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War of the Worlds screenwriter says Martians slaughtering humans are metaphore for U.S. military
Larry Elder Talk Radio Show on KABC AM 790 Los Angeles ^ | Tuesday, July 19, 2005 | Larry Elder

Posted on 07/19/2005 5:35:21 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com

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To: Darkwolf377
Thank you for the excellent information.

Very nice chatting with you too!

"If you check out your favorite movie house's profit statements you often find they are listed as food vendors, because that's where their $$ comes from."

The owner of the chain of movie theaters also told me that without the food concession sales, the theaters could not remain in business, due to the overhead costs including the movie print rental costs.

51 posted on 07/19/2005 8:29:48 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: Darkwolf377

It is interesting how the ending can be viewed as leftists anti-military/anti-defense propoganda, or, as you suggest, a favorable religious message. I believe Hollywood intends for this to be an act by "Mother Nature" from an atheist point of view.

I suppose an ideal movie would be crafted in a way that allows each member of the audience to interpret it in a way they find favorable. This might be analogous to the famous Mona Lisa painting staring back at you from any angle that you gaze upon it.



Mona Lisa


52 posted on 07/19/2005 8:42:28 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: FraudFactor.com

Yep. I don't know if you saw recently a theater chain was offering to refund tickets for Cinderella Man if the ticket buyer didn't like the movie. I welcomed this return to the showmanship style, as it's a great advertising gimmick and only 100 people in the whole chain asked for a refund, which they probably made up for in ten minutes' worth of junk food sales.


53 posted on 07/19/2005 8:44:40 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: FraudFactor.com
I hear ya, though I don't like those endings--I prefer the author to have the guts to make his case and leave it like that.

But the novel was written when Wells was still a christian, I believe (may have to check that) and before he went left and his books became unreadable.

I find it one of the best SF endings ever because it's unique--you can't end another story of this kind like that, the way you can have, say, a thousand movies end with big space battles.

54 posted on 07/19/2005 8:47:01 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377
I complained at one movie theater, either about being unhappy with the quality of the movie, or about excessive noise in the audience, babies crying, or something - I don't remember the details.

The manager was really good about it and said we could pick another movie and watch that one in addition to the movie we already saw, without paying extra. Of course, being in the theater longer, and being appreciative for their good treatment of customers, we did buy more food. However, it was a discount theater and the food was reasonably priced.

I suppose that is one good reason to go to a theater early enough, so if you don't like one movie you may be able to watch another.

Also, if you see a movie is really bad in the first 15 - 25 or 30 minutes (e.g., Election), walk out, and ask for a refund or a ticket to see another movie. It doesn't hurt to ask.

It surprised me to see people bring young children to movie theaters as though it is cheaper than a baby sitter or a baby sitter is not available.

I saw what looked like an entire family in the theater, including several young children, for the Matrix Reloaded (Unloaded) movie. This movie contained gratuitous frontal nudity and sex scenes that did not belong in or add to the movie. The mother and father did not seem to have any concern for their young children seeing these scenes.

It is interesting to note that these nude and sex scenes, together with the excessively long (or looping?) fight scenes, filled out half a movie into a full-length movie.

I felt cheated by the movie producer and as a result, did not see the third Matrix movie, and I did not buy the DVDs.

Based on conversations I had with friends who saw the second and third Matrix movies, the two movies should have had half their footage cut out and the remainder made into one real, complete movie.

55 posted on 07/19/2005 9:49:48 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: finnman69

"I was very disapointed and left feeling like I feel after watching most of the crap that comes out of Hollywood these days. empty and robbed."


My feelings exactly about the current state of Hollywood. I don't know, but the films nowadays just don't grab me anymore. Maybe I've just outgrown them.



56 posted on 07/19/2005 9:58:35 PM PDT by MoochPooch (A righteous person worries about his or her behavior, an extremist about everyone else's.)
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To: FraudFactor.com
I suppose that is one good reason to go to a theater early enough, so if you don't like one movie you may be able to watch another. Also, if you see a movie is really bad in the first 15 - 25 or 30 minutes (e.g., Election), walk out, and ask for a refund or a ticket to see another movie. It doesn't hurt to ask.

I've never had that experience, probably because I've always been such a fan, and have worked with very independent film on and off, so I probably read and hear more about movies than most normal people do, so I have a good indication about what I'm getting in for. I also have a personality that allows me to enjoy just about any movie in some way--I love film scores, for example.

I've never walked out of a movie. The one time I might have was Armageddon, but in fact it's one of the best times I've ever had in a theater, because my friend and I started a running commentary five minutes in. Usually I hate people who talk in movies, but the people around us were laughing at our comments, so we kept it up and had the whole joint laughing. (My favorite moment was when Paris blew up, and in the silence that followed, thinking no one could here me, I mumbled "Good" and the whole row in front of me died laughing--French hatred was pretty high even back then!)

It surprised me to see people bring young children to movie theaters as though it is cheaper than a baby sitter or a baby sitter is not available.

A major peeve with me!

I saw what looked like an entire family in the theater, including several young children, for the Matrix Reloaded (Unloaded) movie. This movie contained gratuitous frontal nudity and sex scenes that did not belong in or add to the movie. The mother and father did not seem to have any concern for their young children seeing these scenes. It is interesting to note that these nude and sex scenes, together with the excessively long (or looping?) fight scenes, filled out half a movie into a full-length movie. I felt cheated by the movie producer and as a result, did not see the third Matrix movie, and I did not buy the DVDs. Based on conversations I had with friends who saw the second and third Matrix movies, the two movies should have had half their footage cut out and the remainder made into one real, complete movie.

Ah, The Matrix Trilogy, I could go on and on about those. The third one DID have a great battle sequence, but this is probably the single most overrated cultural THING since Woody Allen movies.

57 posted on 07/19/2005 10:20:40 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Doctor Raoul
Here is another photo of the backwards Islamic society where women are forced to cover up all of their body, including their heads and faces with veils or burqas, and even their hands when possible.

Afghan women were beaten with sticks and clubs by Talaban "religious police" if they were caught outside their homes without covering the bodies with their burqas. Yet many leftists who claimed they support women's rights either failed to support or opposed the War Against Terrorism in Afghanistan.

Women with entire bodies including hands covered, and heads and faces covered by burqas, cross a market in Parwan Province, Afghanistan. Photo by Staff Sgt. Derrick C. Goode, USAF.

Women with entire bodies including hands covered, and heads and faces covered by burqas, cross a market in Parwan Province, Afghanistan.

Photo by Staff Sgt. Derrick C. Goode, USAF. (Click photo for screen-resolution image; high-resolution image available.)

Source: DefenseLINK Information presented on DefenseLINK is considered public information and may be distributed or copied unless otherwise specified. Use of appropriate byline/photo/image credits is requested.     http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Sep2002/n09272002_200209264.html

58 posted on 07/19/2005 10:27:19 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: Darkwolf377
Sometimes I end up seeing movies I don't want to see because other people I go with want to see them. Sometimes it is difficult to talk them out of a particular movie.

In other cases, we do not do our research, and become victims of what I call "audience ambush", where we are exposed to bad quality movies and/or in-your-face offensive themes, including leftist political propaganda and homo-centric characters and themes.

Election (1999) was a movie we both wanted to walk out on after only fifteen minutes. We looked at each other, and asked if it was going to get better. We made the unfortunate mistake of giving it some more time, and then even more time, and then we saw more than half the movie. After than, I felt it was a bit late to ask for a refund. However, that movie was so bad we should have asked for a refund.

The plot was incredibly bad, with no real beginning, middle, or end. It just plodded along. The acting was excellent, but could not rescue the plot.

The movie Election also committed "audience ambush" by including an unnecessary lesbian high school student, and a high school teacher having an affair with a student. The movie critics gave this movie very positive reviews, but, if I remember correctly, neglected to mention the gratuitous lesbian high school student and teacher having sexual relations with a student. Thus, an audience ambush resulted.

The movie included Reese Witherspoon as Tracy Flick, who is cute, but she is a flaming leftist and anti-gunner. She has been an outspoken advocate for firearm confiscation and is actively involved in the (Less Than) Million Mom March for firearm confiscation (which should have been dubbed DUMB, for Dangerous Uninformed Mommies Brigade).

Another bad movie resulting in "audience ambush" was The Crying Game (1992), where a heterosexual IRA terrorist falls in love with a woman that turns out to be a man with full accessories, that looks like an attractive woman (i.e., a cross-dresser or a partial transvestite). The terrorist is at first repulsed, and then overcomes the repulsion, falls in love with, and goes to prison for a crime committed by this other man.

Despite a bad plot and bad quality movie with highly offensive material, the movie critics gave The Crying Game very positive reviews, and covered up the homo-centric characters and themes, in order to ambush trusting and unsuspecting movie customers.

Many movies have political propaganda themes or are entire propaganda movies (e.g., the Michael Moore movies and others).

The movie industry is alienating more than half their audience and potential customers.

Because I am familiar with the leftist political agenda, the political propaganda in movies stands out, is distracting, and detracts from the quality of the movie.

Also, I will never watch another movie with Julia Roberts in it because of her bigoted statement, "Republican comes in the dictionary just after reptile and just above repugnant." I would keep remembering her statement while watching her on the screen.

Besides, I find her scrawny and unattractive, even when they try to doll her up. Michael Medved said that in Pretty Woman, they had to use a large number of body doubles for different parts of her body (I seem to remember twelve or more - don't ask me why so many).

59 posted on 07/19/2005 11:21:57 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: FraudFactor.com
I agree with so much of what you said--now get out there and get a movie critic's job!

I really enjoyed the other two movies by the director of Election (I wasn't offended, just bored--ditto The Snoring Game). About Schmidt and Sideways were very entertaining, though of course the latter had a ridiculous, blatant Bush-bash in it. But I just chuckle at how stupid these people are and move on. So to speak.

As for the liberalism of movie makers, my personal belief is that it's truly funny to hear all these liberal sentiments, these lessons on how to live with our fellow man, coming from people who live in gated communities with personal security details.

60 posted on 07/19/2005 11:25:29 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377
The problem I had with Terminator 3 was I felt cheated, because I expected that movie to be the last in the series - the War Against the Machines.

Instead, there was the long chase like in the previous two movies, but all the while I was waiting to see the War Against the Machines. Then in the end, I realized the producers strung me on for another movie.

This is how I felt watching the second Matrix movie (Matrix Reloaded (Unloaded), except that Terminator 3 was a good chase movie if you were not expecting to See the War Against the Machines.

BTW, I found it somewhat difficult to engage in voluntary suspension of disbelief with regards to the liquid metal terminator in Terminator 2. I had to force myself to pretend it could be possible, and then I really enjoyed the movie. Of course, the great special effects helped.

61 posted on 07/19/2005 11:31:59 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: FraudFactor.com
I really liked T3 but you're so right on the liquid metal thing. It's more like science 3000 years in the future. But this goes back to my point about movies not being logical--I mean, it was COOL. :) So Cameron thought of it (trying hard not to steal as he did on T1) and he didn't go "Hmm, this would look cool but it's too advanced..."

Movies and fiction are about emotion, first and foremost.

I didn't feel cheated because I'm so old by now (39) that I kind of get a feel for something I want to see and then don't look at previews, though I do read a lot about movies I don't know about yet or have already seen.

It's great reading your posts, btw, too bad there wasn't a FR movie corner. AICN is all about people screaming "YOu suck!" at each other, people who have no knowledge of movie history. I watched Rear Window three times this week, btw...

62 posted on 07/19/2005 11:38:51 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377
"I agree with so much of what you said--now get out there and get a movie critic's job!"

Thank you for the fine compliment!

"As for the liberalism of movie makers, my personal belief is that it's truly funny to hear all these liberal sentiments, these lessons on how to live with our fellow man, coming from people who live in gated communities with personal security details."

LOL - This is so true!

This reminds me of a radio talk show host who managed to get Cher on his show for an interview. It may have been Larry Elder on KABC, or perhaps Larry Marino on KRLA. She was spouting leftist nonsense that made her sound like a high school student. When she was challenged and debated, she could not respond in a coherent manner.

It was an obvious intellectual mismatch, and she was not used to being challenged in her normal interviews. It was clear that she had no idea how the average middle class or lower class person lives. She sounded like a spoiled brat! I believe she refused to come back on the show after that.

63 posted on 07/19/2005 11:49:07 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: Darkwolf377
"I watched Rear Window three times this week, btw...
Rear Window is one of the great Alfred Hitchcock movies.

Alfred Hitchcock

I also enjoyed North by Northwest and Frenzy. Frenzy was interesting but somewhat eerie.

Alfred Hitchcock created excellent movies with great suspense, often using symbolism (like the shadow of an arm holding a knife moving down on its victim), without all the modern special effects.

Although Psycho (1960) did have the graphic bloody shower scene. I guess the color of blood is one big difference between color and black and white movies.

64 posted on 07/20/2005 12:07:28 AM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: FraudFactor.com
Watch for a cameo appearance by Alfred Hitchcock when you watch one of his movies. Sometimes it is very brief. I don't know if he did this for all of his movies.

Alfred Hitchcock


65 posted on 07/20/2005 12:22:42 AM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: Darkwolf377
There isn't a net figure to find. The studios don't publish net figures. They charge a bookkeeping fee to themselves and recycle the accounting so movies never, or rarely, go into the black to people on the outside. They charge overhead to a movie's profits, they have all kinds of profit participation and distribution deals, and they charge THEM for the accounting--which the studio itself performs. They do this everytime they give an accounting to one of their participants, so the "profit" keeps dropping to the naked eye while the studio enjoys the profits.

It's one of the reasons why if you were to write a screenplay or act in a movie and are offered net points, you should laugh very hard, because you will never see them. And only a handful of people earn gross points. Spielberg is one of them, but he also owns Dreamworks, so technically his participation would cut into the net-except he's profitting.

Stop looking for the net; you won't find it.
Ditto!

A movie producer told me that in the movie business, you never accept a percentage of net profit - only a percentage of gross profit if you can get it, or a salary. They adjust, i.e., cook the books, so there is no net profit.

Maybe they find that convenient for income tax purposes. I wonder if they have really good lawyers and accountants that keep them legal, or if they think they are above the law.

66 posted on 07/20/2005 2:01:26 AM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: garjog
Speaking of treason ...

Excerpt from:

Las Vegas Tribune

Band of Half-Wit Brothers

Viewpoints column by Hugo J. Byrne
http://www.lavozdecubalibre.com/

Volume 6 Issue 17
November 26, 2004

http://www.lasvegastribune.com/20041126/viewpoints2.html

<snip>

Speilberg is not just a regular admirer of Fidel Castro. He has the highest regard for the Cuban tyrant. The director of "Saving Private Ryan" once spent a number of hours chatting with Castro in Havana as his guest of honor, and ever since he has done as much as anybody -in and out of Hollywood- to promote and propagandize the totalitarian agenda of the aging dictator.

Speilberg stated that his hours visiting with Castro were "the most important moments of his life." If we take that statement at face value, Castro's visit was more important to Spielberg than the time when his son was born and more intense occasion than those when he received awards for his artistic achievements. Could he be ignorant of the fact that he is befriending a Caribbean Hitler? How could anyone supposedly so sensitive to human suffering, feel that close to such a mass killer?

Worse, Speilberg knows for sure that Bin Laden is not the top terrorist in recent history. Castro long ago earned that dubious title, and Speilberg cannot claim ignorance of the fact. Had the Cuban despot got his way during the so-called "Missile" crisis of 1962, the loss of life and destruction in the United States would have made the tragedy of September 11 look like child's play. The record of Castro's vile wishes, confirmed by the former Soviet bosses, is at the same time horrendous and indisputable.

The only difference in fortunes between Bin Laden and Castro is that the Taliban demonstrated to be a much more reliable ally than The Soviet Union. The Afghan rulers, prime state terrorists themselves, backed Alqaeda to the bitter end. The entrenched Soviets, fat and corrupted to the core and with its own survival at stake, fortunately balked at Castro's extreme demands in 1962.

However, that undeniable fact is either ignored or purposely disregarded, not only by Speilberg, but also by almost every other Hollywood "celebrity." Many of them are in open political cahoots with the "Comandante."

<snip>

67 posted on 07/20/2005 2:30:06 AM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: FraudFactor.com
There is a book around, can't recall the title, about the Art Buchwald case against Paramount over their stealing his screenplay for Coming to America. The legal case blew the whole scam open and showed how the studios cook the books "legally" by charging fees for all kinds of things against their movie grosses.

People sometimes forget that the movie business is a business first. As Pauline Kael phrased it, "It's an artform run by businessmen." And as we see lately, not running it as well as they might.

68 posted on 07/20/2005 10:10:42 AM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377

Did you ever see Moon Zero Zero? That has to be in the top ten worst!


69 posted on 07/20/2005 11:07:43 AM PDT by ariamne (reformed liberal--Shieldmaiden of the Infidel)
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To: ariamne

I think it's Moon Zero Two, and it may be one of the worst, but the hottie Catherine Schell is in it, so it deserves to exist. :)


70 posted on 07/20/2005 11:14:20 AM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377

Ok, we'll let it exist! What did you think of "The Mole People?" Used to scare the bejezes out of me as a kid..

I loved The Day the Earth Stood Still, Crack in the World, and When Worlds Collide. What do you think?


71 posted on 07/20/2005 11:18:28 AM PDT by ariamne (reformed liberal--Shieldmaiden of the Infidel)
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To: ariamne
What did you think of "The Mole People?" Used to scare the bejezes out of me as a kid..

It's actually pretty bad--a classic Mystery Science Theater episode--BUT the actual Mole People are damned cool!

I loved The Day the Earth Stood Still, Crack in the World, and When Worlds Collide. What do you think?

I like TDTESS but was always turned off by it's bizarre message--stop fighting each other or we'll kill you all! Having said that, I loved the score by Bernard Hermann, the acting, and jsut the whole idea that it's a more intellectual, serious attempt at a SF film than most of the era.

CITW I saw so long ago I can't recall much.

WWC, which is being remade, was good but left out way too much material from the book. It's a pretty cheap movie, actually, but it uses its budget well. I always thought it was ahead of its time in daring to show the destruction of the planet, period, something most movies always avoided, though the actual end of the planet is disappointing. Also disappointing was the Candyland scene at the end, which I've learned wasn't intended to be the final matte painting but they used it anyway.

My particular faves of the pre-Star Wars era are (among others) The Time Machine, War of the Worlds, Forbidden Planet, Five, 2001, The Andromeda Strain, Colossus:The Forbin Project, Solaris (Russian), Omega Man, Planet of the Apes, Metropolis, The Shape of Things to Come, Magnetic Monster....I could be listing all day...

72 posted on 07/20/2005 11:28:32 AM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377
I could talk to you all day!! Gee, is there a Sci-fi fan thread?

I agree with most of your list: I really liked Colossus, the Forbin Project and Andromeda Strain. I try to talk movies on IMDB, but somehow I also end up fighting with a Bush-Basher or America-Basher no matter what the film is! I mean, we could be discussing the relative merits of Disney's Pochantos vs. the sequel, and someone will come up with an anti-American, anti-Bush tie-in.

By the way, when I first saw TDTESS, I was kind of young and didn't get it, but I clearly remember my grandmother being frustrated by the hypocrisy of the planets Klaatu represented--"curb your agression, you savage humans, or our robots will rip you a new one?"

Take care. It was fun.

73 posted on 07/20/2005 12:30:08 PM PDT by ariamne (reformed liberal--Shieldmaiden of the Infidel)
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To: Darkwolf377; ariamne

I really enjoyed the cold war era Colossus - The Forbin Project (1970).

It was an interesting and intelligent movie.

It introduced a great new theme and concept and may now "occupy the field" for those who remember it.

The only problem I have with it is that any new movie based on the same or a similar theme will be accused of copying Colossus - The Forbin Project, even though the concept is simple and can be independently conceived.

This is significant, because modern military technology has advanced to the point that armed unmanned aerial vehicles (e.g., Predators armed with Hellfire missiles) have already been used in the War on Terror, and in the future, one can envision unmanned naval and land military systems.

At some point, the technology may develop to the point that there will be fewer or no humans in the control loop of these fighting systems. For example if the control communication link with an unmanned aerial vehicle is lost, the vehicle must be capable of operating in an autopilot mode.

Although Colossus - The Forbin Project dealt with computer-controlled nuclear missile launchers, modern technology allows for much more than missile launchers and missiles to be remotely controlled by computers.

The fact that Microsoft has been lobbying hard and in many cases successfully to get its Windows operating system into embedded military weapons systems could itself be the subject of a science fiction/horror movie. And such a movie could even involve viruses!


General Atomics Aeronautical Systems, Inc. Rq-1 Predator Unmanned Aerial Vehicle (UAV) armed with two Hellfire missiles
General Atomics Aeronautical Systems, Inc.
Rq-1 Predator Unmanned Aerial Vehicle (UAV)
armed with two Hellfire missiles

http://www.ga.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=983174400&archive=&start_from=&ucat=&

74 posted on 07/20/2005 4:02:53 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: Darkwolf377
There is a book around, can't recall the title, about the Art Buchwald case against Paramount over their stealing his screenplay for Coming to America. The legal case blew the whole scam open and showed how the studios cook the books "legally" by charging fees for all kinds of things against their movie grosses.

People sometimes forget that the movie business is a business first. As Pauline Kael phrased it, "It's an artform run by businessmen." And as we see lately, not running it as well as they might.

Thanks for the great info. I am interested in reading that book.

Based on an Amazon.com search, the book must be the following one:

Fatal Subtraction: The Inside Story of Buchwald V. Paramount by Pierce O'Donnell, Dennis McDougal

The Editorial Reviews states:

"Though O'Donnell and McDougal focus on procedural aspects and the courtroom drama, they blow the lid off the major Hollywood studios's sleazy accounting practices, which have enabled them to deprive creative talent of millions of dollars in royalties by claiming that top-grossing films earned zero net profits."
I won't hold my breath for Hollywood to make a movie out of this book, even though it would probably make a great movie!

75 posted on 07/20/2005 4:16:56 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: FraudFactor.com

Yes, that's the book, check it out--a terrific education for folks on how Hollywood manages to keep afloat when so many movies appear to make no money.


76 posted on 07/20/2005 8:27:47 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: FraudFactor.com

The basic idea behind Colossus has been around for a long time, at the very least since Capek's R.U.R. (which was where the word "robots" originated) or even Frankenstein, which I believe was an acknowledged influence on the novel writer. Not to mention 2001's HAL and Forbidden Planet's Krell underground being audio/visual influences.


77 posted on 07/20/2005 8:29:32 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: ariamne

Thanks, I enjoyed the chat. It is hard to talk movies on the net, politics always comes in and many artistically inclined people are kneejerk libs, so what can ya do?


78 posted on 07/20/2005 8:30:28 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377; FraudFactor.com

Although not in the same categories as the movies previously mentioned, weren't the Terminator movies based on this concept as well?


79 posted on 07/21/2005 6:20:14 AM PDT by ariamne (reformed liberal--Shieldmaiden of the Infidel)
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To: ariamne; FraudFactor.com
Although not in the same categories as the movies previously mentioned, weren't the Terminator movies based on this concept as well?

The real inspiration for the Terminator movies appears to be a couple of sources, both of which reveal the, ah, "depth" of Cameron's creativity.

A couple of months back a woman won a huge settlement in court against the makers of both The Matrix and Terminator franchises.

http://www.terminatorfiles.com/?id=1764&arch=1

And back in the 80's, writer Harlan Ellison successfully sued Cameron because Cameron ripped off some of Ellison's concepts from two Outer Limits episodes. One part of the setllement resulted in Ellison's name being slapped on the end credits in a very obvious way; I haven't seen the DVD but in the home video, his name really sticks out because it was added after all the other credits were done.

80 posted on 07/21/2005 10:15:34 AM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377
Very interesting stuff.

Do you by any chance know which Outer Limits episodes were considered to have been ripped off? I LOVED Outer Limits, many of the episodes were pretty cool even by today's standards. I used to have horrible nightmares after watching it as a kid. Of particular note: the episode where a whole neighborhood is beamed to another planet; the man with the glass hand who was being chased by beings from the future; one where everyone and thing is standing stock still; one where a man has spent the past thirty years inside a camera.

As for Cameron--well, what is there to say about someone who produces a film where the Christians are the bad guys and the Muslims are the innocent victims "we just want to live in peace!"

81 posted on 07/21/2005 11:13:54 AM PDT by ariamne (reformed liberal--Shieldmaiden of the Infidel)
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To: ariamne
The episodes were "Soldier" and "Demon With A Glass Hand," easily my favorite of the show's run. I have the first season on DVD and want the second, even though it's not as good a season as #1.

What was great about Outer Limits was that it was a melding of SF and horror. The percentage of good episodes is a lot higher than Twilight Zone, which has dated badly.

82 posted on 07/21/2005 11:35:11 AM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: ariamne; Darkwolf377

Yes, the Terminator movies were based on computer-controlled unmanned military vehicles/systems that were infected with a computer virus and got out of control.

This is somewhat similar to, yet different than the Cold War era Colossus - The Forbin Project (1970). In Colossus - The Forbin Project, a U.S. defense computer system named Colossus controls the U.S. nuclear missiles and can launch them automatically when it believes the U.S. is under attack. A communication link is temporarily established between Colossus and the communist Soviet Union counterpart defense computer system, named Guardian, which controls the Soviet nuclear missiles. Colossus and Guardian share classified information and communist ideology before the communication link is disconnected.

Colossus demands that the communication link be reestablished, under threat of initiating a nuclear missile exchange with the Soviet Union. The link is reestablished, and the two computers take over, lock out humans from disabling their systems, and control the world by threatening to nuke cities in the the U.S. and the Soviet Union if the humans do not follow their orders.

83 posted on 07/21/2005 2:44:03 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: FraudFactor.com
In Terminator, once Skynet comes online it links up with the Soviet computer and becomes self-aware and all that, too, so it's VERY similar to Colossus. The computer-controlled vehicle element is just a small part of that.

All SF ideas come out of OTHER SF ideas, that's just a simple fact. But Terminator simply appropriated other ideas without really doing anything different. Cameron could have used his noggin a little and without touching the concept of the terminators come up with a more original backstory for them; instead he's revealed as a thief.

84 posted on 07/21/2005 3:04:35 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call Osama guilty without a trial, but DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377

Thank you again for your excellent insights.

85 posted on 07/26/2005 8:28:51 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: FraudFactor.com

Hey FF how goes it? Any movie watching? :D


86 posted on 07/26/2005 9:01:06 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call UBL guilty without a trial, but thinks DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377

It's going pretty well.

I am considering seeing Mr. & Mrs. Smith, except that it features Brad Pitt, another Hollywood leftist, who is married to a nasty leftist, actress Jennifer Aniston. Aniston refers to President Bush using the F-word, and may have actually converted Pitt into a leftist.

Then again, I may pass on this movie and remain true to my principles, and not help enrich these bigoted Hollywood leftist freaks.

A quick movie database search revealed another movie, Mr. and Mrs. Smith (1941), a comedy directed by Alfred Hitchcock.

I am considering seeing Fantastic Four.

87 posted on 07/26/2005 11:56:50 PM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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To: FraudFactor.com
The Hitchcock Mr and Mrs Smith was actually Hitchock's only attempt at a "straight" movie, a kind of comedy. (His other semi-comedy was the black comedy The Trouble With Harry.) A friend said the Pitt/Jolie movie was fun junk, and he suggested I see it, but he knows I think Angelina is hot.

Pitt earned my disdain when he and Anniston encountered Jenna Bush, who was all agog at seeing this big star. This was not long after the drinking incident, in which she tried to buy booze with a fake I.D. Instead of saying something nice to a girl who was all flustered at seeing a star he said "Hey, you want a drink? I got some beer in the truck."

What a jerk.

88 posted on 07/27/2005 12:06:26 AM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Dean won't call UBL guilty without a trial, but thinks DeLay and Rove should be in jail)
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To: Darkwolf377

I agree with your comments on Angelina Jolie and Brad Pitt.

89 posted on 07/27/2005 3:10:53 AM PDT by FraudFactor.com (Support redistricting reform to end gerrymandering and achieve more honest and responsive government)
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