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The Legenday White-Skinned Cloud People Of Peru
The Right Perspective ^ | 2-11-2012

Posted on 02/11/2012 11:44:55 AM PST by blam

The Legenday White-Skinned Cloud People Of Peru

Village of the Cloud People

Archeologists have discovered a 12-acre lost city deep within the Amazon rain forest that may shed light on a long-lost tribe of white-skinned, blonde-haired people known as the Cloud People.

The Cloud People, also known in legend as “the white warriors of the clouds” established expansive kingdom located in the northern regions of the Andes in present-day Peru during the ninth century. Bordered by the Maranon and Utcubamba rivers, in the zone of Bagua, their civilzation extended up to the basin of the Abiseo river, and to the very edges of Peru’s northern Amazon jungle. The Cloud People were defeated by the Incas but later conquered them by aligning with the Spanish Conquistadors. Unfortunately, diseases brought to the New World by their allies eventually wiped the Cloud People out.

Past archeological discoveries were so heavily looted that little was left to learn about the Cloud People, who are referred to as Chachapoyas in Inca legends. Other pre-hispanic groups referred to the Cloud People as “White Gods” due to their height, blonde hair and blue eyes.

The spanish conqueror Pedro Cieza de Leon wrote they wore woolen clothing and wollen turbans, and described them as “the whitest and most handsome of all the people that I have seen, and their wives were so beautiful that because of their gentleness, many of them deserved to be the Incas’ wives and to also be taken to the Sun Temple.” He also noted the Cloud People were significantly taller than the Spaniards, indicating they were Nordic and not Mediteranian. Another Spanish conqueror, Orellana, wrote similar descriptions. Verification of the Cloud People’s racial makeup came two years ago, when archaeologists found an underground burial vault inside a cave with five mummies, two intact with skin and hair.

According to Inca legend, the Chachapoyas remembered that their ancestors came from the East. The Amazon river is on the East and far east is the Atlantic Ocean. Archeologists have discovered paintings and drawings of large ships on the buildings of the Chachapoyas, indicating that they possibly traveled from Europe to South America by sea, passing through the Amazon river flows until they reached a more tolerable climate, away from the unbearable tropical heat of the Amazon jungle.

The Cloud People are probably best known for the Kuellap fortress on the top of a mountain in Utcubamba, which can only be compared in scale to the Incas’ Machu Picchu retreat, built hundreds of years later.

The newly-discovered fortress is tucked away in one of the most far-flung areas of the Amazon. Sitting at the edge of a chasm which may have been used as a lookout post, it was extremely isolated and very well-preserved.

The main encampment is made up of circular stone houses overgrown by jungle over 12 acres, according to archaeologist Benedict Goicochea Perez.

Rock paintings cover some of the fortifications and next to the dwellings are platforms believed to have been used to grind seeds and plants for food and medicine.


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: chachapoyas; cloudpeople; ggg; godsgravesglyphs; history; peru
More:

Ancient City Discovered Deep In Amazonian Rainforest Linked To The Legendary White-Skinned Cloud People Of Peru

A previous posting on the subject:

Kuelap - The Machu Picchu Of Northern Peru (Chachapoyas - White, blonde haired people)


1 posted on 02/11/2012 11:45:07 AM PST by blam
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To: blam

Legenday? Sequel to I Am Legend?


2 posted on 02/11/2012 11:46:54 AM PST by saganite (What happens to taglines? Is there a termination date?)
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To: SunkenCiv
Images Of Kuelap Fortress

I invite each of you to speculate as to who are these people. I'll start:

* King Solomon's exiled miners. (They were forgotten there when ancient Israel fell into turmoil)

3 posted on 02/11/2012 11:53:22 AM PST by blam
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To: blam

I would guess they were lost Vikings that made it a little too far south, and never bothered returning.


4 posted on 02/11/2012 11:59:23 AM PST by yank in the UK ( A liberal mocking Christianity. I asked "why don't you mock Islam?" he replied "Muslims are violent)
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To: blam

Have DNA analysis of their origins been able to be done?


5 posted on 02/11/2012 12:02:19 PM PST by khelus
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To: yank in the UK
"I would guess they were lost Vikings that made it a little too far south, and never bothered returning. "

LOL. It was this earlier article posted By SunkenCiv that inspired me to post this article.

Viking Barley In Greenland

6 posted on 02/11/2012 12:04:37 PM PST by blam
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To: blam

In the 1500’s, the conquistador Pizarro described the Incan rulers as “corn blond” and “whiter than the people of spain”. Interesting indeed!

http://books.google.com/books?id=Obgdz8auwkMC&pg=PA37&lpg=PA37&dq=Pizarro+%22corn+blonde%22&source=bl&ots=c4aRzUv510&sig=lOtqnvcFEz1lSdWuYX7yCSMthys&hl=en&ei=fzjgTPqZGI28sAOOvajICg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBMQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Pizarro%20%22corn%20blonde%22&f=false


7 posted on 02/11/2012 12:05:17 PM PST by Allon
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To: blam

So...can Norway demand restitution from Mexico for the slaughter of her people?


8 posted on 02/11/2012 12:08:06 PM PST by Grizzled Bear (No More RINOS!)
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To: khelus
Have DNA analysis of their origins been able to be done?

Yep.

Verification of the Cloud People’s racial makeup came two years ago, when archaeologists found an underground burial vault inside a cave with five mummies, two intact with skin and hair.

9 posted on 02/11/2012 12:12:38 PM PST by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: Grizzled Bear
So...can Norway demand restitution from Mexico for the slaughter of her people?

Heck no, are you crazy?

They were white people.

10 posted on 02/11/2012 12:14:44 PM PST by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: Grizzled Bear

Oops

They were in Peru by the way.


11 posted on 02/11/2012 12:15:59 PM PST by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: saganite
"Orellana" kinda has a Spanish form ~ but it also kinda sorta has a Gaelic form.

I'm thinking this is "O rel lana" which clearly means (in Welsh or Breton) "From Lana rel" ~ odds are good he was as tall and blue eyed as any other Northern European.

Recall from your French history that much of Brittany was conquered by the Normans back in Viking times.

Of course the Bretons were already pretty much more like the Northern Europeans (Irish, Scots, Welsh, Cornish, Manx, etc.) than Souvrners or North Africans. They used to go down to Spain during the Reconquista and vie for fame and fortune.

I'd be careful with the translations that give you a Heavy Mounted Knight as being anything other than a blue eyed blond (or redhead with green eyes) and shorter than an Indian except for a Mohican or Mohawk back in the 1500s.

Not all Spaniards in that time looked all that Spanish!

That "Lana Rel" part, would be "wool kingdom", "sheep country" ~ maybe even something in Basque, but I don't have a basque translator handy.

12 posted on 02/11/2012 12:21:29 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: blam
The spanish conqueror Pedro Cieza de Leon wrote they wore woolen clothing and wollen turbans, and described them as “the whitest and most handsome of all the people that I have seen, and their wives were so beautiful that because of their gentleness, many of them deserved to be the Incas’ wives and to also be taken to the Sun Temple.”

Another translation: They are the whitest and most handsome of all the people that I have seen in the Indies, and their wives were so beautiful that because of their gentleness, many of them deserved to be the Incas' wives and to also be taken to the Sun Temple.

That puts a different complexion on the Chachapoyas. For Indians they were light-skinned, but they weren't necessarily so by European standards.

13 posted on 02/11/2012 12:21:40 PM PST by x
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To: Pontiac
Verification of the Cloud People’s racial makeup came two years ago, when archaeologists found an underground burial vault inside a cave with five mummies, two intact with skin and hair.

I should have been more specific. What were the results ??? or have they not been released ?
14 posted on 02/11/2012 12:23:21 PM PST by khelus
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To: Allon
Here is a link to some YouTube videos about the Chachapoyas.
15 posted on 02/11/2012 12:24:14 PM PST by blam
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To: blam

lost tribes of israel?


16 posted on 02/11/2012 12:26:04 PM PST by mamelukesabre
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To: x
Yes, and we are dealing with Spanish of the 1500s, not modern Spanish, so we can't be certain that he is saying "white" or "shiny".

Oh, and that Spanish was filled with all sorts of unassimilated words ~ from French, Breton, English, Arabic, Berber, Basque ~ and Italian. That was one of the reasons for the establishment of the SpanishAademy ~ to make the language standardized, and to regularize Spanish spelling conventions.

17 posted on 02/11/2012 12:26:33 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: blam

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chachapoyas_culture#Origin_of_the_Chachapoyas

Contrary to erroneous assertions, no early Spanish accounts describe the Chachapoyas as “blond haired” or “blue eyed”. The oft-quoted Cieza de Leon merely records that they were the “whitest” in coloration he had seen. There is no indication of “racial” connotations in this description - another early Spanish source, Pedro Pizarro, describes all the Indians of Peru as “white”. Hair and eye color are not mentioned. Thus the supposedly “enduring mystery for scholars of the region as to their ultimate origin” is a modern slant based on a misunderstanding of the sources, and seems largely driven by a desire to find a trans-Atlantic origin for the Chachapoyas.

All that seems to be indicated by Cieza de Leon is that the Chachapoyas were among the lightest in skin color, of the Andean natives the Spanish contacted. Inge Schjellerup’s book Incas and Spaniards in the Conquest of the Chachapoyas (1997) refers to anthropological examinations of the physical remains of Chachapoyans. There is no reason from these to conclude that the Chachapoyas had any exotic origins different from other ancient Peruvians. For instance, the teeth show an almost complete absence of Carabelli’s cusp on the upper molars, while shovel-shaped upper incisors are universally present - in both of these the Chachapoyas resemble other Amerindians, and differ from “white” Europeans.


18 posted on 02/11/2012 12:28:15 PM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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To: blam; a fool in paradise

When did they start storing people on the cloud?


19 posted on 02/11/2012 12:30:19 PM PST by Revolting cat! (Let us prey!)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
2004: Top (Archaeological) Finds On Bolivian Highlands


20 posted on 02/11/2012 12:32:11 PM PST by blam
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To: khelus

Your question is right on. But I bet it is not going to be answered because it is a bunch of hogwash.

It’s like the many “blond” San Blas Indians here in Panama. No one bothered/bothers to come here and look into their rapidly shifty quivering blue eyes aside from other physical features. They would find they are albinos. The San Blas Indians have lived on islands off the coast of Panama for a zillion years and do not like intruders.

These albinos are caused by interbreeding and nothing else…no outside Euro influence.


21 posted on 02/11/2012 12:37:19 PM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
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To: blam
Thanks for the link. It goes back further than the Incans too.

The Incan legends speak of an ancient white people that came from the north that they destroyed.

Here's some older mayan glyphs that gives one pause.

Mmmmm, Mayans, the other white meat...

22 posted on 02/11/2012 12:40:30 PM PST by Allon
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To: khelus

How about hair and skin samples from live indians?


23 posted on 02/11/2012 12:42:15 PM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
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To: khelus
Are you kidding?? Of course they want DNA and they'll go for it......as soon as the bazillion dollars in grant money arrives.

It's no longer about finds...they are everywhere...it's about controversial guesses so that money keeps on coming!!

24 posted on 02/11/2012 12:44:41 PM PST by Sacajaweau
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25 posted on 02/11/2012 12:52:06 PM PST by TheOldLady (FReepmail me to get ON or OFF the ZOT LIGHTNING ping list)
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To: Sacajaweau

LOL!!!

“Are you kidding?? Of course they want DNA and they’ll go for it......as soon as the bazillion dollars in grant money arrives.”

LOL!!! twice..

You are so correct!!!!


26 posted on 02/11/2012 2:21:18 PM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
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To: blam

“I invite each of you to speculate as to who are these people.”

I’ll have a shot at it.

They were Freepers. After time travel is discovered a band of Freepers from the future travels back in time to start their own Free Republic.

Things were going well until a “moderate” faction arose, led by a descendant of Romney. They increased spending, raised taxes, wrote regulations, and grew dependency. Extinction was only a matter of time.


27 posted on 02/11/2012 2:23:27 PM PST by PastorBooks
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To: Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
One of the museums were searching a cemetery (which my buddy and I were restoring) for evidence of indians....which was absolutely stupid to start with.

The town paid $2500 for the REQUIRED report. Two college kids dug little holes, sifted it and wrote down the soils...(It was a sandhill).

What they did find....well, me and my buddy told them what it was....part of an old iron fence...hell...we found 50 pieces of the fence and a 1900 photograph of the fence.

The testing was a total scam!!

28 posted on 02/11/2012 2:31:14 PM PST by Sacajaweau
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To: blam

Looks Jewish to me!!


29 posted on 02/11/2012 2:32:30 PM PST by Sacajaweau
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To: Allon
Top picture...okay honey...push....one more time....

Itsa boy!!!

30 posted on 02/11/2012 2:34:11 PM PST by Sacajaweau
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To: khelus

Go here...and I get no pleasure sending you this because it is a tad sad for me:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/21147073@N06/4432246546/


31 posted on 02/11/2012 2:36:36 PM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
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To: Sacajaweau

Thank you for sharing.


32 posted on 02/11/2012 2:43:36 PM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
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To: Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)

Thank you for the link. Very Interesting. I did some quick research on Kuna Indians. I was unaware that there were populations in which albinoism was so common.


33 posted on 02/11/2012 3:47:37 PM PST by khelus
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To: Allon

Inbreeding and albinism could provide partial answers.


34 posted on 02/11/2012 4:41:09 PM PST by tbw2
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To: blam

So I am tall, blonde hair and blue eyes. I was shopping in a craft store for some paint supplies and a child from Africa (saw me and froze in his tracks staring at me and then following me around the store. He was kind of afraid of me but still followed me around at a distance. I noticed him and talked to him but he looked afraid and then I thought maybe he is lost and told a clerk that I thought there was something wrong for him. His aunt arrived and explained that he thought I was “a god” because my “coloring was so strange.” That made no sense to me at the time and I assigned it to poor English skills. LOL


35 posted on 02/11/2012 4:45:49 PM PST by SaraJohnson
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To: Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)

I grew up near the housing projects south of New Orleans. I saw albinos there, in the housing projects. Strange indeed.


36 posted on 02/11/2012 4:46:08 PM PST by AlmaKing
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To: khelus

You are so welcome.

It boggles the mind what folks will invent...like global warming.

If you looked at those photos, they were not exactly too pleasant to look at….sorry.


37 posted on 02/11/2012 4:52:02 PM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
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To: AlmaKing

Thank you for your reply.

To try to link an albino to some European heritage is nuts.


38 posted on 02/11/2012 5:02:22 PM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
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To: blam

39 posted on 02/11/2012 8:09:26 PM PST by Prospero
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To: Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
"To try to link an albino to some European heritage is nuts."

There are Europeans and there are albinos and you're the only one linking them.

To try and refute these centuries old tales by posting one picture of albinos is nuts. The Spanish didn't know about albinos?

I didn't make up these stories, they've been around for decades and until I see some DNA proof I'm not convinced of anything. I don't flippantly disregard them though. There are too many unanswered questions not to consider every possibility.

This is Luzia One of the oldest skeletons ever found in the Americas...from Brazil.(Who the heck is this?)

Some more (unexpected) old skeletons in the Americas:

Vintage Skulls(Who are these people and were did they come from?)

"The oldest human remains found in the Americas were recently "discovered" in the storeroom of Mexico's National Museum of Anthropology. Found in central Mexico in 1959, the five skulls were radiocarbon dated by a team of researchers from the United Kingdom and Mexico and found to be 13,000 years old. They pre-date the Clovis culture by a couple thousand years, adding to the growing evidence against the Clovis-first model for the first peopling of the Americas."

"Of additional significance is the shape of the skulls, which are described as long and narrow, very unlike those of modern Native Americans."

'First Americans Were Australian'

40 posted on 02/11/2012 10:25:30 PM PST by blam
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To: Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
"...No one bothered/bothers to come here and look into their rapidly shifty quivering blue eyes aside from other physical features..."

Curious, I looked up human albinism at Wikipedia, and found that eye color does range, and...

"...Eye conditions common in albinism include: Nystagmus, irregular rapid movement of the eyes back and forth, or in circular motion..."[4]

41 posted on 02/11/2012 10:43:56 PM PST by Does so ("What elephant?")
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To: blam
They may have been new arrivals in the region, perhaps from the North, who were taller than the usual Andean or Amazonian peoples.

Actually, "warriors of the clouds" would apply better to the Incas themselves: scientists say that the short stature and proportions of the Andean peoples is well suited to the thin atmosphere at high altitudes.

But if you were an Inca and came across a people who were taller than others and possibly with a different skin tone from yours, you might make them part of your mythology -- and that would fit in well with European mythology.

We tend to assume that people from cold and snowy regions like mountains or polar areas are tall, blond, and blue-eyed, even though that's not the case for Incas, Sherpas, Eskimos, and other groups who actually inhabited those environments.

42 posted on 02/12/2012 11:37:53 AM PST by x
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To: StayAt HomeMother; Ernest_at_the_Beach; decimon; 1010RD; 21twelve; 24Karet; 2ndDivisionVet; ...

 GGG managers are SunkenCiv, StayAt HomeMother & Ernest_at_the_Beach
Thanks blam.

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.


43 posted on 02/12/2012 7:33:23 PM PST by SunkenCiv (FReep this FReepathon!)
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To: Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)

“They would find they are albinos. The San Blas Indians have lived on islands off the coast of Panama for a zillion years and do not like intruders.”

Their language is speculated to have split from chocoe only ~5 centuries ago (just a philologists’ estimate based on drift); the obvious answer is the island-dwellers dialect began to shift from the mainland shoko around the time they began living on islands.

some islands (not the major ones) have inhabitants that, if taken without costume, look more like choko than kuna (or guna, as they seem to have changed it to now).

The mummy thing in peru should be prety easy to resolve with dna testing, lack of anything public isn’t encouraging.


44 posted on 02/14/2012 10:47:45 AM PST by WoofDog123
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To: WoofDog123

Sorry for my late reply to you.

I want to thank you for your comments.


45 posted on 02/15/2012 11:01:12 AM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
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To: blam

Could be some of George Zimmerman’s kin folks.


46 posted on 05/30/2012 10:48:01 PM PDT by beaversmom
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To: WoofDog123

The DNA tests were inconclusive. The tissue is all dead.
However the spanish explores did say that there were blond haired white people in revalations by Pedro Pizarro.
He said they were whiter than the spanish and had hair the color of wheat (trigo)
You can read the english translation here:
http://archive.org/stream/historyofconques01pres/historyofconques01pres_djvu.txt
He never mentioned any eye color at all.


47 posted on 04/04/2013 6:10:58 PM PDT by HenryYsner
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