Free Republic
Browse · Search
Smoky Backroom
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Another Cold Fusion Device Attracts Commercial Interest
Oil Price.com ^ | Thu, 19 September 2013 22:40 | Brian Westenhaus

Posted on 11/12/2013 9:20:52 PM PST by Kevmo

Brillouin Energy has entered into its first international licensing agreement covering three nations. The firm is involved in on-going negotiations for other potential international partners. This makes the second Cold Fusion or Low Energy Nuclear Reaction (LENR) Lattice Assisted Nuclear Reaction (LANR) and Brillouin’s Controlled Electron Capture Reaction (CECR) idea to attract commercial interest.

.... Brillouin’s CECR starts by introducing hydrogen into a suitable piece of nickel (or other metal with the correct internal geometry). A proprietary electronic pulse generator then creates stress points in the metal where the applied energy is focused into very small spaces. This concentrated energy allows some of the protons in the hydrogen to capture an electron, and thus become a neutron. This step converts a small amount of energy into mass in the neutron.

.... Brillouin’s power equation is 2.4 units of energy going in and 24 units coming out.

The Brillouin CECR is thought to be quite versatile. The released energy is initially absorbed by the metal element, and then made available as heat. At lower temperatures, this generated heat can be used directly for space heating, hot water and similar applications. Further refinements of the Brillouin Energy system will produce the higher temperatures needed for electrical generation, dry industrial stream and industrial processes. ......

Big investment money is lining up. Brillouin has raised about $3 million in funding. A “second stage” $20M investment conditional agreement from Sunrise Securities of New York for $20 million is now in place.

The Sunrise deal offers to purchase 15% of Brillouin post-money, conditional on Brillouin moving ahead with and completing successful testing of its CECR at SRI.

....

The $20M Sunrise offer would fund full commercial launch of this merchant power supply retrofit business model after successful testing of the CECR called NHB™ at SRI.

(Excerpt) Read more at oilprice.com ...


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: canr; cmns; coldfusion; lenr
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-66 next last

1 posted on 11/12/2013 9:20:52 PM PST by Kevmo
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: dangerdoc; citizen; Liberty1970; Red Badger; Wonder Warthog; PA Engineer; glock rocks; free_life; ..

The Cold Fusion/LENR Ping List

http://www.freerepublic.com/tag/coldfusion/index?tab=articles


http://lenr-canr.org/

;


2 posted on 11/12/2013 9:21:42 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Kevmo

This is all complete BS. And provably so

Please do not waste our time of FR with this nonsense until

#1. You have a power plant of at least 1 MW that is operating with any type of deuterium tritium or other fusion

This nonsense is just trying to attract $ to go down a rat hole

Don’t waste your time Freepers. These free energy types are all liars of the first degree and give science and engineering a bad name


3 posted on 11/12/2013 10:11:38 PM PST by Truthoverpower (The guvmint you get is the guvmint you deserve)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

asked & answered

—————www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg85737.html———————


4 posted on 11/12/2013 10:29:53 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

And provably so
***Then, by all means... prove it. We breathlessly await your painstaking proof.


5 posted on 11/12/2013 10:31:00 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

This nonsense is just trying to attract $ to go down a rat hole

speaking of $ratholes, where is your condemnation of the hundreds of $billions pissed down the hot-fusion rathole? I agree that this makes science look extremely bad. 14 orders of magnitude bad, in contrast.

asked & answered

-————————www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l@eskimo.com/msg85822.html——————


6 posted on 11/12/2013 10:36:21 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

If you don’t want to waste YOUR time why do you bother to read the article and comment on it?

Here’s a suggestion... when you see a post on cold fusion DON”T CLICK ON IT - just move on.


7 posted on 11/12/2013 11:27:05 PM PST by aquila48
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower
These free energy types are all liars of the first degree and give science and engineering a bad name

We already got free energy smarty pants, I have a Chevy Volt.

8 posted on 11/12/2013 11:46:00 PM PST by itsahoot (It is not so much that history repeats, but that human nature does not change.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower
This nonsense is just trying to attract $ to go down a rat hole

That 20 million from Sunrise might fill quite a bit of that "rathole".

It sounds like somebody with money was convinced.

9 posted on 11/12/2013 11:54:41 PM PST by toast
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

>> Don’t waste your time Freepers. These free energy types are all liars

Thanks for sounding the alarm; some of us already realize that “scam” and “science” are actually two different things, no matter that they both start with the same two letters. :-)


10 posted on 11/13/2013 3:09:25 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower
"This is all complete BS. And provably so"

I might be inclined to take that view if it weren't for NASA scientists evaluating the science and finding something real:

NASA: A Nuclear Reactor To Replace Your Water Heater

Never forget, there were those who claimed that cars could never go 60 miles an hour, powered flight was a waste of time, and rockets wouldn't work in the vacuum of space. I'd be a bit concerned about joining the hallowed ranks of techno-Luddites... ;-)

LENR is certainly worthy of lots more investigation...and the fact that for-profit businesses are seeing something there is encouraging!

11 posted on 11/13/2013 3:14:43 AM PST by PreciousLiberty
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Kevmo

Proof? You want proof this is bogus?

How about basic chemistry? A proton plus an electron does NOT create a neutron. A neutron is an elemental subatomic particle with no charge and you can’t create one by “mashing” an electron and proton together.

Also note the vague “scientific” jargon like “suitable internal geometry”. What does that even mean? Sounds like a better worded Nigerian scam email.

People will always find ways to separate fools from their money.


12 posted on 11/13/2013 3:17:16 AM PST by MDspinboyredux
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: toast
It sounds like somebody with money was convinced.

This model could be used to fleece city slicker leftists out of their money. So much of what leftists believe about reality just isn't so. There are unlimited ways to turn that delta into cash.

Actually government clock punchers live almost entirely off this kind of scam, exploiting people's impossible beliefs. A baby momma has stupid kids? Just spend $20,000 per year in taxpayer money from age 4 to 26 and they too can get a college degree!

13 posted on 11/13/2013 3:47:29 AM PST by Reeses
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: MDspinboyredux
"How about basic chemistry?"

Firstly, this isn't chemistry (I'm a chemist). It's nucleonics.

"A proton plus an electron does NOT create a neutron. A neutron is an elemental subatomic particle with no charge and you can’t create one by “mashing” an electron and proton together."

Wrong. Neutrons can and do decompose into protons and electrons (beta decay), so the reverse process is certainly not impossible.

14 posted on 11/13/2013 4:14:42 AM PST by Wonder Warthog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: MDspinboyredux

‘Also note the vague “scientific” jargon like “suitable internal geometry”. What does that even mean? Sounds like a better worded Nigerian scam email.’

If you follow the link at post #11, there is a bit deeper scientific explanation.

It may in fact be a solution that will revolutionize energy generation. We’ll see...


15 posted on 11/13/2013 4:57:05 AM PST by PreciousLiberty
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower
"These free energy types are all liars of the first degree and give science and engineering a bad name."

Let's see, your first mistake is lumping LENR into the "free energy" category.....it isn't. The ultimate source of the energy is well known if the exact mechanism of the release is not.

Your second mistake is to categorize the scientists who have studied the phenomenon and published peer-reviewed papers on it as "liars". If you bother to check their science credentials, you will find them to be impeccable.

The SOLE exception to this is Rossi, who does have some shady stuff in his background.

But this article isn't about Rossi, it is about Brillouin, whose technology was independently tested and verified by SRI International, one of the top science organizations in the USA. Also, Brillouin is located in the "Silicon Valley" area, and their funding is from the same venture capitalists who once financed guys like Steve Jobs...who have surely done the "due diligence" needed to justify investment.

All these folks liars??? Not likely.

16 posted on 11/13/2013 5:06:29 AM PST by Wonder Warthog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: aquila48
"Here’s a suggestion... when you see a post on cold fusion DON”T CLICK ON IT - just move on."

Bravo! Would that more people would follow that advice.

17 posted on 11/13/2013 5:07:57 AM PST by Wonder Warthog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Wonder Warthog

Interesting news. Saving my excitement for when they demonstrate a pilot device, running under the control of an independent testing lab, operating for an extended period of time.


18 posted on 11/13/2013 6:34:42 AM PST by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Kevmo

If they can make this portable enough to fit underneath the hood of a car, then it will be the end of the oil era. Oil will just be used to make plastic products. This would be awesome to see in my lifetime.


19 posted on 11/13/2013 6:42:28 AM PST by Brett66 (Where government advances, and it advances relentlessly , freedom is imperiled -Janice Rogers Brown)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Wonder Warthog; MDspinboyredux
Wrong. Neutrons can and do decompose into protons and electrons (beta decay), so the reverse process is certainly not impossible.

It's called electron capture (where the nucleus captures an inner electron and a proton becomes a neutron) and it does occur in nature as a recognized isotope decay mode. See link. Beryllium-7 decays into Lithium-7 via electron capture.

20 posted on 11/13/2013 6:46:37 AM PST by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower
Why waste your time responding if it is such garbage?

I appreciate Kevmo posting these items so I don't have to spend time looking for them.

21 posted on 11/13/2013 6:52:04 AM PST by mad_as_he$$
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: MDspinboyredux

>>People will always find ways to separate fools from their money.<<

I have met people where the “more money than brains” certainly applied. In some cases it was just $20, in others it was in the high millions. Where do you fit into that picture?


22 posted on 11/13/2013 6:53:57 AM PST by B4Ranch (Name the illness that you have and Google it with "hydrogen peroxide". Do it and be surprised.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: Brett66
"If they can make this portable enough to fit underneath the hood of a car, then it will be the end of the oil era. Oil will just be used to make plastic products."

It would be the end of the oil era even if inventors don't manage that degree of shrinkage. With very-low-cost energy available, we can synthesize any fuel we want from "organic waste" (actually any carbon containing material that needs to be "destroyed"), whether that fuel be methanol, ethanol, gasoline, or diesel, or some other more exotic choice.

23 posted on 11/13/2013 6:55:23 AM PST by Wonder Warthog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: Reeses

I am so glad the world has people such as yourself who are always trying to keep me from making bad investments. Thank you from the bottom of my heart.


24 posted on 11/13/2013 6:56:09 AM PST by B4Ranch (Name the illness that you have and Google it with "hydrogen peroxide". Do it and be surprised.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: PapaBear3625
"It's called electron capture (where the nucleus captures an inner electron and a proton becomes a neutron) and it does occur in nature as a recognized isotope decay mode. See link. Beryllium-7 decays into Lithium-7 via electron capture."

Thanks for the info. I actually "did" know that, but was having trouble dredging the name up out of deep storage (pre-coffee syndrome, y'know). The last time I had to think about this stuff was forty years ago......

25 posted on 11/13/2013 7:00:11 AM PST by Wonder Warthog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: Reeses
This model could be used to fleece city slicker leftists out of their money.

The cold fusion scammers will sell you licenses, distribution rights, and shares. They'll sell you everything but a working device.

26 posted on 11/13/2013 7:02:23 AM PST by Moonman62 (The US has become a government with a country, rather than a country with a government.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: toast

A fool and his money are soon parted

By slick sounding ‘scientists’

Look spend all the money you want to make nuclear reactions occur at room temp and then be able to be carefully controlled and produce real power on the order of either existing fission or even solar photovoltaics

I’ve met these brillouin guys. In an engineer with 20 yrs in the energy business here in the sf bay and these guys are just line the ‘nano tech’ solar guys who got 100 million in 2003 and were going to revolutionize the p. industry. Result. Nothing. Not one panel of Anything for 100m$

Oh and then there was solyndra you’ve heard of them right? They too were going to revolutionize PV

Look if you don’t have a background in nuclear chemistry and physics just relie on us engineers

We ask simply about this science- ok so how is this going to be useful AND competetive with existing technology in the real world?

I’ve seen their proposed designs it’s all crapola. You can do all kinds of things in a carefully controlled lab that will not work at scale. You can also embellish lab results and skew parameters easily as well and then BS about them in white papers

Who the heck wants a 50000$ nuclear reactor for a water heater. Which costs 200$ and uses 30$ of gas a month

If that’s annoying to you then solar thermal is well established and works fine for about 6-8 k$ and then you have no gas bill again

So as you can plainly see this is nonsense unless they are trying to make real power (ie < 10MW continuous).

And even if it would work which it can’t good luck powering a nuclear anything here in ca , isotopes of hydrogen or not

So there’s your cold water in the face, charlatans and their gullible believers in the pie in the sky and free energy and let’s ignore the second law of thermodynamics

For those in rio Linda that is energy cannot be created or destroyed. Only changed from one form to another

Mark my words Freepers


27 posted on 11/13/2013 7:11:54 AM PST by Truthoverpower (The guvmint you get is the guvmint you deserve)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: Wonder Warthog; MDspinboyredux
In a peer-reviewed article in Physical Review Letters: Strong Flux of Low-Energy Neutrons Produced by Thunderstorms:
Received 13 July 2011; published 19 March 2012

We report here for the first time about the registration of an extraordinary high flux of low-energy neutrons generated during thunderstorms. The measured neutron count rate enhancements are directly connected with thunderstorm discharges. The low-energy neutron flux value obtained in our work is a challenge for the photonuclear channel of neutron generation in thunderstorm: the estimated value of the needed high-energy γ-ray flux is about 3 orders of magnitude higher than that one observed.

© 2012 American Physical Society

So lightning seems to be creating low-energy neutrons, by some unknown mechanism. My speculation is that perhaps intense electric fields may cause electron capture somehow.
28 posted on 11/13/2013 7:11:59 AM PST by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: Wonder Warthog; MDspinboyredux
"A proton plus an electron does NOT create a neutron. A neutron is an elemental subatomic particle with no charge and you can’t create one by “mashing” an electron and proton together."

I thought that is what the Large Hadron Collider does.......

29 posted on 11/13/2013 7:16:50 AM PST by Red Badger (Proud member of the Zeta Omicron Tau Fraternity since 2004...................)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Nervous Tick

Science does not equal engineering. You can do stuff in a lab that will never be practical in the real world. This is not evil or bad just academics

Oh and lots of taxpayer$ usually


30 posted on 11/13/2013 7:17:35 AM PST by Truthoverpower (The guvmint you get is the guvmint you deserve)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Wonder Warthog; Kevmo
Where the findings at the link in #28 become relevant, is that the Widom-Larsen theory of LENR:
Allan Widom and Lewis Larsen propose that, in condensed matter, local breakdown of the Born-Oppenheimer approximation occurs in homogeneous, many-body, collectively oscillating patches of protons, deuterons, or tritons found on surfaces of fully loaded metallic hydrides; Born-Oppenheimer breakdown enables a degree of electromagnetic coupling of surface proton/deuteron/triton oscillations with those of nearby surface plasmon polariton (SPP) electrons. Such coupling between collective oscillations creates local nuclear-strength electric fields in the vicinity of the patches.

SPP electrons bathed in such high fields increase their effective mass, thus becoming heavy electrons. Widom and Larsen propose that heavy SPP electrons can react directly with protons, deuterons, or tritons located in surface patches through an inverse beta decay process that results in simultaneous collective production of one, two, or three neutrons, respectively, and a neutrino. Collectively produced neutrons are created ultra-cold; that is, they have ultra-low momentum and extremely large quantum mechanical wavelengths and absorption cross-sections compared to “typical” neutrons at thermal energies.

Finally, Widom and Larsen propose that heavy SPP patch electrons are uniquely able to immediately convert almost any locally produced or incident gamma radiation directly into infrared heat energy, thus providing a form of built-in gamma shielding for LENR nuclear reactions.

The thunderstorm-generated low-energy neutrons may indicate that there are mechanisms by which low-energy neutrons are generated by strong electric fields.
31 posted on 11/13/2013 7:33:23 AM PST by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: MDspinboyredux

Proof? You want proof this is bogus?
***Yes. He said it was provable, so I’m asking for that proof. All I get is crickets. Because there is no proof.


32 posted on 11/13/2013 2:58:07 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: MDspinboyredux

How about basic chemistry? A proton plus an electron does NOT create a neutron. A neutron is an elemental subatomic particle with no charge and you can’t create one by “mashing” an electron and proton together.
***That just means the guys at oilprice.com aren’t very good writers. That doesn’t prove LENR is bogus.

Also note the vague “scientific” jargon like “suitable internal geometry”. What does that even mean?
***The Internal geometry of the metal lattice matrix is known to be critical for LENR formation. Whether it’s Palladium with Deuterium or Nickel with Hydrogen. Both lattices have shown that the internal geometry is critical. Of course, if you haven’t been following LENR, you wouldn’t be aware of that. But doesn’t mean LENR is bogus, it means you don’t have the background to loudly proclaim it to be bogus.

Sounds like a better worded Nigerian scam email.
***And your bloviating sounds like all the other hypercritical anti-science bloviating we’ve been witnessing here on FR for the past few years.

People will always find ways to separate fools from their money.
***So your concern is duly noted, over $20M of private funding. Where is your concern for the hundreds of $Billions poured down the rathole of hot fusion? Silent, just like your scientific background.


33 posted on 11/13/2013 3:04:07 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: PapaBear3625
"So lightning seems to be creating low-energy neutrons, by some unknown mechanism. My speculation is that perhaps intense electric fields may cause electron capture somehow."

There have been occasional references to both this and earthquakes as producing low-energy neutrons. The hot physics community has been stalwart in denying that either was possible. Same as for LENR.

34 posted on 11/13/2013 3:10:44 PM PST by Wonder Warthog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: Red Badger
"I thought that is what the Large Hadron Collider does....... "

Yes, but that fits into the category of a high-energy process, and thus is well-accepted by the hot physics folks.

35 posted on 11/13/2013 3:12:23 PM PST by Wonder Warthog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

A fool and his money are soon parted By slick sounding ‘scientists’
***A poor writer and a worn-out cliche are soon united. Or is it that you’re concerned about all those hundreds of $billions of public money already spent on the hot fusion scam? Those were certainly some slick sounding scientists. My guess is that you simply need to take a good writing class.

Look spend all the money you want to make nuclear reactions occur at room temp and then be able to be carefully controlled and produce real power on the order of either existing fission or even solar photovoltaics
***That’s exactly what they’re doing, so what is your problem with it? Again, perhaps you need to take a writing class.


36 posted on 11/13/2013 3:18:11 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

I’ve met these brillouin guys. In an engineer with 20 yrs in the energy business here in the sf bay
***I’m an engineer in Silicon Valley as well and I’d love to be introduced to these guys. Care to make the introduction?

and these guys are just line the ‘nano tech’ solar guys who got 100 million in 2003 and were going to revolutionize the p. industry.
***You mean these guys?
http://www.nanosolar.com/company/company-overview/
They’re still in business.

Result. Nothing. Not one panel of Anything for 100m$
***That happens all the time in Silicon Valley. I don’t see you calling all those failed startups fraudulent.

Oh and then there was solyndra you’ve heard of them right? They too were going to revolutionize PV
***There are dozens of examples of failures. It proves nothing. You’ve heard of the Wright brothers, haven’t you? They, too, were accused of being frauds for 5 years before they were allowed to demo to an actual contract.

Look if you don’t have a background in nuclear chemistry and physics just relie on us engineers
***95% of the electrical engineers I work with in the valley do not have a background in nuclear chemistry nor nuclear physics. Where do you get the idea we can rely on engineers to make these kinds of decisions? What gives any of us freepers the confidence that we can rely on YOU for any technical advice, when what you’ve posted has already been refuted and you deliver crickets on the rest?


37 posted on 11/13/2013 3:26:38 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower
We ask simply about this science- ok so how is this going to be useful AND competetive with existing technology in the real world? ***You honestly can't see that a new, emission-free power source that has 10,000X the energy density of gasoline is going to be useful in the real world? Where do you come up with this garbage? I’ve seen their proposed designs it’s all crapola. You can do all kinds of things in a carefully controlled lab that will not work at scale. ***Right here you self-refute. You acknowledge that the effect works in the lab but hint that it won't work to scale. Same thing happened to the transistor. It took time, but it became utterly reliable. If the effect didn't work at all in the lab, you might have some ground to stand on but you have already relinquished that ground. You can also embellish lab results and skew parameters easily as well and then BS about them in white papers ***That's a mighty wide conspiracy theory you've got going there. 14,720 replications, all "embellished" and "skewed parameters"? Bowlsheet. The only scientists caught fraudulently embellishing their LENR results were at MIT when they tried to shut down LENR and it turned out their own results showed excess heat. But we wouldn't expect someone like you to know that kind of thing, seein' as how you have not taken the time to come up to speed on this nascent technology. Who the heck wants a 50000$ nuclear reactor for a water heater. Which costs 200$ and uses 30$ of gas a month ***No one other than people in space or antarctica who can't get gas delivered. Who would want a $300 water heater that uses $30 worth of hydrogen over its entire lifetime? Millions, that's who. If that’s annoying to you then solar thermal is well established and works fine for about 6-8 k$ and then you have no gas bill again ***First, let me just say that your writing is so painful to follow that I can't just let it pass without comment. Please, please... take a writing class. You have established a $6-8k baseline for useful technology, assuming you don't move the goalposts like everyone else who has argued from your position. LENR is going to be made from Palladium or Nickel and some hydrogen + some lead shielding. It will be easy for it to beat the baseline you've established. For one thing, it will work when the sun does not shine. So as you can plainly see this is nonsense unless they are trying to make real power (ie < 10MW continuous). ***Please show us where you've come up to speed on this issue by letting us know which LENR guys are aiming outside of the parameter you just posted... assuming you meant <10MW continuous, or did you mean >10MW continuous? Either way, show us what the hell you're talking about rather than just bloviating and displaying your foolishness like a peacock. And even if it would work which it can’t good luck powering a nuclear anything here in ca , isotopes of hydrogen or not ***As a Californian, I often find myself apologizing for other californians who think that if it can't be done here it ain't worth doing. So there’s your cold water in the face, charlatans and their gullible believers in the pie in the sky and free energy and let’s ignore the second law of thermodynamics ***Who says the 2nd law is being ignored? Have you read up on the Widom-Larson theory? How about KP Sinha's theory? Or is it that you don't trust PhD Nuclear Physicists? For those in rio Linda that is energy cannot be created or destroyed. Only changed from one form to another ***Wow, that just blows my hair back the way you explained it... /s Mark my words Freepers ***I am marking your words, noting how poor those words have been written down, and how poorly you defend your thoughts.
38 posted on 11/13/2013 3:42:22 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

We ask simply about this science — ok so how is this going to be useful AND competetive with existing technology in the real world?
***You honestly can’t see that a new, emission-free power source that has 10,000X the energy density of gasoline is going to be useful in the real world? Where do you come up with this garbage?

I’ve seen their proposed designs it’s all crapola. You can do all kinds of things in a carefully controlled lab that will not work at scale.
***Right here you self-refute. You acknowledge that the effect works in the lab but hint that it won’t work to scale. Same thing happened to the transistor. It took time, but it became utterly reliable. If the effect didn’t work at all in the lab, you might have some ground to stand on but you have already relinquished that ground.

You can also embellish lab results and skew parameters easily as well and then BS about them in white papers
***That’s a mighty wide conspiracy theory you’ve got going there. 14,720 replications, all “embellished” and “skewed parameters”? Bowlsheet. The only scientists caught fraudulently embellishing their LENR results were at MIT when they tried to shut down LENR and it turned out their own results showed excess heat. But we wouldn’t expect someone like you to know that kind of thing, seein’ as how you have not taken the time to come up to speed on this nascent technology.


39 posted on 11/13/2013 3:45:02 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

Who the heck wants a $50000 nuclear reactor for a water heater. Which costs 200$ and uses 30$ of gas a month
***No one other than people in space or antarctica who can’t get gas delivered. Who would want a $300 water heater that uses $30 worth of hydrogen over its entire lifetime? Millions, that’s who.

If that’s annoying to you then solar thermal is well established and works fine for about 6-8 k$ and then you have no gas bill again
***First, let me just say that your writing is so painful to follow that I can’t just let it pass without comment. Please, please... take a writing class. You have established a $6-8k baseline for useful technology, assuming you don’t move the goalposts like everyone else who has argued from your position. LENR is going to be made from Palladium or Nickel and some hydrogen + some lead shielding. It will be easy for it to beat the baseline you’ve established. For one thing, it will work when the sun does not shine.


40 posted on 11/13/2013 3:46:03 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

So there’s your cold water in the face, charlatans and their gullible believers in the pie in the sky and free energy and let’s ignore the second law of thermodynamics
***Who says the 2nd law is being ignored? Have you read up on the Widom-Larson theory? How about KP Sinha’s theory? Or is it that you don’t trust PhD Nuclear Physicists?

For those in rio Linda that is energy cannot be created or destroyed. Only changed from one form to another
***Wow, that just blows my hair back the way you explained it... /s

Mark my words Freepers
***I am marking your words, noting how poor those words have been written down, and how poorly you defend your thoughts.


41 posted on 11/13/2013 3:46:44 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: aquila48

Excellent point.

For instance, I see all kinds of threads on catholic beliefs that I consider to be a waste of time... so ... I don’t click on them.


42 posted on 11/13/2013 4:14:53 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: PapaBear3625

propose that, in condensed matter, local breakdown of the Born-Oppenheimer approximation occurs in homogeneous, many-body, collectively oscillating patches of protons, deuterons, or tritons found on surfaces of fully loaded metallic hydrides
***Their proposal is as good as anyone else’s, maybe. Something breaks down locally inside metallic hydrides. If it’s the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, then KP Sinha wins the Nobel. I think that there’s a lot of evidence of Bose-Einstein Condensates being formed (Y.E. Kim would get the Nobel prize), but the temperatures are way too high for BEC formation. So my proposal is that instead of a 3D BEC forming, it’s a 2D or 1D BEC, forming along only one axis rather than 3.


43 posted on 11/13/2013 4:50:07 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Kevmo

No sir I have a JOB or two actually. Not all day to try and SOUND smart

Capisce?

Believe in the tooth fairy all ya want

I’m sticking with REAL world engineering

Thanks for your input and one day i send ya one of MY white papers or 50 page analyses

Geezh!


44 posted on 11/13/2013 8:34:07 PM PST by Truthoverpower (The guvmint you get is the guvmint you deserve)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: Wonder Warthog
Yes, but that fits into the category of a high-energy process, and thus is well-accepted by the hot physics folks.

That also fits into the category of high priced technology, and thus is well accepted by the crony capitalist folks....................

45 posted on 11/14/2013 6:46:04 AM PST by Red Badger (Proud member of the Zeta Omicron Tau Fraternity since 2004...................)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: Red Badger
"That also fits into the category of high priced technology, and thus is well accepted by the crony capitalist folks...................."

True dat! (Cajun expression)

46 posted on 11/14/2013 11:59:09 AM PST by Wonder Warthog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower
"I’m sticking with REAL world engineering."

Good idea. Since you want to do that, I suggest you obtain a copy of George Beaudette's book "Excess Heat, Why Cold Fusion Research Prevailed".

His biography:

Charles Beaudette was born in Boston in 1930. He attended Massachusetts Institute of Technology in Cambridge, Mass., where he majored in electrical engineering and held the position of managing editor of The Tech, the official student newspaper. He was awarded the degree of Bachelor of Science in electrical engineering in 1952. In 1958 he started Dychro Corporation and sold it to a computer company in 1961. From 1963 to 1973 he was employed by EG&G Corporation in Wellesley, Massachusetts, in the capacity of senior engineer and engineering manager. It was during this time that he participated in the technology development for what eventually became the office facsimile, and which work included development of what is now the PC modem. From this activity, Mr. Beaudette was issued a patent on image processing for variable speed page scanning and transmission.

After retirement, he attended an ICCF (International Conference on Cold Fusion) symposium on a whim, and found there, not the fraud and fakery he expected, but serious science and research.

The book is the result of his research into the reality of cold fusion.

He covers the experimental evidence quite well (though now a bit dated, as the book was written in 2002), as well as the "sociological factors" that led the physicists (NOT Pons and Fleischmann)to "get it wrong".

47 posted on 11/14/2013 12:09:25 PM PST by Wonder Warthog
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: Kevmo
Something breaks down locally inside metallic hydrides. If it’s the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, then KP Sinha wins the Nobel. I think that there’s a lot of evidence of Bose-Einstein Condensates being formed (Y.E. Kim would get the Nobel prize), but the temperatures are way too high for BEC formation. So my proposal is that instead of a 3D BEC forming, it’s a 2D or 1D BEC, forming along only one axis rather than 3.

I think it just takes the appropriate kind of pixie dust sprinkled on the electrodes.
48 posted on 11/14/2013 12:32:57 PM PST by ZX12R (Never forget the heroes of Benghazi, who were abandoned to their deaths by Obama)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: Truthoverpower

Not only is your writing piss poor, but your actual reasoning (once one is able to figure out what you’re really trying to say) basically is purely fallacious. Capisce?


49 posted on 11/14/2013 1:36:22 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: Red Badger

That also fits into the category of high priced technology, and thus is well accepted by the crony capitalist folks....................
***If the LENR scientists were half the charlatan scam artists their critics claim, they’d be all over this angle. My personal opinion of the Widom-Larson theory is that it is baloney, borne out of the need to distance themselves from what resembles cold fusion. But it shows that coming up with a theory based upon scientific political correctness can actually move the ball forward, so it has its value. What we need is a high energy LENR theory that would focus on Electron Capture and attract $200M in seed money just so that regular LENR experiments can be carried out.


50 posted on 11/14/2013 1:39:57 PM PST by Kevmo ("A person's a person, no matter how small" ~Horton Hears a Who)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-66 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Smoky Backroom
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson