Skip to comments.Priests 'In Orgy' at Seminary
Posted on 07/12/2004 10:26:32 AM PDT by Land of the Irish
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Vatican spokesman Ciro Benedettini told the Austria Press Agency that the Holy See had no comment.
Roman Catholic leaders ... discovered a vast cache of photos and videos allegedly depicting young priests having sex at a seminary. About 40,000 photographs ...Looking on the bright side, it's encouraging to learn that there's no shortage of seminarians in Austria ...
This is all over the European press this morning. Apparently, Bishop Krenn has also been a strong proponent of doing little or nothing to sex offenders, and was known to have sheltered another bishop who had been removed from his diocese for homosexual activity.
The Vatican will not shut this place down. It will thrive undisturbed, regardless of scandal. Yet Rome sought throughout the eighties to shut down the Econe Seminary in Switzerland for the high crime of being traditionally Catholic. And it sought ways to do this even though its own emissaries reported the seminary was above reproach both doctrinally and morally. Rome was not deterred by such a glowing tribute. It ignored its own report and seized on the pretext that the Archbishop had dared to question the wisdom of Vatican II. It did so even while knowing its own emissaries, the ones doing the evaluation in the first place, themselves publicly had doubted the Virginity of Mary and the Resurrection of Jesus--to the horror of Econe's young semianrians. It was this skepticism regarding actual Catholic dogmas which had led to the Archbishop's outburst--which in turn gave the cardinals in Rome the excuse they needed to shut the seminary down. What hypocrites! Now these same officials will look the other way in the present scandal.
Anything that has to do with homosexuality or pornography has no place at a seminary for priests, it said.
I think this needs to be re-written for a great deal of NO seminaries: Anything that has to do with Scripture or Tradition has no place at a seminary for priests.
"A group of St. Poelten Diocese officials planned to ask the Vatican to remove Krenn as bishop"
If this bishop is removed (don't hold your breath), it'll probably be because of promotion either to archpriest of a major Roman basilica or to the sacred college of cardinals.
Exactly. And the seminary will remain. Compare this with the treatment of Lefebvre. They sought to condemn him for daring to challenge the wisdom of Vatican II--and for this purported outrage, they sought to shut down his entire seminary, one that was above reproach doctrinally and morally. Never mind that it was filled to the brim with orthodox devout young men studying for the priesthood! The patent hypocrisy and injustice of this is mind-boggling, especially when the Vatican's inaction regarding genuine corruption and apostasy is so obvious!
Bishop Kurt Krenn, a conservative churchman
I wonder what makes this guy 'conservative' in the eyes of Europeans?
Probably the power of the pen.
"I wonder what makes this guy 'conservative' in the eyes of Europeans?"
Unfortunately the word "conservative" is constantly evolving. The current crop of so-called Catholic "conservatives" used to be considered "arch-liberals" in more sane times. The liberals who have now taken over most of our chanceries used to be laughed off as "heretics", but that word has fallen out of use (now called "hate-speech").
There are very good seminaries, and they are growing. This one was clearly not one of them - they have photos (which were graphically described in the European press, but which I won't go into here) of the seminary director with various seminarians.
My personal feeling about these people is that they should be taken out and strung up by their thumbs for the scandal they give and the vocations they discourage. But all it takes is a good bishop and a tolerably orthodox seminary, and vocations soar - I think there's a lot of what market analysts call "pent up demand" out there!
While bishops and priests are buggering altar boys and seminarians in nearly every diocese around the world, what do you think the holy father is doing?
This brings back memories of the emperor Nero, who fiddled while Rome burned. Nero's last words which were "Qualis artifex pereo" (loosely translated "What a loss I shall be to the arts") are possibly also relevant to the current pontificate.
Actually, I think the Pope may have realized - a little too late, as Pope Paul VI saw the smoke of Satan a little too late - that he hasn't done enough. I think he has an excessive devotion to "collegiality" and an almost naive faith in the goodwill of other bishops, particularly liberal ones. Or maybe I should say "had," because it seems to me that he has recently been attempting to correct this.
Better late than never. God will judge, but I would have preferred a Pope who spent less time trying to synthesize the writings of phenomenologists and personalists, and more time exercising a bit of authority.
However, it may not be too late. We have had a number of good bishops appointed (including to my diocese), so I am trying to be positive about this. The interesting thing is that with the new bishop, a lot of priests I had thought to be liberal flakes have suddenly emerged as orthodox, are starting Benediction with Exposition, devotion to the Sacred Heart, First Fridays, etc.
I wonder why the usual guy hasn't shown up on this thread to defend these special, gentle preists and seminarians? After all, the "chaste" gays make the best of priests.
That they were caught in the act must give the lavender liberal modernist heretics a sinking feeling.
Krenn added, "Let me state categorically that I am not homosexual, nor do we tolerate homosexuality within our ranks. I just enjoy having sex with other men. That doesn't make me gay."
The million dollar question is, how on earth would you know that someone is "gay" but "chaste"?
Ol' BS just loves to attack His Holiness. Seems to be hung up on literary offerings. Sounds familiar.
Yep, all of the usual defenders of the indefensible are hiding out.
The 'chaste' sodomite excuse for admitting them into the seminaries, with the rejoinder, "besides who are they going to marry" is how the original apostates, communist infiltrators and masonists got the seeds of the homosexual destructors admitted into the seminaries beginning in the 1950's. The lavender mafia sprung from there and propogated and screened out any true Catholics who would be a threat to them, and thus only admitted or promoted its own afterwards.
The destruction they wreaked by "just being themselves" more than fulfilled the objectives of those who brought them into the priesthood for that exact same purpose.
Such an animal is nearly nonexistent. If a priest talks like your sister, he's a high-risk sexual liability that needs to be eliminated from the clergy yesterday.
The reason we've somehow come to believe that gays can be "chaste" is that leftist can perform the greatest of acrobatics with language. Stalin got the "workers" to unite around the hammer and sickle then proceeded to starve and murder them. The socialists here call those they seek to exploit "working Americans", as if the rest of us don't work.
In the church of Christ where it should be the most moral sanctuary on earth we have the most rampant sexual/criminal deviance found anywhere. Yet to want to cut the destructive cancer out is to be a hater or "intolerant".
Orwell said love = hate as God told us that good will be made to appear evil and visa versa. Exactly that is happening yet still we have Catholics with scales over their eyes who won't say or do anything about it. Further they'll become angry with those who do.
I am not mad at you. Who are you, and why should I be mad at you? I cannot remember a single post of yours that I have ever read.
Do you have a guilty conscience or something?
Broadsword: I have been what my son refers to as a "rabid" practicing Catholic all my life (51 years). Fortunate enough to be taught by some very loving nuns and don't have the horror stories you often hear. I have been a supporter of Vatican II most of my life, still recognizing that some things might have been a bit much, but overall, thinking it was a good thing. I mean, do you really think its bad that women aren't relegated to the back of the church with their heads covered? I like that the alter faces the people and that I can understand what is being said. Having said that, I too am concerned with the drastic downward spiral that can clearly be traced back to Vat II. I cry when I think of the sin in our church.
Expect, at some point, to be crucified.
The Modern European Church at play. Yuck.
I don't recall women ever being asked to sit in the back of the Church. As for covering their heads, St. Paul said that a woman who doesn't cover her head in the presence of the Lord disgraces herself. Do you know more than St. Paul?
I'm a woman, and I never had to "stand at the back of the church with my head covered" prior to VatII. Women were active, nuns were active, married men were active. As for the head coverings, even in the late 50s, as women stopped wearing hats in the secular world (remember, prior to this, respectable women did not even go out on the street in a city or town without a hat), this was not a vital requirement. I even heard priests preach against silly things like women pinning dollar bills or Kleenex to their heads. In other words, a headcovering was a sign of respect if you could do it, but it was certainly not as important as going to Mass. Christians are not, after all, Muslims, to whom the external is vitally important.
There were problems with clericalism (that is, some of the clergy thought they were godlets - read J.F.Powers' stories for an accurate description), but I fail to see that this has changed in any way. Except perhaps now there are more people who believe they are clergy (most of the women, married men and nuns mentioned above).
Ummmm...just as a matter of history, there was a time when women did sit in the galleries. The REALLY old churches here have HUGE galleries for this purpose, but it was out of practice before my grandmother's time.
And the thing about the hats...I wish we'd go back to it. Talk about a great way to hide a bad hair day.
Officials seen kissing priests
From correspondents in Vienna
July 13, 2004
PICTURES of authorities at a seminary caressing and kissing student priests have been published by a magazine in a sex scandal that has rocked the Roman Catholic church in Austria.
The weekly Profil magazine said prosecutors had opened an investigation into the seminary and had found thousands of photographs on portable computers showing acts of pedophilia and bestiality, as well as numerous pornographic films.
Profil said the scandal at the Sankt Poelten seminary, about 80km west of Vienna, erupted after priests decided to put an end to years of silence about the activities there.
It said the seminary director, Ulrich Kuechl, resigned last week.
His deputy, Wolfgang Rothe, was quoted by the magazine as saying he would also resign, without admitting any guilt.
Gay seminary scandal rocks Austria
July 13, 2004 - 7:04AM
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Austria's Roman Catholic Church is launching an investigation into charges of homosexuality between priests and seminarians at a seminary outside Vienna.
A church panel in the Sankt Poelten diocese west of the capital agreed on the inquiry after the news magazine Profil published photographs showing leading clerics of the local seminary fondling and kissing student priests.
Profil said investigators had also found at least 40,000 mostly pornographic photographs at the seminary.
The director of the seminary and his assistant have both quit as details of the scandal emerged in recent days.
"The panel has decided to investigate this issue thoroughly, discuss and assess the results of this inquiry and draw the necessary conclusions from the result," a Church statement said.
Kurt Krenn, Sankt Poelten's controversial bishop, told Austria's ORF television he had seen a compromising photograph of the seminary director fondling another man over his clothes but said the scene had nothing to do with homosexuality.
This and other shots concerned nothing more than "youthful pranks", said Krenn, who told his interviewer he did not plan to step down because of the scandal.
The Roman Catholic Church has been shaken by a series of sexual abuse scandals across the world. The abuse has cost the American Catholic Church millions of dollars in payments to victims and angered Catholics who held priests in high esteem.
The Church in traditionally Catholic Austria was rocked by a scandal in 1995 when Profil published charges that Cardinal Hans Hermann Groer, the then head of the Catholic Church in the country, had sexually abused seminarians. The Vatican replaced him months later and he retired to a monastery.
Krenn, whose close ties to Pope John Paul led to a papal visit to his modest diocese in 1998, has regularly been criticised by lay Catholic groups as an arch-conservative.
The Austrian Bishops Conference said on Sunday the Church had "an urgent need to act" in view of the alleged scandal at the Sankt Poelten seminary.
Porn discovered at Austrian seminary
Roman Catholic diocese scandalized by cache of photosThe Associated Press
Updated: 6:24 p.m. ET July 12, 2004VIENNA, Austria - A vast cache of child pornography and photos of young priests having sex has been discovered at a Roman Catholic seminary, officials said Monday, leading politicians and church leaders to demand a criminal probe and the resignation of the bishop in charge.
Bishop Kurt Krenn, who oversees the diocese, refused to step down, however, dismissing the images as a childish prank.
Leaders of the Catholic diocese of St. Poelten where the seminary is located, about 50 miles west of Vienna, spent much of the day in an emergency meeting.
The seminarys director, the Rev. Ulrich Kuechl, resigned along with his deputy, Wolfgang Rothe, the diocese said after the meeting. It did not elaborate.
As many as 40,000 photos and an undisclosed number of films, including child pornography, were found a year ago on computers at the seminary, the respected news magazine Profil reported.
It published several images purportedly showing young priests and their instructors kissing and fondling each other, and said others showed them engaging in orgies and sex games. The child porn came mostly from Web sites based in Poland, the magazine said.
Hannes Jarolim, a spokesman for the opposition Socialist Party, urged the Interior Ministry on Monday to launch a criminal investigation. Public prosecutor Walter Nemec said police were examining the material, which he said showed seminarians in perverse situations together with their superiors.
The Austrian Bishops Conference issued a statement pledging a full and swift internal investigation.
Anything that has to do with the practice of homosexuality or pornography has no place at a seminary for priests, it said.
Krenn, a conservative churchman, told Austrian television he had seen photos of seminary leaders in sexual situations with students, but he described the images as part of an elaborate prank that had nothing to do with homosexuality.
Harsh reaction for bishop
His nonchalance drew swift and scathing reaction across the overwhelmingly Catholic nation.
Collecting child pornography cannot be dismissed as a prank, said Thomas Huber, a Green Party politician.
In the mid-1990s, Austria was stung by allegations that Cardinal Hans Hermann Groer, who died last year, had molested students at an all-male Catholic boarding school two decades earlier. The affair had prompted Groer to step down.
A group of St. Poelten Diocese officials planned to ask the Vatican to remove Krenn as bishop, Austrian radio reported Monday. Martin Walchhofer, who supervises the alpine countrys seminaries, said Krenn ultimately was responsible and must answer before the church and before God for all of this.
Asked whether he intended to resign, Krenn said bluntly: No.
The Vatican said it had no comment.
Krenn, 68, issued a statement calling the accusations groundless while conceding that he may have made some wrong personnel decisions at the seminary. Rothe, the former deputy seminary chief, was a legal adviser to the bishop.
Close the seminary and burn it to the ground.
"I too am concerned with the drastic downward spiral that can clearly be traced back to Vat II."
The scandals began in the 1950's if you look up the John Jay Report. Blame the rightists or the leftists, blame celibacy or the poetry of Pope John Paul II, or the Latin Mass or English Mass or whatever you like, but Vat. II is no more to blame for the immorality of Catholics than the Council of Carthage.
BS, calm down.
I'm mystified when I see statements like this. On what basis does he "seem to be a very holy man"? We can't judge his soul, just like any other man, we can only make prudential judgements based on exterior actions. All of his exterior actions have promoted the "Vatican II Church," have systematically undermined the traditional Catholic faith, and have caused immensely more scandal than any pope of the Middle Ages.
What if you saw a photo of Bill Clinton kissing the Koran? You'd be ready to indict him for treason and consorting with the enemy right on the spot. How does JPII manage to get away with it and still be considered "holy" even by someone who recognizes the damage he has inflicted?
I can't understand why his exterior actions would lead anyone to consider JPII "holy." Just because he can get a bunch of teenagers at some "Catholic Woodstock" to shout "JPII, we love you"? I'm afraid he seems to share more in common with the American televangelists than he does with the four Evangelists.
Only God can judge the state of his soul. But if you were making a prudential decision about joining a certain parish, and you were told that the pastor there was known to do things like:
Mix Aztec worship with the Mass
Have bare-breasted lectors reading at Mass
Have clowns on stilts come up for communion
Hold inter-faith services with local protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Hindu and even Voo-Doo practicioners
"Reinterpret" all the traditional Catholic rules about marriage
Sponsor rock-n-roll, rap and break-dancing performances, but refuse to find enough time ever to meet with any traditional Catholics,
Give sermons in which no one understood a word he was saying, but they just managed to catch the idea that he was promoting a new kind of Catholicism,
Would you say, "He seems like a very holy priest"? Or would you say, "Hell will freeze over long before I or my family ever set foot in such a parish"?
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