend some time with you. Think about it and let me know what sounds nice."

Dearest wac3rd...That you are asking for counsel is admirable which means you are teachable. That is a big plus in working out any problem. So many people continue on in their same pattern and never figure out how to change themselves to obtain the goal they have set for themselves.

In your case, it seems you have set a very worthy goal and that is to save your marriage and provide a loving environment for yourself, your wife and your children. First of all, as you can tell from many of the comments, most marriages have the exact challenges you are facing. My first marriage, of seven years, ended because I was tired of being emotionally alone...loneliness while being married is very painful. However, if I would have had someone wise to tell me that marriage is like a dance, sometimes slow, sometimes fast I believe I would have had a much better life than I experienced after my divorce. I should have stayed in my first marriage and worked on it. Working on marriage WORKS! Giving up leads to very bad consequences.

My second marriage of 37 years has been almost a daily challenge. We have faced every domestic disaster you could face but I wouldn't give up. I truly have callouses on my knees from praying us through years and years of conflicts and tensions but I wouldn't give up. Consequently I now have a peaceful partner for my old age companion. I have a grown happily married daughter (I didn't scar her life with divorce) and two wonderful grandchildren. I have a wonderful family. All those years of struggle has paid off. Oh my first marriage cost me my 8 yr. old son when he was shot and killed by the nanny's son while I was out working to support my he and I. It seems raising him in a single parent home didn't work out very well for us. So, I was very determined to keep my daughter in a nurturing home with two parents.

Now the secret to my success was that I relied on God 24/7 for 37 years. My husband and I both went through many spiritual changes that made us emotionally compatible. I finally got my husband to understand that God made man the INITIATOR and woman the RESPONDER. So if he initiated love, care, concern and unselfishness that is what I returned to him. Initiate/Respond, almost a knee jerk reaction. Husband gives time and attention, wife responds with time and attention. Husband gives criticism, judgment, indifference, Wife responds with the same only usually more intense. I have so much to say on this subject but will move on to my last point.

Making love! What a subject, but I am going to give to to you straight. I am a woman of much experience. Before I was 35 I was not a Christian so I knew the ways of men, very well. As a Christian mother and wife I have been faithful and never tempted to go outside of my marriage for any reason. I say all that to lay the ground work for my counsel. Making love is where most men loose it. There is sex and there is making love. Sex is for personal gratification and making love is to set your needs aside and focus in on your partner's need. It requires a giving attitude. Your only focus is to pleasure your wife. Bring her to ecstasy then enjoy your own pleasure. Making love starts in the kitchen for a woman...taking out the garbage, unasked on a regular basis, clearing off the dishes after dinner without being asked. Doing a load of laundry on the week end. A woman's home is an extension of her. How you help and take care of your home touches a woman very deeply. She then becomes more receptive to how you touch her as you pass by her chair, kiss her goodbye in the morning, call and say hi from work. All this is MAKING LOVE!

Well I have hit on some high points. Divorce is not necessary. The consequences are 2x more difficult than putting the effort into falling in love again with your wife...Remember INITIATE/RESPOND. What do you want? Give it out first and it will come back. This might take time but with God's help, it will change your marriage around.

Oh, one last piece of advice. God took woman out of Adam's side. That is her divine position, at her husband's side. If she PERCIEVES there is ANYTHING, hobby, sports, work, mother-in-law, whatever as the #1 priority in her husband's life she will fight it or become indifferent. She must know she is #1 not the job,golf,best friend, etc. then she will purr like a kitten. Trust me on this...so don't be a workaholic. Take a random day or few hours off just to be with her, every once in awhile. The time invested will be well worth it.

Hang in there...do some changes...be patient. Just when it's the darkest the light is over the horizon. It will work. It took me 37 years but I am so glad I invested.

Consider it that way, and from what you say the facts point to that. She and your relationship with her is nowhere near as important as the kids and your relationship with them.

Make it legal and it will work out or not, but in the long run for you and the kids it will end up worlds better even if it is really done.

Keep your sanity, your job, and the kids relationship protected.... make it legal and that will remove one unknown. Yes it (things) are empty, but from what you describe it has been that way. So face up to that and protect your sanity, your job, and the legal stuff with the kids so those worries are gone.

I have seen this several times and been though it twice personally.
The time I made it legal it ended up being for the better for us both and we still live together as the real friends we were to start.
The one I didn't make legal cost way too much pain (all the way around) and ended up after years of driving me nuts to be over.

Only now I can see it was a done deal from way back, and I could have gone much further, and faster, if I had made it legal from the start.

Remember, going legal does not affect the kids 'cause they don't know what that is anyway. When I did take that first one legal, it all was clearer and easier from the point the papers where filed. In the long run that one ended up working out better for both of us too.
It did not make us better, but as I said, in the long run I can see that one was done from the start too.

Make it legal, keep your sanity, and your job. Remember, legal is only papers, and that can change with by ripping up the papers... but if it is really done now (which is what you indicated from the start of this thread) I promise you will be glad the paper work is done NOW.

Sanity, job, kids are all you have that is just yours, so take away the variable. If she really wants to change it, she can take action to do so. If she does not, then she does not want to.

Make her show she wants it any other way than it is now. If not, you will be ahead of the inevitable! Best yet she will have to deliberately answer the papers and the current situation so you will force her to move in some direction... which you indicate she is not now.

Remember the kids are all that matters now, and for history. Everything else will fade. Just keep saying to yourself, kids, job, and sanity. DO NOT be swayed by her till she comes around and it will work out for the better.

Good luck and hang tough. Peace brother.
Freep mail me if yu want to chat on this some more.

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