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The Five Failed Predictions of Creationism
Crevo thread: Professor Dumped Over Evolution Beliefs ^ | 24 March 2003 | PatrickHenry

Posted on 04/01/2003 8:12:41 AM PST by PatrickHenry

This vanity thread was inspired by a provocative question that Junior directed to a creationist: "Biblical prophesies notwithstanding, what biological predictions does creationism make?" The creationist didn't respond, but I did, as follows:

I can think of a few creationist predictions. Because -- according to creationism -- all species were specially created at virtually the same time, and did not gradually evolve from earlier forms:

1. There should be no transitional species.
2. There are most certainly no pre-human species.
3. There should be no evidence, whether in fossils or DNA, showing the chronological evolution of life.
4. There must surely be at least one species, and probably several, having no genetic similarities with any other life on earth.
5. The fossil record must show all kinds of species (such as dinosaurs and humans) living together at the same time.
I shall call these The Five Failed Predictions of Creationism.

In fairness to the creationists, although the first three have already been disproved (for example: #1 -- Transitional Vertebrate Fossils FAQ, #2 -- Human Ancestors, more #2 -- Comparison of all skulls, #3 -- Tree of Life Project ), the last two (#4 and #5) can't yet be considered to be totally failed predictions. All we can do is point out that the predicted evidence has not yet been discovered. Given the lack of actual research being conducted by creationists, it is unlikely to be discovered.


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: creationism; crevolist; darwin; evolution
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Yes, this is a shameless vanity post, but this is April Fool's Day, so the timing is right. We're in the Smokey Backroom, so feel free to say your piece.
1 posted on 04/01/2003 8:12:41 AM PST by PatrickHenry
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To: VadeRetro; jennyp; Junior; longshadow; *crevo_list; RadioAstronomer; Scully; Piltdown_Woman; ...
Hot new crevo thread for April Fool's day.

[This ping list is for the evolution -- not creationism -- side of evolution threads, and sometimes for other science topics. To be added (or dropped), let me know via freepmail.]

2 posted on 04/01/2003 8:14:28 AM PST by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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To: PatrickHenry
It's been quiet on the crevo front lately. Will print for a later read.
3 posted on 04/01/2003 8:23:53 AM PST by stanz
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To: PatrickHenry
I don't think creationism makes a positive statement about number four. But I am inclined to believe that the creator/designer inflicted a great deal of pain and suffering with his botched designs. They are remarkable bits of engineering -- no doubt about that -- but show no regard for the well being of individuals, as opposed to species.
4 posted on 04/01/2003 8:29:46 AM PST by js1138
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To: js1138
I don't think creationism makes a positive statement about number four. [There must surely be at least one species, and probably several, having no genetic similarities with any other life on earth.]

True. But it's inferred. A weak inference, perhaps. If each species were a unique creation, there is no reason at all for each to be so similar to the others in their molecular structure.

5 posted on 04/01/2003 8:36:59 AM PST by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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To: PatrickHenry
They'd need to be similar so they could eat each other. No need, however to build this really neat branching tree of DNA.
6 posted on 04/01/2003 8:42:15 AM PST by js1138
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To: PatrickHenry
Excellent post, with my usual caveat: the scientific evidence for evolution does not discredit the Bible, only the misguided attempt by some to read it as a hyper-literal science book.

My bottom line: God created man; evolution is currently our best guess as to how He did it.

7 posted on 04/01/2003 8:55:11 AM PST by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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To: js1138
They'd need to be similar so they could eat each other.

Yes, locally; but worldwide? Not even an island with an isolated ecosystem that's different from everything else? There's no creationist reason why a lion can eat animals from all over the globe.

8 posted on 04/01/2003 9:54:49 AM PST by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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To: PatrickHenry
Hmmm, an April Fool's day crevo thread...
Do do I have to post as a creationist now?
9 posted on 04/01/2003 10:10:41 AM PST by BMCDA
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To: BMCDA
Do do I have to post as a creationist now?

As we are all Irish on St. Patrick's Day, so are we all creationists on April Fool's Day.

10 posted on 04/01/2003 10:17:37 AM PST by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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To: PatrickHenry
OK well, then let's see...

......calibrating.........


Evo flight // matrix ... OVERLORDS !

hop (( delusians )) -- skip (( reality )) -- jump (( science )) ---

hale bopp ... cargo // theocide cult !

EVO RULE -- SCHLOCK ... rubber rule !

11 posted on 04/01/2003 10:28:07 AM PST by BMCDA
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To: BMCDA
You do a much better imitation than I do.
12 posted on 04/01/2003 12:05:10 PM PST by js1138
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To: js1138
Yeah, I can cut&paste at least as good as f-dott, n'est-ce pas? ;^D
13 posted on 04/01/2003 12:14:48 PM PST by BMCDA
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To: BMCDA
I made the mistake of trying to appear rational. I was in a hurry to post before the blue tide arrived.
14 posted on 04/01/2003 12:16:50 PM PST by js1138
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To: js1138
You could have quoted line noise and gotten a similar effect.
15 posted on 04/01/2003 12:32:06 PM PST by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch is der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: js1138
I was in a hurry to post before the blue tide arrived.

The creationists are not on my ping list. You can summon them to the thread if you wish. This is the day for it.

16 posted on 04/01/2003 12:49:03 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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To: js1138
According to christian theology, this world has been running down since the Fall. I see evidence of this all day and no evidence of building upwards.
I wish my house work would evolve!
17 posted on 04/01/2003 2:05:30 PM PST by metacognative
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To: metacognative
According to christian theology, this world has been running down since the Fall. I see evidence of this all day and no evidence of building upwards.

But if the 2LoT was a side effect of the Fall, then does that mean it wasn't in effect before the Fall? Wouldn't that fundamentally change chemistry, just for starters? Would biology even be possible without the 2LoT? I mean, wouldn't people spontaneously combust?

Or, would dust spontaneously clump together & break into song?

(This could get interesting!)

18 posted on 04/01/2003 2:30:20 PM PST by jennyp (http://lowcarbshopper.bestmessageboard.com)
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To: PatrickHenry
Evolution is a vile communist plot! Creationism is the only possibility! There is TONS of evidence backing this up. HORDES of scientists are seeing the light and rushing to confirm what I've known all along!

I am secretly a creationist and have been POSING as a reasonable human being just to infiltrate your ranks and get on you ping lists! Now I can reveal the truth, for we will surely WIN and TAKE OVER THE WORLD!!!

MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA!!!!!!!
19 posted on 04/01/2003 3:05:21 PM PST by gomaaa
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>>>>>>BACK-BREAKING-NEWS<<<<<<
Interesting E-mail from Jim Robinson
Address:http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/backroom/882225/posts?page=4
20 posted on 04/01/2003 3:08:56 PM PST by tpaine
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To: jennyp
But if the 2LoT was a side effect of the Fall, then does that mean it wasn't in effect before the Fall? Wouldn't that fundamentally change chemistry, just for starters? Would biology even be possible without the 2LoT? I mean, wouldn't people spontaneously combust? Or, would dust spontaneously clump together & break into song?

Rivers could flow backward, smoke could be sucked back into cigarette ash to make tobacco, crazy glue would no longer be necessary to fix a vase that had broken, salt would spontaneously come out of solution in water, the seas would boil and the skies would blacken, dogs and cats, living together, MASS HYSTERIA!

21 posted on 04/01/2003 3:11:52 PM PST by gomaaa
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To: PatrickHenry
Bah. A proper April Fool's post would be "Evolution scientists announce, 'It was all a big joke', admit ultimate goal was to lead the gullible away from Christ". I bet that quite a few Creationists would buy it as fact (given that people honestly believe that JK Rowling is a member of the Church of Satan).
22 posted on 04/01/2003 3:27:12 PM PST by Dimensio
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To: gomaaa
...crazy glue would no longer be necessary to fix a vase that had broken...

I feel sorry for that poor guy hanging by his hard hat from that I-beam...

23 posted on 04/01/2003 3:31:15 PM PST by Junior (Computers make very fast, very accurate mistakes.)
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To: Dimensio
You ought to gin up a story along those lines and post it. I'd ping the list in a heart beat.
24 posted on 04/01/2003 3:32:11 PM PST by Junior (Computers make very fast, very accurate mistakes.)
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To: PatrickHenry
We all know that God Created the earth in 7 days six thousand years ago and if you let all these facts keep getting in the way of your faith your going straight to hell.
25 posted on 04/01/2003 3:57:08 PM PST by Sentis
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To: Dimensio
A proper April Fool's post would be "Evolution scientists announce, 'It was all a big joke', admit ultimate goal was to lead the gullible away from Christ".

That's so close to what the creationoids actually do believe that it would be too cruel to post it as a joke.

So far, the biggest joke is that they are all avoiding the thread. Perhaps crevos really do get out there and celebrate today as a holiday.

26 posted on 04/01/2003 4:08:13 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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To: Dimensio
Please please post this before the day is over include some fake scientist coming out of the closet do to speak. It will be in Crevo science/faith books before the end of the week.
27 posted on 04/01/2003 5:36:36 PM PST by Sentis
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To: jennyp
Even the rocks would cry out, huh? Seems like I've heard that before somewhere. I don't know how the Second Law worked before the Curse, but it sure makes upward evolution against physico-chemical equilibrium impossible now...unless Bergson was right.
28 posted on 04/02/2003 5:53:54 AM PST by metacognative
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To: gomaaa
And the Great Flood was just a Raleigh-Taylor instability in the Water Canopy that overhung (or hung over) the Firmament.

Anyway, Happy Sizda-Bedar!
29 posted on 04/02/2003 7:56:34 AM PST by Doctor Stochastic (Vegetabilisch = chaotisch is der Charakter der Modernen. - Friedrich Schlegel)
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To: All
Shamelessly bumping my own thread. Where are the creationoids? They can't all be human shields.
30 posted on 04/02/2003 4:33:31 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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To: PatrickHenry
Now I can see more clearly the fight we are in ...

limited govt (( creation // rights )) === Republic ---

... vs ...

unlimited govt // BS ...

(( evolution // elitist tyranny --- technocrats )) === socialism // fascism // communism ...

technocracy!

The dictatorship of the psuedo - intellectuals ...



untouchables --- overlords !

School // PARTY of social engineering via traitors -- nazis ...

atheists // EVOLUTION !


31 posted on 04/02/2003 5:49:34 PM PST by f.Christian (( who you gonna call ... 1 800 orc // evo bstr ))
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To: f.Christian
theres nothing like the real thing baby!!! :)
32 posted on 04/02/2003 7:44:26 PM PST by Sentis
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To: Dimensio
[P]eople honestly believe that JK Rowling is a member of the Church of Satan

She's not? Dang.

Rowling isn't even Wiccan?

33 posted on 04/02/2003 8:25:07 PM PST by Genesis defender ("Free Republic, a hotbed of Christian Zionist opinionating.")
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To: PatrickHenry
If each species were a unique creation...

Tsk tsk, Pat. You're getting sloppy. It's nitpicking, I know, but we creationoids prefer to use the term "kind", as in the dog kind. (Ex. - Wolves and dogs are separate species but can interbreed)

34 posted on 04/02/2003 8:32:38 PM PST by Genesis defender ("Free Republic, a hotbed of Christian Zionist opinionating.")
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To: Genesis defender
I don't know her religious affiliation apart from the fact that she's said that she's not a Satan worshipper. My comment was in reference to an Onion article, a satirical story that a number of Christian groups (and even an editor at WorldNetDaily) believed to be true.
35 posted on 04/02/2003 9:29:00 PM PST by Dimensio
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To: gomaaa
... dogs and cats, living together, MASS HYSTERIA!

All right. But what if you're wrong? Will you go to jail peacefully? Quietly? Will you enjoy it?

36 posted on 04/02/2003 9:43:55 PM PST by Condorman (He's an ugly little spud!)
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To: Genesis defender
You're getting sloppy. It's nitpicking, I know, but we creationoids prefer to use the term "kind" [not "species"]

Well, if I start down the road that leads to making creationoids happy, I will have to leave all my knowledge behind, so I don't want to even begin that journey. I'll have to live with the guilt of knowing that I've upset another creationoid. "Kind" or "species," it's all voodoo.


PTHHHHHHHHHH!

Neat screenname, by the way.

37 posted on 04/03/2003 3:43:06 AM PST by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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To: PatrickHenry
Someday, when you stand before God, you will know the truth.
38 posted on 04/03/2003 8:41:36 AM PST by exnavy
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To: PatrickHenry
THIS JUST IN: An Ivy League University is introducing a School of ... Gay Science. The most popular course so far is Nuclear Choreography 101
39 posted on 04/03/2003 10:59:15 AM PST by f.Christian (( who you gonna call ... 1 800 orc // evo bstr ))
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To: f.Christian
who did you cut and paste this from it is way more coherent than your usual posts?
40 posted on 04/03/2003 2:18:07 PM PST by Sentis
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To: Sentis
Here's another ...

But what do they have to fear, really? Michael Moore and his Oscar night tantrums? Ralph Nader? Tom Daschle? Susan Sarandon? Soccer moms with ... Darwin fish? Horrible traitors all.

Shock and awe ... conservatism ---

schlock and bluster ... liberalism // ideology (( evolution )) !

41 posted on 04/03/2003 2:30:45 PM PST by f.Christian (( who you gonna call ... 1 800 orc // evo bstr ))
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To: Sentis
The ... "tip" --- is near, if it has not already happened.
42 posted on 04/03/2003 3:27:51 PM PST by f.Christian (( who you gonna call ... 1 800 orc // evo bstr ))
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To: Dimensio
If you get the Reader's Digest, you may remember a while back that a woman wrote in (twice!) saying Rowling was a Satanist. She even refered to the Onion article as truth! It was the funniest thing I ever read when the RD editor wrote in reply politely saying that the Onion is a satirical site.
43 posted on 04/03/2003 4:13:29 PM PST by Genesis defender ("Free Republic, a hotbed of Christian Zionist opinionating.")
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To: PatrickHenry
My post was a bad attempt at humor.... I wasn't trying to be that serious.

Neat screenname, by the way.

Thanks. It's kind of ironic that I usually don't post much to crevo threads. Some posters in these threads just degenerate into petty name-calling and insults. That gets boring after awhile. I must admit some of y'all get really creative with the insults.

44 posted on 04/03/2003 5:38:31 PM PST by Genesis defender ("Free Republic, a hotbed of Christian Zionist opinionating.")
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To: Genesis defender; All
pr1 ...

good thing, that. I'm glad we have a Constitutional Republic, and not a democracy.


23 posted on 04/04/2003 8:05 AM PST by packrat01



fC ...

The constitution is amendable by a 2/3rds majority ...

democracy trumps the law // constitution ---

' mob ' rule -- 'science' ===> liberalism // EVOLUTION !

more ...

Originally the word liberal meant social conservatives(no govt religion--none) who advocated growth and progress---mostly technological(knowledge being absolute/unchanging)based on law--reality... UNDER GOD---the nature of GOD/man/govt. does not change.

LC...

Now I follow, thank you. Actually, I don't disagree with this at all since I see the left as abandoning the uncertianty of democracy and majority rule (( constitutional // law ))* * for the assurance technocracy and expert rule (( dictatorship // tyranny ))* * .

152 posted on 9/10/02 12:17 PM Pacific by Liberal Classic

... * * ... my additions !


45 posted on 04/04/2003 11:16:36 AM PST by f.Christian (( who you gonna call ... 1 800 orc // evo bstr ))
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To: Sentis; ZULU; All
zl ...

The liberal anti-gunners will never give up.

As long as they control the mass media, as long as the NEA maintains its ... Bolshevik monopoly * * --- on public education, and as long as we support churches, actors and other organizations who try to subvert our God-given, governmentally guarenteed rights, we will lose by gradual attrition.

zl ...

We must take strong action on the propaganda front to sieze the initiative from these anti-Constitutionalist, left-wing wacko revisionists.

41 posted on 04/04/2003 11:34 AM PST by ZULU

fC ...

The catholic hirearchy and the ussc sanctions ...

rubberstamps this gestapo science ---

... * * ... junta !

Main Entry: jun·ta

Pronunciation: 'hun-t&, 'j&n-, 'h&n-
Function: noun
Etymology: Spanish, from feminine of junto joined, from Latin junctus, past participle of jungere to join -- more at YOKE
Date: 1622
1 : a council or committee for political or governmental purposes; especially : a group of persons controlling a government especially after a revolutionary seizure of power
2 : JUNTO

46 posted on 04/04/2003 12:33:12 PM PST by f.Christian (( who you gonna call ... 1 800 orc // evo bstr ))
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To: f.Christian
I am not sure why you posted this to me. I am against gun control and I am against the NEA. I am for teaching the truth in schools. I dont want to see your mythology taught as truth and I certainly dont want to see the New Age Mythology taught as truth either.
47 posted on 04/04/2003 1:38:02 PM PST by Sentis
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To: Sentis
New Age Mythology taught as truth either.

It is ... evolution !

48 posted on 04/04/2003 1:46:43 PM PST by f.Christian (( who you gonna call ... 1 800 orc // evo bstr ))
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To: Sentis
On the 700 club ...

they had a lady from Albania describe what atheism // communism // evolution was like ---

look at nkorea --- public schools !
49 posted on 04/04/2003 1:48:11 PM PST by f.Christian (( who you gonna call ... 1 800 orc // evo bstr ))
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To: Sentis
It's internet therapy time at the asylum. Be patient. Before long they'll take his keyboard away and sedate him.
50 posted on 04/04/2003 4:22:37 PM PST by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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