Skip to comments.Black is Black (an honest criticism of some fellow FReepers and also of liberals)
Posted on 10/10/2004 8:32:16 AM PDT by jmstein7
Black is Black
By Jonathan M. Stein
Honesty is clearly the best policy; that is not in question. However, broadcasting one's honesty isn't always the best politics -- sometimes, in fact, it is incredibly stupid.
There is no question that, in general, conservatives are more honest than their liberal counterparts. However, conservatives have a nasty habit of crowing about just how honest they are, often to their detriment. Conservatives know when they're right, when they're wrong, when they've done well, and when they've done badly. That doesn't mean that they have to stand on the rooftops and shout about it. Loudly letting liberals know when things are going badly for conservatives doesn't make liberals think "wow, gee, look how honest conservatives are!" It doesn't make liberals feel badly about themselves. On the contrary, it is incredibly stupid in that liberals wisely, and gladly, use it against conservatives. As liberal bloggers, and John Kerry, have demonstrated, they are only too gleeful to use Republican criticisms of Republicans against Republicans in the public debate.
Now, I'm not urging dishonesty; I'm certainly not advocating lies. All I am saying is that the liberals do not need any more free advice or any more free ammunition to use against Republicans and conservatives -- they already have plenty of that. All I am asking is that, as we move into the final weeks of an election that will determine the safety and security of all Americans going forward, a life or death election, if conservatives don't have anything nice to say about themselves or their candidates, then don't say anything at all. This can be boiled down to two simple words... if you don't have anything nice to say then shut up.
The consequences of not shutting up are clear; just look at what happened after the first debate, when things didn't go as well as we liked: we criticized, we grumbled, we despaired -- and the liberals fed off it, gained strength, re-energized their base, used it against us, and made some headway in the polls. This same mistake must not be repeated. If you don't like how things are going, that's fine -- just keep it to yourself. As is often said: "loose lips sink ships."
Alternatively, what conservatives should not do is what liberals do when things go badly for them: lie, deceive, and spin. Just look at what happened after the second debate, when President Bush made a comeback. Democrats and other liberals went beyond merely keeping quiet about their losses; that would have been fine. No -- they actually went out of their way to convince others that the opposite was true -- that their loss was actually a win. That is dishonest, and it is something conservatives should never do.
What is truly frightening about all this isn't the lying, spin, or deception. What is truly frightening is that, to liberals, the lies, spin, and deception actually became their truth! They really believed what they were saying! Look no further than the rhetoric at the Democratic Underground. This is frightening because it is further evidence of just how far the left has gone down the Orwellian path.
In 1984, George Orwell describes a trio of though-control devices that make this self-deception possible -- and orthodox. The concepts are crimestop, blackwhite, and doublethink. In 1984, any thought that went against that which was considered "orthodoxy" was considered a crime. Thus, citizens were trained to consciously stop themselves, stop their though processes, before their very thoughts strayed beyond what was considered orthodox. This concept was known as crimestop, i.e. consciously stopping unorthodox, "criminal" though (crimethink) before it "polluted" the mind. The left-wingers have clearly mastered this, especially considering the things they have gone on record saying about Senator Kerry's debate performance. As their negative thoughts about Kerry formed, they simply, and clearly, stopped thinking. Scary.
Of course, crimestop is necessary when the beginnings of adverse thought have already entered the mind. Thus, to remedy the effects of some tainted thought, it is necessary to convince one's self that the opposite of those thoughts is really true. If it is bad to think that black is actually black, and you started to think about that, but stopped short, then one must convince one's self that black is actually white. If black is a bad thought and white is a good thought, you must convince yourself that black is white. This technique is known as blackwhite. If a Democrat had started to think that John Kerry gave a dismal performance, that Democrat must quickly, and consciously, convince himself that Kerry was fabulous, despite reality. Blackwhite.
The final step in this conscious self-deception is paradox resolution and reconciliation. The process of convincing one's self that black is white is a conscious one. In the back of one's mind, one knows that black is black. So, it is necessary to convince one's self that although one knows that black is black, black can also be white in fact, black can be black and white at the same time! It is necessary to believe that a non sequitur can be logical, and that, in fact, it has always been logical. Not only did John Kerry do well, despite the fact that he did badly, but the fact is that he had been doing well all along. And, by gosh, he actually did vote for the $87 billion before he voted against it! Doublethink.
This is how liberals lie so effectively -- because they really believe it, and they have mastered believing it, and they never believed otherwise. A contradiction can be consciously true and false and reconciled, and, in fact, it has always been true. They have mastered these Orwellian thought-control techniques and if they assume power, they will make sure that everyone else masters them as well.
"This is how liberals lie so effectively -- because they really believe it, and they have mastered believing it, and they never believed otherwise."
If they believe what they say is true they haven't lied. To lie requires one to knowingly deceive. I think they know full well they are lying.
'This is how liberals lie so effectively -- because they really believe it, and they have mastered believing it, and they never believed otherwise. A contradiction can be consciously true and false and reconciled, and, in fact, it has always been true. They have mastered these Orwellian thought-control techniques and if they assume power, they will make sure that everyone else masters them as well.'
A prime example are the Buchanan/Tancredo organizations.
The process of double think has been elevated to high philosophy:
Well, yes... they are lying -- to themselves.
I tend to disagree. Liberals throw our words back in our face at their peril. At times, it seems John Kerry is running to the right of George W. Bush - attacking him for not being enough like Ronald Reagan, for instance.
How on earth is that supposed to help Kerry with his own crowd? "Vote For Me! I'm More Like Ronald Reagan!"
What are you thinking...? Your telling us we should'nt have an honest voice on this forum. That only those who will say what you want the world to hear should speak! No way.....as an American I will exercise my right to disagree and have an opinion even if you don't like it. I'm appalled at what you are suggesting on this forum called FREE Republic.
As is often said: "loose lips sink ships."
And to that I would say: indeed. I'm reminded of something perhaps just a little profound: We have two ears and one mouth, perhaps that means we should listen twice as much as we speak.
I disagree. In order to retain long-term credibility, we need to remain truthful in our commentary. Anything less is incredibly shortsighted.
One of the advantages of not lying is that you don't have to remember what story you gave 10 minutes ago. This is why John Kerry has a massive problem with flip-flopping and George W. Bush does not.
If Bush was the inconsistent flip-flopper in this election, he would be down by 15 points.
The problem with your thesis is that you interchangeably utilize the terms "conservative" and "Republican." Not all conservatives are Republican and certainly not all Republicans are conservative. It is a matter of principle over party.
I have 10 fingers and 2 eyes, so I'm going to post 5 times as much as I read.
(I need some defending here -- the stakes are high)
No. Read it again... I made the express point of seperating out the terms "conservative" and "Republican."
"I disagree. In order to retain long-term credibility, we need to remain truthful in our commentary. Anything less is incredibly shortsighted."
Right on. Liberalism/socialism is going to die under its own weight, eventually. It will be naturally REJECTED by those that now blindly support it. The lies, the deceit, the scams, the crime...all the things that liberalism has to be to survive, will kill it once the kool-aid drinkers start wising up and liberalism can no longer support itself.
The prevailing party will be the party of REALITY AND TRUTH. It will prevail. There is no substitute for truth. When you tell the truth, you don't have TO REMEMBER WHAT YOU SAID!!!
You can respectfully KISS MY *SS!
"Keeping quiet" has given us CBS and Dan Rather.
"Keeping quiet" has given us 2 terms of Bill and Hillary Clinton.
What you're proposing is what the military is doing with Sadr's thugs. Just because they are being killed at a rapid clip, and beg for a cease fire with a promise to negotiate...we accomodate them...now for about the 3rd time.
That's one more time than "1st time, shame on you, 2nd time...Shame on Us".
Anybody capable of fogging a mirror under their nose, clearly say that President Bush was ill-prepared for Debate I.
If we hadn't complained, Debate II might have been more of the same.
TAKE NO PRISONERS! Liberals are politically and morally retarded, IMO. Call them on it...every day...at every opportunity.
But then you'll be reading what you post, and you'll have to post 5 times as much as you read, and then you'll be reading what you post, and... ;-)
There is power in keeping quiet while your enemy goes crazy all around you. If we win this election while losing our dignity, we have not won anything. Nay-sayers, just shut your damn mouths if you have noting positive to add. Bitch all you want after the election is over.
EagleUSA and NittanyLion,
Read it again. I'm not advocating lying -- I'm advocating silence.
If you haven't said anything, commented, or taken a position, you haven't lied, and there is nothing to remember later anyway.
To say otherwise it to aver that there is an affirmative duty to speak, and if you don't, you've lied. That is nonsense. Just as we have a right to free speech, we have the freedom NOT to speak.
I get the feeling some folks will incorrectly infer you're saying one thing and argue a point you didn't imply.
"Call them on it...every day...at every opportunity"
Absolutely... call them on it.
All I'm saying is that we take Ronald Reagan's advice and follow the Reagan 11th Commandment -- i.e., to paraphrase, never criticize a fellow conservative in public.
"Nay-sayers, just shut your damn mouths if you have noting positive to add. Bitch all you want after the election is over."
"I get the feeling some folks will incorrectly infer you're saying one thing and argue a point you didn't imply."
I think that has already happened. Want to help me respond to these people who completely missed the point?
I may be guilty of that....even after reading it twice.
You wear those boots like a real trooper...I'll say what I think on this forum until I'm booted out. And if I'm booted out for not towing the party line then this is not where I need to be anyway.
Glad you caught that :)
I was thinking the same thing especially during the first debate. Well, everytime Kerry opens his mouth I think the same thing.
A prime example are the Buchanan/Tancredo organizations.
The problem with shutting up is it gives Freepers like yourself the opportunity to lie like a liberal. Prime example above.
Again, I disagree. I'm not about to criticize liberals for silently allowing their party to become led by panderers and liars, only to adopt the same behavior.
If a particular leader doesn't want to be criticized by the base, might I suggest they conduct themselves accordingly? Otherwise they should expect to hear honest criticism where it's deserved.
I'm hoping to close the gap by posting hundreds of one-line vanities with my eyes closed.
I think some are starting to get it and I'd love to help, I just can't due to time constraints. I'll check back with this thread in a few hours.
You hit the nail right on the head. Now, if only others on this thread could be made to "get it" as well...
We have a world with alot of problems BECAUSE PEOPLE WILL NOT STAND UP AND SPEAK AND FACE THE TRUTH. Silence about serious issues is very bad. Take the Muslims/Islamics, for instance...that use SILENCE AS A WEAPON AGAINST NON-MUSLIMS...take our MSM for instance...that USE THEIR SILENCE AS A WEAPON AGAINST CONSERVATIVES....
ridiculous article IMO.. a fallacy.. Truth is the number 1 value... let the friggin chips fall where they may. You look weak don't follow truth.
you don't think Rove has people reading this BBS? damn straight... and look what happened.. Bush didn't change his message... he just forcefully confronted a liar. possibly due to some to the upset folks here.
Perhaps I'm reading too much into it, but that's an interesting choice of phrase.
Oh, I'm sorry. I forgot, its all about YOU. What was I thinking?
Meditate on these three names and how they relate to what I have said:
Lincoln Chafee, Chuck Hagel, John McCain.
yikes...very bad grammar in my post.. sorry people.
jmstein7, I've come to have a really good opinion of you because you are so level-headed and really, really bright. But you just jumped the shark, so to speak.
Honest discourse is, well, honest. We have a pretty wise crowd in FR. While I might disagree with many of the crowd on some subjects, I would never ask them to silence themselves in the interest of some greater good.
You are still the man, jmstein7.
Perhaps I'm reading too much into it, but that's an interesting choice of phrase.
That was the right choice of words for what is going on here with the way of thinking of some people here. I never imagined seeing the stiffling of honest opinion on FreeRepublic.
The electorate is intelligent enough to sort out legitimate information from pandering and half-truths. Frankly, I couldn't care less what any of the above have to say, since I believe the administration is more than capable of responding. In the long-term, truth and integrity wins out over lies and political pandering. We'd do well on threads like this one to remind ourselves of that.
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