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Berg V Obama: Appeal Denied
The Kansas Citian ^ | Nov. 1, 2008 | thekansascitian

Posted on 11/01/2008 1:55:10 PM PDT by thekansascitian

Lots of news on Barack Obama's citizenship status.

First, the third circuit court of appeals has rejected Philip J. Berg's appeal. The judge in the case upheld the lower court ruling on Berg's lack of standing.

DENIED. For the reasons ably expressed by the District Court —and not addressed in Plaintiff-Appellant’s Emergency Motion— it appears that Plaintiff-Appellant lacks standing to challenge Senator Barack Obama's candidacy for the Presidency of the United States. Accordingly, Plaintiff-Appellant has not shown a likelihood of success with respect to his appeal.

A similar case in Ohio has been tossed out. The judge ruled the onus of proof is on the plaintiff to prove Obama is not a natural-born citizen and not on Obama to prove he is.

“The onus is upon one who challenges such public officer to demonstrate an abuse of discretion by admissible evidence – not hearsay, conclusory allegations or pure speculation,” Hasselbach wrote in his decision .

David M. Neal, the plaintiff, wrote on his website that when he enrolled his child in public school he had to produce a birth certificate for his son to prove eligibility... "[Barack Obama] is running for president of the United States." the implication being the applicant bore the onus to prove citizenship and not the school to prove non-legal status.

Finally, the Associated Press is reporting that Hawaii officials declared Barack Obama's birth certificate as genuine. But that's not exactly what the Hawaii officials said.

Dr. Chiyome Fukino said today she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama's original birth certificate.

A statement of fact of which we already knew. The question is not whether they have his original certificate, but whether that certificate indicates he was actually born in the U.S. and not born the child of a Hawaiian citizen abroad. The latter of which is what has been alleged by Philip J. Berg based on an eyewitness account of Obama's birth in Kenya from his paternal grandmother.

We know Dr. Fukino did not actually see Obama's birth certificate, because "she says state law bars release of a certified birth certificate to anyone who does not have a tangible interest." Emphasis added.

If Barack Obama ultimately wins on Tuesday, this issue is not going to go away without the official "vault" birth certificate being produced. Arguments that the people do not have standing to enforce the Constitution sets a dangerous president and requiring challengers to bear the burden of proof when the Constitution specifically requires natural-born status of presidential candidates creates a constitutional crisis that patriots simply can not allow.

Of course this entire issue would go away if Barack Obama would simply authorize the release of the document. Why does he continue to fight this issue and not just put it to rest?


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Conspiracy; Government; Politics
KEYWORDS: barackobama; bergvobama; certifigate; citizenship
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1 posted on 11/01/2008 1:55:11 PM PDT by thekansascitian
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To: thekansascitian

Didn’t Hawaii just release his BC????


2 posted on 11/01/2008 1:56:47 PM PDT by SkyDancer ("I Believe In The Law Until It Interferes With Justice")
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To: SkyDancer

NO!


3 posted on 11/01/2008 1:58:08 PM PDT by ScaniaBoy (Part of the Right Wing Research & Attack Machine)
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To: SkyDancer

No, They sealed it.


4 posted on 11/01/2008 1:58:21 PM PDT by FR_addict
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To: thekansascitian

It sure appears as though Americans not longer have “standing” in our “courts.” I guess illegal aliens and Islamofascist terrorists took up all the “standling” places.


5 posted on 11/01/2008 1:58:35 PM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (I'm voting for McCain/Palin so I can look my grandchildren in the eyes when I tell them I'm sorry.)
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To: thekansascitian

Put a fork in it, this one’s done.


6 posted on 11/01/2008 1:59:58 PM PDT by bigbob
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To: thekansascitian

who the hell has standing then? the FEC? It is ridiculous that a citizen does not have standing to ensure that the person running for the presidency is qualified.

To have standing you must suffer a definite and substantial harm, and it must be reperable only by the action sought. I don’t see how making sure that the leader of a democratic (well technically democratic-republic) system is answerable to his citizens does not constitute a harm, nor how making him present the BC does not fix it

and no, HI didn’t release anything. What they said doesn’t mean anything.


7 posted on 11/01/2008 2:00:25 PM PDT by wrhssaxensemble
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To: wrhssaxensemble

There are three constitutional standing requirements:

Injury: The plaintiff must have suffered or imminently will suffer injury - an invasion of a legally protected interest which is concrete and particularized. The injury must be actual or imminent, distinct and palpable, not abstract. This injury could be economic as well as non-economic.

Causation: There must be a causal connection between the injury and the conduct complained of, so that the injury is fairly traceable to the challenged action of the defendant and not the result of the independent action of some third party who is not before the court. Massachusetts v. Environmental Protection Agency (global warming caused by EPA’s refusal to regulate carbon dioxide emissions satisfied element of causation for Massachusetts’s alleged injury of loss of coastland).

Redressability: It must be likely, as opposed to merely speculative, that a favorable court decision will redress the injury.


8 posted on 11/01/2008 2:01:32 PM PDT by wrhssaxensemble
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To: thekansascitian
Just make sure you're not between Biden & a microphone on November 5th if there's any truth to Berg's allegations.
9 posted on 11/01/2008 2:03:12 PM PDT by GoLightly
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To: thekansascitian

A little late on old news. It’s being appealed to the Supreme Court.


10 posted on 11/01/2008 2:04:09 PM PDT by Red Steel
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To: thekansascitian
The judge ruled the onus of proof is on the plaintiff to prove Obama is not a natural-born citizen and not on Obama to prove he is.

The XX Amendment Section 3 says, "if the President elect shall have failed to qualify". That tells me that once a person has been elected to be President, then it is incumbent on the President elect to prove he is Constitutionally qualified.

Perhaps that's when he can be challenged and forced to prove he is qualified.

11 posted on 11/01/2008 2:04:55 PM PDT by savedbygrace (SECURE THE BORDERS FIRST (I'M YELLING ON PURPOSE))
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To: thekansascitian
The American public is not amused at the judicial claim that no American has any right
to question, or investigate, an obvious non-American Communist, friend of terrorists, seizing the office of POTUS.


12 posted on 11/01/2008 2:05:00 PM PDT by Diogenesis (Igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum)
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To: wrhssaxensemble

The FEC already weighed in and said they don’t have standing. Apparently we the people no longer have a say in making sure our constitution is upheld.

No fears, the politburo is making the right choices for us comrades.


13 posted on 11/01/2008 2:05:01 PM PDT by cripplecreek (Paying taxes for bank bailouts is apparently the patriotic thing to do. [/sarc])
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To: cripplecreek

Hmmm any idea why the FEC disavowed it? what is the point of it if not to enforce the election laws?


14 posted on 11/01/2008 2:06:39 PM PDT by wrhssaxensemble
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To: thekansascitian

How can a person verify something if they have not seen it?

That does not make sense.

Obama needs to release his bc. McCain has. We should not elect a person to be POTUS if they can not prove they are a citizen of the US.

The courts are wrong. They should be held accountable.


15 posted on 11/01/2008 2:08:14 PM PDT by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote.)
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To: Red Steel

Too bad they won’t reach a decision in time. I wonder if (assuming they grant the case cert) they will then dismiss it because it is considered moot, or if they will view it more generally and approach the issue of who has standing to question a candidate’s qualifications and then remand it to the district court. I would imagine the first would happen rather than the second, but the second would provide a very interesting constitutional question.


16 posted on 11/01/2008 2:08:34 PM PDT by wrhssaxensemble
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To: wrhssaxensemble

I don’t reacall what reason the FEC gave but I think they said that their interest is mostly in the financial aspects of electoral law. (Not that they’re doing much there either)


17 posted on 11/01/2008 2:08:40 PM PDT by cripplecreek (Paying taxes for bank bailouts is apparently the patriotic thing to do. [/sarc])
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To: wrhssaxensemble

To clarify, they would only remand if they find a citizen like Berg has standing. Otherwise they would just dismiss it.


18 posted on 11/01/2008 2:09:41 PM PDT by wrhssaxensemble
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To: FR_addict

Just read here that it was said to be legal ....
State Verifies Obama’s Birth Certificate
KITV ^

Posted on Saturday, November 01, 2008 12:35:01 PM by okb Free Republic


19 posted on 11/01/2008 2:09:57 PM PDT by SkyDancer ("I Believe In The Law Until It Interferes With Justice")
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To: Diogenesis

>The American public is not amused at the judicial claim that no American has any right
to question, or investigate, an obvious non-American Communist, friend of terrorists, seizing the office of POTUS.

don’t know about you, but this part of “We the people” is more than a little PO’d about this insult being hurled into our faces from someone who is, supposedly, sworn to uphold the US Constitution.


20 posted on 11/01/2008 2:09:58 PM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: ScaniaBoy

State Verifies Obama’s Birth Certificate
KITV ^

Posted on Saturday, November 01, 2008 12:35:01 PM by okb
Free Republic ....


21 posted on 11/01/2008 2:10:28 PM PDT by SkyDancer ("I Believe In The Law Until It Interferes With Justice")
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To: FlingWingFlyer

Since this is a government rep, he has standing according to some of the arguments that have been floated around here:

“After Obama, McCain rulings, PA state rep. wants presidential candidates to prove citizenship”

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2120318/posts


22 posted on 11/01/2008 2:11:35 PM PDT by Red Steel
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To: OneWingedShark

seriously though, with so many cases that have come up since the 60’s, how many do you really think are based on the constitution? seems too many of them are based on “prenumbras” and other nonsense. Heck, even a lot of pro-choicers concede there is no right to abortion in the constitution per se but support Roe v. Wade anyways. Been a while (excluding some justices like Scalia) that the higher courts have actually applied the constitution.


23 posted on 11/01/2008 2:13:37 PM PDT by wrhssaxensemble
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To: SkyDancer
From the article that started this thread:

“Finally, the Associated Press is reporting that Hawaii officials declared Barack Obama’s birth certificate as genuine. But that's not exactly what the Hawaii officials said.

Dr. Chiyome Fukino said today she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama’s original birth certificate.

A statement of fact of which we already knew. The question is not whether they have his original certificate, but whether that certificate indicates he was actually born in the U.S. and not born the child of a Hawaiian citizen abroad. The latter of which is what has been alleged by Philip J. Berg based on an eyewitness account of Obama’s birth in Kenya from his paternal grandmother.”

Nothing else! You are all being mushroomed - kept in the dark and fed sh-t.

24 posted on 11/01/2008 2:15:17 PM PDT by ScaniaBoy (Part of the Right Wing Research & Attack Machine)
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To: ScaniaBoy

I am probably missing something, but would they have it if he was not born in the US? just not sure how the protocol goes


25 posted on 11/01/2008 2:16:24 PM PDT by wrhssaxensemble
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To: SkyDancer

Still no original, typewritten birth certificate has been produced.

One which would indicate the hosptial, doctor’s signature, parent’s birth place, religion and marriage status, baby footprint and witness signature...

What hospital was he born at again? His sister says one hospital, he says another.

Obama still needs to prove he is eligible for POTUS.

And again where are his college records, his passport records, his Socialist party records, his IRS and medical records?

WE DON’T KNOW WHO THIS MAN EVEN IS...


26 posted on 11/01/2008 2:16:26 PM PDT by IreneE (Live for nothing or die for something.)
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To: OneWingedShark

It is more likely that a civil war is coming than the DOJ
and the Judicary uphold the US Constitution.


27 posted on 11/01/2008 2:17:09 PM PDT by Diogenesis (Igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum)
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To: IreneE

Line 3 (Citizenship) Indonesia
Line 4 (Religion) Islam

28 posted on 11/01/2008 2:18:11 PM PDT by Diogenesis (Igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum)
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To: wrhssaxensemble
I am not an expert. What I know I've read on FR and other sites. Apparently you can (or could) apply for a certificate even if the child was born abroad. However, in that case the country of birth would be noted.

If Obama was born in Kenya, then one can understand why he would find it embarrassing to release the certificate.

29 posted on 11/01/2008 2:20:26 PM PDT by ScaniaBoy (Part of the Right Wing Research & Attack Machine)
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To: thekansascitian

“dangerous president”

tongue-in-cheek pun or just another bloviating blog goof?


30 posted on 11/01/2008 2:23:39 PM PDT by Vn_survivor_67-68 (CALL CONGRESSCRITTERS TOLL-FREE @ 1-800-965-4701)
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To: Diogenesis

Obama has a special kind of arrogance. It’s the arrogance of a man who has never done anything so has never faced failure.

I’m thinking it’s time to humble his marxist ass.


31 posted on 11/01/2008 2:24:31 PM PDT by cripplecreek (Paying taxes for bank bailouts is apparently the patriotic thing to do. [/sarc])
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To: wrhssaxensemble

I have low expectations expecting SCOTUS to ignore it. I agree the second possibility you mentioned would be interesting ...that could prevent another Obama constitutional problem from happening again.


32 posted on 11/01/2008 2:27:23 PM PDT by Red Steel
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To: IreneE

Yeah, that’s what Charlie Rose and Tom Brokaw were discussing the other day. “Who is this guy” ... kinda late if you ask me ....


33 posted on 11/01/2008 2:28:00 PM PDT by SkyDancer ("I Believe In The Law Until It Interferes With Justice")
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To: SkyDancer

The State verified that they have Obama’s BC, not anything about what’s on it. In Hawaii, a birth occurring in another country to a resident of Hawaii can be registered on an original BC. Such a BC will however show the placed of birth as that foreign country, not some city in Hawaii.


34 posted on 11/01/2008 2:28:26 PM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: ScaniaBoy
Bring on the pitchforks and torches .... who is this guy??????
35 posted on 11/01/2008 2:29:02 PM PDT by SkyDancer ("I Believe In The Law Until It Interferes With Justice")
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To: SkyDancer
Didn’t Hawaii just release his BC????

No they just verified that they have it. They did not say anything about its contents.

36 posted on 11/01/2008 2:29:45 PM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: El Gato

So what happens if he gets in office and his real BC turns up and he’s not a US citizen?????


37 posted on 11/01/2008 2:29:55 PM PDT by SkyDancer ("I Believe In The Law Until It Interferes With Justice")
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To: Diogenesis

>It is more likely that a civil war is coming than the DOJ
and the Judicary uphold the US Constitution.

I think you are correct, sir. Though it’s ironic that if the DOJ & Judiciary were interested in Justice (you know, their jobs) that would likely not be the case.


38 posted on 11/01/2008 2:32:58 PM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: SkyDancer
Bring on the pitchforks and torches .... who is this guy??????

Nobody knows!

This from another thread on Obama's documentation:

1. Occidental College records — Not released

2. Columbia College records — Not released

3. Columbia Thesis paper — ‘not available’

4. Harvard College records — Not released

5. Selective Service Registration — Not released

6. Medical records — Not released

7. Illinois State Senate schedule — ‘not available’

8. Law practice client list — Not released

9. Certified Copy of original Birth certificate — Not released

10. Embossed, signed, paper Certification of Live Birth — Not released

11. Harvard Law Review articles published — None

12. University of Chicago scholarly articles — None

13. Record of baptism— Not released or ‘not available’

14. Illinois State Senate records—’not available’

39 posted on 11/01/2008 2:33:10 PM PDT by ScaniaBoy (Part of the Right Wing Research & Attack Machine)
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To: Red Steel

Yeah, I don’t expect them to grant cert either... but who knows with Roberts and Alito there now


40 posted on 11/01/2008 2:35:24 PM PDT by wrhssaxensemble
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To: SkyDancer
If it is found out before the electoral college makes its decision the situation can be (partially) saved. If it is after he has been sworn in you and all of us are so scr-w-d. It will be a constitutional disaster like no other since the Civil War.

And this happens to the only super power in the world. A nightmare worthy of the best of fiction writers.

41 posted on 11/01/2008 2:37:04 PM PDT by ScaniaBoy (Part of the Right Wing Research & Attack Machine)
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To: thekansascitian

“... OF the people, BY the people, FOR the people”

Lawsuit to extract a birth certificate from Obama : NO STANDING

Lawsuit to propagate maximum whining after bitter election loss: BRING THEM IN

Hypocrites will be called on judgment day. Faith in Jesus Christ the Son of God will save you.


42 posted on 11/01/2008 2:37:08 PM PDT by ROTB (Our Constitution [is] for a [Christian] people. It is wholly inadequate [for] any other. -John Adams)
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To: ROTB; All

“... OF the people, BY the people, FOR the people”

Lawsuit to extract a birth certificate from Obama : NO STANDING

Lawsuit to propagate maximum whining after bitter election loss: BRING THEM IN

Hypocrites will be called on judgment day. Faith in Jesus Christ the Son of God will save you.


43 posted on 11/01/2008 2:37:53 PM PDT by ROTB (Our Constitution [is] for a [Christian] people. It is wholly inadequate [for] any other. -John Adams)
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To: ScaniaBoy

Well he could be brought up on fraud charges and all those people who helped hide the fact, you think????


44 posted on 11/01/2008 2:39:15 PM PDT by SkyDancer ("I Believe In The Law Until It Interferes With Justice")
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To: thekansascitian

Unbelievable.

So anyone can prance to the Oval Office and say “Prove it” when challenged.

How do you prove a negative?

I am disgusted and disheartened by this.


45 posted on 11/01/2008 2:43:15 PM PDT by autumnraine (Churchill: " we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall never surrender")
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To: SkyDancer

He would have to be impeached, but with a Dim Congress and Senate, who knows. However, all of the laws he would signed could be disputed in the courts, the military would not have to heed his command, and foreign nations would not know whether his signature on any agreement carried any value what so ever.

The consequences would be grim. (I think this is the reason why the courts shy away. They really do not want to touch this issue.)


46 posted on 11/01/2008 2:43:57 PM PDT by ScaniaBoy (Part of the Right Wing Research & Attack Machine)
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To: IreneE
First ever black....er...Kenyan president.
47 posted on 11/01/2008 2:44:43 PM PDT by Churchillspirit
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To: thekansascitian

If Barack Obama ultimately wins on Tuesday, this issue is not going to go away without the official “vault” birth certificate being produced.


Actually it may not become a real issue until he is officially elected by the electors in Dec. or is sworn in Jan. 09. At that point he maybe in violation of the Constitution if he is in fact not elgible to be president. Is there anything in the Constitution or Statutes that keeps an unqualified person from running for the presidency?.....

You don’t mention the Berg Esq. appeal to the SCOTUS, why? Also do you have any info on the videos that he was going release over a week ago?


48 posted on 11/01/2008 2:53:35 PM PDT by deport ( ----Cue Spooky Music---)
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To: wrhssaxensemble

The FEC only gets involved if the Candidate takes Public Financing. How convenient for Barack.


49 posted on 11/01/2008 2:56:12 PM PDT by autumnraine (Churchill: " we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall never surrender")
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To: autumnraine

>The FEC only gets involved if the Candidate takes Public Financing. How convenient for Barack.

This whole campaign is too convenient for Barak.


50 posted on 11/01/2008 3:00:17 PM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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