To Vote or Not to Vote

[jstaff]

With the mid-terms close by I am hearing more and more that I should just not vote for Tom Tillis or any other Republican incumbent that defeated a Tea Party challenger in their primary. I should not support the Rovians. Mitch McConnell should be defeated by a Dem to teach him a lesson. I must be a closet liberal, American Constitution hating Democrat to even consider such a thing. Some with that view pop up on FR regularly to tell me to stay home on election day to teach the moderates R's a lesson by letting the D's win.

For what it's worth, I consider myself a social and fiscal conservative. I believe in the Constitution and the importance of the rule of law. I am also a pragmatist on election day. I firmly support the idea that when the best is not available we need to choose the least bad option, holding our noses if we need to. To simply not vote is to concede the debate to the other side, something that I am not going to do. While I can understand, if not approve, this idea on an emotional basis I just don't understand it on a logical, rational level.

In my view, anyone who claims any sort of conservative label and stands loudly and firmly behind the idea that we should just let the libs take charge does so for one of only four reasons:

1. They are ignorant. They just haven't noticed what is going on around them.

2. They are stupid. They see everything that is going on, they don't like it, but they just don't have the intellectual ability to figure out what is causing it.

3. They are fools. They know what is going on around them, they realize it is bad and they know what is causing it. They take an emotional approach to decision making, however, because their fav didn't win the primary and this is their way getting back at the bully who gave them a big boo-boo.

4. They are liars. They are really playing for the other side and this is just another tool they use to discourage us from voting.

If there is a reasoned, non-emotional argument to support the stay home approach to elections I would very much like to read it. Until I do I will continue to encourage everyone to forget this all-or-none attitude. Everyone makes choices in their life, every day, that reflect a personal compromise between what they would like to happen vs what they can realistically make happen. You do the best you can do for yourself at the time. There is no reason that electing the leadership of the entire nation should be treated differently.

[Prospero]

Whatever differences many may have with Speaker Tillis, the go or no-go issue for he and the rest of the new Republican majority "running things" at the NC General Assembly for me was Voter ID. That was my litmus test, at least, and they did finally get the bill passed.

And I fully understand his GOP primary opponent's supporters feelings, but I can't be persuaded yet Tillis presents any clear and present danger to American nationalism, or at the very least any similar danger clearly posed by Kay Hagan, whom I watched closely perform as a puppet of the national and state Democrats when she served in the NC Senate.

I would vote for a Yellow Dog before I'd vote for Kay Hagan, who will definitely cause me continued loss of sleep representing North Carolina in Washington through the end of this decade.

She should never have been elected to the U.S. Senate, and wouldn't have if Elizabeth Dole had not proven out to be one of the most incompetent U.S. Senate prima donnas when she ran a half-assed re-election campaign six years ago.

Mrs. Dole --- "Jimmy Carter with Helmet Hair" -- that's a RINO. Tillis may owe fealty to a lot of groups and people I am definitely more than "at odds" with, but he's also no fool.

Kay Hagan, on the other hand, needs to be sent back to the Greensboro Junior League where she belongs --- ASAP.

[VRWC For Truth]

Where was I living in 2000-2006, when the R’s had control of the House, Senate AND WH, and did NOTHING with it.

GOPe - Conservatives = Whigs. The GOPe is DEAD.

[Yosemitest]

I can understand their passion.
But they trust LIARS!
And they expect us too ?

NO MORE!
NOT ONE DAMN PENNY'S WORTH !

[Drrdot]

That’s not true and you know it. They passed TARP, and expanded Medicare. Because, you know, those RHINOs are so conservative.

[itsahoot]

Voting for a Progressive RINO is the same as voting for any other Tyrant.

If voting made any difference they wouldn't let us do it."

Mark Twain -

[InterceptPoint]

you are hardly “tea party all the way” when you shill for democrats running as republicans.

Just answer one simple queston:

Do you want the Dems or the GOP to control the Senate in 2015?

Or do you care given your view that there really isn't any difference?

[VRWC For Truth]

I say again. Not one dime’s worth of difference.

[dware]

Do you want the Dems or the GOP to control the Senate in 2015?

I want Conservatives running the Senate. If we can't do that with the current slate of (so called) R's, then put the Democrats in place, let em run it into the ground and spark the next reformation.

[Yosemitest]

That quote ...

"

If voting made any difference they wouldn't let us do it."

Mark Twain -

It reminds me of a new tactic in STEAL VOTES BEFORE WE VOTE.

Here is a MUST WATCH VIDEO about STEALING ELECTIONS !
Make sure you tell ALL your acquaintances to watch it, and watch it RIGHT NOW !

HBO Hacking Democracy The Pima County Way, Card Reader and RTA Election. ( 16:30 )
By AUDITAZ Uploaded on Apr 24, 2011

In the RTA election of May 16, 2006 more than 100 optical scanners failed on Election Day at various precincts.

Election day I was out inspecting precincts and once I found that a large number of optical scanners were failing to work at the precincts.
I called Rep. Ted Downing, (Chair of State Party Election Integrity committee) also (at that time) the Chair of our county party "Donna Branch-G".
Both went to the election department to see what the problem was
and that is when they found the Microsoft -Access manual open right next to the central tabulator.

Donna and Ted took pictures of this.
Both were told that they had no oversight rights because
this was a nonpartisan election
thus stopping us from actually finding out
if MS-access was on the system
and if the central tabulator networked to other computers in the office.
By the time we got to check the computer several months later the program was gone.
However, we did find MS-Access on the Maricopa Election Department and that system count 58% of the vote state wide.

The Diebold-GEMS software is built on MS-Access program.
It is illegal by state law to have software that has not been approved and or certified by the SOS office such as MS- Access.
This is because
MS Access easily backdoors the database
and one could change anything they want by passing the GEMS Audit log.

To make it worse
the normal backup which was always done EVERY election night
and/or major event was not until the following Friday at 5:01pm.

Additional Facts:
In the case of the RTA, the election department after processing 13,000 early ballots 6 days out,
went in early the next morning
and did a backup over that database
destroying that file called "early ballots day 1"
and replaced it with a new day 1 backup,
then illegally printed (5 days before the election) 2 election summary reports 10 minutes apart.
These reports by law are not supposed to be printed until one hour after the polls close.
Such a process took many computer moves that could never be a simple "slip of the finger".

Fact: Even though Brian Crane told the Judge Miller
this was a normal practice,
examination of the computer logs showed this had only been done one other time since 2000.
In actuality, Bryan Crane did backups at lunch
and before he went home at night.

AUDIT-AZ
Producer: John R Brakey
Esq: Bill Risner
BBV: Jim March

[itsahoot]

Sure, throw your vote away.

Bob Dole for President! Woo! Woo!

John McCain for President! Woo! Woo!

Mitt Romney for President! Woo! Woo!

[Cboldt]

Voter participation, and the right to vote, both are used to justify whatever action the government decides to make. The right to vote is basically a device used to channel dissent. You have a right to vote, which substitutes for a right to complain or even disobey. The vote is used to legitimize the government, even when it acts in an illegitimate fashion.

None of that justifies not voting, rather to illuminate that the value of the vote is negligible. Those who don't vote aren't throwing away much of anything. The people essentially no control over the federal government, which is so far outside its constitutional boundaries to be reasonably viewed as illegitimate. The government rules by force, not by consent. The vote is there to fool them into thinking they have a meaningful voice, and to empower the government to make the claim that it governs by the consent of the governed (see "right to vote.")

The calculus I describe is associated with universal suffrage, and putting a high value on universal suffrage.

[Cboldt]

-- Only one Republican (Joseph Cao, LA) voted for Obamacare. Every other Republican in the House and Senate, RINO and non-RINO) voted AGAINST Obamacare. Had the Congress had more Republicans, RINO and non-RINO, at the time there would be no Obamacare today. --

The GOP offered its version of Obamacare as an alternative to Hillarycare, back in the day. Both parties in the federal government are determined to expand the scope of federal influence.

[itsahoot]

A Republican usually won’t vote against our gun rights.

Nope, but maybe they will appropriate the money to buy up the ammo supply. Or some other back door plan to make it impossible for you to actually exercise your right.

Notice that Boehner and Pelosie got together to pass a CR that fully funds Planned Parenthood, Obamacare and fund the terrorists in Syria until December, which gives the defeated members one last chance to screw over the people before the New Congress is seated.

“Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost.”

-- John Quincy Adams

If voting made any difference they wouldn't let us do it."

Mark Twain -

[itsahoot]

Had the Congress had more Republicans, RINO and non-RINO, at the time there would be no Obamacare today.

You delude yourself. The reason every RINO voted against ObamaCare is because it didn't matter. Remember if you will how it ever got to the Senate floor for a vote, in the first place.

[loveliberty2]

"If there is a reasoned, non-emotional argument to support the stay home approach to elections I would very much like to read it."

Perhaps this suggestion fails to meet the "non-emotional argument" point; however, given the obviously immediate threats to life and liberty under the present Administration and its partisan Democrats, it may tip the scales for voting for a less-than-perfect candidate in order to, perhaps, buy time before Constitutional restraints on government power are abolished and individual liberty is back to Old World, and pre-1776 levels:

Look into the innocent face of your child, grandchild, or neighbor's child, and then convince yourself that sitting out this election will give that child a better chance at future life, liberty and happiness than would your going to the polls and considering that your vote might be against another rubber stamp for the president's policies and a delay against "approaching tyranny."

[itsahoot]

We have a bill in the Senate to limit free speech,

A bill that has Zero chance of becoming law, no matter who controls the Senate and you know it.

[itsahoot]

Here I was expecting immigration reform, reduced spending, balanced budgets, etc., which is why I worked so hard for the R’s in 2000. Won’t make that mistake again!

Remember this one from John McCain?

If they want a fence we will build a g-d d@mn fence.

[InterceptPoint]

I want Conservatives running the Senate. If we can't do that with the current slate of (so called) R's, then put the Democrats in place, let em run it into the ground and spark the next reformation.

That is an honorable idea. But, IMHO, totally impractical.

So a question: How long do you think it will take if your scenario play out: Dems run it into the ground, country comes to it's senses, we vote in a solid block of conservatives in both the House and the Senate.

BTW, who doesn't hope for that scenario given the fact that, IMHO, the Dems have already run us into the ground?

But ... how long do you think this will take if we follow your advice?

[DesertSapper]

Who ultimate benefits most by your vote (or non vote)?

[loveliberty2]

Republicans are making a serious mistake by not hammering Hagan's unqualified participation in and outright enthusiastic support of Obamacare and its campaign of lies and misrepresentations!

The milktoast ads currently being run for Tillis by the U. S. Chamber and others may allow the teachers' union's misrepresentations of his actions to prevail in the public mind and result in Hagan keeping her seat.

Hagan lied about the reasons for supporting the Trojan Horse for unfettered government power over individuals and the taking of the fruits of their labors. She participated in the lies which Democrats used for justifying that economic power grab, such as claiming that patients with cancer could not get insurance in the pre-Obamacare marketplace, and she, along with Pelosi and Reid and their President, lied when they assured citizens that "if you like your . . . , you can keep . . . ."

Every day between now and Election Day every citizen should have those quotes and the disastrous results we're now seeing and will continue to see blaring from every radio and TV set.

Instead, they're seeing nice little soft ads for her opponent about his work history.

Cancer patients, last year, many of whom had purchased policies since their diagnosis, and were happy with those insurance policies, were forced to spend their last Thanksgiving/Christmas Season online searching for new coverage, all because their insurance carrier was forced by the "rules of the so-called "Affordable" Care Act" to cancel the perfectly good policy they then held. This is a sad fact which few are talking about and one which should lie at the feet of Senators like Kay Hagan!