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10th Amendment Power- Montana Tells Feds To Leave Montana's Guns Alone
secondamendmentfreedom.blogspot.com/ ^ | 05/11/09 | Sasparilla

Posted on 05/11/2009 8:04:29 AM PDT by Sasparilla

The tentacles have been cut off the Federal gun regulation octopus in the Big Sky State. The gun law is a gloves off slap in the face of the Federal Government and gun control groups. The Bradys are apoplectic once again. Montana exercised its 10th Amendment state sovereignty as the Governor signed a law that exempts guns, accessories such as magazines, silencers, and ammunition made in the state of Montana from all Federal firearms regulation. The guns and ammunition can't leave the state of Montana, and all guns made there must have "Made In Montana" stamped on them. There are no background checks, no serial numbers, and no paperwork.

The state believes that since the Montana made guns don't cross state lines, then they are immune to all Federal Interstate commerce law's regulation. The state believes that just as the second amendment's "well regulated" militia, doesn't refer to the National Guard, which was created a hundred or so years after the second Amendment was written, regulation of interstate commerce doesn't apply because nothing travels interstate between the states. Montanans believe that when the State was admitted to the Union that the Second Amendment was a contract between the State, The people, and the United States and that it guaranteed the right to keep and bear arms.

The Montana firearms industry isn't big. There are just a few specialty gun makers there, and a few that make western re-creations. But, of course the implications are huge. Alaska and Texas are considering similar legislation. Colonel Travis would be proud of Texas. The state will go and further will arrest any Federal agents in Montana who try to enforce Federal gun law over Montana made guns and ammo.

Losing any power is not in politician's blood, especially in the Obama administration. This law...

(Excerpt) Read more at secondamendmentfreedom.blogspot.com ...


TOPICS: Politics
KEYWORDS: 10thamendment; banglist; guncontrol; statesrights
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1 posted on 05/11/2009 8:04:29 AM PDT by Sasparilla
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To: Sasparilla

Big Sky Bump...


2 posted on 05/11/2009 8:12:34 AM PDT by Iscool (I don't understand all that I know...)
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To: Sasparilla

Does anyone remember Viki Weaver ?


3 posted on 05/11/2009 8:12:58 AM PDT by BlueMoose
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To: Sasparilla

A farmer once thought that a few acres of grain that he grew for personal consumption didn’t count as “interstate commerce”.

The Supreme Court showed him the error of his ways in no time.

Unfortunately.
I see a repeat of this odious reasoning.
The manufacture of guns in Montana will reduce the demand for guns manufactured elsewhere, and will not be tolerated.


4 posted on 05/11/2009 8:14:29 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: Sasparilla

5 posted on 05/11/2009 8:14:51 AM PDT by Vaquero ("an armed society is a polite society" Robert A. Heinlein)
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To: Sasparilla
Awesome, this is a def. win for the states.
6 posted on 05/11/2009 8:16:43 AM PDT by aureliusss (who is John Galt?)
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To: Sasparilla
Fantastic. Lets hope this goes to the majority of the States. The Feds will do everything they can to hurt Montana now and this might be the start of a real revolution.
7 posted on 05/11/2009 8:17:57 AM PDT by Logical me (Oh, well!!!)
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To: SJSAMPLE
The Supreme Court showed him the error of his ways in no time.

Unfortunately.
I see a repeat of this odious reasoning.
The manufacture of guns in Montana will reduce the demand for guns manufactured elsewhere, and will not be tolerated.

we are on the cusp of a civil war. If the feds, the supremes or whoever try to take away basic rights it will be time that Jefferson spoke off to refresh the tree of liberty....

8 posted on 05/11/2009 8:18:07 AM PDT by Vaquero ("an armed society is a polite society" Robert A. Heinlein)
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To: Sasparilla

The Big Sky state has given the big middle finger salute to the feds.

Way to go Montana !!!!!


9 posted on 05/11/2009 8:22:06 AM PDT by NeverForgetBataan
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To: Sasparilla

We’ve now set the stage for a solid “keep” challenge for RKBA: a native Montanan buys a “made in Montana” item (suppressor or SBR if they really want to stir things up), then moves - taking the item with him - to another state which by local law has no problem with him owning it.


10 posted on 05/11/2009 8:24:04 AM PDT by ctdonath2 (John Galt was exiled.)
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To: Sasparilla

Now I would LOVE to see the Montana state and local police start arresting federal agents when they try to enforce these laws, with a few (dozen) extra cracks of the baton because they were “resisting”. Then give the same treatment to any federal judge that would approve these warrants. That would be a day to celebrate!


11 posted on 05/11/2009 8:31:04 AM PDT by apillar
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To: Vaquero

It is now only a matter of where the first actual shots will be fired. They have already been figuratively fired.


12 posted on 05/11/2009 8:33:29 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: NeverForgetBataan
"The Big Sky state has given the big middle finger salute to the feds."

However this turns out I think you've pointed out the most valuable part of it. Anything that promotes a general attitude of suspicion and contempt for the leviathan federal government we now have is a good thing.

Speaking for myself, I've pretty much learned my lesson(s) over the past two decades, and even if 'conservatives' take the federal reins back, I'll never trust (or respect) it again. This isn't to say that the local yokels are any more 'virtuous' either, but they might be a little easier to watch and control.

13 posted on 05/11/2009 8:37:33 AM PDT by VR-21 (The election of Barack Obama was a hate crime.)
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To: SJSAMPLE

“A farmer once thought that a few acres of grain that he grew for personal consumption didn’t count as “interstate commerce.”

Wickard v. Filburn, 1942

The effect of that decision is that Congress may regulate a purely local activity if the cumulative effect of such activitiy is that it would have a substantial effect on interstate commerce.

What is the likelihood that this will be overturned in the near future?


14 posted on 05/11/2009 8:39:49 AM PDT by preacher (A government which robs from Peter to pay Paul will always have the support of Paul.)
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To: ctdonath2

I don’t know - some states have no problem with MGs, SBRs,
SBSs, sound suppressors, etc as long as they are held in accordance with Federal laws, and say so in their statues.

Taking an item across state lines to such a state would invite trouble unless the states were to reword their
law such that the items in question were to be unconditionally permitted with reference to Federal law.


15 posted on 05/11/2009 8:43:18 AM PDT by rahbert
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To: rahbert

“without reference to Federal Law”


16 posted on 05/11/2009 8:44:35 AM PDT by rahbert
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To: rahbert

Some states have no problem with those, and don’t even say federal compliance is required.


17 posted on 05/11/2009 8:48:06 AM PDT by ctdonath2 (John Galt was exiled.)
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To: BlueMoose
Does anyone remember Viki Weaver ?

Vicki Weaver didn't have state and local law enforcement backup.

18 posted on 05/11/2009 8:48:10 AM PDT by Centurion2000 (We either Free America ourselves, or it is midnight for humanity for a thousand years.)
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To: preacher

The issue is that there is no natural nor Constitutionally-clear dividing line between “substantial” and “unsubstantial”. And the feds like it that way.


19 posted on 05/11/2009 8:52:10 AM PDT by ctdonath2 (John Galt was exiled.)
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To: BlueMoose

Absolutely. What a horrible thing to have happened.
Way to go Mr.Reno!


20 posted on 05/11/2009 8:54:13 AM PDT by gimme1ibertee (For the sake of our Republic....RAISE HOLY HELL!)
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To: Sasparilla
Montana would do well to push their native son Dirk Benedict (former star of Battlestar Galactica / A-Team) into politics. I've read his book Confessions of a Kamikaze Cowboy and have heard his semi-regular appearances on the Rusty Humphries show, as well as his occasional columns at Breitbart's Big Hollywood. He's very much the embodiment of the classic American rugged individual and would make a great spokesman for our side...


21 posted on 05/11/2009 8:56:30 AM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Sasparilla
"The Montana firearms industry isn't big."

This may change in the future with a ruling like this. Also, I would think for anyone to challenge this in court, they would have to have some sort of standing to do so.
22 posted on 05/11/2009 8:56:45 AM PDT by Old Teufel Hunden
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To: ctdonath2
We've got some pretty good gun manufacturers here in VA..
..Alas,with the present governor and the blue state of affairs in the northern part of the state,it is not to be....
yet.
23 posted on 05/11/2009 8:58:19 AM PDT by gimme1ibertee (For the sake of our Republic....RAISE HOLY HELL!)
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To: VR-21
Anything that promotes a general attitude of suspicion and contempt for the leviathan federal government we now have is a good thing.

Obama doesn't have what it takes for my opinion of him to improve to "suspicion and contempt".

24 posted on 05/11/2009 9:02:07 AM PDT by TurtleUp (Turtle up: cancel optional spending until 2012, and boycott TARP/stimulus companies forever!)
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To: Old Teufel Hunden

The entire state of Montana has fewer than 1 million residents. The market is rather small. However, I have two friends who are on police forces in Montana - they will gladly arrest a federal agent!


25 posted on 05/11/2009 9:03:34 AM PDT by JD91
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To: Vaquero
Have you noticed the phrase at the end of the Second Amendment that says “Shall not be infringed”. The Democrats keep missing that.
26 posted on 05/11/2009 9:14:14 AM PDT by ANGGAPO (Leyte Gulf Beach Club)
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To: preacher
The effect of that decision is that Congress may regulate a purely local activity if the cumulative effect of such activitiy is that it would have a substantial effect on interstate commerce.

True, but as we all know, the ruling itself was faulty. The Supreme Court is not omnipotent! Congress (and not the SC) can REGULATE interstate commerce, but that commerce must first occur. Things in a state that have any effect on interstate commerce are none of the feds business, only the states.

Return power to the states where it belongs. The state legislature is (or should be) more responsive than some distant bureaucratic behemoth government.

27 posted on 05/11/2009 9:15:28 AM PDT by jeffc (They're coming to take me away! Ha-ha, hey-hey, ho-ho!)
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To: TurtleUp
Obama doesn't have what it takes for my opinion of him to improve to "suspicion and contempt".

Roger that. Were I talking about Obama alone, I would have thrown in the words "revulsion." I was talking about the politicians and the legions of bureaucrats who lord over us presently.


28 posted on 05/11/2009 9:17:23 AM PDT by VR-21 (The election of Barack Obama was a hate crime.)
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To: ctdonath2

There is however a clear difference between commerce and interstate commerce. The courts decision is erroneous because there is a reason that interstate commerce is labeled that. It is not the same as commerce in general, and the courts decision ignores the difference.


29 posted on 05/11/2009 9:20:24 AM PDT by ResponseAbility (Government tends to never fix the problems it creates in the first place)
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To: Joe 6-pack

I am familair with Dirk’s body of work, and respect his ability, but I just can’t condone a man coloring his hair......


30 posted on 05/11/2009 9:29:52 AM PDT by I Buried My Guns (I just hope CW2 comes before my creaky knees give out completely!)
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To: Vaquero
That's already past due. First shots have already been fired.

But, Lost is on and people just can't be bothered right now...

31 posted on 05/11/2009 9:30:43 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (III)
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To: I Buried My Guns
"I just can’t condone a man coloring his hair......"

Hey...Even Reagan was known to hit the bottle from time to time...


32 posted on 05/11/2009 9:32:04 AM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Sasparilla

So will it be the job of the state to ensure none of their domestically manufactured firearms leave the state? How will they do that?


33 posted on 05/11/2009 9:35:12 AM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: preacher

That was my favorite bit of case law during my MBA program.

That convoluted thinking made me glad I chose business school over law school. To this day, I cannot have a reasoned argument with the lawyers in my family or my lawyer friends. Every damned one of the suborns logic to “precedent”.

Basically, the retarded kid turns in his test first, and from that point on, 1+1=7.

Go figure.


34 posted on 05/11/2009 9:38:37 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: Joe 6-pack

He’s a friggin’ crybaby.
He can’t stand it that the new Battlestar Galactica outshines the old campy shit by several orders of magnitude.
He’s written several editorials about it, and he’s never come off good.


35 posted on 05/11/2009 9:40:25 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: SJSAMPLE

bump .... stealing that example for use in later debates. :)


36 posted on 05/11/2009 9:43:21 AM PDT by Centurion2000 (We either Free America ourselves, or it is midnight for humanity for a thousand years.)
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To: SJSAMPLE
I disagree....he can't stand it that the old Battlestar has been feminized beyond recognition, and it's just a symptom of society at large. Not sure if this is one of the editorials to which you refer, but I think he's right...

"Lt. Starbuck...Lost in Castration"

37 posted on 05/11/2009 9:46:45 AM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Sasparilla
You go, Montana!

Here's one resident of the despicable Gay State, Massachusetts, who'll wager that MA's national politicians will be working overtime to 'protect the children' from Montana giving the Feds the finger here while simultaneously working the same in reverse to give the nation our stinky finger of homo marriage.

Of course, the hypocrisy of it all will be lost on the great thinkers like Kennedy, Markey, Frank, and the other MA arsehole politicians that blight Washington.

38 posted on 05/11/2009 9:52:53 AM PDT by Lovely-Day-For-A-Guinness (Eenie meanie, chili beanie, the spirits are about to speak....)
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To: Joe 6-pack

He’s just mad that the new Starbuck is more manly than anything he ever did. Prancing about with a Cheshire grin doesn’t cut it with a more intellectual audience. It’s about more than selling toys.

More gritty.
More violent.
Better story.
Better acting (not even close).

No friggin “Boxie” or a robotic dog.
No genius big-headed kid.

As I said, better by FAR.
And he just can’t take it.


39 posted on 05/11/2009 9:53:57 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: Sasparilla
All this and yet.....three of the top four elected officials in the state are filthy RATS.I just don't get it.
40 posted on 05/11/2009 9:56:55 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Christian+Veteran=Terrorist)
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To: SJSAMPLE
We shall have to disagree...while you enjoy the new show, I tend to agree with Benedict's assessment of it...

"...a show of despair, sexual violence and family dysfunction. To better reflect the times of ambiguous morality in which we live, one would assume. A show in which the aliens (Cylons) are justified in their desire to destroy human civilization, one would assume. Indeed, let us not say who the good guys are and who the bad are. That is being “judgmental,” taking sides, and that kind of (simplistic) thinking went out with Margaret Thatcher and Ronald Reagan and Kathryn Hepburn and John Wayne and, well, the original “Battlestar Galactica.”

41 posted on 05/11/2009 10:10:43 AM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Joe 6-pack

Dirk Benedict wants us to return to a show that NOBODY would watch. It would produce nothing but laughter - as did the original series.

I like both the humans and the cylons in the new series, and have to actually think about which group is “right” at a particular time.
Imagine that. The “bad guys” have an actual grievance and wrestle with the morality of their acts.

Benedict knows that his character and performance only work if you suspend credible thinking and accept one side as the ONLY side. People want to think, and his “Galactica” required none of that.

And, throwing around Margaret Thatcher, Ronald Reagan and John Wayne doesn’t work either. Little more than name-dropping to try to force an incoherent point.

Families can be dysfunctional. I know this.
Former slaves can harbor resentment. Not a giant leap there.

Margaret Thatcher and Ronald Reagan weren’t “simplistic”, they were committed. Benedict doesn’t seem to understand this.


42 posted on 05/11/2009 10:42:40 AM PDT by SJSAMPLE
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To: Non-Sequitur

“So will it be the job of the state to ensure none of their domestically manufactured firearms leave the state? How will they do that?”

Nope, its up to the individual to keep the products in the state of Montana. Venture outside the state with them and you are Fed bait.


43 posted on 05/11/2009 10:59:34 AM PDT by Sasparilla
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To: Gaffer
It is now only a matter of where the first actual shots will be fired.

It takes a lot of will and self sacrifice to defeat an army and I think you give waaaaay too much credit to the people of this nation. Going back to the Vietnam era this country will not rise up and take up arms in facing a modern military force. The test of this was the gun grab after Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans. If anybody could be expected to shoot back you'd think it'd be them thar CAJUNS but noooooo they all rolled over.

A lot of folks talk FROM MY COLD DEAD HANDS but when they face a crystal nacht midnight raid from a SWAT team for their guns with MP5s pointed at the heads of their kids, they'll do what the generations of public school grads have been well taught: They will submit with a mere whimper.

Randy Weaver was as good as his word in this respect. What did it get him. A dead wife. A dead son a dead dog and a court case. He won rthe court case but those loved ones are still dead. Did the rest of the populace RISE UP to help? Nope, we all watched as the goons in government and their federal gestapo were built up as heroes by the mass media as the poor citizen (Weaver) was vilified and isolated. Cut off he had one choice: Surrender. That it took the most decorated Special Forces Officers of the Vietnam era was significant. Bo Gritz negotiated the surrender but after the cost in lives had already been paid.

Talk is cheap. Deeds not words.

44 posted on 05/11/2009 11:27:51 AM PDT by ExSoldier (Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb voting on dinner. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.)
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To: ExSoldier

While I agree largely with you. Times such as now and yet-to-come are not ordinary. You will begin to see the smart ones go quiet. You also presume that the ‘Army’ will abet what is likely to come. At some point a difficult decision spurred by strife will occur. It is then we will see if our soldiers really value freedom and liberty over obedience. People do not even come close to realize what is happening now, but they will...


45 posted on 05/11/2009 11:59:34 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: Sasparilla

46 posted on 05/11/2009 12:17:25 PM PDT by wastedyears (Iron Maiden's gonna get ya, no matter how far!)
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To: NeverForgetBataan
The Big Sky state has given the big middle finger salute to the feds.

I would characterize it more as the scene in Braveheart where the Scots moon the English army at Stirling Bridge. IOW, a prelude to armed conflict.

47 posted on 05/11/2009 1:27:54 PM PDT by Charles Martel ("Endeavor to persevere...")
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To: VR-21
Great pic. Those aren't cockroaches, tho' -- they're giant water bugs.

I've been bitten by them a couple times; here in Florida we have the 4-inch long variety. Nasty critters.

48 posted on 05/11/2009 6:01:31 PM PDT by Joe Brower (Sheep have three speeds: "graze", "stampede" and "cower".)
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To: Joe Brower
I appreciate the correction Joe. I was given the pic by another FReeper who thought I offended snakes when I used this to illustrate my opinion of the United States Congress.


49 posted on 05/11/2009 6:11:59 PM PDT by VR-21 (The election of Barack Obama was a hate crime.)
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To: Non-Sequitur
So will it be the job of the state to ensure none of their domestically manufactured firearms leave the state? How will they do that?

Not at all. The law simply says "Montana citizen, IF you keep a Montana made weapon in state, the following federal infringements do not apply to you....". Obviously if a person takes such a weapon out of state, whatever happens is beyond the scope of this law.

50 posted on 05/11/2009 8:54:29 PM PDT by Still Thinking (If ignorance is bliss, liberals must be ecstatic!)
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