Free Republic
Browse · Search
Bloggers & Personal
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Why I am not worried about Japan’s nuclear reactors
Morgsatlarge ^ | 3/13/2011 | Dr. Josef Oehmen (M.I.T.)

Posted on 03/13/2011 9:24:12 AM PDT by Qbert

I know this is a fairly full on statement from someone posting his very first blog. It will also be far and away the most well written, intelligent post I ever make (I hope!) It also means I am not responsible for its content.

This post is by Dr Josef Oehmen, a research scientist at MIT, in Boston.

He is a PhD Scientist, whose father has extensive experience in Germany’s nuclear industry. I asked him to write this information to my family in Australia, who were being made sick with worry by the media reports coming from Japan. I am republishing it with his permission.

It is a few hours old, so if any information is out of date, blame me for the delay in getting it published.

This is his text in full and unedited. It is very long, so get comfy.

I am writing this text (Mar 12) to give you some peace of mind regarding some of the troubles in Japan, that is the safety of Japan’s nuclear reactors. Up front, the situation is serious, but under control. And this text is long! But you will know more about nuclear power plants after reading it than all journalists on this planet put together.

There was and will *not* be any significant release of radioactivity.

By “significant” I mean a level of radiation of more than what you would receive on – say – a long distance flight, or drinking a glass of beer that comes from certain areas with high levels of natural background radiation.

I have been reading every news release on the incident since the earthquake. There has not been one single (!) report that was accurate and free of errors (and part of that problem is also a weakness in the Japanese crisis communication). By “not free of errors” I do not refer to tendentious anti-nuclear journalism – that is quite normal these days. By “not free of errors” I mean blatant errors regarding physics and natural law, as well as gross misinterpretation of facts, due to an obvious lack of fundamental and basic understanding of the way nuclear reactors are build and operated. I have read a 3 page report on CNN where every single paragraph contained an error.

We will have to cover some fundamentals, before we get into what is going on.

Construction of the Fukushima nuclear power plants

The plants at Fukushima are so called Boiling Water Reactors, or BWR for short. Boiling Water Reactors are similar to a pressure cooker. The nuclear fuel heats water, the water boils and creates steam, the steam then drives turbines that create the electricity, and the steam is then cooled and condensed back to water, and the water send back to be heated by the nuclear fuel. The pressure cooker operates at about 250 °C.

The nuclear fuel is uranium oxide. Uranium oxide is a ceramic with a very high melting point of about 3000 °C. The fuel is manufactured in pellets (think little cylinders the size of Lego bricks). Those pieces are then put into a long tube made of Zircaloy with a melting point of 2200 °C, and sealed tight. The assembly is called a fuel rod. These fuel rods are then put together to form larger packages, and a number of these packages are then put into the reactor. All these packages together are referred to as “the core”.

The Zircaloy casing is the first containment. It separates the radioactive fuel from the rest of the world.

The core is then placed in the “pressure vessels”. That is the pressure cooker we talked about before. The pressure vessels is the second containment. This is one sturdy piece of a pot, designed to safely contain the core for temperatures several hundred °C. That covers the scenarios where cooling can be restored at some point.

The entire “hardware” of the nuclear reactor – the pressure vessel and all pipes, pumps, coolant (water) reserves, are then encased in the third containment. The third containment is a hermetically (air tight) sealed, very thick bubble of the strongest steel. The third containment is designed, built and tested for one single purpose: To contain, indefinitely, a complete core meltdown. For that purpose, a large and thick concrete basin is cast under the pressure vessel (the second containment), which is filled with graphite, all inside the third containment. This is the so-called “core catcher”. If the core melts and the pressure vessel bursts (and eventually melts), it will catch the molten fuel and everything else. It is built in such a way that the nuclear fuel will be spread out, so it can cool down.

This third containment is then surrounded by the reactor building. The reactor building is an outer shell that is supposed to keep the weather out, but nothing in. (this is the part that was damaged in the explosion, but more to that later).

Fundamentals of nuclear reactions

The uranium fuel generates heat by nuclear fission. Big uranium atoms are split into smaller atoms. That generates heat plus neutrons (one of the particles that forms an atom). When the neutron hits another uranium atom, that splits, generating more neutrons and so on. That is called the nuclear chain reaction.

Now, just packing a lot of fuel rods next to each other would quickly lead to overheating and after about 45 minutes to a melting of the fuel rods. It is worth mentioning at this point that the nuclear fuel in a reactor can *never* cause a nuclear explosion the type of a nuclear bomb. Building a nuclear bomb is actually quite difficult (ask Iran). In Chernobyl, the explosion was caused by excessive pressure buildup, hydrogen explosion and rupture of all containments, propelling molten core material into the environment (a “dirty bomb”). Why that did not and will not happen in Japan, further below.

In order to control the nuclear chain reaction, the reactor operators use so-called “moderator rods”. The moderator rods absorb the neutrons and kill the chain reaction instantaneously. A nuclear reactor is built in such a way, that when operating normally, you take out all the moderator rods. The coolant water then takes away the heat (and converts it into steam and electricity) at the same rate as the core produces it. And you have a lot of leeway around the standard operating point of 250°C.

The challenge is that after inserting the rods and stopping the chain reaction, the core still keeps producing heat. The uranium “stopped” the chain reaction. But a number of intermediate radioactive elements are created by the uranium during its fission process, most notably Cesium and Iodine isotopes, i.e. radioactive versions of these elements that will eventually split up into smaller atoms and not be radioactive anymore. Those elements keep decaying and producing heat. Because they are not regenerated any longer from the uranium (the uranium stopped decaying after the moderator rods were put in), they get less and less, and so the core cools down over a matter of days, until those intermediate radioactive elements are used up.

This residual heat is causing the headaches right now.

So the first “type” of radioactive material is the uranium in the fuel rods, plus the intermediate radioactive elements that the uranium splits into, also inside the fuel rod (Cesium and Iodine).

There is a second type of radioactive material created, outside the fuel rods. The big main difference up front: Those radioactive materials have a very short half-life, that means that they decay very fast and split into non-radioactive materials. By fast I mean seconds. So if these radioactive materials are released into the environment, yes, radioactivity was released, but no, it is not dangerous, at all. Why? By the time you spelled “R-A-D-I-O-N-U-C-L-I-D-E”, they will be harmless, because they will have split up into non radioactive elements. Those radioactive elements are N-16, the radioactive isotope (or version) of nitrogen (air). The others are noble gases such as Xenon. But where do they come from? When the uranium splits, it generates a neutron (see above). Most of these neutrons will hit other uranium atoms and keep the nuclear chain reaction going. But some will leave the fuel rod and hit the water molecules, or the air that is in the water. Then, a non-radioactive element can “capture” the neutron. It becomes radioactive. As described above, it will quickly (seconds) get rid again of the neutron to return to its former beautiful self.

This second “type” of radiation is very important when we talk about the radioactivity being released into the environment later on.

What happened at Fukushima

I will try to summarize the main facts. The earthquake that hit Japan was 7 times more powerful than the worst earthquake the nuclear power plant was built for (the Richter scale works logarithmically; the difference between the 8.2 that the plants were built for and the 8.9 that happened is 7 times, not 0.7). So the first hooray for Japanese engineering, everything held up.

When the earthquake hit with 8.9, the nuclear reactors all went into automatic shutdown. Within seconds after the earthquake started, the moderator rods had been inserted into the core and nuclear chain reaction of the uranium stopped. Now, the cooling system has to carry away the residual heat. The residual heat load is about 3% of the heat load under normal operating conditions.

The earthquake destroyed the external power supply of the nuclear reactor. That is one of the most serious accidents for a nuclear power plant, and accordingly, a “plant black out” receives a lot of attention when designing backup systems. The power is needed to keep the coolant pumps working. Since the power plant had been shut down, it cannot produce any electricity by itself any more.

Things were going well for an hour. One set of multiple sets of emergency Diesel power generators kicked in and provided the electricity that was needed. Then the Tsunami came, much bigger than people had expected when building the power plant (see above, factor 7). The tsunami took out all multiple sets of backup Diesel generators.

When designing a nuclear power plant, engineers follow a philosophy called “Defense of Depth”. That means that you first build everything to withstand the worst catastrophe you can imagine, and then design the plant in such a way that it can still handle one system failure (that you thought could never happen) after the other. A tsunami taking out all backup power in one swift strike is such a scenario. The last line of defense is putting everything into the third containment (see above), that will keep everything, whatever the mess, moderator rods in our out, core molten or not, inside the reactor.

When the diesel generators were gone, the reactor operators switched to emergency battery power. The batteries were designed as one of the backups to the backups, to provide power for cooling the core for 8 hours. And they did.

Within the 8 hours, another power source had to be found and connected to the power plant. The power grid was down due to the earthquake. The diesel generators were destroyed by the tsunami. So mobile diesel generators were trucked in.

This is where things started to go seriously wrong. The external power generators could not be connected to the power plant (the plugs did not fit). So after the batteries ran out, the residual heat could not be carried away any more.

At this point the plant operators begin to follow emergency procedures that are in place for a “loss of cooling event”. It is again a step along the “Depth of Defense” lines. The power to the cooling systems should never have failed completely, but it did, so they “retreat” to the next line of defense. All of this, however shocking it seems to us, is part of the day-to-day training you go through as an operator, right through to managing a core meltdown.

It was at this stage that people started to talk about core meltdown. Because at the end of the day, if cooling cannot be restored, the core will eventually melt (after hours or days), and the last line of defense, the core catcher and third containment, would come into play.

But the goal at this stage was to manage the core while it was heating up, and ensure that the first containment (the Zircaloy tubes that contains the nuclear fuel), as well as the second containment (our pressure cooker) remain intact and operational for as long as possible, to give the engineers time to fix the cooling systems.

Because cooling the core is such a big deal, the reactor has a number of cooling systems, each in multiple versions (the reactor water cleanup system, the decay heat removal, the reactor core isolating cooling, the standby liquid cooling system, and the emergency core cooling system). Which one failed when or did not fail is not clear at this point in time.

So imagine our pressure cooker on the stove, heat on low, but on. The operators use whatever cooling system capacity they have to get rid of as much heat as possible, but the pressure starts building up. The priority now is to maintain integrity of the first containment (keep temperature of the fuel rods below 2200°C), as well as the second containment, the pressure cooker.  In order to maintain integrity of the pressure cooker (the second containment), the pressure has to be released from time to time. Because the ability to do that in an emergency is so important, the reactor has 11 pressure release valves. The operators now started venting steam from time to time to control the pressure. The temperature at this stage was about 550°C.

This is when the reports about “radiation leakage” starting coming in. I believe I explained above why venting the steam is theoretically the same as releasing radiation into the environment, but why it was and is not dangerous. The radioactive nitrogen as well as the noble gases do not pose a threat to human health.

At some stage during this venting, the explosion occurred. The explosion took place outside of the third containment (our “last line of defense”), and the reactor building. Remember that the reactor building has no function in keeping the radioactivity contained. It is not entirely clear yet what has happened, but this is the likely scenario: The operators decided to vent the steam from the pressure vessel not directly into the environment, but into the space between the third containment and the reactor building (to give the radioactivity in the steam more time to subside). The problem is that at the high temperatures that the core had reached at this stage, water molecules can “disassociate” into oxygen and hydrogen – an explosive mixture. And it did explode, outside the third containment, damaging the reactor building around. It was that sort of explosion, but inside the pressure vessel (because it was badly designed and not managed properly by the operators) that lead to the explosion of Chernobyl. This was never a risk at Fukushima. The problem of hydrogen-oxygen formation is one of the biggies when you design a power plant (if you are not Soviet, that is), so the reactor is build and operated in a way it cannot happen inside the containment. It happened outside, which was not intended but a possible scenario and OK, because it did not pose a risk for the containment.

So the pressure was under control, as steam was vented. Now, if you keep boiling your pot, the problem is that the water level will keep falling and falling. The core is covered by several meters of water in order to allow for some time to pass (hours, days) before it gets exposed. Once the rods start to be exposed at the top, the exposed parts will reach the critical temperature of 2200 °C after about 45 minutes. This is when the first containment, the Zircaloy tube, would fail.

And this started to happen. The cooling could not be restored before there was some (very limited, but still) damage to the casing of some of the fuel. The nuclear material itself was still intact, but the surrounding Zircaloy shell had started melting. What happened now is that some of the byproducts of the uranium decay – radioactive Cesium and Iodine – started to mix with the steam. The big problem, uranium, was still under control, because the uranium oxide rods were good until 3000 °C. It is confirmed that a very small amount of Cesium and Iodine was measured in the steam that was released into the atmosphere.

It seems this was the “go signal” for a major plan B. The small amounts of Cesium that were measured told the operators that the first containment on one of the rods somewhere was about to give. The Plan A had been to restore one of the regular cooling systems to the core. Why that failed is unclear. One plausible explanation is that the tsunami also took away / polluted all the clean water needed for the regular cooling systems.

The water used in the cooling system is very clean, demineralized (like distilled) water. The reason to use pure water is the above mentioned activation by the neutrons from the Uranium: Pure water does not get activated much, so stays practically radioactive-free. Dirt or salt in the water will absorb the neutrons quicker, becoming more radioactive. This has no effect whatsoever on the core – it does not care what it is cooled by. But it makes life more difficult for the operators and mechanics when they have to deal with activated (i.e. slightly radioactive) water.

But Plan A had failed – cooling systems down or additional clean water unavailable – so Plan B came into effect. This is what it looks like happened:

In order to prevent a core meltdown, the operators started to use sea water to cool the core. I am not quite sure if they flooded our pressure cooker with it (the second containment), or if they flooded the third containment, immersing the pressure cooker. But that is not relevant for us.

The point is that the nuclear fuel has now been cooled down. Because the chain reaction has been stopped a long time ago, there is only very little residual heat being produced now. The large amount of cooling water that has been used is sufficient to take up that heat. Because it is a lot of water, the core does not produce sufficient heat any more to produce any significant pressure. Also, boric acid has been added to the seawater. Boric acid is “liquid control rod”. Whatever decay is still going on, the Boron will capture the neutrons and further speed up the cooling down of the core.

The plant came close to a core meltdown. Here is the worst-case scenario that was avoided: If the seawater could not have been used for treatment, the operators would have continued to vent the water steam to avoid pressure buildup. The third containment would then have been completely sealed to allow the core meltdown to happen without releasing radioactive material. After the meltdown, there would have been a waiting period for the intermediate radioactive materials to decay inside the reactor, and all radioactive particles to settle on a surface inside the containment. The cooling system would have been restored eventually, and the molten core cooled to a manageable temperature. The containment would have been cleaned up on the inside. Then a messy job of removing the molten core from the containment would have begun, packing the (now solid again) fuel bit by bit into transportation containers to be shipped to processing plants. Depending on the damage, the block of the plant would then either be repaired or dismantled.

Now, where does that leave us?

The plant is safe now and will stay safe.

Japan is looking at an INES Level 4 Accident: Nuclear accident with local consequences. That is bad for the company that owns the plant, but not for anyone else.

Some radiation was released when the pressure vessel was vented. All radioactive isotopes from the activated steam have gone (decayed). A very small amount of Cesium was released, as well as Iodine. If you were sitting on top of the plants’ chimney when they were venting, you should probably give up smoking to return to your former life expectancy. The Cesium and Iodine isotopes were carried out to the sea and will never be seen again.

There was some limited damage to the first containment. That means that some amounts of radioactive Cesium and Iodine will also be released into the cooling water, but no Uranium or other nasty stuff (the Uranium oxide does not “dissolve” in the water). There are facilities for treating the cooling water inside the third containment. The radioactive Cesium and Iodine will be removed there and eventually stored as radioactive waste in terminal storage.

The seawater used as cooling water will be activated to some degree. Because the control rods are fully inserted, the Uranium chain reaction is not happening. That means the “main” nuclear reaction is not happening, thus not contributing to the activation. The intermediate radioactive materials (Cesium and Iodine) are also almost gone at this stage, because the Uranium decay was stopped a long time ago. This further reduces the activation. The bottom line is that there will be some low level of activation of the seawater, which will also be removed by the treatment facilities.

The seawater will then be replaced over time with the “normal” cooling water

The reactor core will then be dismantled and transported to a processing facility, just like during a regular fuel change. Fuel rods and the entire plant will be checked for potential damage. This will take about 4-5 years.

The safety systems on all Japanese plants will be upgraded to withstand a 9.0 earthquake and tsunami (or worse) I believe the most significant problem will be a prolonged power shortage. About half of Japan’s nuclear reactors will probably have to be inspected, reducing the nation’s power generating capacity by 15%. This will probably be covered by running gas power plants that are usually only used for peak loads to cover some of the base load as well. That will increase your electricity bill, as well as lead to potential power shortages during peak demand, in Japan.

If you want to stay informed, please forget the usual media outlets and consult the following websites:

http://www.world-nuclear-news.org/RS_Battle_to_stabilise_earthquake_reactors_1203111.html

http://bravenewclimate.com/2011/03/12/japan-nuclear-earthquake/

http://ansnuclearcafe.org/2011/03/11/media-updates-on-nuclear-power-stations-in-japan/


TOPICS: Science
KEYWORDS: bwr; fukushima; japan
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-72 next last

1 posted on 03/13/2011 9:24:19 AM PDT by Qbert
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Qbert

bump


2 posted on 03/13/2011 9:31:04 AM PDT by goodnesswins (Unlike the West, the Islamic world is serious.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: goodnesswins

bookmarked


3 posted on 03/13/2011 9:35:43 AM PDT by Charlespg
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

bump!


4 posted on 03/13/2011 9:37:50 AM PDT by EBH ( Whether you eat your bread or see it vanish into a looter's stomach, is an absolute.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Thanks Qbert!


5 posted on 03/13/2011 9:39:06 AM PDT by SteamShovel ("Does the noise in my head bother you?")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert
Very lucid explanation. This guy should be on TV every channel. Thanks for posting this.
6 posted on 03/13/2011 9:43:46 AM PDT by hinckley buzzard
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

We have our hysteria, its ours, we worked for it, we earned it and nobody is going to take it away!


7 posted on 03/13/2011 9:43:59 AM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Fascinating stuff - thanks for posting.


8 posted on 03/13/2011 9:46:49 AM PDT by andyk (Wealth != Income)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

” But you will know more about nuclear power plants after reading it “.
And I thank you for that Qbert,
Good job


9 posted on 03/13/2011 9:50:31 AM PDT by Joe Boucher ((FUBO))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/bloggers/2688107/posts


10 posted on 03/13/2011 9:54:38 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (The 2nd Amendment follows right behind the 1st because some people are hard of hearing.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Best... Analysis... Yet...

Bravo!


11 posted on 03/13/2011 9:57:27 AM PDT by HangnJudge
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Thank you. Very interesting.


12 posted on 03/13/2011 10:00:33 AM PDT by JimSEA
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Thanks for the post, but I’ll be damned before I hang out near that plant.


13 posted on 03/13/2011 10:05:12 AM PDT by eyedigress ((Old storm chaser from the west)?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert
Thanks for the information. I haven't had time to read the whole article and am wondering if their spent-fuel facilities are safe. They have over fifty nuclear plants so there must be a lot of waste somewhere.

Afterthought . . . maybe your knowledge could be used in a constructive way to clean up the mess (among others) left at Hanford, Washington.

14 posted on 03/13/2011 10:05:50 AM PDT by TiaS
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

The Japanese BWRs do not have a core catcher. There is nothing like that incorporated in GE’s design unless it was some sort of add-on. At TMI the internals in the reactor including the fuel rods, control rods and the stainless steel rack support structures completely melted. All of that ended up in the bottom of the reactor looking like a pile of rubble. The reactor (4” thick steel) was never breached.


15 posted on 03/13/2011 10:10:59 AM PDT by meatloaf
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Excellent post. Thanks.


16 posted on 03/13/2011 10:17:19 AM PDT by all the best
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert; andyk
Fascinating stuff - thanks for posting.

I agree. Thanks Qbert and thank to Dr Josef Oehmen.

17 posted on 03/13/2011 10:23:19 AM PDT by PGalt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Good post. Mostly accurate.


18 posted on 03/13/2011 10:23:31 AM PDT by Nuc 1.1 (Liberals aren't Patriots. Remember 1789!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert; andyk
Fascinating stuff - thanks for posting.

I agree. Thanks Qbert and thanks to Dr Josef Oehmen.

19 posted on 03/13/2011 10:23:41 AM PDT by PGalt
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

I wish this could be posted on the Front Page, I am SO tired of the chicken Littles on every quake thread on FR....


20 posted on 03/13/2011 10:24:29 AM PDT by ScreamingFist (Quiet the Idiot)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

I bow to your excellent post.

Love the fact that the material has a half life of mere seconds and is not really a threat.

Further, the entire containment system and Dr. Oehmen’s explanation is superb.

Now I can go on about my day and give a quick tutorial to others, hopefully giving them ease of mind.


21 posted on 03/13/2011 10:28:16 AM PDT by Vendome ("Don't take life so seriously... You'll never live through it anyway")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: TiaS

Thanks.

Just to clarify, I’m not the author of the blog- I just felt it was important to post this because there seems to be a lot of misinformation floating around the Internet about the reactors.

(I will be speaking this week with a friend of mine whose father is a nuclear scientist, and will try to see if he has any further information that may be helpful.)


22 posted on 03/13/2011 10:30:35 AM PDT by Qbert ("I seem to smell the stench of appeasement in the air" - Margaret Thatcher)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: hinckley buzzard
This guy should be on TV every channel.

Oh no! Can't let *that* happen. If he did, then people would no longer be alarmed, and they [gasp] might stop watching 24-hour news! The loss of advertising revenue! Think of the loss of revenue!

23 posted on 03/13/2011 10:35:18 AM PDT by COBOL2Java (Obama is the least qualified guy in whatever room he walks into.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Thank you!

The reporting has been atrocious.


24 posted on 03/13/2011 10:36:48 AM PDT by FrogMom (There is no such thing as an honest democrat!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert
Very informative.

Can anyone verify there is, in fact, a 3rd containment at the reactor in question?

25 posted on 03/13/2011 10:37:36 AM PDT by Mariner (USS Tarawa, VQ3, USS Benjamin Stoddert, NAVCAMS WestPac, 7th Fleet, Navcommsta Puget Sound)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Nuc 1.1
For those of us who are not engaged in nuclear physics and found the good doctor's commentary very clear and informative, could you please elabourate on any inaccuracies.

Also, what is the half-life of the radioactive isotopes of iodine and cesium to which the doctor refers? These numbers did not appear in the article (or, perhaps I just missed them). These would seem to be somewhat of importance, as radioactive cesium is oftentimes mentioned as the principal nasty agent in a (putative) terrorist dirty-bomb attack.

Thank you for any corrections/information you can add, and FReegards!

26 posted on 03/13/2011 10:37:36 AM PDT by SAJ (Zerobama -- a phony and a prick, therefore a dildo)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Thnaks for this.


27 posted on 03/13/2011 10:37:56 AM PDT by mad_as_he$$
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Thanks for this.


28 posted on 03/13/2011 10:38:05 AM PDT by mad_as_he$$
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Robert A. Cook, PE

Ok this makes more sense than the “diesel fuel was contaiminated with seawater” line from yesterday.


29 posted on 03/13/2011 10:40:20 AM PDT by mad_as_he$$
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert
Thanks for posting this, and thanks to the original author for explaining the situation.

Did anyone else have to look up the word "tendentious?" Or am I just the product of a State educational system? :-)

30 posted on 03/13/2011 10:47:50 AM PDT by ThunderSleeps (Stop obama now! Stop the hussein - insane agenda!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SunkenCiv

I vote for this thread, because it was posted in full. :-)


31 posted on 03/13/2011 10:50:07 AM PDT by Larry Lucido
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Mariner; Qbert; All
OK, I just looked some things up and I have to call BS! on this "blog". No fault to Qbert, he's just passing it along.

First, the GE BWR-1 reactor in question has NO 3rd containment. If the "pressure cooker" is breached, the fuel is exposed to the environment.

Secondly, Cesium-137 has a 30yr half-life. If you were to get a big breath full of that steam, you would likely have health problems, if not serious health problems. That's not to say it was concentrated or didn't adequately disperse at sea.

32 posted on 03/13/2011 10:53:19 AM PDT by Mariner (USS Tarawa, VQ3, USS Benjamin Stoddert, NAVCAMS WestPac, 7th Fleet, Navcommsta Puget Sound)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: Qbert
I will try to summarize the main facts. The earthquake that hit Japan was 7 times more powerful than the worst earthquake the nuclear power plant was built for (the Richter scale works logarithmically; the difference between the 8.2 that the plants were built for and the 8.9 that happened is 7 times, not 0.7). So the first hooray for Japanese engineering, everything held up.

When the earthquake hit with 8.9, the nuclear reactors all went into automatic shutdown. Within seconds after the earthquake started, the moderator rods had been inserted into the core and nuclear chain reaction of the uranium stopped. Now, the cooling system has to carry away the residual heat. The residual heat load is about 3% of the heat load under normal operating conditions.

Good post overall, but the earthquake was 8.9 at the epicenter, not where the nuclear reactors are.

33 posted on 03/13/2011 11:00:20 AM PDT by Moonman62 (Half of all Americans are above average. Politicians come from the other half.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Al B.

Good read.....


34 posted on 03/13/2011 11:01:52 AM PDT by HalfFull ("Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery?" -PHenry)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

bookmarked


35 posted on 03/13/2011 11:04:24 AM PDT by RckyRaCoCo (I prefer liberty with danger to peace with slavery, IXNAY THE TSA!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

THIS IS WHY I LOVE Free Republic!

Lots of accurate, comprehensive information, usually with references.

Thanks for posting, Qbert!


36 posted on 03/13/2011 11:04:44 AM PDT by BwanaNdege
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SAJ
Iodine 131 has a half life of about 8 days, so it's very radioactive and absorbed by the thyroid.

Cesium 137 is a lot less radioactive, it has a half life of about 30 years. As far as I know, it doesn't have a special affinity for a specific organ or tissue

37 posted on 03/13/2011 11:07:22 AM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

I am a perfect example of how partial knowledge can be dangerous. I nod to better information. My profs would’ve had my ass for some of my thoughts. Great info.


38 posted on 03/13/2011 11:10:49 AM PDT by reed13k (For evil to triumph it is only necessary for good men to do nothing.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Toddsterpatriot

Cesium is in the same grouping on the periodic chart (1A) as sodium and potassium and therefore could be found anywhere those two elements (or their salts) are found. In other words, just about everywhere.


39 posted on 03/13/2011 11:21:10 AM PDT by reg45
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: neverdem; decimon; justa-hairyape; spokeshave; Tolsti2

*PING*


40 posted on 03/13/2011 11:22:01 AM PDT by grey_whiskers (The opinions are solely those of the author and are subject to change without notice.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Mariner

I wouldn’t go so far as to call it “BS”. That seems a bit harsh to a rather reasoned explanation by someone trying to help people to chill out, which is badly needed.

Let’s be charitable and call it inaccurate while we wait to see. As you implied, there is a lot of good info here.

If the author made an honest error which might invalidate the core of his analysis, then that will be apparent.


41 posted on 03/13/2011 11:31:58 AM PDT by rlmorel (How to relate to Liberals? Take a Conservative, remove all responsibility...logic...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: Toddsterpatriot

It has been a while for me, but I do recall Cs-137 is very dangerous when inhaled or ingested. That was the case in South America when some people found a discarded medical source in a dump and broke it open to see what was inside.


42 posted on 03/13/2011 11:39:47 AM PDT by rlmorel (How to relate to Liberals? Take a Conservative, remove all responsibility...logic...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: rlmorel

Yes, it’s a really dangerous gamma and beta source, but much less radioactive than iodine 131.


43 posted on 03/13/2011 11:50:59 AM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

OK, but nothing mentioned to reduce the threat of Mothra.


44 posted on 03/13/2011 11:52:56 AM PDT by Dr. Sheldon Cooper (I'm not insane, my mother had me tested!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

ping good post


45 posted on 03/13/2011 11:58:59 AM PDT by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Mariner

“First, the GE BWR-1 reactor in question has NO 3rd containment. If the “pressure cooker” is breached, the fuel is exposed to the environment.”

From where are you getting this information?


46 posted on 03/13/2011 12:02:27 PM PDT by Qbert ("I seem to smell the stench of appeasement in the air" - Margaret Thatcher)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

I think he is correct on this, containment appears to be a identified weakness in this circa 1971 design.


47 posted on 03/13/2011 12:36:08 PM PDT by rlmorel (How to relate to Liberals? Take a Conservative, remove all responsibility...logic...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: Qbert

Time,distance & shielding.....


48 posted on 03/13/2011 12:44:03 PM PDT by stevecmd
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Larry Lucido

:’D


49 posted on 03/13/2011 12:49:56 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (The 2nd Amendment follows right behind the 1st because some people are hard of hearing.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: rlmorel

“I think he is correct on this, containment appears to be a identified weakness in this circa 1971 design.”

—I’m just correcting the claim that the Fukushima reactors are BWR-1 types. They’re actually all BWR-3 and higher:

http://www-pub.iaea.org/MTCD/publications/PDF/CNPP2010_CD/pages/AnnexII/tables/table2.htm

As for containment flaws with this design- could well be, I don’t know. I’ll defer to the experts here.


50 posted on 03/13/2011 12:56:22 PM PDT by Qbert ("I seem to smell the stench of appeasement in the air" - Margaret Thatcher)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-72 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Bloggers & Personal
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson