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JFK's fatal head wound: The truth for those who want to know (very graphic)
jmasland.com & others | 11/22/03

Posted on 11/22/2003 5:10:59 PM PST by Wolfstar

The Zapruder film proves itself to be authentic. There is no possibility that any frames could have been cut out of the film or altered. Why/how? Every time a frame was exposed, part of the background scene was exposed onto both the next frame and the previous frame in the sprocket hole areas. This is because the sproket holes are between frames, as shown below:


The head shot, frame-by-frame:

Frame 312


Frame 313


Frame 313 enlarged:


Frame 314


Frame 315


Frame 316


Frame 317


Frame 318


Frame 319


Frame 320


The head wound:


The large flap of skull, skin and other tissue blown out above and just in front of the president’s right ear. The flap stayed attached and hung over the president's right cheek. On the ride to Parkland, Mrs. Kennedy attempted to put it back in place. What the doctors saw at Parkland was the wound partially closed with the shattered pieces at the top rear of the wound missing. Hence, some doctors recalled a wound in that area:



TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: 01nov1963; bang; diem; jfk; jfkhit; oswald
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To: Wolfstar
Thanks should go to you. The frame shots and the mock-up of the head make this the best thread I've seen so far on this subject.
101 posted on 11/22/2003 6:48:41 PM PST by Double Tap
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To: Wolfstar
Okay, Thanks!
102 posted on 11/22/2003 6:51:14 PM PST by CyberAnt (America .. the LIGHT of the World)
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To: CholeraJoe
Disappointing. I had hoped that, as a physician, you would look at the autopsy photos clinically. Sigh. Can you not put aside your own opinions for a few minutes and just objectively describe the wounds you see in the autopsy photos? I don't mean what direction you believe the shot to have come from, but the nature of the wounds, themselves. If you are, indeed, a physician, you could add to the knowledge of us all.
103 posted on 11/22/2003 6:53:27 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: CholeraJoe
Also the exit wound exploded as a dum dum bullet would cause and not the cleaner hole produced by military ammo as is the "magic bullet"... An accurate physical simulation would also be in the realm of possibility, knowing the weight of his head and calculating a rotation around the neck.. Dynamics is dynamics.. no matter what the material..
104 posted on 11/22/2003 6:55:11 PM PST by glowworm
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To: Double Tap
Those who refuse to acknowledge the truth are beyond reach. But those who really do want to know the facts may benefit by this info, even though it is gruesome. I very much appreciate it when someone, such as yourself, takes the time to add his or her expertise to our body of knowledge.
105 posted on 11/22/2003 6:57:14 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: wideminded
"The physicist Luis Alvarez, who wrote an extensive report on the Zapruder film, showed that the backwards head movement can be explained by the forward ejection of brain matter. Alvarez is a Nobel Prize winner who worked on the atomic bomb."

-----
I also heard that they did tests on melons of some sort and had to do many, many test shots to get one to recoil backwards like Alvarez' theory purports.
106 posted on 11/22/2003 7:01:13 PM PST by gooleyman
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To: CholeraJoe
In this frame you can see the impact and the bullet exiting from the rear.

Holy cow! I've never heard anyone say this before. You mean you can actually see the bullet in this photo?

107 posted on 11/22/2003 7:04:06 PM PST by texasbluebell
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To: kayak
Might the backwards motion of his head also have been partially due to the sudden acceleration of the car. If my recollection is even close to correct, as soon as the shots rang out the driver sped up quickly ....

It would make sense that they sped up, but I've read accounts from some of the agents who were perplexed that the car just sat there for something like 10 seconds. I can't link to it though, sorry.

108 posted on 11/22/2003 7:06:48 PM PST by texasbluebell
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To: Wolfstar
"He used a single magic bullet."

No, actually, he didn't.

There were three verified shots fired. One that missed, one that hit the president in the back and exited through his throat, and one that hit the president in the head.


The only thing I am trying to do with this thread is demonstrate the truth about the fatal head shot clearly for those whose minds are open to the truth.
I do not argue for or against any conspiracy theory — only that those who believe a conspiracy existed should at least not twist the truth about the fatal head shot.

It came from the rear and took out pretty much all of the upper right side of the president's head.
A well-meant conspiracy theory will try to make the theory fit the facts, not the other way around.
18 -Ws-




The single "magic" bullet theory is key to the controversy, not the direction of the head shot, which may never be proven.


You insist there were three "verified" shots fired. One that missed, one that hit the president in the back and exited through his throat, and one that hit the president in the head.



Thus you contradict yourself claiming the "only thing I am trying to do with this thread is demonstrate the truth about the fatal head shot clearly for those whose minds are open to the truth."

You are arguing for the Reports theory & against any conspiracy theory.

— That the fatal head shot came from the rear and took out pretty much all of the upper right side of the president's head is not really an issue, as another shooter from the rear is entirely possible.

The timing of the previous shots, the wounds they made, when compared to the Z film, make it almost impossible for Osawald to have to have been the lone assassin.

Certainly, "a well-meant conspiracy theory will try to make the theory fit the facts, not the other way around." -- And this is exactly what the Commission did back in '64 with their single bullet bull.

--They made themselves into the whackos, and most of us never believed their lone gunman fantasy.

109 posted on 11/22/2003 7:07:58 PM PST by tpaine (I'm trying to be 'Mr Nice Guy', but FRs flying monkey squad brings out the Rickenbacker in me.)
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To: kayak
Might the backwards motion of his head also have been partially due to the sudden acceleration of the car. If my recollection is even close to correct, as soon as the shots rang out the driver sped up quickly .... or so accounts were saying at the time. And it certainly makes sense.

Alvarez did an extremely detailed analysis of the motion of the car and the camera. He showed that the car actually slowed down just before the fatal shot and stayed at this reduced speed until the end of the portion of the Zapruder film which he examined. Here's one link to the Alvarez report. Unfortunately it is a photo-copy.

110 posted on 11/22/2003 7:11:46 PM PST by wideminded
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To: Wolfstar
No one can see the bullet exit. It fragmented inside the president's head.

Was it the bullet that hit the Presidents head that also hit Conally or one of the other shots? And what kind of bullet was used (I'm assuming a very limited number of commercial cartridges available for this caliber at the time of the shooting, and only one milsurp one)?

111 posted on 11/22/2003 7:13:30 PM PST by templar
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To: TalBlack
He also pointed out that the distance fron the window to the cars position on the street is no great distance. TV makes it look bigger than it is. The shot has ben BETTERED by amatures.
 
The History Channel needs to have R. Lee Ermey put a good shooter in a tower and take a shot at a watermelon moving below at 15mph to prove to a lot of people that it is a good shot but not an incredible shot. I'm pretty sure I could duplicate the first shot  - getting two on target that quickly is probably a little better than I could do - but then again I haven't practiced trying to assassinate anyone as a life goal. 
 
Regarding brains going backwards. The apple photo shown earlier demonstrates the physics of bullets hitting soft targets perfectly. People who think bullets always make small holes going in and big holes going out are right if your talking about steel or wood, but people are soft. Even Democrats don't have steel heads.

112 posted on 11/22/2003 7:18:06 PM PST by azcap
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To: Wolfstar
The only bullet photos I have seen are of one intact bullet that was found on JFK's stretcher. What about the one that blasted the TX Governor? What about the one that hit the curb? What about the one from the front that was a hollow point? Show me an xray of his head with official stamps.
113 posted on 11/22/2003 7:19:40 PM PST by CholeraJoe (Daddy, how many US soldiers have to die in defense of Freedom? Daughter, if necessary, all but 9.)
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To: CholeraJoe
HUH?
114 posted on 11/22/2003 7:22:45 PM PST by davetex
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To: tpaine
You are arguing for the Reports theory & against any conspiracy theory.

No, actually, I am not. All I've done is state what is known on the record. There are three shots on the record, per photographs, witness testimony, wounds, and the marks of the bullet known to have missed. One missed. One hit the president in the back/neck. One hit him in the head. Notice I have avoided the claim that the bullet that hit Kennedy in the back/neck also hit Connolly. I'll let others argue the point.

The single "magic" bullet theory is key to the controversy, not the direction of the head shot, which may never be proven.

The number and direction of all the shots is key to the whole issue of whether or not there was a conspiracy. How can you say the direction of the head shot "may never be proven" when the proof is right in front of you? I don't argue against a conspiracy, only against basing the argument for a conspiracy on a distortion of the known facts.

115 posted on 11/22/2003 7:26:01 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: CholeraJoe
Work on the atomic bomb does not necessarily establish expertise in wound ballistics. I have extensive knowledge about Critical Nuclear Weapons Design and Deployment Information (CNWDDI) I was cleared for that level of security when I was in the USAF.

Alvarez was selected to be involved in the original design of the atomic bomb at Los Alamos because he was a REALLY SMART GUY (and he happened to work for Ernest O. Lawrence). He didn't claim to be an expert on wounds or the fluid dynamics of jetting brain matter, just on physics. BTW you might be interested to know that he originated the idea of using exploding wire arrays to trigger atomic explosions. I posted a link to his report in #110.

116 posted on 11/22/2003 7:26:34 PM PST by wideminded
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To: templar
According to the Warren Commission, the first shot missed, the second shot hit the president in the back and exited out his throat continued on and hit Connolly. The third, fatal head shot occurred a few seconds later. Again, for those who insist on misunderstanding: This is according to the Warren Commission, not according to me. As for the kind of bullets used, I don't know that info.
117 posted on 11/22/2003 7:29:24 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: Wolfstar; Double Tap
Thanks should go to you. The frame shots and the mock-up of the head make this the best thread I've seen so far on this subject.

Ditto.

118 posted on 11/22/2003 7:30:41 PM PST by wideminded
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To: davetex
While there are photos pretending to be from the the JFK autopsy, there are no xrays of his head that have been authenticated. I insist upon seeing AP and Lateral skull films with AFIP markers. Until I do, I cannot accept the premise that there was a single shooter.
119 posted on 11/22/2003 7:34:18 PM PST by CholeraJoe (Daddy, how many US soldiers have to die in defense of Freedom? Daughter, if necessary, all but 9.)
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To: CholeraJoe
First, the nearly pristine bullet was found on Connolly's stretcher, not JFK's. Again, the Warren Commission said the first shot missed, the second hit the president in the back, exited his throat and hit the governor. The third shot hit the president in the head. If you've got a beef about this, argue with the Warren Commission.

Show me an xray of his head with official stamps.

Do your own research, doc. There are books that have been published with many if not all of the autopsy photos. They are hard to find on the internet, although with enough time and patience, you may find some. The photos published on this site are authentic, whether or not you want to believe them.

Once again, doc, any good physician should be able to put his or her personal opinions aside and clinically explain the anatomy of what is seen in the autopsy photos posted here. Even if you think they are falsified, you should still be able to offer a clinical description of what they show. You may choose not to, or it may be that you can't. A physician with expertise in nuclear weapons? Hmmm...

120 posted on 11/22/2003 7:38:27 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: wideminded
Thanks.
121 posted on 11/22/2003 7:39:25 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: gooleyman
I also heard that they did tests on melons of some sort and had to do many, many test shots to get one to recoil backwards like Alvarez' theory purports.

So you admit that the theory describes something that *can* happen! They used tape covered melons which obviously aren't perfect models of the human head. I don't know how many tests were done but I've seen the film of the melon falling backwards. Alvarez discusses the melon test and the physics behind it in the link I posted in #110.

122 posted on 11/22/2003 7:44:32 PM PST by wideminded
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To: wideminded
I consider myself a REALLY SMART GUY, too. I'm a physician but I haven't won any Nobel Prizes, yet.

I just can't accept a single gunner theory.

123 posted on 11/22/2003 7:50:03 PM PST by CholeraJoe (Daddy, how many US soldiers have to die in defense of Freedom? Daughter, if necessary, all but 9.)
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To: Wolfstar
The single "magic" bullet theory is key to the controversy, not the direction of the head shot, which may never be proven. You insist there were three "verified" shots fired. One that missed, one that hit the president in the back and exited through his throat, and one that hit the president in the head. Thus you contradict yourself claiming the "only thing I am trying to do with this thread is demonstrate the truth about the fatal head shot clearly for those whose minds are open to the truth." You are arguing for the Reports theory & against any conspiracy theory.
— That the fatal head shot came from the rear and took out pretty much all of the upper right side of the president's head is not really an issue, as another shooter from the rear is entirely possible.

The timing of the previous shots, the wounds they made, when compared to the Z film, make it almost impossible for Osawald to have to have been the lone assassin.

Certainly, "a well-meant conspiracy theory will try to make the theory fit the facts, not the other way around." -- And this is exactly what the Commission did back in '64 with their single bullet bull.
--They made themselves into the whackos, and most of us never believed their lone gunman fantasy.
109 -tpaine-

_____________________________________

You are arguing for the Reports theory & against any conspiracy theory.

No, actually, I am not. All I've done is state what is known on the record.

Yes, you are, percisely because the flawed Reports "record" has aways been the issue.

There are three shots on the record, per photographs, witness testimony, wounds, and the marks of the bullet known to have missed. One missed. One hit the president in the back/neck. One hit him in the head.
Notice I have avoided the claim that the bullet that hit Kennedy in the back/neck also hit Connolly. I'll let others argue the point.

That ~IS~ the point. The single "magic" bullet theory is key to the controversy, not the direction of the head shot, which may never be proven.

The number and direction of all the shots is key to the whole issue of whether or not there was a conspiracy. How can you say the direction of the head shot "may never be proven" when the proof is right in front of you?

You see 'proof', most don't.

I don't argue against a conspiracy, only against basing the argument for a conspiracy on a distortion of the known facts.

The distortions of many known facts are in the Report. You are arguing for the Reports distortions.

124 posted on 11/22/2003 7:50:23 PM PST by tpaine (I'm trying to be 'Mr Nice Guy', but FRs flying monkey squad brings out the Rickenbacker in me.)
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To: CholeraJoe
As a physician, Cholera Joe, you should be interested in the information provided in EVALUATION OF THE MEDICAL, PATHOLOGICAL AND RELATED EVIDENCE PERTAINING TO THE DEATH OF PRESIDENT JOHN F. KENNEDY (BY THE FORENSIC PATHOLOGY PANEL) produced for the House Select Committee on Assassinations. (The link most cheerily provided to you.)

As for right-side autopsy photo and the following x-rays, these also are from the HSCA evidence:

House Select Committee On Assassinations Exhibit #F-58. It shows where the flap of skull and skin seen in the Zapruder film fit in the president's skull.


125 posted on 11/22/2003 7:57:00 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: tpaine
Since you cannot distinguish between merely stating what a report says to be a fact from the act of endorsing what the report says, all else is lost on you.
126 posted on 11/22/2003 8:02:34 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: wideminded
" So you admit that the theory describes something that *can* happen! They used tape covered melons which obviously aren't perfect models of the human head. I don't know how many tests were done but I've seen the film of the melon falling backwards. Alvarez discusses the melon test and the physics behind it in the link I posted in #110.

-----
I'm not ADMITTING anything. I'm just saying what I had seen on a documentary. I saw it many years before I knew what a VCR was if it even existed on the consumer level, so I can't go back and watch it again. You describe it as "falling" backwards. Maybe you didn't mean it to sound as if gravity simply acted upon it after the shot, but it did make me think that after so many unsuccessful tries, maybe they sort-of gave it a little tilt backwards so it would "fall" backward...OH there I go again (slaps himself.) Sorry I try to control the conspiracy kook in me, but it's tough. He's a pesky little bugger.

I just find it hard to believe that a person's head shot from the back would recoil backwards. Physics degree or no...Nuclear Expert or no, I think the radiation has gotten to his brain to come up with such a bogus scheme. I give him credit. He's baffled a lot of people with that BS. What was the reason they covered the melons with tape? Why not use coconuts...something hard like the skull? That Emperer (sp?) is as naked as a jaybird.
127 posted on 11/22/2003 8:02:51 PM PST by gooleyman
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To: Wolfstar
Show me the entrance wound on the back of his head, would you, please? Circle it in photoshop, huh? I just don't see it. Maybe I'm stupid but I can't see it. The back of his skull is intact. This looks like a tangential wound from the front.
128 posted on 11/22/2003 8:06:02 PM PST by CholeraJoe (Daddy, how many US soldiers have to die in defense of Freedom? Daughter, if necessary, all but 9.)
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To: CholeraJoe
This looks like a tangential wound from the front.

Very interesting.

129 posted on 11/22/2003 8:10:50 PM PST by texasbluebell
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To: CholeraJoe
Again, do your own research. I've gone to the trouble of providing you with a link to the work product of other physicians produced for the HSCA. You may agree or disagree with their findings, but as a physician, one would think you'd at least be interested in what they had to say.

And, as I keep trying to prompt you to do, then you might use your training and knowledge to educate the rest of us.

There has been an autopsy photo of the rear entrance wound published in books. However, I've done enough research and posting for one night. Time to go feed my dogs, one of whom I'm deeply concerned about because she's a 14-yr-old with a heart block. Know what that is? I'll check back in the morning for any response you'd care to give.

130 posted on 11/22/2003 8:11:57 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: gooleyman
A show was on just this week and they showed an 80 year old guy shooting the rifle three times in less time than Oswald took.
131 posted on 11/22/2003 8:15:15 PM PST by Az Joe
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To: Wolfstar; CholeraJoe
And, as I keep trying to prompt you to do, then you might use your training and knowledge to educate the rest of us.

But he IS, Wolfstar! He's telling us what this looks like according to his training. This is fascinating, Joe.

132 posted on 11/22/2003 8:15:17 PM PST by texasbluebell
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To: CholeraJoe; texasbluebell
PS, Joe: Before I shut down the PC for the night - the back of his head doesn't look intact to me. It looks severely fractured and deformed. However, at least the bone is still present, unlike the right front which disintegrated when that portion of the head exploded, just as you can see in the stills from the Zapruder film. That area of the right front is the exit wound.

Incidentally, "tangential" is a synonym for marginal, unimportant, nonessential, minor, and secondary. Now you can argue any conspriacy theory you'd like, but when someone is missing all of the bone structure in one area of his head, I'd hardly call that a tangential wound — unless you mean it in some clinical way not obvious to us non-physicians?

133 posted on 11/22/2003 8:21:36 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: texasbluebell
He's telling us what this looks like according to his training.

Hmmm...

Really do have to sign off now. Dogs are hungry.

134 posted on 11/22/2003 8:23:52 PM PST by Wolfstar (An angel still rides in the whirlwind and directs this storm.)
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To: gooleyman
What was the reason they covered the melons with tape? Why not use coconuts...something hard like the skull?

If you have ever cracked open a coconut you know that there is a lot of air inside along with the relatively hard coconut and a small amount of watery coconut milk. Alvarez and his assistants wanted to examine the possible effect of a jet of soft fluid-like matter. Brains are very soft. In fact they must be treated with chemicals just to harden them enough to permit examination if they are removed during an autopsy. Alvarez says that they wrapped the melons in Scotch filament tape to "mock up the tensile strength of the cranium". Undoubtedly a taped covered melon is not a perfect model of the human skull. But it is impressive the the first crude model of a skull that Alvarez made proved the theory correct. What really counts is the physics of the situation which you can read about in the link in #110.

Alvarez was not such a sleaze as to fake the test. In contrast to your previous assertion he says that 6 out of 7 tests resulted in backwards recoil of the melon. In the seventh test the melon "just rolled around". The reason I said "fell backwards" is that the film showed the melon on top of a step ladder, so that the direction of recoil would be the direction of fall.

135 posted on 11/22/2003 8:36:52 PM PST by wideminded
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To: Wolfstar
Since you cannot distinguish between merely stating what a report says to be a fact from the act of endorsing what the report says, all else is lost on you.
126 -Ws-





Weird.. -- You are endorsing that what the Report says is factual, yet you claim to be merely 'stating' that, not endorsing what the report says.

Your distinction is meaningless.
You support the Report.
136 posted on 11/22/2003 8:41:10 PM PST by tpaine (I'm trying to be 'Mr Nice Guy', but FRs flying monkey squad brings out the Rickenbacker in me.)
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To: Az Joe
"A show was on just this week and they showed an 80 year old guy shooting the rifle three times in less time than Oswald took.

-----
Was it the same bolt action rifle that Oswald used?
Did he hit his target 2 out of 3 times?
Actually 3 out of 3 since the theory is that a tree branch deflected the first shot.
137 posted on 11/22/2003 8:56:12 PM PST by gooleyman
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To: wideminded
Alvarez was not such a sleaze as to fake the test. In contrast to your previous assertion he says that 6 out of 7 tests resulted in backwards recoil of the melon.

-----
Sorry wideminded, I'm not buying. Just like you won't look at anything beyond the Warren Commission's report or things that support it, I can't buy Alvarez' BS. No need to reply. I won't listen to any explanation. Just like you. I guess I'm just as "wide minded" as you are.

p.s. Everyone has their price. Apparently Alvarez' price was met.
138 posted on 11/22/2003 9:05:29 PM PST by gooleyman
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To: gooleyman
He dry fired it.
139 posted on 11/22/2003 9:10:54 PM PST by Az Joe
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To: Az Joe
"He dry fired it."

-----
I think you know what I'm going to say. That doesn't prove Sugar Honey Ice Tea. (I'm not trying to be mean. Just funnin' with you.) But from what I remember of the marcsmen (sp?) they used in the test I talked about above. I think they used real bullets and a real target. They couldn't do it in the amount of time that it was done that fateful day in Dallas.
140 posted on 11/22/2003 9:31:03 PM PST by gooleyman
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To: gooleyman
Just like you won't look at anything beyond the Warren Commission's report or things that support it,

Not true. I have read extensively in the conspiracy literature over the years starting with Mark Lane. I even read every word of the 747-page Best Evidence: Disguise and Deception in the Assassination of John F. Kennedy by David S. Lifton. But most of the conspiracy theories have not stood the test of time. IMO there might still be some open questions about mafia involvement via Oswald and/or Ruby.

No need to reply. I won't listen to any explanation.

The mature approach. Don't worry, I'm not replying for your benefit.

141 posted on 11/22/2003 9:38:29 PM PST by wideminded
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To: gooleyman
The fact is that it has been proven repeatedly that the rifle Oswald used can easily be fired within the time frame and even faster. As for aiming and hitting what you're aiming at, some of that is skill and some of that is luck. Oswald fired three shots and hit home with two-67%.

Is 67% good? I don't know. Would things turn out the same way if you repeated the scenario 10 times? Probably not everytime or even most times. Maybe sometimes all three shots hit home and maybe sometimes none of the shots hit home.

The fact is that Oswald firing all three shots and being the only shooter in Dealy Plaza is still, by far, the most plausible scenario. The conspiracy nuts have nothing even close to it as far as proof goes.

I'll put it this way: If Oswald was not the one who killed Kennedy then Kennedy wasn't killed and nobody has ever killed anyone.

The conspiracy nuts are the one who haven't proved sh*t.
142 posted on 11/22/2003 9:42:08 PM PST by Az Joe
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To: wideminded
Have you read "Case Closed" by Posner? I went from conspiracy theory to lone gunman (Oswald) after reading that book and seeing documentaries. Not right away, but gradually. I still see Oswald doing it alone as the most plausible scenario, by far.

I am only talking about what happened in those few seconds in Dealy Plaza, I do not know about what happened prior to that that may have significance to the case, if anything.
143 posted on 11/22/2003 9:45:17 PM PST by Az Joe
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To: Az Joe; wideminded
One other thing before I turn in for the night. I remember someone saying that there was a last minute change in the motorcade route. That originally they weren't supposed to go by the bookstore. The supposition there was that Oswald could not possibly have known of the change in the route days before when he was picking his shot-spot and therefore set himself up in the wrong position if he was going to kill Kennedy. Had either of you ever heard/read that one. I suppose the route had to be common knowledge just before the motorcade came through that day or else there wouldn't have been so many people lining the street there.

I'll wait a few minutes for your responses and I've got to hit the hay. It's late on the eastern front.

Oh, wideminded, I knew you couldn't resist responding to my last tirade. I wouldn't have resisted either.
144 posted on 11/22/2003 10:03:32 PM PST by gooleyman
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To: gooleyman
I believe the motorcade route was known at least a day or two before the 22nd and the route was published in the paper.
145 posted on 11/22/2003 10:09:25 PM PST by Az Joe
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To: Az Joe
"I believe the motorcade route was known at least a day or two before the 22nd and the route was published in the paper. "

-----
I'll have to do some checking on that when I can keep my eyes open a little better. In the meantime, if you find a source, I'd appreciate a link to it.
146 posted on 11/22/2003 10:23:10 PM PST by gooleyman
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To: gooleyman
This site has it.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/route.htm

"As the date for the President's visit approached, the two Dallas newspapers carried several reports of his motorcade route. The selection of the Trade Mart as the possible site for the luncheon first appeared in the Dallas Times-Herald on November 15, 1963. The following day, the newspaper reported that the Presidential party "apparently will loop through the downtown area, probably on Main Street, en route from Dallas Love Field" on its way to the Trade Mart. On November 19, the Times-Herald afternoon paper detailed the precise route:

The motorcade will then pass through downtown on Harwood and then west on Main, turning back to Elm at Houston and then out Stemmons Freeway to the Trade Mart.

Also on November 19, the Morning News reported that the President's motorcade would travel from Love Field along specified streets, then "Harwood to Main, Main to Houston, Houston to Elm, Elm under the Triple Underpass to Stemmons Freeway, and on to the Trade Mart."
147 posted on 11/22/2003 10:28:11 PM PST by Az Joe
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To: Az Joe
Have you read "Case Closed" by Posner?

I haven't read his entire book although I read some long magazine excerpts when it came out and of course he has been interviewed on TV many times. Posner is extremely convincing and his book seems to be much more well-researched than any of the conspiracy books, with a lot of new information and clarification of previously confusing factors. The title might be a little strong, but anyone who disagrees with Posner is going to have to come up with something pretty good. Posner's book came out 10 years ago and I haven't heard of his conclusions being overturned by some new information.

148 posted on 11/22/2003 10:58:55 PM PST by wideminded
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To: wideminded
I guess it comes down to what is the most likely scenario of events given all the evidence and review of evidence by current technology. It seems to me that what fits the facts that I am aware of is that Oswald acted alone that day in Dealy Plaza.
149 posted on 11/22/2003 11:05:52 PM PST by Az Joe
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To: Az Joe
According to one of the episodes of the History Channel's series, there were supposedly 3 spots in Dallas where this was to go down that day:

The Trade Mart, the airport, and Dealey Plaza.
150 posted on 11/22/2003 11:07:31 PM PST by texasbluebell
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