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Intelligent Design Might Be Meeting Its Maker
The New York Times ^ | December 4, 2005 | LAURIE GOODSTEIN

Posted on 12/03/2005 5:28:45 PM PST by Right Wing Professor

TO read the headlines, intelligent design as a challenge to evolution seems to be building momentum.

...

Behind the headlines, however, intelligent design as a field of inquiry is failing to gain the traction its supporters had hoped for. It has gained little support among the academics who should have been its natural allies. And if the intelligent design proponents lose the case in Dover, there could be serious consequences for the movement's credibility.

On college campuses, the movement's theorists are academic pariahs, publicly denounced by their own colleagues. Design proponents have published few papers in peer-reviewed scientific journals.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: crevolist; evochat; intelligentdesign
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The article says that the Templeton Foundation gave them a few grants for conferences and courses to debate intelligent design, but then asked for research proposals, and nothing came in. It hasn't caught on even in Christian colleges, because it has no explanatory power. Several faculty from such colleges are quoted as saying it doesn't belong in science class. And the biggest blow -- the Dover verdict -- is yet to fall.

Sounds like you can stick a fork in ID, because it's done.

1 posted on 12/03/2005 5:28:46 PM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: Right Wing Professor; PatrickHenry

More a death knell than a ping.


2 posted on 12/03/2005 5:29:41 PM PST by Right Wing Professor
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To: Right Wing Professor

I'm glad to see you consider the New York Times to be a reputable source on this or any other topic.

Like you, they are desperate not to lose Darwin's exclusive monopoly on our school children.

Funny that those who are interested in ID are perfectly happy to have Darwin taught in the schools, but Darwinists simply can't brook any competition.


3 posted on 12/03/2005 5:32:26 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Right Wing Professor

An obituary from the NYT - and just wishful thinking.

Darwin converted few scientists of his generation. It will be the same with ID. The Darwinian fundamentalist profs won't convert - but the next generation already has.

Darwinian fundamentalism - you can stick a fork in it.


4 posted on 12/03/2005 5:33:16 PM PST by Liberty1970
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To: Right Wing Professor

ID is as phony as the ID I had as a college frosh.


5 posted on 12/03/2005 5:33:25 PM PST by Senator Pardek
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To: Right Wing Professor

Wow. From the NYT. I'm impressed.


6 posted on 12/03/2005 5:34:15 PM PST by manwiththehands (Democrats and the MSM: lies and hypocrisy on steroids)
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To: Right Wing Professor
Donkeys Can Talk, People Can Fly, And A Man Named Jesus Lives Up In The Sky!


7 posted on 12/03/2005 5:36:07 PM PST by peyton randolph (Warning! It is illegal to fatwah a camel in all 50 states)
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To: Right Wing Professor
It has gained little support among the academics who should have been its natural allies.

Well, of course not. You would have to be intelligent to understand intelligent design and liberal leaning academies require all inductees to check their brains at the door.

"Shut up und drink ze koolade!"

8 posted on 12/03/2005 5:36:32 PM PST by Juan Medén
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To: Cicero
There is no scientific competition.

What's next? Are we going to teach young earth creationism in schools as well?

9 posted on 12/03/2005 5:37:19 PM PST by jess35
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To: Right Wing Professor

YEC INTREP


10 posted on 12/03/2005 5:38:26 PM PST by LiteKeeper (Beware the secularization of America)
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To: Right Wing Professor
A triumph of bigotry over honest, thoughtful science?

You'll do your damnedest.

11 posted on 12/03/2005 5:38:29 PM PST by JCEccles
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To: Right Wing Professor
More a death knell than a ping.

Yeah, but it's the weekend, and news is slow. Also, the NYT is MSM, and if they're onto the subject, we need to know it. You know they'll spin it as an anti-conservitive issue. I'm cranking up the ping machine ...

12 posted on 12/03/2005 5:39:39 PM PST by PatrickHenry (No response if you're a troll, lunatic, dotard, common scold, or incurable ignoramus.)
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To: Right Wing Professor
Image hosted by Photobucket.com
13 posted on 12/03/2005 5:40:03 PM PST by ThreePuttinDude ()......Politically incorrect by Intelligent Design........()
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To: VadeRetro; Junior; longshadow; RadioAstronomer; Doctor Stochastic; js1138; Shryke; RightWhale; ...
Evolution Ping

The List-O-Links
A conservative, pro-evolution science list, now with over 320 names.
See the list's explanation, then FReepmail to be added or dropped.
To assist beginners: But it's "just a theory", Evo-Troll's Toolkit,
and How to argue against a scientific theory.

14 posted on 12/03/2005 5:41:01 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Virtual Ignore for trolls, lunatics, dotards, common scolds, & incurable ignoramuses.)
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To: PatrickHenry
Image hosted by Photobucket.com
15 posted on 12/03/2005 5:41:35 PM PST by ThreePuttinDude ()......Politically incorrect by Intelligent Design........()
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To: Right Wing Professor
Sounds like you can stick a fork in ID, because it's done.

Never fear, it'll morph into something with a new name, a few more bells and whistles, a little better window dressing and camouflage, and they'll trot her out again like she's a debutante at the coming out ball, instead of the tired old tarted-up hag she really is.

16 posted on 12/03/2005 5:45:08 PM PST by longshadow
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To: Cicero
Like you, they are desperate not to lose Darwin's exclusive monopoly on our school children.

That's because evolution is based upon actual science and belongs in science classrooms.

Funny that those who are interested in ID are perfectly happy to have Darwin taught in the schools, but Darwinists simply can't brook any competition.

No, the ID crowd and other anti-science groups have been working hard to eliminate evolution and by extension, any other science facet that might threaten their narrow minded fanatic version of the Bible from science classrooms - hence the court battles against science in Kansas and Ohio.

BTW - there is no such thing as a Darwinist. That's more inaccurate than calling someone who recognizes that jets fly a "Bernoulli-ist" or that a multistage rocket was capable of reaching the moon a "von-Braunist."

There are those who are educated in science and those whose ignorant fear propels them against it.

17 posted on 12/03/2005 5:45:59 PM PST by Ophiucus
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To: jess35

hat's next? Are we going to teach young earth creationism in schools as well?



They already teach fisting....but you're not complaining there.


18 posted on 12/03/2005 5:49:34 PM PST by JudgemAll (Condemn me, make me naked and kill me, or be silent for ever on my gun ownership and law enforcement)
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To: Right Wing Professor

to tell you the truth, I'm partial to all out creationism myself. Call it like it is "God created the world"
I've never heard any other explanation that makes sense.


19 posted on 12/03/2005 5:52:15 PM PST by whispering out loud (the bible is either 100% true, or in it's very nature it is 100% a lie)
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To: All
Help for new visitors to the evolution debate
Another service of Darwin Central, the conspiracy that cares.

If you're interested in learning about evolution, visit The List-O-Links.
If you're serious about debating this issue, see How to argue against a scientific theory.
If you're permanently stuck on stupid, but determined to post anyway, use the Evolution Troll's Toolkit.

20 posted on 12/03/2005 5:52:29 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Virtual Ignore for trolls, lunatics, dotards, common scolds, & incurable ignoramuses.)
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To: Right Wing Professor
Well, I'm not a big pusher of ID because I homeschool and teach my children Biblical truth. But don't gloat so quickly, my Godless friend. ID, I think, was only developed to demonstrate the weakness of Darwinism. And in that, it has succeeded brilliantly. It's proponents have shown that the same attacks on it (it's not really science because it's not falsifiable, it's a philosophy rather than science, etc.) also apply to evolution. You may think you are winning, but I believe you have already lost.

And, BTW, our homeschool has Darwin as required reading. We're not afraid of the debate.

Let the name-calling begin . . .

21 posted on 12/03/2005 5:52:32 PM PST by Timmy
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To: peyton randolph

BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA!


22 posted on 12/03/2005 5:52:58 PM PST by balrog666 (A myth by any other name is still inane.)
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To: Right Wing Professor

ID came about from research done in the EU and the US by atheists who, when they found out some formulas, were branded religionists. Check the work by D'Ambricour

Also called Evolution through Stochastic processes with strange attractor.

The weather, trees and everything in nature obtains its order from such differential equations...but also evolutive patterns seem to be preprogrammed


23 posted on 12/03/2005 5:54:18 PM PST by JudgemAll (Condemn me, make me naked and kill me, or be silent for ever on my gun ownership and law enforcement)
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To: Right Wing Professor

Good. That which kills ID will only make conservatism stronger.


24 posted on 12/03/2005 5:55:36 PM PST by RightWingAtheist (Free the Crevo Three!)
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To: Timmy
Let the name-calling begin . . .

Good screen name selection.

25 posted on 12/03/2005 5:55:52 PM PST by balrog666 (A myth by any other name is still inane.)
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To: Ophiucus
No, the ID crowd and other anti-science groups have been working hard to eliminate evolution and by extension, any other science facet that might threaten their narrow minded fanatic version of the Bible from science classrooms - hence the court battles against science in Kansas and Ohio.

You mischaracterize the Kansas (and probably Ohio also)debate. Because you are misinformed or misleading?

26 posted on 12/03/2005 5:55:57 PM PST by Timmy
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To: peyton randolph

Landover Baptist is an anti-Christian satire site. It is the equivalent of citing a report on "Christian Hate Crimes" from the ACLU.


27 posted on 12/03/2005 5:56:28 PM PST by Killborn (Pres. Bush isn't Pres. Reagan. Then again, Pres. Regan isn't Pres. Washington. God bless them all.)
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To: JudgemAll

28 posted on 12/03/2005 5:56:59 PM PST by balrog666 (A myth by any other name is still inane.)
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To: balrog666

Differential equations are not a myth.


29 posted on 12/03/2005 5:58:50 PM PST by JudgemAll (Condemn me, make me naked and kill me, or be silent for ever on my gun ownership and law enforcement)
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To: Right Wing Professor

Sounds like you can stick a fork in ID, because it's done.

It never even got into the oven among the scientific community. For once in my life the MSM may be an ally (it makes me sick, BTW). By painting ID for what it is, it may get the movers and shakers in the GOP to quitely walk away from it. At least that's what I hope.

30 posted on 12/03/2005 5:59:10 PM PST by ml1954 (NOT the disruptive troll seen frequently on CREVO threads)
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To: peyton randolph
We already knew donkeys (or to me precise, asses) can talk:

We just wish they'd shut up.

31 posted on 12/03/2005 5:59:13 PM PST by RightWingAtheist (Free the Crevo Three!)
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To: longshadow
Never fear, it'll morph into something with a new name, a few more bells and whistles, a little better window dressing and camouflage, and they'll trot her out again like she's a debutante at the coming out ball, instead of the tired old tarted-up hag she really is.

Like Madonna?

32 posted on 12/03/2005 6:00:32 PM PST by RightWingAtheist (Free the Crevo Three!)
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To: Right Wing Professor

The most disturbing aspect about this debate is the rabid desire of evolution proponents to ridicule and otherwise attempt to marginalize those who would dare to question them.


33 posted on 12/03/2005 6:01:23 PM PST by Cinnamon Girl (OMGIIHIHOIIC ping list)
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To: Right Wing Professor

Dear "Right Wing Professor,"

Intelligent Design is a good as proven, and anyone with any common sense knows it. But "professors" are notorious for lacking common sense.

The simplest living cell is perhaps more complicated than all of man's technology, yet you believe that it fell together by random chance. And based on what evidence? People who don't have a clue about combinatorics tout "billions of years," not realizing that it is about 1000 orders of magnitude too little. If you wish to educate yourself on the matter, I recommend you start with Lee Spetner's book, Not By Chance.

I am amazed that someone who calls himself "Right Wing Professor" could fail to realize that he is doing the work of the Left Wing. The Left just loves to ridicule ID and its believers because it plays right into their grand strategy for world domination. If and when they take control, they will owe no small debt of gratitude to fools on the Right who are playing right into their game plan. Have a nice day.


34 posted on 12/03/2005 6:02:22 PM PST by RussP
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To: Ophiucus
Kansas [new] Science Curriculum Standards, Standard 3 Benchmark 3 Indicators 1-7 (pg 75-77).

1) understands biological evolution, descent with modification, is a scientific explanation for the history of the diversification of organisms from common ancestors.

2) understands populations of organisms may adapt to environmental challenges and changes as a result of natural selection, genetic drift, and various mechanisms of genetic change.

3) understands biological evolution is used to explain the earth’s present day biodiversity: the number, variety and variability of organisms.

4) understands organisms vary widely within and between populations. Variation allows for natural selection to occur.

5) understands that the primary mechanism of evolutionary change (acting on variation) is natural selection.

6) understands biological evolution is used as a broad, unifying theoretical framework for biology.

7) explains proposed scientific explanations of the origin of life as well as scientific criticisms of those explanations.

This is what you're having a cow over?

35 posted on 12/03/2005 6:02:23 PM PST by Timmy
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To: Cicero
Darwinists simply can't brook any competition. On the contrary; science is very competitive. But ID is not science.
36 posted on 12/03/2005 6:02:54 PM PST by ARCADIA (Abuse of power comes as no surprise)
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To: Killborn
an anti-Christian satire site. It is the equivalent of citing a report on "Christian Hate Crimes" from the ACLU.

Nope. Satire is ridicule to make a point. A report by the ACLU would be written without intentional satire.

And lest you think that satire is necessary, feel free to look at God's Ark, a Christian website that should be satire...but isn't.

37 posted on 12/03/2005 6:04:19 PM PST by peyton randolph (Warning! It is illegal to fatwah a camel in all 50 states)
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To: RightWingAtheist
We just wish they'd shut up.

Poor Al Franken...there are a few tacos missing from his Mexican combo platter.

38 posted on 12/03/2005 6:05:48 PM PST by peyton randolph (Warning! It is illegal to fatwah a camel in all 50 states)
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To: Right Wing Professor
It has gained little support among the academics who should have been its natural allies.

This is a ridicules assumption.

39 posted on 12/03/2005 6:07:07 PM PST by Jeff Gordon (Lt. Gen. Russel Honore to MSM: "You are stuck on stupid. Over.")
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To: RussP

"? People who don't have a clue about combinatorics tout "billions of years," not realizing that it is about 1000 orders of magnitude too little."

People who have NO clue about probability spout wildly improbable figures about the probabilities of processes they know nothing about.


40 posted on 12/03/2005 6:07:13 PM PST by CarolinaGuitarman ("There is a grandeur in this view of life...")
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To: RightWingAtheist
Like Madonna?

I'll go a step further and say that Madonna is will make a falsifiable prediction before ID or its retooled replacement ever does.

41 posted on 12/03/2005 6:08:04 PM PST by longshadow
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To: peyton randolph

Don't post from that site again. Thanks.


42 posted on 12/03/2005 6:08:57 PM PST by Lead Moderator
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To: Right Wing Professor

True. ID doesn't belong in science class. Why? Because it doesn't adhere to scientific method.


43 posted on 12/03/2005 6:09:38 PM PST by spetznaz (Nuclear-tipped Ballistic Missiles: The Ultimate Phallic Symbol)
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To: Cinnamon Girl
The most disturbing aspect about this debate is the rabid desire of evolution proponents to ridicule and otherwise attempt to marginalize those who would dare to question them.

When the proponents of ID produce a testable hypothesis I promise that we'll start calling it science instead of philosophy. Until then...

44 posted on 12/03/2005 6:10:13 PM PST by Zeroisanumber
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To: Right Wing Professor

This article is bogus. It is wishful thinking for the g-d haters. Intelligent Design is sweeping the country and has already been implemented into many of the curriculum of the public school system.


45 posted on 12/03/2005 6:11:36 PM PST by Agdistis
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To: Lead Moderator
Don't post from that site again.

Okay. I assume you meant Landover Baptist...not God's Ark.

46 posted on 12/03/2005 6:12:05 PM PST by peyton randolph (Warning! It is illegal to fatwah a camel in all 50 states)
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To: ThreePuttinDude

LOL! That cartoon is hysterically funny!


47 posted on 12/03/2005 6:12:10 PM PST by jocon307
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To: Agdistis
Intelligent Design is sweeping the country and has already been implemented into many of the curriculum of the public school system.

To the detriment of children everywhere.

48 posted on 12/03/2005 6:12:37 PM PST by Zeroisanumber
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To: peyton randolph
Satire is ridicule to make a point.

Whoopee! Riduiculing Christians to make a point is still ridiculing Christians...

49 posted on 12/03/2005 6:12:51 PM PST by DBeers (†)
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