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The Tucson Shooting: a Reminder to Arm Yourself
Pajamas Media ^ | January 12, 2011 | AWR Hawkins

Posted on 01/12/2011 6:32:25 AM PST by Kaslin

When Jared Loughner opened fire in Tucson on January 8, six people were killed and fourteen injured. No matter where you were sitting, as the 24-hour news carried the details of the story, the world seemed almost to stop spinning. The raw evil of what Loughner had done was simply too great for decent, law abiding citizens to comprehend.

Sadly, it didn’t take long for various talking heads on the left to see the shooting as just another crisis that could be used to further their agenda: tightening gun control, besmearing the Tea Party, and destroying Sarah Palin. For instance, within 48 hours of the shooting, Representative Carolyn McCarthy (D-NY) promised to introduce stricter gun control legislation as soon as her staff could draw it up, the Washington Post’s Courtland Milloy affixed blame to the Tea Party, and uber-leftist Paul Krugman disgraced himself as one of the shrillest voices placing the blame on Palin.

Lost in these attempts to gain political points by placing blame on someone other than the shooter is the clearest lesson of the Tucson shooting: that we must take responsibility for our own lives — and be prepared to defend those lives with weapons we carry for protection.

Far from serving as fodder for the anti-gunners (save as they pervert the story to make it fit their template), the shooting in Tucson reminds us that when the criminal mind acts on its inclinations, its would-be victims must be prepared to take the necessary steps to stop the perpetrator in his tracks. Clearly, this is best achieved by lawfully carrying a handgun on our persons: a handgun with which we are familiar, and which we are willing to use to defend our own lives and the lives of other innocents.

If anyone thinks I go too far in positing a handgun as the best means of self-defense, consider Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito’s explanation for why that court famously overturned handgun bans in Washington, D.C., and Chicago: “We held that individual self defense is ‘the central component’ of the Second Amendment right [to keep and bear arms]. …[And] we found that this right applies to handguns because they are ‘the most preferred firearm in the nation to ‘keep’ and use for protection of one’s home and family.’”

Alito’s words rang in my head as I was eating lunch in a restaurant with my family on the afternoon of January 8, watching the television on the wall as news of the shooting poured in. My youngest daughter, who knows I legally carry a concealed pistol everyday, looked at me and asked: “Dad, would you have stopped him?” I explained to her that while I couldn’t say for sure I would have stopped him, I certainly would have been prepared to stop him and would have had absolutely no qualms about shooting a criminal who threatened the lives of my family and/or myself.

Such is life. As long as we are on this earth, criminals will be seeking the opportunity to carry out their evil schemes. And if we respond to their schemes as Representative McCarthy wants to, by passing more and more gun control laws, we’ll inevitably be disappointed to find that criminals will ignore the new laws just as easily as they ignored the old ones. In the end, such an approach will only hamper the ability of law abiding citizens to get their hands on the weapons “most preferred” for self defense, effectively transforming more and more innocents into sitting ducks for the next Loughner whenever and wherever he decides to kill in cold blood.

Our lives are our own responsibilities. We cannot entrust their protection to agents of the state, whether those agents are legislators, police officers, or federal agents.

If we want to be safe, we need to arm ourselves as a means of making preparation for safety. Perhaps this is the most valuable lesson the Tucson shooting can teach us.


TOPICS: Society
KEYWORDS: alito; armedcitizen; banglist; concealedcarry; constitution; giffords; loughner; massshooting; selfdefense
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1 posted on 01/12/2011 6:32:28 AM PST by Kaslin
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To: Kaslin
I've had a CC permit since 2008. Taken some ribbing for bringing it with me on seemingly innocuous errands. My feeling is, the day I don't have it with me is the day I'll probably need it. Not getting much ridicule about it after Saturday.
2 posted on 01/12/2011 6:37:36 AM PST by edpc (It's Kräusened)
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To: Kaslin

FNC is reporting that gun sales rose 60% in Arizona on the Monday after the pothead went on his shooting rampage and Dipstik went on his moronic ranting rampage.


3 posted on 01/12/2011 6:39:24 AM PST by FlingWingFlyer ("New laws are always a "good idea" until the first time you have to enforce them." - Unknown)
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To: edpc

>I’ve had a CC permit since 2008. Taken some ribbing for bringing it with me on seemingly innocuous errands. My feeling is, the day I don’t have it with me is the day I’ll probably need it. Not getting much ridicule about it after Saturday.

Exactly. I see carrying a gun like wearing a seat belt. You don’t wear it because you either want, or intend to get in an accident. You wear it because if you do get in that accident, it really sucks not to have it on.


4 posted on 01/12/2011 6:46:26 AM PST by drbuzzard (different league)
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To: Joe Brower; Jeff Head; Squantos; Travis McGee; Lion Den Dan; FreedomPoster; Stonewall Jackson; ...

FYI


5 posted on 01/12/2011 6:46:51 AM PST by SLB (23rd Artillery Group, Republic of South Vietnam, Aug 1970 - Aug 1971.)
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To: edpc
I used to carry 24/7/365 for decades.

No longer bother.

As long as some wildcard $hitbird going off misses my a$$, I could care less about the remainder.

The delusion that one takes out some deranged shooter in a public setting is just that... A delusion.

Should such delusion manifest it is assured that those you “saved” will all sue your ass for the emotional trauma and distress to their persons you caused.

6 posted on 01/12/2011 6:47:49 AM PST by mmercier (give the people what they want)
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To: Joe Brower; Jeff Head; Squantos; Travis McGee; Lion Den Dan; FreedomPoster; Stonewall Jackson; ...

FYI


7 posted on 01/12/2011 6:52:29 AM PST by SLB (23rd Artillery Group, Republic of South Vietnam, Aug 1970 - Aug 1971.)
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To: mmercier

talk about delusions


8 posted on 01/12/2011 6:55:05 AM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

I watched the report


9 posted on 01/12/2011 6:56:41 AM PST by Kaslin (Acronym for OBAMA: One Big Ass Mistake America)
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To: Kaslin
IMHO, a CC permit and a reason for the CCW is to protect yourself and the lives of your loved ones.

It is NOT a license to be a policeman, a "defender of the people", a hero, or a martyr.

I think, unless the gunman was pointing at me or directly threatening me, my duty would be to get my loved ones and myself out of the KZ ASAP, and then contact the authorities. I am not trained nor want to be trained for those other duties.

My reason for the CCW would be for my protection and my loved ones; it would not be for any of the other reasons named above.

10 posted on 01/12/2011 6:57:53 AM PST by China Clipper (My favorite animals usually are found next to the rice on my plate.)
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To: mmercier
....it is assured that those you “saved” will all sue your ass for the emotional trauma and distress....

I have no doubt you are correct. There is no interest, on my part, to start slinging lead with criminals or insane people in public. The laws are different for each state. In my particular case, we were instructed on what was permissible in given situations.

My first instinct, in a situation like that, would be finding cover for me and whoever is with me. If we're directly threatened, at least I don't have to worry about being at a disadvantage. With my luck, I would be in a position to take out the bad guy, then find myself shot by LE personnel.

11 posted on 01/12/2011 7:00:50 AM PST by edpc (It's Kräusened)
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To: China Clipper

Agreed.


12 posted on 01/12/2011 7:01:54 AM PST by edpc (It's Kräusened)
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To: mmercier
The delusion that one takes out some deranged shooter in a public setting is just that... A delusion.

I doubt that Jeanne Assam would agree.

13 posted on 01/12/2011 7:06:50 AM PST by Charles Martel (Endeavor to persevere...)
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To: Charles Martel
I do not know Jeanne.

I am guessing she got lucky. My uncle trained a young lady who popped a early release schizoid who was hiding in her garage. Why she had a loaded .380 in her hand when he grabbed her is a question best not asked.

In my experience, you always have a gun when you do not need it, and never have one when you do.

I believe everyone of reasonable intellect should be afforded the lawful right to carry.

I just stopped carrying because it is a pain in the a$$.

It is counterproductive to desire the salvation of those who have made the legal hurdles so high.

I will save my own a$$, and I do not need a gun. I'll just take theirs.

14 posted on 01/12/2011 7:25:23 AM PST by mmercier (everything a boy can do)
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To: Charles Martel

I think Dr. Hupp probably disagrees too:

Dr Suzanna Hupp on Virginia Tech
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ggg0LwhrH0&NR=1


15 posted on 01/12/2011 7:26:45 AM PST by beaversmom
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To: Kaslin
Seems like quite a bit of cynisism on the thread...but, there were enough people directly threatened in this shooting in that crowd when this guy came amongst them, that had one or two had conceal carry, they would have had the time to use it to protect themselves and loved ones.

That's exactly what we need, IMHO. More law abiding people armed to protect against these maniacs when they go off. otherwise, everyone else becomes a target until enough people can physically restrain the individual at much greater risk to themselves (as this example indicates). The guy got off an amazing number of shots, and he was (tragically...horrifically) effective with the shots he made.

If someone right close had been armed and returned fire immediately, a lot of suffering may have been prevented, though I doubt seriously anyone was going to stop his first few shots.

16 posted on 01/12/2011 7:35:19 AM PST by Jeff Head (Liberty is not free. Never has been, never will be. (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: SLB; Eaker; Travis McGee; Squantos; betty boop; joanie-f; Dukie; Grampa Dave; B4Ranch

See my post 16.


17 posted on 01/12/2011 7:37:40 AM PST by Jeff Head (Liberty is not free. Never has been, never will be. (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: harpseal; TexasCowboy; nunya bidness; AAABEST; Travis McGee; Squantos; wku man; SLB; ...
"Our lives are our own responsibilities. We cannot entrust their protection to agents of the state, whether those agents are legislators, police officers, or federal agents."

Exactly so. And the extension of this fundamental truth is it's converse, where, as Jeff Snyder pointed out in his seminal essay, Nation of Cowards, that anyone who will not act in their own self-defense, yet demand that the police run to their rescue is at best morally bankrupt.

Click the Gadsden flag for pro-gun resources!

18 posted on 01/12/2011 7:44:16 AM PST by Joe Brower (Sheep have three speeds: "graze", "stampede" and "cower".)
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To: edpc
Exactly.

Years back me and a friend got woke by two strange people rooting through our camp. They decided to leave when a 10mm colt got stuck in the face of the big guy.

My friend asked what we would do if we had to off them. No need for an answer..

I would have been digging three holes alone.

Bo has a conscience and a big mouth.

19 posted on 01/12/2011 7:45:18 AM PST by mmercier (sad, but true)
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To: mmercier
The delusion that one takes out some deranged shooter in a public setting is just that... A delusion.

If the Bay County school board had been armed, they could have offed the shooter instead of pleading "Please Don't, Please don't". Luckily, the shooter missed them.

20 posted on 01/12/2011 7:48:55 AM PST by SeeSac
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To: mmercier
They decided to leave when a 10mm colt got stuck in the face of the big guy.

Luckily, the big guy didn't take it away from you.

21 posted on 01/12/2011 7:50:10 AM PST by SeeSac
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To: mmercier
....woke by two strange people......

My friend asked what we would do if we had to off them. No need for an answer.. I would have been digging three holes alone. Bo has a conscience and a big mouth.

Fella, I'm certainly glad you don't call me friend. Because, frankly, I think there a little somethin' off about you.

22 posted on 01/12/2011 8:12:16 AM PST by Gaffer
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To: Jeff Head

I agree 100%. A Granny with a handgun in her purse or a man with a derringer in his pocket could have interrupted his shooting spree. The main thing is to have it with you, not in the car or on the nightstand.


23 posted on 01/12/2011 8:16:52 AM PST by B4Ranch (Do NOT remain seated until this ride comes to a full and complete stop! We're going the wrong way!)
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To: Kaslin

I’ve also had a ccw for many years, in multiple states. I used to only carry it in my vehicles, but now have taken to carrying one almost everywhere (no financial institutions, schools, or government centers due to their posted restrictions). Also just watched the remake of “True Grit”. Was slammed at the display of lawlessness, the frontier (taming the lawlessness via Frontier justice), and the “civilized” world that pushed for control of the lawlessness (”I got a good lawyer that will help you!”). It seems we be sliding back now, as the lawlessness sometimes needs frontier justice to keep it in check and prevent it from backflowing into the “Civilized” society...


24 posted on 01/12/2011 8:17:13 AM PST by Dubh_Ghlase (Therefore, send not to know For whom the bell tolls, It tolls for thee.)
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To: China Clipper

>>a CC permit and a reason for the CCW is to protect yourself and the lives of your loved ones.<<

Arizona is Constitution Carry state. No permission permit required. No groveling on your knees for your rights.


25 posted on 01/12/2011 8:22:07 AM PST by B4Ranch (Do NOT remain seated until this ride comes to a full and complete stop! We're going the wrong way!)
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To: drbuzzard

Excellent view in your post. In one of my classes under Mas Ayoob, a weapon was referred to as a piece of safety equipment, such as a fire extinguisher. I really like your analogy to wearing a seat belt. Bravo!!!!


26 posted on 01/12/2011 8:25:22 AM PST by toolman1401
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To: Kaslin
Pretty much everyone out there can agree that initiating force is not a good thing. We don't just walk up and start beating on people. The whole "sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me" mantra most of us grew up with.

However, I am a firm believer that RETALIATORY force has gotten short shrift in part because of the "turn the other cheek" philosophy. If someone is going to shoot you in the head, there is no other cheek to turn. Further, once the perp has done away with you, he may very well go on and kill others.

Fight back. Even against simple property crimes. They want your wallet? Give it to them, then draw your pistol and kill them. They want your car? Give it to them, along with a pair of 180gr hollow points to their head as they attempt to drive off.

If you don't fight back, you create a safe environment for career criminals. You acclimate an already bovine public into thinking property crimes "are not worth fighting" over. Now when it comes time to fight back against a seriously deranged murderer, you have become so used to the "don't fight back" mentality that you run and hide like mice. Further, insane nut cases might see the general public as easy pickings for exactly this kind of murder spree because of the pacified attitude of the sheep-like masses.

This event should have played out that this creep died in a hail of return fire from the hands of his intended victims. Yes, even from the Representative herself had she any warning at all this this nut-ball was raising a gun to her.

This event is enough of a tragedy in and of itself. We will only compound this tragedy if we don't learn this harsh lesson and if we allow those opportunists in government to further restrict our Rights.

27 posted on 01/12/2011 8:39:46 AM PST by Dead Corpse (III%. The last line in the sand)
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To: China Clipper
I think, unless the gunman was pointing at me or directly threatening me, my duty would be to get my loved ones and myself out of the KZ ASAP, and then contact the authorities. I am not trained nor want to be trained for those other duties.

_________________________________________________________

I am an old man now and don't run well. I can't man handle people like I used to even though I'm still 6’ 4”.

I don't look to protect anybody but me and those with me. If someone starts shooting I will not try to run away, I will shoot as quickly as possible. I practice every other weekend. I will not likely miss.

I do not look forward to killing or even wounding anybody but if someone starts shooting while my wife is near they must have a death wish.

I don't always carry, if I think there is any possibility that I will need it I carry. I live in a very small town and going to McDonald's is not likely to be a problem but when I travel in the car I have a gun. If I go into the city (Louisville, KY) I strap it on.

I will do my best to not end up like that poor 9 year old girl or the honest but dead judge. The shooter may get me but likely he won't get anybody after me, with my last breath if I have to I will take him out.

I know that is strong talk, perhaps humorous to some but I do mean it.

28 posted on 01/12/2011 8:43:47 AM PST by JAKraig (Surely my religion is at least as good as yours)
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To: mmercier
Hello Sarah Brady! GTFO! STFU!

You are the delusional one.

29 posted on 01/12/2011 8:50:25 AM PST by DCBryan1 (FORGET the lawyers...first kill the "journalists". (Die Ritter der Kokosnuss))
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To: B4Ranch
Arizona is Constitution Carry state. No permission permit required. No groveling on your knees for your rights.

I think that's a good thing, and as I've been shouting in every forum I can in the last few days...to buy a handgun in AZ you still need to pass the fed NICS check. Sheriff dipstick has admitted they/he knew about the death threats Loughner made. Had they prosecuted Loughner on even one of those threats, he would've been denied in the NICS system, and thus no glock. Everyone on our side should be making as much collective noise as they can about this.
30 posted on 01/12/2011 8:55:23 AM PST by domeika
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To: domeika

>>.to buy a handgun in AZ you still need to pass the fed NICS check.<<

Private sales do not require the need to pass the fed NICS check. That’s what they don’t like. Citizens with uncontrolled liberty.


31 posted on 01/12/2011 8:59:19 AM PST by B4Ranch (Do NOT remain seated until this ride comes to a full and complete stop! We're going the wrong way!)
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To: B4Ranch
Private sales do not require the need to pass the fed NICS check. That’s what they don’t like. Citizens with uncontrolled liberty.

That may be so, but if that nutjob wanted to buy a pistol from you, would you sell it to him? I would guess not, and any responsible person wouldn't either. But that aside, he bought it from a store, so the argument is relevant.
32 posted on 01/12/2011 9:17:17 AM PST by domeika
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To: beaversmom

Thaks for posting that video link. I hadn’t see it before. Dr. Hupp is a sub host on KLBJ in the morning and afternoon talk shows. I really like her.


33 posted on 01/12/2011 9:20:27 AM PST by Arrowhead1952 (America has two cancers - democrats and RINOS.)
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To: mmercier
That is your choice as an American Citizen.

The problem is when our Legislators want to deny that choice for others.

I live in CA where obtaining a Conceal Carry Permit is nearly impossible unless you are a Politician or retired Police Officer.

Be glad you have the choice to carry, I have none and am at the mercy of Lawbreakers who could care less what our “leaders” think is good for us Serfs.

34 posted on 01/12/2011 9:30:32 AM PST by Kickass Conservative (Obamunism, the fatal cure for Bush Derangement Syndrome.)
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To: mmercier

“I do not need a gun. I’ll just take theirs. “

Glad to know you can outrun a bullet.


35 posted on 01/12/2011 9:35:30 AM PST by CodeToad (Islam needs to be banned in the US and treated as a criminal enterprise.)
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To: mmercier

“The delusion that one takes out some deranged shooter in a public setting is just that... A delusion.”

Unfortunately for you reality doesn’t say that. Plenty of people have taken out a bad guy. Sorry to know you are a puss that wouldn’t try much less think to do so.


36 posted on 01/12/2011 9:36:39 AM PST by CodeToad (Islam needs to be banned in the US and treated as a criminal enterprise.)
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To: mmercier

“Should such delusion manifest it is assured that those you “saved” will all sue your ass for the emotional trauma and distress to their persons you caused.”

Name one time that has ever happened. Go ahead, loudmouth, we’ll wait.


37 posted on 01/12/2011 9:37:29 AM PST by CodeToad (Islam needs to be banned in the US and treated as a criminal enterprise.)
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To: edpc
You know, I went the local grocer to pick up some ice cream one afternoon. I happened to pick up one of my 45's for a quick 10 minute run to the store.

I had my daughter(11yr old) with me.

We heard a crash on the aisle over and two men arguing. As we rounded the corner both had armed themselves with knives and were facing off.

My FIRST instinct was get my daughter behind me as I reached for the Colt. My second was to announce my intention to shoot the first one of the two men that advanced on the other. This was loud enough for both of them to turn and look at my hand on the pistol(still holstered). The one closest took one step towards me and the weapon was out in a heartbeat.

After that BOTH were very compliant with dropping knives, getting prone on the floor with arms stretched out, and the smell of urine where they both had lost control, waiting for the police to arrive.

Daughter was shook up for a while because of it, and requested a lot more range time between us.

Lesson: You never know.

38 posted on 01/12/2011 9:40:19 AM PST by Wizdum (Wisdom is what you gain when things go wrong.)
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To: domeika

Stores aren’t permitted to make judgement calls on whether to sell you a gun or not. Pass the Fed NICS test and it’s yours.


39 posted on 01/12/2011 10:23:00 AM PST by B4Ranch (Do NOT remain seated until this ride comes to a full and complete stop! We're going the wrong way!)
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To: B4Ranch
Stores aren’t permitted to make judgement calls on whether to sell you a gun or not. Pass the Fed NICS test and it’s yours.

Exactly. And if Loughner was prosecuted for his death threat(s), he would not have been approved by NICS.
40 posted on 01/12/2011 10:27:26 AM PST by domeika
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To: Arrowhead1952
Dr. Hupp is a sub host on KLBJ in the morning and afternoon talk shows. I really like her.

Your'e welcome. I'm just barely familiar with her, but from watching a few videos of her now and in the past, she seems like a great gal.

41 posted on 01/12/2011 12:07:01 PM PST by beaversmom
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To: beaversmom; basil
She has talked about the Killeen Luby massacre on several occasions. FReeper basil knows her from the Second Amendment Sister organization.
42 posted on 01/12/2011 12:16:22 PM PST by Arrowhead1952 (America has two cancers - democrats and RINOS.)
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To: beaversmom; basil
She has talked about the Killeen Luby massacre on several occasions. FReeper basil knows her from the Second Amendment Sister organization.
43 posted on 01/12/2011 12:16:36 PM PST by Arrowhead1952 (America has two cancers - democrats and RINOS.)
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To: Arrowhead1952

That’s interesting. I’ve known of her story for a while, but always have to look up her name if I’m trying to reference her.


44 posted on 01/12/2011 12:19:51 PM PST by beaversmom
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To: beaversmom

Dr. Hupp is quite passionate and still emotional at times when she talks about that awful day. She had a lot to do with getting the concealed carry laws passed in Texas.


45 posted on 01/12/2011 12:46:19 PM PST by Arrowhead1952 (America has two cancers - democrats and RINOS.)
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To: mmercier
I would have been digging three holes alone.

Bo has a conscience and a big mouth.

Thank you for no longer carrying. I also want to hope you never become my friend. If it were a serious enough confrontation to defend yourself with deadly force, it is also serious enough to report to the police - not shoot, shovel, and shut-up which seems to be what you had in mind if you pulled the trigger. That takes "self defense" from just that to something else otherwise known as "murder".

The only valid reason to ccw and use the weapon is to protect yourself or those immediately around you (such as your family) from death and/or severe bodily injury. Therefore, the threat has to be present and you have to be in fear for your life and limb. In the end one might have to prove it to a jury, so you had better be positive when you start pressing the trigger.

Carrying a concealed weapon does not make one an unofficial member of the local police force (or an executioner) nor does carrying one give you that right or privilege. However, being in a situation and a crowd (like the one in Tucson) and having a madman gunning down those around you would certainly qualify for using available deadly force to stop the murderous threat to yourself and others in the immediate vicinity. After all, it took the cops 10 minutes to show up after the shooting.

Perhaps somebody present with a ccw and armed could have ended it earlier? Perhaps. Perhaps not. It was just lucky a retired army guy was there and really close and with the presence of mind to get a hand on this killer as he passed by and before he could reload and do more killing. But that is not something I would want to depend on for my survival.

I don't carry a gun because it's "convenient", nor I want to prove I'm some sort of macho guy, neither do I want to be an honorary deputy sherriff. I carry one because I'm getting too old to properly fight or run and carrying a cop around is too heavy. Therefore, my self-defense options are increasingly limited. Plus, I have zero desire to hold my wife's hand while she is on a ventilator because she isn't as big as me or able to run as fast.

You are certainly free to not carry. Again, I thank you for not doing so with your present attitude.

46 posted on 01/12/2011 2:18:39 PM PST by Gritty (The Democrats are becoming a totalitarian cult, bent on seizing power by any means necessary-R Poe)
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To: mmercier
I could care less

Does that mean that you care more?

47 posted on 01/12/2011 2:31:10 PM PST by windsorknot
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To: Arrowhead1952
Arrowhead, Suzanna Hupp is a life time member of Second Amendment Sisters, as well as our national radio and television spokesman. She is one of the nicest people I know--and she has taken the deaths of her family and all those people in Luby's that day to do all she can do for the right of every law-abiding citizen to be able to defend themselves with a gun if the need ever arises.

She's pretty good on the range, too--BTW.

48 posted on 01/12/2011 3:19:55 PM PST by basil (It's time to rid the country of "Gun Free Zones" aka "Killing Fields")
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To: mmercier
I will save my own a$$, and I do not need a gun. I'll just take theirs.

In your first post weren't you talking about "delusions"?

49 posted on 01/12/2011 3:37:50 PM PST by OldPossum
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To: windsorknot
I could care less

Does that mean that you care more?

I wonder if people will ever replace that expression "I could care less" with the logical expression "I could not care less."

Think about it for 20 seconds. If "you could not care less" you don't care. If "you could care less" you care somewhat, now don't you?

50 posted on 01/12/2011 3:49:53 PM PST by OldPossum
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