Posted on 11/19/2014 7:38:52 AM PST by Gamecock
Title pretty much sums it up.
Interested in one I can secure in my glovebox, if I feel the need. and keep at home to "discourage" anyone who may want to do us harm.
In the military I was used to a 9mm and back in the day a .45.
Will look for a concealed carry weapon later.
What does y'all suggest?
Many thanks!
It doesn’t take a rifle to make the difference.
The “bigger is better” concept, as applied to handgun caliber, has a strong emotional appeal. However, strong emotional appeal often has little positive correlation with science. Indeed, it may have a negative correlation with reality. Keep this in mind when evaluating handgun stopping power.
http://www.chuckhawks.com/handgun_stopping_power.htm
Back in the 1960’s, big bore fans asserted that .45 ACP 230 grain ball ammo would achieve 95% one shot stops. Subsequent research has shown that 230grain FMJ .45 ACP loads actually provide about 60-64% one shot stops and several smaller calibers using expanding bullets are more effective stoppers. The most effective of all self-defense handgun cartridges is the medium bore .357 Magnum with a 125 grain JHP bullet, which provides 93-97% stops. Those numbers are supported by a huge data base and several different researchers, working independently, have discovered essentially the same thing.
If you can afford it, a shotgun is better at home and cheaper than most handguns.
I have both and feel pretty secure. I don't open carry. My guns are for home security.
I don't travel much anymore and I live in a very small town in SW Colorado. I like it.
FMCDH(BITS)
How’s your PMR30 doing?
If order of your rules is important, why is #5 after #4?
Dot or feather?
It had problems. Every second load was a failure. Returned it and waited 3 months They fixed it with new slide and barrel and “fluff and buff” . I wonder say what I think about F&B.
If it's your only handgun and need it to versatile (occasionally carry in your waistband or something) you'll want to go light and small for comfort reasons. I cannot more strongly recommend the Ruger LCR in .357 mag. for this purpose. There is also a .38spl version, but the weight diff is almost insignificant.
However, if it will be strictly a "car gun" and maybe live on your nightstand, you have the option of going big. Nothing beats (in my humble opinion) a nice, broken-in 1911 in .45. I still like my old Colt for this purpose. I keep it loaded up with Corbon slugs.
One other suggestion : don't keep it in the glove box with your papers. It makes for a very tense situation if you get pulled over, trust me on this... I learned the hard way. Either keep your papers in a holder on your visor away from your firearm, or get one of the permanently mounted under-dash holsters to mount under your steering column, out of sight. you shouldn't have to disclose the presence of your firearm if you get pulled over (well, I think a couple states require it), and you don't want a cop to get a glimpse of it unexpectedly. It puts you in danger.
Good luck. Oh, and if you have the option, it's always good to ask your buddies what they have and borrow them for some range time to see what you think. Everybody has a different opinion of "feel" and weight. Also keep in mind, some very fine handguns come with lousy grips... but that can almost always be solved with aftermarket grips and turn a lousy "feel" into a very comfortable shooter.
good info
“Glock 19.
Pretty much perfect for any need, given no details on particular needs.”
One of the most balanced, size-efficient handguns ever made. Small, light, high ammo capacity, comfortable grip angle, conceals nicely, and easy to shoot well.
BUT, my carry gun is a Ruger LCR .357 loaded with .38 spl +P in a DeSantis pocket holster with 6 extra rounds in a Bianchi Speed Strip in the offside pocket. Nothing beats a powerful “pocket pistol”. See Rule #1.
The little Ruger is a gem, isn’t it? Some Hogue grips really help give it some balance.
For another couple hundred bucks the S & W 640 Pro Series (’hammerless’) is a beauty too, with night sights and a tiny bit slimmer.
Both of them small, safe, great feel, lots of punch.
Surprised you don’t already have one.............
Ah yes, the myth of stopping power.
First, most gun fights DO NOT END by “stopping power” (instant kill, dropping the target, whatever). Most end by one side running away (later going to the ER) or by giving up (caused by pain or passing out from blood loss).
Second, shot placement is key (see rule #2). A .22 to the brain pan is far more effective “stopping power” than a .45 to the guts. Does that make the .22 have more stopping power? No.
(Sydney Vail MD, FACS, is an associate professor of surgery on the trauma faculty at Penn State Milton S. Hershey Medical Center and Penn State College of Medicine in Hershey, Pa. He also serves as director of tactical medicine programs for the Arizona Department of Public Safety and Maricopa County (Ariz.) Sheriff’s Office SWAT teams.)
“I have seen a .22 caliber bullet completely incapacitate someone and a .45 ACP fail to achieve that result. People and animals shot with 10mm rounds and .357 SIG rounds have continued to run from the police. I have been on scene as a tactical medical provider when a suicidal person shot himself in the head with a .45 Colt round resulting in instant death. And I have seen the same results in suicides that used smaller calibers, including .22, .25, and .32. I have also seen people hit with 9mm, .40, and .45 without so much as staggering or slowing their verbal or physical activities.”
http://www.policemag.com/channel/weapons/articles/2013/01/stopping-power-myths-legends-and-realities.aspx
I consider the opinion of medical doctors who regularly treat gun shot wounds higher than gun enthusiast blog writers. That is why #2 is in the rule set before #4.
Since we are talking about rule #4, it is subject to rule #3, #2, and #1. Thus, when comparing two calibers, we assume that all of the above rules are equal. Thus, the person is actually carrying, the shot placement is to the same location, and that the firearm was actually brought into the firefight in time.
In essence, all being equal, the scenario breaks down into two different evaluations. 1) the person is incapacitated by the shot placement (no need to go further as the size is then irrelevant) and 2) the person is not incapacitated by the shot placement. This is the scenario that leads to bigger bullet vs faster bullet rule.
Since the person is not already incapacitated, the temporary wound cavity is NO LONGER RELEVANT to the discussion. The target has already survived the temporary wound. What now becomes relevant is the permanent would cavity which allows blood flow to exit the body causing a drop in blood pressure, shock and possibly loss of life. The larger the hole, the greater the blood flow. I know this as I see this quite often while big game hunting. In your comparison, you compare two bullets that have about 0.1 difference in diameter. How about comparing a .22 vs a .45? That is a difference of 0.23. That is a significant difference in the permanent wound cavity.
You will also note that when the calibers are the same, I clearly state that a faster bullet is better. There is not that much difference between the .380, .38, 9 mm, 357, or 10 mm, 40 caliber ballistics other than speed. However, this is still subject to rule #2. If a person can not accurately shoot a .40 but can accurately shoot a .38, they would be better off with the .38 due to the fact that accuracy is king.
Because of simple mechanics. It is harder to make the second follow up shot than the first. Thus the second shot has a much higher chance of missing. See rule #2. Rule #5 addresses the capacity issue.
Banging a whole lot of rounds down range is not as critical as actually hitting the target. Thus the capacity of rounds of a particular firearm takes a back seat to hitting the target accurately and putting a big enough hole in the person that they stop fighting.
S&W also has nice 8-rd revolvers, like a 357 mag.
Agreed, but what was your point of bigger hose then intend to effect?
Second, shot placement is key
Very True.
I consider the opinion of medical doctors who regularly treat gun shot wounds higher than gun enthusiast blog writers.
You might want to learn a bit more about Chuck Hawks before you dismiss his opinion as worthless. Do you dismiss the actual data as well?
“I have seen a .22 caliber bullet completely incapacitate someone and a .45 ACP fail to achieve that result.
Still agree, but that wasn't what we were discussing.
Since the person is not already incapacitated, the temporary wound cavity is NO LONGER RELEVANT to the discussion.
Not just temporary. And the amount of damage can be quite relevant to how soon the fight ends. Otherwise, why did you write #4?
What now becomes relevant is the permanent would cavity which allows blood flow to exit the body causing a drop in blood pressure, shock and possibly loss of life.
Penetration is a significant part of the cavity and bleed out.
In your comparison, you compare two bullets that have about 0.1 difference in diameter. How about comparing a .22 vs a .45?
I wouldn't consider a 22 for protection, would you? If not, why compare it? It should not be considered a effective choice, if choosing what gun to keep for protection, which was the topic of this thread.
There is not that much difference between the .380, .38, 9 mm, 357, or 10 mm, 40 caliber ballistics other than speed.
Energy is certainly a factor. Different weights and more importantly, bullet design, make a significant difference in the wound.
LOL - feather!
No, my point is just the opposite. There are more important considerations than the caliber.
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