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Obama - Maybe a Citizen of the United States But Not a Natural Born Citizen
http://puzo1.blogspot.com/2010/03/obama-maybe-citizen-of-united-states.html ^ | March 4,2010 | Mario Apuzzo

Posted on 03/05/2010 4:25:45 AM PST by Spaulding

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Mario Apuzzo has written the most authoritative, until the Supreme Court acts, history of natural born citizenship in our Constitution yet provided, filled with dozens of references. All the hidden documents, the birth certificates, the passport records, the school enrollment records, are Obama's version of transparency, and likely a waste of time pursuing. Mr. Apuzzo has explained the evidence our legislators would like to forget, the evidence and the legal support with which only Obama acolytes will argue - and their arguments will be lies or misdirection. Barack Obama is ineligible to serve as president and Mr. Apuzzo has explained why. This will be the truth even if a corrupt judiciary avoids the political turmoil a decision will bring. If they avoid it, they are presiding over the destruction of our republic, and will demonstrate that their powers are no longer separate, but ceremonial - which may explain Chief Justice Robert's difficulty in presiding over the oath of allegiance. Allegiance was the issue for our founders' insertion of natural born citizenship into our Constitution, and Obama's allegiance, as he told us all along, was derived from the dreams he inherited from his father, the Marxist British Subject.
1 posted on 03/05/2010 4:25:45 AM PST by Spaulding
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To: Spaulding

bump for later


2 posted on 03/05/2010 4:28:33 AM PST by knarf (I say things that are true ... I have no proof ... but they're true)
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To: knarf

This will become the scandal of the CENTURY...someday. He’ll be in the history books alright. I just hope it’s not as the LAST PRESIDENT of the U.S.


3 posted on 03/05/2010 4:30:17 AM PST by Huebolt (Democrat = (national socialist) = NAZI)
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To: NewJerseyJoe

P4L


4 posted on 03/05/2010 4:31:43 AM PST by NewJerseyJoe (Rat mantra: "Facts are meaningless! You can use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!")
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To: Huebolt

I’m wondering if Obama NOT producing a Long Form Birth Certificate is going to be a Constitutional Crisis that alters the country forever.

Something stinks here, for certain.

Imagine how much of a laughing stock America will be if we’re found to have an undocumented, ineligible in our nation’s highest office?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64b_pwlrY7A

You can save this video with free software

http://download.cnet.com/Orbit-Downloader/3000-2071_4-10600926.html


5 posted on 03/05/2010 4:38:09 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, John 11:25, 14:6, 1 Tim 2:5, John 3:17-18, John 20:31, 1 John 5:13, John 6:69)
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To: Spaulding


6 posted on 03/05/2010 4:44:04 AM PST by Man50D (Fair Tax, you earn it, you keep it! www.FairTaxNation.com)
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To: Spaulding

Good info with mid-terms coming up.


7 posted on 03/05/2010 4:47:56 AM PST by real_patriotic_american
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To: F15Eagle

***Imagine ............. if we’re found to have an undocumented, ineligible in our nation’s highest office?***

This explains why no-one in political office, credible journalism and think tanks are making public statements or inquiry.

If, for instance: His mother was a white Kenyan, descended from European royalty and his father a black American descendent of George Washington Carver - his full life story would be a television series on the order of ROOTS.


8 posted on 03/05/2010 4:51:17 AM PST by sodpoodle (Despair - Man's surrender. Laughter - God's redemption.)
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To: Spaulding
and likely a waste of time pursuing.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Well?....There are two ways to pluck a duck: In the courts and Public Pressure.

Since I am not an attorney, I can't comment on whether or not there will be legal success in getting Obama to disclose documents.

However...If it weren't for the publicity generated by Taitz, Berg, and the other lawsuits, few in our nation would even know that Obama had a problem with natural born citizenship.

In the best case scenario, Obama will be revealed. He will be arrested for massive fraud, and be put in prison for a long time. I doubt that he would be turned over to a military tribunal and tried and executed for treason.

A likely scenario is that he will not run in 2012, and for evermore all candidates for president and vice president will be under state law and public pressure to prove their natural born citizenship.

9 posted on 03/05/2010 4:52:10 AM PST by wintertime (Good ideas win! Why? Because people are not stupid!)
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To: jersey117

Bookmark


10 posted on 03/05/2010 4:56:04 AM PST by jersey117
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To: Spaulding
I propose going back in time and having the founding fathers insert the following addition:

"...and may not be islamic, a fraud, a Chicago street thug and bagman for a criminal political entity, a drunk, a user of crack, a liar, a Marxist, a socialist, a communist, a fascist, a mulatto, a punk, an arrogant son-of-a-bitch, a racist, and a person bent on the destruction of the United states of America."

11 posted on 03/05/2010 5:00:49 AM PST by Doc Savage (SOBAMP!)
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To: Spaulding

Seems to me that this whole game of hiding all his information and obama not settling this is just a game of “In your face, we won. What are you going to do about it?” So judges have blocked the lawsuits to reveal who this guy is, but at some point the truth will leak out. Maybe at some point the dimrat party will have enough of this joker and start undermining him. If they get their butts handed to them in November, there is a possibility.
Train loads of popcorn.


12 posted on 03/05/2010 5:09:33 AM PST by Texas resident (Hunkered Down)
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To: Spaulding
the case/matter needs to be adjudicated in the Supreme Court.
duty shouldn't be shirked; let'em take a position.
13 posted on 03/05/2010 5:10:46 AM PST by 1234 ("1984")
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To: 1234

They probably feel like they already have.

Historically, there are two classes of citizens. Native born and naturalized. Natural born has always been the same as native born.

The birthers created a third out of thin air last year and now want it recognized.


14 posted on 03/05/2010 5:17:58 AM PST by MrRobertPlant2009
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To: Texas resident

So judges have blocked the lawsuits to reveal who this guy is,

Two articles yesterday, “Judge Roberts may step down”. Just a guess but, does he know something pertaining to this situation?


15 posted on 03/05/2010 5:19:48 AM PST by buck61
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To: buck61

The Justice Roberts story was started as a goof by a Georgetown instructor. According to the media so take that for what it’s worth.


16 posted on 03/05/2010 5:21:42 AM PST by Texas resident (Hunkered Down)
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To: Huebolt

Well said.


17 posted on 03/05/2010 5:26:39 AM PST by ICAB9USA
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To: MrRobertPlant2009
Historically, there are two classes of citizens. Native born and naturalized. Natural born has always been the same as native born.

Not true.

In Wong Kim Ark , the Supreme court made the distinction.

The petition was filed by Ark as a NATIVE born citizen. Part of the decision states-

The right of citizenship never descends in the legal sense, either by the common law or under the common naturalization acts. It is incident to birth in the country, or it is given personally by statute. The child of an alien, if born in the country, is as much a citizen as the natural born child of a citizen, and by operation of the same principle. [p666]

While it says a native born was 'just as much as citizen' as a natural born, it does NOT say a native born is the same as natural born.

18 posted on 03/05/2010 5:36:42 AM PST by MamaTexan (NO ONE owes allegiance to an unconstitutional government)
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To: Spaulding

Immigration and Citizenship: Process and Policy fourth edition
Under Jus Soli, the following is written “The Supreme Court’s first holding on the sublect suggested that the court would give a restrictive reading to the phrase, potentially disqualifing significant number of persons born within the physical boundries of the nation. In Elk v. Wilkins 112 U.S. 94, 5 S.CT. 41, 28 L.ED. 643 (1884), the court ruled that native Indians were not U.S. citizens, even if they later severed their ties with their tribes. The words “subject to the jurisdiction thereof,” the court held, mean “not merely subjct in some respect or degree to the jurisdiction of the United States, but completely subject to their political jurisdiction, and owing them direct and immediate allegiange.” Most Indians could not meet the test. “Indians born within the territorial limits of the United States, members of, and owing immediate allegiance to, one of the Indian Tribes, (an alien through dependent power,) although in a geographical sense born in the United States, are no more ‘born in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof,’*** then the children of subjects of any foreign government born within the domain of that government ***. Id. at 102.
It continues that Congress eventually passed legislation with the ‘Allotment Act of 1887, that conferred citizenship on many Indians.

The fact remains, the Court held, complete and sole Jurisdiction. As I have held that being born anywhere in the United States, jurisdiction is required, sole and complete, and Barack Hussein Obama was already claimed by British jurisdiction under the British Nationailty Act of 1948, and as such fails the United states Constitutional requirement of a Natural Born Citizen.

Title 8 and the 14th Amendment both state; All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

So explain how “not merely subjct in some respect or degree to the jurisdiction of the United States, but completely subject to their political jurisdiction, and owing them direct and immediate allegiange.”

So to ‘what’ degree was Barack Hussein Obama under US Jurisdiction at birth? Knowing that he was already under British jurisdiction, and how that being only partial or to whatever degree you impose not being in conflict with “completely subject to”?

Mind you this is The Supreme Court that has stated complete and not partial to any degree jurisdiction.

Just to make it crystal clear;

Indigenous peoples are any ethnic group who inhabit a geographic region with which they have the earliest known historical connection

ethnic; An ethnic group is a group of humans whose members identify with each other, through a common heritage that is real or assumed

common heritage; Common Heritage of Mankind (also termed the common heritage of humanity,common heritage of humankind or common heritage principle) is a principle of international law which holds that defined territorial areas and elements of humanity’s common heritage (cultural and natural) should be held of trust for future generations and be protected from exploitation by individual nation states or corporations.

So how can a foreigner be part of a native/Indigenous people, that are part of a ethnic bond with a common heritage?


19 posted on 03/05/2010 5:36:54 AM PST by syc1959
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To: MamaTexan

Don’t feed the troll.


20 posted on 03/05/2010 5:38:09 AM PST by DJ MacWoW (Make yourselves sheep and the wolves will eat you. Ben Franklin)
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To: DJ MacWoW
Don’t feed the troll.

Awwww, man

You spoil all my fun!

LOL!

21 posted on 03/05/2010 5:40:54 AM PST by MamaTexan (NO ONE owes allegiance to an unconstitutional government)
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To: MamaTexan

I’m sorry! LOL


22 posted on 03/05/2010 5:45:55 AM PST by DJ MacWoW (Make yourselves sheep and the wolves will eat you. Ben Franklin)
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To: DJ MacWoW
I’m sorry! LOL

s'okay...you're forgiven. ;-)

-----

I have to admit this writing by Apuzzo the the most accurate and informative that I've seen on the subject.

Not that I'm a lawyer [yuck] or anything, but I've spent over a decade wading through historical and legal documentation, and he nails ever point squarely on the head!

23 posted on 03/05/2010 5:51:53 AM PST by MamaTexan (NO ONE owes allegiance to an unconstitutional government)
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To: MamaTexan

It is good. All the trolls are getting input from their bosses about now. ;-)


24 posted on 03/05/2010 5:54:16 AM PST by DJ MacWoW (Make yourselves sheep and the wolves will eat you. Ben Franklin)
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To: Huebolt

‘Because “natural born Citizen” status requires unity of citizenship and allegiance,’

I think that it the key sentence. Obama does not have ‘allegiance’ to this Country....the Largest Islamic country, Indonesia yes, AMerica, not so much...


25 posted on 03/05/2010 5:57:28 AM PST by Freddd (CNN is down to Three Hundred Thousand viewers. But they worked for it.)
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To: Freddd

26 posted on 03/05/2010 6:01:23 AM PST by syc1959
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To: MrRobertPlant2009

Look here another troll. Were you recently unemployed, and found this new job opportunity?


27 posted on 03/05/2010 6:12:27 AM PST by castlegreyskull
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To: DJ MacWoW
All the trolls are getting input from their bosses about now. ;-)

Then this should really make their heads explode-

"Every Person born within the limits of the United States, and subject to their jurisdiction, is by virtue of natural law and national law a citizen of the United States. This will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, who belong to the families of ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the Government of the United States, but will include every other class of persons."
Senator Jacob Howard, co-author of the citizenship clause of the 14th Amendment, 1866.

The 14th Amendment does not confer citizenship of any kind to children born of parents who are foreigners or aliens.

Like Africans here on student visas.

28 posted on 03/05/2010 6:32:00 AM PST by MamaTexan (NO ONE owes allegiance to an unconstitutional government)
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To: MamaTexan

In Elk v. Wilkins 112 U.S. 94, 5 S.CT. 41, 28 L.ED. 643 (1884), the court ruled that native Indians were not U.S. citizens, even if they later severed their ties with their tribes. The words “subject to the jurisdiction thereof,” the court held, mean “not merely subjct in some respect or degree to the jurisdiction of the United States, but completely subject to their political jurisdiction, and owing them direct and immediate allegiange.”

Title 8 and the 14th Amendment both state; All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

So explain how “not merely subjct in some respect or degree to the jurisdiction of the United States, but completely subject to their political jurisdiction, and owing them direct and immediate allegiange.”

So to ‘what’ degree was Barack Hussein Obama under US Jurisdiction at birth? Knowing that he was already under British jurisdiction, and how that being only partial or to whatever degree you impose not being in conflict with “completely subject to”?

Mind you this is The Supreme Court that has stated complete and not partial to any degree jurisdiction.


29 posted on 03/05/2010 6:38:07 AM PST by syc1959
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To: MamaTexan
Very interesting. Thanks.

In the last couple of days, I have quit posting any info. I believe that the troll effort is now to see how much Freepers know. Trolls know they won't change anyone's mind. So it's fishing and disruption for them.

30 posted on 03/05/2010 6:39:12 AM PST by DJ MacWoW (Make yourselves sheep and the wolves will eat you. Ben Franklin)
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To: Freddd

Obama calls himself a ‘citizen of the world’ most likely because he collected enough of them to be claimed on four different continents.


31 posted on 03/05/2010 6:44:35 AM PST by edge919
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To: syc1959

BO is not pro-British or pro-American. He is only Pro-BO.


32 posted on 03/05/2010 6:49:06 AM PST by sodpoodle (Despair - Man's surrender. Laughter - God's redemption.)
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To: sodpoodle

Is that Pro BO-NO


33 posted on 03/05/2010 6:55:14 AM PST by syc1959
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To: DJ MacWoW
I have quit posting any info. I believe that the troll effort is now to see how much Freepers know. Trolls know they won't change anyone's mind. So it's fishing and disruption for them.

Perhaps, but sometimes I post in the hope of someone with some intellectual honesty might see it and pause long enough to actually cast an objective eye on the subject at hand.

[and sometimes I just don't have anything better to do! LOL!]

34 posted on 03/05/2010 6:56:25 AM PST by MamaTexan (NO ONE owes allegiance to an unconstitutional government)
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To: MamaTexan

What you posted is on the LOC. I doubt it will get scrubbed. I was being taunted yesterday into posting something that I had mentioned. I didn’t post it. Early links are gone. Scrubbed clean. I’m not going to show them if there’s more. Besides, it gets saved anyway. Why tell them where and who? :-)


35 posted on 03/05/2010 7:00:31 AM PST by DJ MacWoW (Make yourselves sheep and the wolves will eat you. Ben Franklin)
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To: STARWISE; LucyT; little jeremiah

ping


36 posted on 03/05/2010 7:06:12 AM PST by DJ MacWoW (Make yourselves sheep and the wolves will eat you. Ben Franklin)
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To: syc1959
So explain how “not merely subjct in some respect or degree to the jurisdiction of the United States, but completely subject to their political jurisdiction, and owing them direct and immediate allegiange.”

Try this thread for What "Subject to the Jurisdiction Thereof" Really Means

-----

Knowing that he was already under British jurisdiction, and how that being only partial or to whatever degree you impose not being in conflict with “completely subject to”?

Depends on where he was actually born. On the assumption he was born in Hawaii, he's either a native born citizen [based on his mother's citizenship] or a forigen national [based on his fathers]

Either way, he is NOT natural born precisely because he is NOT completely subject to.

37 posted on 03/05/2010 7:11:48 AM PST by MamaTexan (NO ONE owes allegiance to an unconstitutional government)
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To: DJ MacWoW
Early links are gone. Scrubbed clean. I’m not going to show them if there’s more.

I've had several link scrubbed in various places. I also used to post links to a few legal definitions and government codes only to read it later and discover it has been 'changed'.

Kinda makes you go hmmmmm, doesn't it? :-)

38 posted on 03/05/2010 7:14:47 AM PST by MamaTexan (NO ONE owes allegiance to an unconstitutional government)
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To: MamaTexan

Stuff disappearing also tells us we are right.


39 posted on 03/05/2010 7:24:37 AM PST by DJ MacWoW (Make yourselves sheep and the wolves will eat you. Ben Franklin)
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To: F15Eagle

I don’t worry what others outside of our country think if all of this ineligibility information comes to light. I think they already know and are wondering how long it will take for something to be done about it.

Since the Supreme Court has no authority to initiate impeachment proceedings but has full authority to prosecute for treason, I keep hoping that one of the justices or someone in a lower court will look at the fraud he has committed against our country and our citizens and start legal action. The House of Representatives are the only ones who can initiate impeachment proceedings. None of this will happen as long as the Dems hold majorities in both houses of Congress. I hope and pray that the Repubs take both houses of Congress in 2010 and I hope they will move to have him ousted via impeachment or malfeasance. I do believe, however, that the reason nothing has been done to date is the fear of civil unrest resulting from legal moves against him. It is quickly coming to the point where a decision must be made regarding civil unrest vs destruction of our country from within. Not a great scenario with either option.


40 posted on 03/05/2010 7:24:43 AM PST by NBCforSure (!!)
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To: castlegreyskull

Media Matters/Soros - hiring internet trolls
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/bloggers/2457491/posts?page=2420#2401

They’re .. H E E E R E!


41 posted on 03/05/2010 7:42:49 AM PST by STARWISE (They (LIBS-STILL) think of this WOT as Bush's war, not America's war- Richard Miniter)
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To: STARWISE

Reducing unemployment one troll at a time.


42 posted on 03/05/2010 7:46:46 AM PST by castlegreyskull
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To: DJ MacWoW; Fred Nerks; null and void; stockpirate; george76; PhilDragoo; Candor7; rxsid; ...
Image and video hosting by TinyPic

"I believe that the troll effort is now to see how much Freepers know. Trolls know they won't change anyone's mind. So it's fishing and disruption for them."

.

43 posted on 03/05/2010 10:29:27 AM PST by LucyT
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To: Spaulding; patlin
Thanks for the article. This is quite substantial. I didn't realize how many Supreme Court Cases cited/referred to Vattel's definition of "natural born citizen" -- nine cases from 1814 to 1898.

It's clear that there has never been any doubt about the meaning of the phrase "natural born citizen" by past Supreme Courts. If the words of Article II and these Courts throughout history are not definitive, then what is??? Precedence is precedence -- unless, I guess, one is dealing with lawless prefabricators.

44 posted on 03/05/2010 10:35:37 AM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: LucyT

I saw we continue topublish a list of these disruoors, even thoughthe mmods keep deleting them.The mods are on the side of the disruoptrs. .Jim is gong to lose this site which is the plan of the mods and these disruptors. Someone has Jim over a barrel. The feds? Someone in Jim’s family who is dedicated to Obama?


45 posted on 03/05/2010 10:37:37 AM PST by Candor7 (Now's the time to ante up against the Obama Fascist Junta ( member NRA))
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To: Candor7
Just out of curiosity, what is a “disruoor?”
46 posted on 03/05/2010 10:38:50 AM PST by tired_old_conservative
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To: LucyT
“I believe that the troll effort is now to see how much Freepers know.”

That wouldn't take long.

47 posted on 03/05/2010 10:39:53 AM PST by tired_old_conservative
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To: tired_old_conservative

Sorry, mouth full of doughnut. Disruptor. luch break at work, my apologies.


48 posted on 03/05/2010 10:41:33 AM PST by Candor7 (Now's the time to ante up against the Obama Fascist Junta ( member NRA))
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To: Spaulding
"Mario Apuzzo has written the most authoritative, until the Supreme Court acts, history of natural born citizenship in our Constitution yet provided, filled with dozens of references."

Uuuuuuhhhh... I don't think you quite have a handle on what "authoritative" means. Mario is a personal injury lawyer, not a constitutional lawyer, and has never held any position that would qualify him as an authority on anything to do with the Constitution.

The actual "most authoritative... history of natural born citizenship in our Constitution yet provided" can be found in the Decision of the Supreme Court for the case United States v. Wong Kim Ark. You can find it here:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/search/display.html?terms=elk+v+wilkins&url=/supct/html/historics/USSC_CR_0169_0649_ZO.html
49 posted on 03/05/2010 10:45:19 AM PST by EnderWiggins
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To: LucyT

Too many people feeding the trolls on other threads. *sigh*


50 posted on 03/05/2010 11:14:55 AM PST by DJ MacWoW (Make yourselves sheep and the wolves will eat you. Ben Franklin)
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