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Considerations For SHTF Living & Bug Out Locations
SHTF Plan ^ | 4-4-2011 | Mac Slavo

Posted on 05/04/2011 4:43:43 PM PDT by blam

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To: All
Another organization that I admire is Aashray

There are a couple of children of day-laborers whose education through school (from age 8-16) we sponsor at Aashray. It sounds very noble of me, but you know how much it costs? For 9 years of school at a "good school" ?(namely one that will teach them English, a tool to help them escape poverty -- on a side note, they are the children of Tamil day laborers -- Tamil is a different language from the language of the state of Bombay, Marathi and from the Indian national languages, Hindi/English. These people are the lowest caste and no one in their family has ever been literate)

It only costs $3,000 --> not annually, but for the entire 9 years, plus giving them clothes, buying them books and stationary and school materials. What is $3,000 to most of us? Nothing. Yet it can help break the cycle of poverty.

101 posted on 05/05/2011 1:40:18 AM PDT by Cronos (Libspeak: "Yes there is proof. And no, for the sake of privacy I am not posting it here.")
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To: All
Another organization that I admire is Aashray

There are a couple of children of day-laborers whose education through school (from age 8-16) we sponsor at Aashray. It sounds very noble of me, but you know how much it costs? For 9 years of school at a "good school" ?(namely one that will teach them English, a tool to help them escape poverty -- on a side note, they are the children of Tamil day laborers -- Tamil is a different language from the language of the state of Bombay, Marathi and from the Indian national languages, Hindi/English. These people are the lowest caste and no one in their family has ever been literate)

It only costs $3,000 --> not annually, but for the entire 9 years, plus giving them clothes, buying them books and stationary and school materials. What is $3,000 to most of us? Nothing. Yet it can help break the cycle of poverty.

One man I met in Jersey (he must be 30 something now) had a similar background, only worse -- the son of lowest caste illiterate day laborers, he was blinded at the age of 6.

He was lucky that a priest from St. Xavier's was helping there and took him to St. Xavier's school at Fort, Bombay.

the boy was smart and studied his way and church charities sponsored his education through until 21. Then he got a scholarship to a uni in the US and now he's doing pretty well for himself. He's brought his parents out of the slums, educated his brothers and sisters and set them out of poverty. The family is middle-class now and has a house and pride -- and he did it on his own.

These people need our help to give them the opportunity to help themselves.

What is agonizing is not their poverty but how little it takes to help them step OUT of generations of poverty.

102 posted on 05/05/2011 1:44:33 AM PDT by Cronos (Libspeak: "Yes there is proof. And no, for the sake of privacy I am not posting it here.")
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To: PA Engineer
"Come on. Can't be that well insulated. I live in one of those places (in the east and competitive with Anchorage) and it takes no more than 5 chords of seasoned hardwood to heat (my house is not super-insulated). We are one of the worst at about 6000 HDDs."

It's the 60-80 mph winds here (110 mph wind load for building code), mostly, and yes, some extremes (-35, F, this winter). But more than that, propane prices over $4 (tourism, retirees). We're blessed with well over 300 sun days in my treeless area, but nearly no one takes full advantage of it (heating, drainback systems needed but too much work for most). ...mornings around 10, F, now, and some snows. I'm at over 9,000 feet just east of a few 14-ers (thus, the high winds most days).


103 posted on 05/05/2011 1:49:24 AM PDT by familyop ("Don't worry, they'll row for a month before they figure out I'm fakin' it." --Deacon, "Waterworld")
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To: PA Engineer

BTW, there are a few closed loop solar radiant heat systems here, but very few (mostly boiler fired, with the pex tubing right in the top inch of floors!). The closed loop systems have little (monoslab foundations) to no (crawlspace) thermal mass. ...stainless heat exchangers. ...high pressure, too much collector efficiency (too hot for parts), they’re a high cost disaster. Here’s one that I like (Gary’s, with a few modifications, like larger concrete tank in shed w/ frost-protected foundation). ...pex for radiant in the bottom of a frost-protected, concrete slab as per the federal guide for FPSFs, of course.

The Solar Shed — Using Solar Collectors Mounted on an Outbuilding for House Heating
http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/SpaceHeating/SolarShed/solarshed.htm

But for cloudier, higher latitude places, I don’t know. ...would need very large, insulate subterranean tanks in insulated sheds or houses at least, and with backup (maybe inline water heaters at least).


104 posted on 05/05/2011 1:59:42 AM PDT by familyop ("Don't worry, they'll row for a month before they figure out I'm fakin' it." --Deacon, "Waterworld")
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To: Free Vulcan

Southern Iowa is great. I lived in rural northern MO long ago and liked it, too—smart, civilized, independent folks (including some of my own), extremely arable land and far better weather than here.


105 posted on 05/05/2011 2:04:52 AM PDT by familyop ("Don't worry, they'll row for a month before they figure out I'm fakin' it." --Deacon, "Waterworld")
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To: PA Engineer

I’m 47 years old 5 foot 10 and 165 lbs and very active despite junk knees. I wander the woods and fields and have become very familiar with my surroundings.

I have no intent on defending my little town all by myself. Any aggressive defense would likely fall to younger men while the older people would take on other tasks.


106 posted on 05/05/2011 4:18:14 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Remember the River Raisin! (look it up))
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To: tbw2

Not this HOA. Nazis.


107 posted on 05/05/2011 5:00:10 AM PDT by melissa_in_ga (Mr. President: Game On!)
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To: familyop
"Forbes: I was in Colorado, and I knew people who had 200, 300 guns."

I have friends who say that if you know how many guns you have, then you don't have enough.

108 posted on 05/05/2011 5:13:21 AM PDT by blam
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To: cherry
"let me predict something....mostly, it'll be the OLDER parents taking in the younger people....that will be our situation...we have the big house, the 5 acres, the garden space....my husband has knowledge enough to hunt, with a bow, and to fix most things like electrical or plumbing, or car repairs....I can cook,bake,can, etc.."

That's my belief too. I'm old but I have resources that can/will be shared with younger people who 'man the guns' during a crisis.(That includes stored food, etc.)

109 posted on 05/05/2011 5:19:35 AM PDT by blam
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To: tbw2

No. Ever dealt with one? They are typically run by the fat a$$ed real estate agent or soccer mom that thinks they have a political future.


110 posted on 05/05/2011 5:26:52 AM PDT by mad_as_he$$
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To: PA Engineer
Smithfield CEO: Higher Food Prices Are Here To Stay

The CEO of Smithfield Farms, the largest pork producer in the US. Among other things he said:

"And we’re going to be seeing food shortages in the US in the coming months."

Alarmist....maybe?

111 posted on 05/05/2011 5:35:57 AM PDT by blam
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To: metmom

“You are a real city slicker, aren’t you, if you think that we rural folk only have small arms.”

Sorry, haven’t seen too many people with crew served weapons like howitzers, 50 cal machine guns, etc. And no I grew up in the country so I know what it’s like and what the people are like.


112 posted on 05/05/2011 5:50:18 AM PDT by trapped_in_LA
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To: qam1
Long before the rural areas feel any pain, when those 1st of the month checks are no longer are enough to pay for their HBO or the insurance on their Cadillac Escalades, they will 1st turn on each other and burn their own cities down.

I stay out of stores around the 1st - the government babies are all clogging the stores around then. The Walmart CEO has been reporting more and more sales around the 1st, with sales dropping drastically toward the end of the month - implying they run out of money and are desperate when the 1st comes around and they get their government money. Without that check coming in - they will panic.
113 posted on 05/05/2011 7:03:32 AM PDT by CottonBall
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To: pyx
I keep asking about people over 45 years of age and more than 25 pounds overweight because I suspect a significant part of American population falls within this group.

Although you have a point, IMO you are fixating on the wrong thing. Certainly, physical fitness will be a part of who survives, but not 100% of it. The preparations they have made will also be part. But one's attitude and ability to cope, face the new reality, and adapt will be the most important characteristic of the survivors.
114 posted on 05/05/2011 7:06:19 AM PDT by CottonBall
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To: CottonBall
But one's attitude and ability to cope, face the new reality, and adapt will be the most important characteristic of the survivors.

Having grown up in a small town (400 people) means I grew up with lots of extended family within shouting distance. Most important was seeing my great grandmother every day. She taught me to garden smart, never expect, and most of all, how to endure. This is a woman who managed to hold her farm and 5 kids together after her husband disappeared during the depression.

When I look at my cousins who grew up in Ann Arbor, Minneapolis, and Kalamazoo I realize that they missed out on a lot having grown up separate from great granny and our little town. These are people who think they're in the deep wilderness of the grass is more than ankle deep. They go looking for an emergency room if they find a tick crawling on them.

My sisters and I had the true Mayberry experience. Free range kids roaming the woods and fields around town. Walking down the railroad bed to go fishing with friends at 9 or 10 years old. I fell off my bike way out on the railroad bed and broke my wrist at 9 years old. Sure I cried but I never thought about someone coming to the rescue. I picked up my bike and pushed it the mile and a half back to town.
115 posted on 05/05/2011 8:19:46 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Remember the River Raisin! (look it up))
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To: trapped_in_LA
Sorry, haven’t seen too many people with crew served weapons like howitzers, 50 cal machine guns, etc.

And you're saying urbanites have those when rural folks don't?

I don't think so.

I also grew up in a city and the only people who had guns were cops and bad guys, and the only ones who were supposed to have guns were the cops. City folk still meltdown about the thought of guns. No way that urbanites and city folk are armed with howitzers, 50 cal machine guns, etc.

116 posted on 05/05/2011 10:02:18 AM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: ccmay
The results would be ugly. Cannibalism ugly.

Do zombies taste like chicken?

117 posted on 05/05/2011 10:15:30 AM PDT by bgill (Kenyan Parliament - how could a man born in Kenya who is not even a native American become the POTUS)
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To: trapped_in_LA
The real danger is that you get some genocidal idiot in a leadership position who decides that there are too many people and starts systematically killing off the undesirables

Reminds me of the U of TX professor Pianka who feels the world would be better off with 90% killed off by ebola.

118 posted on 05/05/2011 10:21:10 AM PDT by bgill (Kenyan Parliament - how could a man born in Kenya who is not even a native American become the POTUS)
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To: CottonBall
I've got to say something about this "over 45 and 25#overweight" buisness..

we belong to a volunteer group that works for bettering wildlife lands and recreational lands....

in involves fencing, fixing fences,planting,building guslers,fishing ramps,etc.....IOWS....physical work....

the average age of this group has got to be 55.....

let me tell you....the old guys are the BEST...

.they know how to work....you can tell the old guys from the young guys by looking at their shoes while working on a project.

..the old guys wear BOOTS and the young guys wear sneakers....

a young fit guy can overtake an older guy who is a little overweight in a man on man battle...but the older guy has the advantage of KNOWLEDGE and WISDOM ....he knows how to get things done and he'll keep at it til its finished....

119 posted on 05/05/2011 10:25:48 AM PDT by cherry
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To: pyx
Experience and treachery will always overcome youth and vigor.
120 posted on 05/05/2011 10:28:13 AM PDT by Pan_Yan
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