Huckabee Endorsement 'Only If' All Illegals Out

worldnetdaily.com ^ | December 16, 2007 | Jerome R. Corsi

[kellynla]

The founder of the Minuteman Project says his endorsement of Republican presidential candidate Mike Huckabee is a conditional one – based on a tough understanding of the former governor's "Secure America Plan" to oust all illegal aliens, or put them behind bars.

"Huckabee's plan would force all illegal immigrants to leave the United States within 120 days, or be arrested," Jim Gilchrist told WND in an exclusive interview.

When asked why he thought illegal immigrants would voluntarily deport themselves, as Huckabee's plan requires, Gilchrist said, "If you start arresting illegal aliens and start take away all their social welfare benefits, the illegal aliens won't have a choice except to leave."

Gilchrist further indicated illegals under Huckabee's proposal may have to wait years before they were allowed to re-enter.

"The illegal immigrants will not be allowed back into the United States until they are legally allowed re-entry," he said, "even if that takes years."

"Nothing I can find in Huckabee's plan indicates he is going to let the illegal immigrants back into the country the next day after they go home," Gilchrist continued. "The illegal aliens, once they are back home, will have to stand in line with everybody else and apply for legal entry at the end of the line."

However, when pressed on how he'd react if Huckabee's plan turned out to provide for quick re-entry, Gilchrist ceased his praise.

"If, in fact, there is no standing in line and waiting for legal entry, I would have a serious reservation about endorsing Huckabee," he said.

WND questioned Gilchrist how Huckabee's "Secure America Plan" differed from the suggestion Rep. Mike Pence, R-Ind., had advanced unsuccessfully during the 109th Congress, requiring illegal aliens to repatriate with so-called "Ellis Island Centers" before applying for legal immigration to the United States.

[kellynla]

ping

[cripplecreek]

Well Jimmy, don’t be surprised if the Huckster changes his mind when he no longer needs your endorsement.

[kellynla]

Gilchrist said, “If you start arresting illegal aliens and start take away all their social welfare benefits, the illegal aliens won’t have a choice except to leave.”

WRONG!

MS-13 is in 42 states and expanding. And they don’t care if you’re illegal!

Deportation is the final solution!

[claudiustg]

“Th-th-th-that’s all folks!”

[woodb01]

I'm as died in the wool conservative as they come.  HARD CORE and can EASILY prove my credentials.  However, on the illegal immigration issue there is a MASSIVE problem.  With an unemployment rate around 4%, one of the lowest in the free world, and an estimated 11 - 20 MILLION illegals, you can NOT simply do a massive deportation of illegals without an economic catastrophe. 

So, I propose the following:  An IMMEDIATE registration of ALL illegals, and a doubling of nearly every citizenship requirement.  IMMEDIATE ineligibility for all social welfare programs of any kind.  Period.  Without exception.  Any of the illegals who is caught that does not go through the registration process is immediately cataloged, DNA'd, pictured, fingerprinted, and sent across the border and FOREVER banned from re-entering the country.  If they are discovered, then their entire family is forever banned from ever coming to the country.  If they commit ANY crime in the U.S., while illegal, then they are eligible for capital punishment.

SOMETHING has to be done, but wholesale deportation is not the answer.  As much as I would like to see that, the economic fallout of immediate deportation of 11-20 MILLION from the U.S. economy would lead to catastrophic hyperinflation.

[kellynla]

“you can NOT simply do a massive deportation of illegals without an economic catastrophe”

Bravo Sierra

All those jobs could be filled immediately by American citizens(although at LEGAL wages) There are millions of AMERICAN teenagers and legal aliens who could & would fill those jobs. Of course the employers would have to pay the going wages!

[org.whodat]

don’t be surprised if the Huckster changes his mind when he no longer needs your endorsement.

He has already changed his mind

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,316253,00.html.

never trust the huck

HUCKABEE: Well, I don't think there's an inconsistency. When I said a pathway, I didn't say what the pathway was.

[org.whodat]

What is you sign on at DU?

[dufekin]

Termination of employment is most effective against the least harmful subgroup of illegal immigrants. We need to secure the border FIRST. Don’t deport people to the other side of the border and watch helplessly as they—especially the worst among them—scurry back to America.

[Grunthor]

“Bravo Sierra”

Damn straight.

[cripplecreek]

The whole border issue is complicated and requires more than one single thing to fix it. A fence is great but we still need to stop luring them here. Gang members will likely need to be removed by force and it will probably be violent since they’ve laid claim to territory.

[dufekin]

Huckabee’s “plan” is a nullity. We don’t seriously enforce immigration law beyond designated ports of entry during operating hours and sporadically along the border. Most immigrants already choose the “illegal” path over the “legal” path because of the relative benefits. So there’s no reason to believe that they’d opt into the legal immigrant path until and unless that path becomes easier and more accessible.

[kellynla]

“Want a Wal-Mart job? Join the crowd
11,000 apply for 400 openings at retailer’s new Oakland store”
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2005/08/17/MNGDPE91AH1.DTL

And Mao-Mart starts off their hourly new employees at MINIMUN WAGES!

[dufekin]

If you want to stop luring illegal immigrants, then you’d better sign on to global-warming propaganda. If we implode our economy (while not requiring “developing” countries to do likewise), then our suddenly deeply depressed newly third-world economy won’t lure many economic migrants. I personally prefer to secure the border to block illegal immigrants physically and to create a simple, easily comprehensible, speedy, relatively inexpensive legal immigration process.

[kellynla]

“to create a simple, easily comprehensible, speedy, relatively inexpensive legal immigration process?”

no need to “create” something that we already have.

U.S. Citizenship & Naturalization Process
http://www.uscitizenship.info/ins_citizenship_process.htm

Lawful Permanent Residence (”Green Card”)
http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.eb1d4c2a3e5b9ac89243c6a7543f6d1a?vgnextoid=4f719c7755cb9010VgnVCM10000045f3d6a1RCRD&vgnextchannel=4f719c7755cb9010VgnVCM10000045f3d6a1RCRD

what you apparently have failed to realze is that these people are not interested in or may not even be able to stay here legally because they are CRIMINALS!

And employers who hire illegals are only interested in hiring illegals because they don’t have to pay them the going wage and abide by labor laws & restrictions.

[Travis McGee]

Huckster has already clarified his "120 days and out" plan.

Seems all theinvaders have to do is make a "touchback," and in a matter of "hours or days, not weeks" they'll be approved to come right back in, for their road to amnesty.

[woodb01]

YOU WROTE:

What is you sign on at DU?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Okay, I half anticipated that. So, without further delay, let me introduce myself:
http://www.nodnc.com/modules.php?name=Content&pa=showpage&pid=259

Or, how about this (ALL U.S. House testimonials on various conservative issues):
http://www.nodnc.com/modules.php?name=Content&pa=list_pages_categories&cid=21

Or, how about this (numerous legal briefs challenging the anti-family / gay agenda in courts):
http://www.nodnc.com/modules.php?name=Content&pa=list_pages_categories&cid=12

OR, best of all, how about the ANTI-DEMOCRAT site I've maintained until I don't have time to keep it going anymore:
http://www.nodnc.com/index.php

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Now, before you continue shooting the messenger, how about asking for some credentials on economics, culture, and social structure...

[cripplecreek]

no need to “create” something that we already have.

No kidding, we've had guest worker programs for all of my 43 years. The OBL pushes the "We need programs" fantasy in hopes that no one will call them on it and point out that we already have "programs" that business wants to sidestep.

I grew up in an area of Michigan where root crops like potatoes, onions and carrots were grown. We had migrants arrive every year for harvest. They were on some kind of two year rotation. Two years in the USA following the crops then back to Mexico for 6 months or a year.

The simple fact is that business doesn't want legal migrant workers. Legal migrant workers will always be more expensive than illegal workers.

[org.whodat]

Now, before you continue shooting the messenger, how about asking for some credentials on economics, culture, and social structure...

Don't need to I have my own!

[kellynla]

Exactly.

And yours truly, worked his way through high school and college unloading produce trucks & boxcars.

So anyone who says that if illegals were deported it would affect the American dramatically is FULL OF IT!

And, as we all know, summer vacations for children were originally given so they could help on the farms with the harvest.

[cripplecreek]

I picked my share of rocks out of the fields when I worked on the dairy farm. There isn’t any more menial labor than that.

[woodb01]

BULL CRAP! This is NOT a “business wants it” issue. This is a DEMOCRAT PARTY WANTS IT issue. While I do not agree with the immediate deportation of all illegals, I do agree with VERY HARSH measures and some type of orderly deportation.

The DEMOCRATS want illegals to help them in the culture war; dividing the country, bankrupt America through growth of the welfare state, and to buy their votes.

BUSINESS (across the board like the MARXISTS preach) doesn’t want illegals. DEMOCRATS want illegals. Unfortunately, now that we have so many here that are economy IS dependent on, there does need to be an orderly change.

The border fence, and RIGID BORDER ENFORCEMENT is a first step in the right direction...

[cripplecreek]

I’m impressed with your usage of the caps key but not much else.

[EternalVigilance]

"If, in fact, there is no standing in line and waiting for legal entry, I would have a serious reservation about endorsing Huckabee," he said.

But Jim! You already endorsed him.

[woodb01]

No problem, then let me spell it out a little more clearly... Lose the Marxist, National Socialist, Anti-Capitalist, left-leaning megalomania belief that the state is god...

[cripplecreek]

No problem, then let me spell it out a little more clearly... Lose the Marxist, National Socialist, Anti-Capitalist, left-leaning megalomania belief that the state is god...

Yes daddy. ROFLMAO

[Man50D]

"The Huckabee plan has a 120-day window for all illegal aliens to turn themselves in and repatriate to their homeland,"

How about strictly enforcing the existing Federal Immigration and Nationality Act that doesn't provide any window Governor?

Federal Immigration and Nationality Act

Section 8 USC 1324(a)(1)(A)(iv)(b)(iii) Recruitment and Employment of Illegal Aliens Encouraging and Harboring Illegal Aliens Enforcement RICO —Citizen Recourse Tax Crimes Comment

Section 8 USC 1324(a)(1)(A)(iv)(b)(iii) "Any person who . . . encourages or induces an illegal alien to . . . reside . . . knowing or in reckless disregard of the fact that such . . . residence is . . . in violation of law, shall be punished as provided . . . for each illegal alien in respect to whom such a violation occurs . . . fined under title 18 . . . imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both."

Section 274 felonies under the federal Immigration and Nationality Act, INA 274A(a)(1)(A):

A person (including a group of persons, business, organization, or local government) commits a federal felony when she or he:

· assists an illegal alien s/he should reasonably know is illegally in the U.S. or who lacks employment authorization, by transporting, sheltering, or assisting him or her to obtain employment, or · encourages that illegal alien to remain in the U.S. by referring him or her to an employer or by acting as employer or agent for an employer in any way, or · knowingly assists illegal aliens due to personal convictions. ·

Penalties upon conviction include criminal fines, imprisonment, and forfeiture of vehicles and real property used to commit the crime. Anyone employing or contracting with an illegal alien without verifying his or her work authorization status is guilty of a misdemeanor. Aliens and employers violating immigration laws are subject to arrest, detention, and seizure of their vehicles or property. In addition, individuals or entities who engage in racketeering enterprises that commit (or conspire to commit) immigration-related felonies are subject to private civil suits for treble damages and injunctive relief.

Recruitment and Employment of Illegal Aliens

It is unlawful to hire an alien, to recruit an alien, or to refer an illegal alien for a fee, knowing the illegal alien is unauthorized to work in the United States. It is equally unlawful to continue to employ an illegal alien knowing that the illegal alien is unauthorized to work.

It is unlawful to hire any individual for employment in the United States without complying with employment eligibility verification requirements. Requirements include examination of identity documents and completion of Form I-9 for every employee hired. Employers must retain all I-9s, and, with three days' advance notice, the forms must be made available for inspection. Employment includes any service or labor performed for any type of remuneration within the United States, with the exception of sporadic domestic service by an individual in a private home. "Day laborers" or other casual workers engaged in any compensated activity (with the above exception) are employees for purposes of immigration law. An employer includes an agent or anyone acting directly or indirectly in the interest of the employer. For purposes of verification of authorization to work, employer also means an independent contractor, or a contractor other than the person using the illegal alien labor.

The use of temporary or short-term contracts cannot be used to circumvent the employment authorization verification requirements. If employment is to be for less than the usual three days allowed for completing the I-9 Form requirement, the form must be completed immediately at the time of hire.

An employer has constructive knowledge that an employee is an illegal unauthorized worker if a reasonable person would infer it from the facts. Constructive knowledge constituting a violation of federal law has been found where (1) the I-9 employment eligibility form has not been properly completed, including supporting documentation, (2) the employer has learned from other individuals, media reports, or any source of information available to the employer that the alien is unauthorized to work, or (3) the employer acts with reckless disregard for the legal consequences of permitting a third party to provide or introduce an illegal alien into the employer's work force. Knowledge cannot be inferred solely on the basis of an individual's accent or foreign appearance.

Actual specific knowledge is not required. For example, a newspaper article stating that ballrooms depend on an illegal alien work force of dance hostesses was held by the courts to be a reasonable ground for suspicion that unlawful conduct had occurred.

It is illegal for nonprofit or religious organizations to knowingly assist an employer to violate employment sanctions, regardless of claims that their convictions require them to assist illegal aliens. Harboring or aiding illegal aliens is not protected by the First Amendment. It is a felony to establish a commercial enterprise for the purpose of evading any provision of federal immigration law. Violators may be fined or imprisoned for up to five years.

Encouraging and Harboring Illegal Aliens

It is a violation of law for any person to conceal, harbor, or shield from detection in any place, including any building or means of transportation, any illegal alien who is in the United States in violation of law. Harboring means any conduct that tends to substantially facilitate an alien to remain in the U.S. illegally. The sheltering need not be clandestine, and harboring covers aliens arrested outdoors, as well as in a building. This provision includes harboring an alien who entered the U.S. legally but has since lost his legal status.

An employer can be convicted of the felony of harboring illegal aliens who are his employees if he takes actions in reckless disregard of their illegal status, such as ordering them to obtain false documents, altering records, obstructing INS inspections, or taking other actions that facilitate the alien's illegal employment. Any person who within any 12-month period hires ten or more individuals with actual knowledge that they are illegal aliens or unauthorized workers is guilty of felony harboring. It is also a felony to encourage or induce an alien to come to or reside in the U.S. knowing or recklessly disregarding the fact that the alien's entry or residence is in violation of the law. This crime applies to any person, rather than just employers of illegal aliens. Courts have ruled that "encouraging" includes counseling illegal aliens to continue working in the U.S. or assisting them to complete applications with false statements or obvious errors. The fact that the alien is a refugee fleeing persecution is not a defense to this felony, since U.S. law and the UN Protocol on Refugees both require that a refugee must report to immigration authorities without delay upon entry to the U.S.

The penalty for felony harboring is a fine and imprisonment for up to five years. The penalty for felony alien smuggling is a fine and up to ten years' imprisonment. Where the crime causes serious bodily injury or places the life of any person in jeopardy, the penalty is a fine and up to twenty years' imprisonment. If the criminal smuggling or harboring results in the death of any person, the penalty can include life imprisonment. Convictions for aiding, abetting, or conspiracy to commit alien smuggling or harboring, carry the same penalties. Courts can impose consecutive prison sentences for each alien smuggled or harbored. A court may order a convicted smuggler to pay restitution if the illegal alien smuggled qualifies as a victim under the Victim and Witness Protection Act. Conspiracy to commit crimes of sheltering, harboring, or employing illegal aliens is a separate federal offense punishable by a fine of up to $10,000 or five years' imprisonment.

Enforcement

A person or entity having knowledge of a violation or potential violation of employer sanctions provisions may submit a signed written complaint to the INS office with jurisdiction over the business or residence of the potential violator, whether an employer, employee, or agent. The complaint must include the names and addresses of both the complainant and the violator, and detailed factual allegations, including date, time, and place of the potential violation, and the specific conduct alleged to be a violation of employer sanctions. By regulation, the INS will only investigate third-party complaints that have a reasonable probability of validity. Designated INS officers and employees, and all other officers whose duty it is to enforce criminal laws, may make an arrest for violation of smuggling or harboring illegal aliens.

State and local law enforcement officials have the general power to investigate and arrest violators of federal immigration statutes without prior INS knowledge or approval, as long as they are authorized to do so by state law. There is no extant federal limitation on this authority. The 1996 immigration control legislation passed by Congress was intended to encourage states and local agencies to participate in the process of enforcing federal immigration laws. Immigration officers and local law enforcement officers may detain an individual for a brief warrantless interrogation where circumstances create a reasonable suspicion that the individual is illegally present in the U.S. Specific facts constituting a reasonable suspicion include evasive, nervous, or erratic behavior; dress or speech indicating foreign citizenship; and presence in an area known to contain a concentration of illegal aliens. Hispanic appearance alone is not sufficient. Immigration officers and police must have a valid warrant or valid employer's consent to enter workplaces or residences. Any vehicle used to transport or harbor illegal aliens, or used as a substantial part of an activity that encourages illegal aliens to come to or reside in the U.S. may be seized by an immigration officer and is subject to forfeiture. The forfeiture power covers any conveyances used within the U.S.

RICO —Citizen Recourse

Private persons and entities may initiate civil suits to obtain injunctions and treble damages against enterprises that conspire to or actually violate federal alien smuggling, harboring, or document fraud statutes, under the Racketeer-Influenced and Corrupt Organizations (RICO). The pattern of racketeering activity is defined as commission of two or more of the listed crimes. A RICO enterprise can be any individual legal entity, or a group of individuals who are not a legal entity but are associated in fact, and can include nonprofit associations.

Tax Crimes

Employers who aid or abet the preparation of false tax returns by failing to pay income or Social Security taxes for illegal alien employees, or who knowingly make payments using false names or Social Security numbers, are subject to IRS criminal and civil sanctions. U.S. nationals who have suffered intentional discrimination because of citizenship or national origin by an employer with more than three employees may file a complaint within 180 days of the discriminatory act with the Special Counsel for Immigration-Related Unfair Employment Practices, U.S. Department of Justice. In addition to the federal statutes summarized, state laws and local ordinances controlling fair labor practices, workers compensation, zoning, safe housing and rental property, nuisance, licensing, street vending, and solicitations by contractors may also apply to activities that involve illegal aliens.

Comment:

A comment and a published quote by Robert Gaffney, Attorney and County Executive of Suffolk County, LI, NY:

The statutory foundation of United States immigration law has always been the jurisdiction of the federal government, Congress and the federal courts. The preeminent laws concerning the employment of illegal aliens are found in the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. §~ 1101-1503), as amended by the Immigration Reform and Control Act of 1986 CIRCA).

The law states it is a crime to assist an illegal alien who lacks employment authorization by referring him to an employer, or by acting as his or her employer, or as an agent for an employer. 8 U.S.C.S. § 1324a(a)(1)(A) (Lexis 1997). Furthermore, it is unlawful to hire an individual for employment without complying with the employment eligibility requirements for every person hired. 8 U.S.C.S. § 1324a(a)(l)(B) (Lexis 1997). Moreover, conduct tending substantially to facilitate illegal aliens remaining in the United States illegally, where there is knowledge or a reckless disregard of an illegal alien s unlawful status, is a crime, with escalating penalties, encompassed within the provisions of 1324. 8 U.S.C.S. § 1324(a)(l)(A)(iii) (Lexis 1997); United States v. Kim. 193 F-3d 567 (2d Cir. 1999), are considered employees for purposes of immigration law.

[nickcarraway]

That’s what they said about ending child labor.

[Travis McGee]

SOMETHING has to be done, but wholesale deportation is not the answer. As much as I would like to see that, the economic fallout of immediate deportation of 11-20 MILLION from the U.S. economy would lead to catastrophic hyperinflation.

First of all, nobody sane has said there could or would ever be "immediate deportation of 11-20 MILLION." That is Teddy Kennedy's "20,000 buses lined up to the north pole" silly straw man. When you pose that straw man, we know you are an ally of Teddy Kennedy. The invaders will self-deport over time when the welcome mat and free social services are cut off. ICE just needs to keep the pressure on, not charter 20,000 buses at one time.

But to your larger point about needing the illegals to support our economy.

Number one: How did the USA become an economic superpower over the first 3/4 of the 20th century without 12 to 20 million illegal aliens? Americans built the bridges, dams, highways and skyscrapers.

Number two: that "the economy will collapse without them" line is the same argument made by supporters of slavery and child labor. We got rid of both, and did just fine.

[Kimberly GG]

“Nothing I can find in Huckabee’s plan indicates he is going to let the illegal immigrants back into the country the next day after they go home,” Gilchrist continued”

Good grief Jim. Just because it wasn’t written in the plan...the one you reviewed and approved...doesn’t mean that hasn’t been part of Huckabee’s plan all along!! READ BETWEEN THE LINES....with ALL candidates (Do ANY of them actually admit to being FOR amnesty???)!!! Besides, only when recently pressed on the issue, Huckabee admitted it could be only days before they are able to return. You jumped the gun Jim and I certainly hope that when you finally understand that Huckabee’s is a TOUCH BACK scheme, you will LOUDLY, CLEARLY, AND PUBLICLY take back your endorsement!!!

[woodb01]

Anyon concerned about immigration should focus on one step at a time. For example, let’s build the fence FIRST, and then maintain the borders...

It would be patently STUPID and a waste of taxpayer money and time to deport any illegal, just to have them turn around and walk right back across the border.

If you want to focus on an issue that will have DRAMATIC impacts, focus on demanding that Congress BUILD THAT FENCE NOW!!! And PROTECT THE BORDERS NOW!