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Mortgage-Backed Securities Without Mortgages?
Market-Ticker ^ | 11/16/10 | Karl Denninger

Posted on 11/17/2010 11:28:01 AM PST by Kartographer

Remember, the allegations made by various legal folks in the practice (and apparently validated by the case law thus far) is that not one note has been able to be produced that contains all of the required conveyances and endorsements.

What's going to happen when (or if) these folks gain access to the files and find that they're missing - that is, that the custodian doesn't have them?

Well now that would be interesting, no? "Mortgage-backed securities" that in fact have no mortgages in them? Why that would be a wee problem, no?

(Excerpt) Read more at market-ticker.org ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Conspiracy
KEYWORDS: boa; chase; corporate; corruption; dodd; finreg; foreclosure; frankobama; jpmorgan; mers; robosigners; tarp2; tarp3; tarp4; tarpi; toobigtofail; welfare; wellsfargo

1 posted on 11/17/2010 11:28:07 AM PST by Kartographer
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To: Chunga85; Lurker; Jack Hydrazine; FromLori; azhenfud; NVDave; Kartographer; servantoftheservant

PING!


2 posted on 11/17/2010 11:29:07 AM PST by Kartographer (".. we mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer

Can you say “sh** storm”? I thought so.


3 posted on 11/17/2010 11:35:58 AM PST by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: Kartographer

Wait until the MERS hits the fans.


4 posted on 11/17/2010 11:40:51 AM PST by isthisnickcool (Sharia? No thanks.)
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To: Kartographer

WaMu must return foreclosed home

http://www.bizjournals.com/portland/news/2010/11/12/wamu-must-return-foreclosed-home.html

Does anyone know how that vote on HR-3808 Veto Override Attempt went today?


5 posted on 11/17/2010 11:49:15 AM PST by FromLori (FromLori)
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To: FromLori

Just another ‘Dead Beat’ that needs to be ‘Tarred and Feathered’! (sarc)


6 posted on 11/17/2010 11:54:54 AM PST by Kartographer (".. we mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer
SUMBS (Screwed Up Mortgage Backed Securities)
7 posted on 11/17/2010 12:05:36 PM PST by azhenfud (The government is not best which secures life and property-there is a more valuable thing-manhood.)
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To: Bullish; CJ Wolf; houeto; Quix; B4Ranch; Whenifhow; Silentgypsy; blam; FromLori; Lurker; ...
"Economic Holocaust" ping.

Moderate (but increasing) volume ping list.

FReepmail me if you want on or off
The Comedian's "Economic Holocaust" ping list...


Frowning takes 68 muscles.
Smiling takes 6.
Pulling this trigger takes 2.
I'm lazy.

8 posted on 11/17/2010 12:11:51 PM PST by The Comedian (I enjoy progressives, especially in a light cream sauce.)
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To: Kartographer

If the prospectus states mortgage backed securities and the paperwork is actually screwed up and legally no mortgage note exists, then the issuer of the prospectus is vulnerable to the charge of fraud. Legally the buyer of the mortgage backed securities can return the investment to the issuing bank and demand their money back. This is known as a putback which can cost the banks billions if the investors choose to do this. This is on top of the state investigations that can conclude the prospectus for these securities were inaccurate and if the issuer knew this they can be charged with fraud. You are talking about hefty fines and prison terms for the ones involved. Bankers are already threatening the US gov that any prosecutions would result in no new mortgages. They even threaten the US gov that if the investors successfully sue them, the US gov must bail them out or they will crash the US economy. If Obama or the new GOP House of Rep really want to score PR points, put the criminal bankers on trial and jail them. After melting down the economy with liar loans and bailouts, the bankers are not contrite but have become more strident in their private demands to the US Treasury and Congress.


9 posted on 11/17/2010 12:33:25 PM PST by Fee
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To: FromLori
I've been trying to watch congress in action today but the house has been in recess for quite a long time now.

It will be a voice vote. They'll probably have paper bags over their heads as they vote for their masters.

10 posted on 11/17/2010 12:49:27 PM PST by Chunga85 ("Foreclosure Fraud", TARP, "Mortgage Crisis", Bailout)
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To: Chunga85

Did you see the outbreak yesterday?

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/nacas-bruce-marks-goes-postal-jpm-crony-during-yesterdays-fraudclosure-hearing


11 posted on 11/17/2010 1:39:52 PM PST by FromLori (FromLori)
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To: Fee; The Comedian

>>Legally the buyer of the mortgage backed securities can return the investment to the issuing bank and demand their money back.<<

Why on earth would someone want to do this with the rate of inflation we currently have?


12 posted on 11/17/2010 1:50:24 PM PST by B4Ranch (Conflict is inevitable; Combat is an option. Train for the fight.)
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To: Fee; The Comedian

OK I figured it out.


13 posted on 11/17/2010 1:54:47 PM PST by B4Ranch (Conflict is inevitable; Combat is an option. Train for the fight.)
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To: The Comedian
"Economic Holocaust" ping.

You got that right.

In SPADES!

14 posted on 11/17/2010 2:17:49 PM PST by houeto ("You know, I actually believe my own bullsh_t," --- BHO)
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To: Fee
So what's the difference between what they have done with the mortgage securities and Benie Madoff's investments?
15 posted on 11/17/2010 2:27:15 PM PST by Kartographer (".. we mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor.")
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To: FromLori; Lurker; Jack Hydrazine; azhenfud; NVDave; Kartographer; servantoftheservant; ...
Not sure exactly what to make of Bruce Marks.

H.R. 3808 Alert – Disposing of the President’s Veto of H.R. 3808- Interstate Recognition of Notarizations Act of 2010

$nip>

Confirmed with Adelholt’s [R-AL] office that vote is taking place tonight sometime in the next two hours. This morning was a discussion and agreement to limit discussion to 10 mins.

ANTICIPATED FLOOR SCHEDULE

On Wednesday, November 17th, the House will meet at 10:00 a.m. for legislative business. Following One Minutes, the House will recess in order to accommodate the Democratic and Republican Organizing Meetings.

At approximately 4:00 p.m., the House will reconvene and resume legislative business. Last votes expected: 6:00 p.m.

One Minutes(15 per side)

Disposing of the President’s Veto of H.R. 3808- Interstate Recognition of Notarizations Act of 2010

(Sponsored by Rep. Aderholt / Judiciary Committee)

$nip>

16 posted on 11/17/2010 2:35:27 PM PST by Chunga85 ("Foreclosure Fraud", TARP, "Mortgage Crisis", Bailout)
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To: B4Ranch

If the portfolio performs, the investor will keep it, but on the other hand if the portfolio does not perform (ala too many properties are defaulting) the investors may execute this option. The other problem is if the investor needs cash and wants to sell their performing MBS to another buyer, these buyers may balk due to the bad PR, thus the investors may decide to exercise the put back option on the banks if such sales fail. The other issue for investors is the price they paid for the MBS was based on a AAA rating. They could have paid less for the risks they are taking, that is why many are using put back to get their money back so they can invest in other financial products with proper price to risk. Ironically Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae under pressure from Congress to keep their liabilities low are one of the biggest put back exercisers of MBS.


17 posted on 11/17/2010 5:18:37 PM PST by Fee
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To: Kartographer

This is one of the reasons why the banks are very scare. The homeowner is the least of their problems because the banks must pay for an investigator to back track and locate the last known location of the title/note. Firms that had it last and lost it can have a lawyer fill out a state form and affidavit to document the lost documents. This option always exist for banks and service companies in case lost documents happen (usually due to natural disasters, fire, etc). The mess up in the MERS just gave more time for the homeowner to stay in their house, but eventually the documents will be located or accounted for and the foreclosure process will restart. However the MBS is another story because these investments were sold with a prospectus that must be accurate and meet SEC/banking regs. Claiming that the MBS are backed with mortgage notes/docs and rated AAA when they are not opens the banks to hot legal problems. Whoever prepared and signed off on the prospectus is already in legal trouble. Question now is will the state governments prosecute and disrupt the banking system with trials. Sec of Treasury and Fed Reserve may be lobbying via federal government for the states to hold off or risk causing more public panic and triggering another financial meltdown of 2008.


18 posted on 11/17/2010 5:34:35 PM PST by Fee
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To: Fee

Thanks for expanding on this.


19 posted on 11/17/2010 6:50:57 PM PST by B4Ranch (Conflict is inevitable; Combat is an option. Train for the fight.)
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To: Fee
“but eventually the documents will be located or accounted for and the foreclosure process will restart” One: Can you to reinstate documents that you purposely destroyed as part of a investor fraud scheme? Two: Can you prove who owns the note? When they were bundled the way they were? Three: What if the bank who owned the note sold it and now is out of business? Four: What stand would a transfered note have if it was never recorded? Five: Wouldn't someone have to determine who actually owns the note before foreclosure. Not who was the first person to hold it, but who actually holds it at present time?
20 posted on 11/17/2010 6:54:00 PM PST by Kartographer (".. we mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor.")
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To: Chunga85

HR3808 failed to muster the 2/3 “YEA’s” to override. I note it was mostly supported by Republicans. That’s disturbing to me because I’m sure they KNOW the corruption banksters are perpetrating, yet would further the hand of crime by support of such a bill.

It would have seemed a more prudent and less harmful thing to postpone action on the bill until the current banking mess subsides, but they chose not to because banksters hides are beginning to sear. I hope America’s public takes note of the bill and of those who chose to vote “YEA” and would consider if “YEA’s” had prevailed, how their prevalence may have forever negatively affected the rule of law.

Apparently one of their bankster friends was on the floor and voted “YEA” as well.

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/vote.xpd?vote=h2010-573


21 posted on 11/17/2010 6:55:48 PM PST by azhenfud (The government is not best which secures life and property-there is a more valuable thing-manhood.)
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To: Fee
"Firms that had it last and lost it can have a lawyer fill out a state form and affidavit to document the lost documents."

Sounds simple, but fact is it won't happen because the assignments have to be in order and when the instrument has changed hands several times without the assignments, getting an affiant with true and accurate knowledge of each exchange would be nearly impossible. Someone will to have to lie to fill in the information gaps. If I were challenged by an affidavit from someone swearing of an incident of more than a year past, I'd ask to depose them and disprove their affidavit b/c there's absolutely no way they remember one particular note's assignment on one particular day amid hundreds of other assignments.

"....but eventually the documents will be located or accounted for and the foreclosure process will restart."

Don't be so sure. If the assignment banks produce in court can be proven fraudulent, they LOSE their rights to enforce. (§ 3-203(b))

22 posted on 11/17/2010 7:17:08 PM PST by azhenfud (The government is not best which secures life and property-there is a more valuable thing-manhood.)
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To: azhenfud

This is why I continue to believe that we have two political parties in the US:

The Evil Party (ie, the DNC)

and

The Stupid Party (ie, the GOP).

The GOP is too stupid to understand the scams the bankers have been running on the investing public, and continue to believe that because the bankers like to espouse “free market” rhetoric, that the bankers must be swell and gosh, just honest-as-the-day-is-long people.


23 posted on 11/17/2010 8:54:03 PM PST by NVDave
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To: azhenfud

Well that is the trick. The company that last physically owned the note/title and failed to foward it to the buyer, and the buyer who never received the note/title fowarded the MBS and hoping to eventually get the note/title are the ones on the hook to account for it. The state forms that they must fill requires a rep/lawyer to sign a sworn statement on what had happened to the lost docs. It means the lawyer or statement giver is liable for making false statements if they chose to lie and risk their careers/licenses. Most mortgage experts feel the docs can be located or accounted for. Despite the dizzy pace of the MERS system, its electronic transactions can be retraced, unless someone in the MERS erases all the digital records (that would be a disaster for the banks involved). It means the banks must hire someone to take his time and diligence to retrace the transactions and attempt to locate the documents.


24 posted on 11/17/2010 8:54:15 PM PST by Fee
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To: Fee
"Most mortgage experts feel the docs can be located or accounted for."

Methinks then they ought find those docs without forgeries or perjuries. If it benefits a servicer to delay foreclosure via reimbursable fees, why would they rush to foreclose with falsified docs if indeed, the originals exist? Methinks those "mortgage experts" are living in a fairy world, soon to be awakened.

Methinks too those "mortgage experts" are the same ones who drove this cart into the ditch and are refusing to recognize the wreckage.

25 posted on 11/18/2010 4:28:50 AM PST by azhenfud (The government is not best which secures life and property-there is a more valuable thing-manhood.)
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To: NVDave

It tells me the GOP majority has no conservatism left and they’d want the FedGov in a state’s issue to cover up ???.


26 posted on 11/18/2010 4:31:11 AM PST by azhenfud (The government is not best which secures life and property-there is a more valuable thing-manhood.)
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To: azhenfud

I agree. Time will tell. Every case that reappears in front of a judge will depend on circumstances and the judges discretion. Lawyers representing the homeowners will challenge the new docs and the banks know this before they appear in front of court. They already blew the first trial and the last thing they need is being caught “lying” the second time. The reason I brought out the points in my posts is there is an impression that the delinquent homeowner will get their home free and clear of the mortgage/bank. They are really not out of the woods yet.


27 posted on 11/18/2010 4:54:07 AM PST by Fee
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To: Fee

“The state forms that they must fill requires a rep/lawyer to sign a sworn statement on what had happened to the lost docs”

So who’s going to be the first to fill out that the documents were shreaded in an effort to promote an investment fraud?


28 posted on 11/18/2010 6:23:17 AM PST by Kartographer (".. we mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor.")
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To: Fee
"The reason I brought out the points in my posts is there is an impression that the delinquent homeowner will get their home free and clear of the mortgage/bank. They are really not out of the woods yet."

And may never be. MERS and its inventors have possibly irreparably fouled hundreds of thousands of good titles and when the last payments or an attempt to sell on these are made and a clear title cannot be acquired without significant further cost to the homeowner, who then will guarantee the owner's interest in the property to be safe?

When you're dealing with a mammoth that refuses to produce the documents asserting their legal rights to monthly consideration and will only reveal a suspect copy, the only option is to make a photocopy of a deposit slip of depositing the payment amount into an escrow account until the issue is settled in court. If they prove standing, the money is there to effect reinstatement and good faith has been established by a continuance of the funds being set aside. If they can't prove standing, the homeowner has funds on hand to compensate the rightful holder of the Note, which is the fair and equitable thing to do.

This problem isn't limited to those the public thinks are deadbeat home inhabitants, this extends to anyone with an outstanding, securitized mortgage of which MERS has tainted the assignment process.

29 posted on 11/18/2010 11:56:39 AM PST by azhenfud (The government is not best which secures life and property-there is a more valuable thing-manhood.)
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