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Catholic Church: We need comprehensive immigration reform, not 'Secure Communities' program
Baltimore Sun ^ | March 5, 2012 | Mitchell T. Rozanski, bishop of the Archdiocese of Baltimore

Posted on 03/05/2012 11:12:02 AM PST by moonshinner_09

The recent article about the expansion into Baltimore of the Department of Homeland Security's program to crackdown on illegal immigrants ("Immigrants, city fear divide over status checks," Feb. 26) makes clear the need for real immigration reform. Programs such as Secure Communities, regardless of aim, are succeeding in spreading fear and division and in threatening the stability of the family. Moreover, the program is altering the relationship between federal immigration enforcement and local law enforcement.

The Catholic Church's concern for the welfare of migrants stems from its belief that immigration is ultimately a humanitarian issue because it impacts the basic human rights and dignity of the human person. The Church believes this dignity is undermined by this program's alleged channeling of immigrants into the criminal justice system through racial profiling and pre-textual arrests for the purpose of vetting them for their immigration status. Because Secure Communities is operated at the point of arrest, rather than post-conviction, it casts a wide net over virtually any immigrant who has come into contact with the criminal justice system.

In other parts of the country where Secure Communities is being operated, some law enforcement officers have denounced the program because it creates a lack of trust between immigrant communities and local police, affecting their ability to investigate crime, assist crime victims and ensure the safety of those communities

(Excerpt) Read more at baltimoresun.com ...


TOPICS: Politics; Religion
KEYWORDS: aliens; catholic; immigration; immigrationiam; religion
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I am sorry and do not mean to offend anyone who is Catholic. However reading the Bishops also urge that an individual not be detained until he/she has been convicted of a crime that poses a threat to public safety of immigrant communities and families, rather than at the time of arrest. How about the Catholic Church agree to accept full responsibility for illegals who are arrested and released on bail, allow the Catholic Church to be 100% responsible for keeping them out of trouble and ensure they show up for all court dates or face sanctions for failing to fulfill their obligations.The Catholic Church at times just seems very backwards
1 posted on 03/05/2012 11:12:08 AM PST by moonshinner_09
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To: moonshinner_09

As a practicing, believing Catholic, I truly wish The Church would shut up about our domestic political policies.


2 posted on 03/05/2012 11:19:44 AM PST by South Hawthorne (In Memory of my dear Friend Henry Lee II)
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To: moonshinner_09; All

Isn’t it ironic that the Catholic Church is in a tizzy about being forced to do something by the government while they’re simultaneously telling the government what to do about illegal immigration.


3 posted on 03/05/2012 11:30:58 AM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: moonshinner_09

I am sorry too and I am Catholic, but I can not make myself line up with such radical charity and radical kindness that continually points its finger at only the United States, holding only the US responsible for the deliverance of human dignity to illelgals, law breakers and border crossers, but NEVER Mexico, and certainly never the illegal.

The good Bishops who always get the press always fault the US and totally IGNORE every jot and tittle of the clear catachesis of the Catholic Church that just as clearly instructs respect for the law of nations, as well as human dignity.

The narrowness of these Bishops is more akin to Marxism than disguised as charity and kindness. There is just no dialogue with these bishops, it’s like you hit a wall.

The Church is rightfully fighting the intrusion into Church doctrine by the government, but the equally illegal intrusion of illegals onto our soil and the burdens they place on the backs of Americans, in regard to taxes and provisions, is staggering.

I love the Church. I do not love the socialist/Marxist leaning element romping unchecked within the Church. Catholics know exactly who they are too, and will fight their advances.

Pelosi is a measuring stick. If she is FOR it, you know you’re in the evil camp, and up to no good.


4 posted on 03/05/2012 11:39:19 AM PST by RitaOK (LET 'ER RIP, NEWT. Newt knows where all the bodies are buried, because he buried them.)
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To: philman_36

Great minds think alike? I said the same thing! Next post!
LOL!


5 posted on 03/05/2012 11:41:49 AM PST by RitaOK (LET 'ER RIP, NEWT. Newt knows where all the bodies are buried, because he buried them.)
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To: South Hawthorne

I am Catholic and I don’t believe the Church should be worrying about this when they have a bigger worry ontheir hands with Obamacare.

The Bishops helped Obama shove this Obamacare mess down our throats and now they have been bitten by it. Perhaps they should spend a bit more time thinking about consequences before shoving ILLEGAL immigrants down our throats.


6 posted on 03/05/2012 11:42:46 AM PST by Venturer
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To: Venturer
The Bishops helped Obama shove this Obamacare mess down our throats and now they have been bitten by it. Perhaps they should spend a bit more time thinking about consequences before shoving ILLEGAL immigrants down our throats.

Apparently they haven't considered the consequences of illegal immigration on healthcare costs, either. Where do they think the money will come from? I think some of them may be marxists at heart, but most of them are probably well-meaning, though naive.

Pope Benedict XVI: “At the same time, states have the right to regulate migration flows and to defend their own frontiers, always guaranteeing the respect due to the dignity of each and every human person...”

7 posted on 03/05/2012 11:59:08 AM PST by BlatherNaut
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To: moonshinner_09
Bishop Rozanski exceeds his authority in stating specific policy preferences; the bishops' role is to declare the principles that bear on the issue, then let the laity exercise their prudential judgment to form policy. If Bishop Rozanski wants to be a policy maker, he should tender his resignation and run for office.
8 posted on 03/05/2012 12:01:19 PM PST by JustSayNoToNannies (A free society's default policy: it's none of government's business.)
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To: moonshinner_09
I don't want to offend any Catholic Freepers either, but this was just striking stupidity coming from a senior churchman.

At the same time that Catholics are benefiting from support of non-catholics over mandated insurance requirements (right to life), this activist dolt publishes a pro-illegal alien screed guaranteed to p#ss off about half the people who were otherwise in their corner. Well, at least it ticked me off - just like the L.A. diocese housing illegals did.

Hint to Mr. Rozanski; opposition to contraception is a fundamental element of Catholic theology but sponsoring the invasion of a neighbor is NOT...unless the Pope calls for another crusade.

9 posted on 03/05/2012 12:05:40 PM PST by norton
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To: moonshinner_09

I am not a Catholic, but taking everything into consideration, the catholic church’s stance on no birth control is is scriptural. God did say, to go forth and multiply. He had good reason, as we are finding out, for Christians and other r non-Islasmists are being outnumbered becuase the Mormons and Islamists even have (had) multiple wives so they can sire more children, while abortion, and contraception takes millions of non- Islamists every year! I shudder to think of how our grandchildren and their children will be iduced to live non-Chrstian lives. under sharia Law. Without the living God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, there can be no America for our descendants. How can we allow this to happen?


10 posted on 03/05/2012 12:10:33 PM PST by Paperdoll (On the cutting edge)
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To: BlatherNaut

I have no doubt they are well meaning.
I am well meaning too,BUT,there must be limits.

Legal immigration establish’s these limits.
Illegal immigration ignores these limits and is the cause of great problems.

Hispanic gangs in cities, drunken uninsured drivers on our highways, anchor babies, costs to hospitals for uninsured.Illegals used as Mules to bring in drugs.
Just a few of those problems.

I wish everyone could live the good life, but destroying the economics of a country will lead to us all living like a third world country, and sooner or later those who work decide that if others can get away with not working they might as well go on the dole too.Especially those who are working for low wages.


11 posted on 03/05/2012 12:18:26 PM PST by Venturer
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To: moonshinner_09

If the Establishment is working to import Democrat voters, they may be working at cross purposes, for most Latinos are people of faith. Of course the Muslim element, the enemy of our way of life in mind are invading us as well! What a dilemma!


12 posted on 03/05/2012 12:21:49 PM PST by Paperdoll (On the cutting edge)
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To: Venturer

Well said.


13 posted on 03/05/2012 12:22:59 PM PST by BlatherNaut
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To: norton

You’re not alone. I’m not Catholic but have been defending them over the contraception dust-up. I even started an account at The Chicago Tribune to get into a virtual brawl over it.

This really chaps my hide.

Just a little blurb about the brawl at the Tribune....there are an awful lot of liberals subscribed to that paper that don’t give two hoots about Constitutional rights. They only care about the rights that they perceive to exist. But then, we all knew that. It surely was on parade a couple of days ago.


14 posted on 03/05/2012 12:26:50 PM PST by abigailsmybaby ("To understan' the livin', you got ta commune wit' da dead." Minerva)
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To: South Hawthorne
As a practicing, believing Catholic, I truly wish The Church would shut up about our domestic political policies.

Right ...

Absolutely.

Those miserable, worthless papists should just STFU about womens' choice, and reproductive rights, and gays' civil right to marry ...

Keep their dirty litle fingers out of our SACRED American domestic political policies.

15 posted on 03/05/2012 12:28:03 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: philman_36
Yes, indeed ... there's a real irony in American citizens objecting to the US Government violating their constitutional right to religious liberty, while at the same time exercising their constitutional right to free speech.

Oh ...

Wait ...

Doesn't sound so ironic after all, now does it?

16 posted on 03/05/2012 12:34:58 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: RitaOK
It's hard to ignore the obvious isn't it.
And yet some people simply can't see the obvious.
17 posted on 03/05/2012 12:37:32 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: ArrogantBustard
Doesn't sound so ironic after all, now does it?

It isn't a free speech issue when you wish to impose your desires and beliefs upon others.
The desire is to implement "social justice" on others through the heavy hand of government and that is neither right nor proper.

18 posted on 03/05/2012 12:42:39 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: abigailsmybaby; norton

Please, don’t judge the Church by its infiltrators. There are those of us who know who these people are and are fighting it.

Check out upthread, if you will. #8 is correct.

I remind us all that many will fall, and keep falling, until there is none left, but the “remnant”.


19 posted on 03/05/2012 12:58:46 PM PST by RitaOK (LET 'ER RIP, NEWT. Newt knows where all the bodies are buried, because he buried them.)
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To: philman_36

All legislation is imopsing one set of desires and beliefs on others.


20 posted on 03/05/2012 2:07:53 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: ArrogantBustard
All legislation is imopsing one set of desires and beliefs on others.
Legislation can't remove your natural rights.
21 posted on 03/05/2012 2:13:06 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: ArrogantBustard
Those miserable, worthless papists should just STFU about womens' choice, and reproductive rights, and gays' civil right to marry ...

I attended Mass at four different Parishes in 3 Dioceses in 2008, and heard implicit calls for Parishioners to vote for Obama. Keep out of politics.

22 posted on 03/05/2012 2:42:25 PM PST by South Hawthorne (In Memory of my dear Friend Henry Lee II)
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To: philman_36; ArrogantBustard; Dr. Sivana
philman_36:

You may PREFER a federal and/or state policy of vigorously enforcing the border and keeping undocumented Latinos and others out of the USA. Your PREFERENCE as to public policy does not begin to rise to the level of an asserted "natural right" of yours. Arrogant Bustard is right (as is quite customary) and you are not.

Also, in response to your #18: Leaders of the Roman Catholic Church or any other church for that matter do not check their personal rights at the door when assuming ecclesiastical responsibilities. They have the same right to freedom of speech, press and assembly as you or me. If you would access Thomas Jefferson's very famous letter to the Baptist Congregation at Danbury, CT (1811) on the subject of the rights of churches under the First Amendment, you will find Jefferson's opinion that the amendment exists to get government off the back of churches while scrupulously preserving the right of the churches and their leaders to give unshirted hell to political leaders and to hold them morally responsible. When the letter was written, Connecticut was an exclusively Congregationalist state and denied to anyone not Congregationalist the right to vote or to own real property. Connecticut gave up that position in 1818 proving Jefferson right and the Congregationalist previous position wrong in the eyes of history if not law (until the 14th Amendment was enacted and became effective).

Giving the morally slimy politicians like Obozo and his supporters unshirted hell is precisely what the Catholic hierarchy is doing on the subject of forced provisions for abortion and contraception in "health" insurance policies under Obozocare. They do not have to trade their free speech rights in to get freedom of worship. Like the rest of American mankind, they have both as a matter of right.

23 posted on 03/05/2012 3:51:04 PM PST by BlackElk ( Dean of Discipline ,Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Society. Burn 'em Bright!)
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To: BlackElk; ArrogantBustard
Your PREFERENCE as to public policy does not begin to rise to the level of an asserted "natural right" of yours. Arrogant Bustard is right (as is quite customary) and you are not.
I made note of the irony of the two positions.
On the one hand you have the Church saying that forcing the Church and its followers to follow the government's health care mandates is wrong as it violates their religious beliefs.
Yet at the same time this same Church wants to force Americans to follow their religious beliefs and have their idea of "social justice" mandated on others despite their religious and moral objections to such actions. The natural rights of many Americans will be abrogated if such legislation is passed at the whim of a minority.

Attempting to push through immigration reform legislation is not a true first amendment issue. It's political activism and that's a separate, distinct issue. Once the Church takes step to force the issue upon the rest of America through legislative dictate or fiat the whole game changes.
Such activism is forcing their beliefs upon others, just like it was with abortion, DADT and gay marriage. The Church is being hypocritical on this issue.

...there's a real irony in American citizens objecting to the US Government violating their constitutional right to religious liberty, while at the same time exercising their constitutional right to free speech.

You can believe that ArrogantBustard is right all you want...I really don't care. I disagree with the premise he is presenting.

They do not have to trade their free speech rights in to get freedom of worship. Like the rest of American mankind, they have both as a matter of right.
So what gives the Catholic Church the authority to tell me, Congress and the rest of America that we all have to conform and accept their vision of "social justice" via legislative fiat?

24 posted on 03/05/2012 5:38:59 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: philman_36; BlackElk
Attempting to push through immigration reform legislation is not a true first amendment issue.

That is complete and unmitigated nonsense. Speech in favour (or against) some government policy or proposed policy is most definite protected by the first amendment.

25 posted on 03/05/2012 6:29:43 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: philman_36; BlackElk
So what gives the Catholic Church the authority to tell me, Congress and the rest of America that we all have to conform and accept their vision of "social justice" via legislative fiat?

Members of the Catholic Church, even bishops, enjoy the same God given and Constitutionally protected rights to freedom of speech and freedom of the press as you do.

Tell me, philman: What other American Citizens to you wish to silence?

I read your posts and smell the sulfrous stench of totalitarianism.

26 posted on 03/05/2012 6:33:38 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: ArrogantBustard
Speech in favour (or against) some government policy or proposed policy is most definite protected by the first amendment.
The freedom of speech in the First Amendment is the protection from government retaliation on Citizens for speaking out against policy that is enacted or elected officials. Simply put...the government can't throw you in jail for protesting or speaking out against the health car act or telling an elected official that they're wrong in what they're doing.
To put it another way...the King can't throw you in jail simply for pointing out to him that he has no clothes on.

Political activism is not freedom of speech...it's political activism.
Freedom of speech is the counter to enacted legislation derived from political activism.

27 posted on 03/05/2012 8:34:34 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: ArrogantBustard
Members of the Catholic Church, even bishops, enjoy the same God given and Constitutionally protected rights to freedom of speech and freedom of the press as you do.
I'm not denying them those rights. And that reply doesn't answer my question in any way! What I want to know is this...

What gives the Catholic Church the authority to tell me, Congress and the rest of America that we all have to conform and accept their vision of "social justice" via legislative fiat?

You're willing to grant some people (members of the Catholic Church) their rights while denying others (those who oppose the forced implementation of "social justice") their rights.

28 posted on 03/05/2012 8:43:05 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: philman_36; BlackElk
Sir, your post is complete and utter nonsense, from beginning to end.

You should be embarrassed to have posted it.

29 posted on 03/05/2012 8:51:53 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: moonshinner_09

very one of them ios a criminal, capture and deport every last one of them.

Make it illegal to hire them with heavy fines for the employer.


30 posted on 03/05/2012 8:55:34 PM PST by dalereed
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To: philman_36; BlackElk
Again, sir, you post nonsense.

What gives any human person the right to express his opinion?

That right is God given and Constitutionally protected.

So, you don't like the way somebody else is exercising his rights.

Tough.

That's your problem ... in this (still, more or less) free country, you'll just have to learn to live with people disagreeing with you.

That, or you can continue to look stupid.

31 posted on 03/05/2012 8:56:44 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: dalereed
very one of them ios a criminal, capture and deport every last one of them. Make it illegal to hire them with heavy fines for the employer.

That's "Step Two".

Step One is cutting them off from welfare and public schools, driver licenses, and any other government benefit.

Some businesses are bad offenders, but government is far worse.

32 posted on 03/05/2012 9:02:26 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: ArrogantBustard
What gives any human person the right to express his opinion?
They aren't wanting to simply "express their opinion"!
What do you not get about that?

They're wanting to force upon others their vision of "social justice" through political activism, not the freedom of speech, and legislative fiat without the consent of those others!

Some cynically minded people might even go so far as to say that they're blackmailing the political parties into enacting this BS for nothing more than votes in the upcoming elections.

33 posted on 03/05/2012 9:13:22 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: philman_36
They're wanting to force upon others their vision

BFD.

That's what anybody who advocates for or against any legislation or policy is doing. And yes, our freedom to do so is God given and Constitutionally protected.

If you can't handle that ... if you can't handle people who disagree with you exercising their freedom of speech ...

You might find North Korea more to your liking.

Some cynically minded people need to get their heads out of their asses.

34 posted on 03/05/2012 9:16:44 PM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: ArrogantBustard
They're wanting to force upon others their vision of "social justice" through political activism, not the freedom of speech, and legislative fiat without the consent of those others!
BFD.
That's it? Big f'ing deal?

That's what anybody who advocates for or against any legislation or policy is doing. And yes, our freedom to do so is God given and Constitutionally protected.
But that "freedom" is not derived from the First Amendment.
It's not that hard to get a bill presented and it doesn't even have to be written by Congressional members.

...if you can't handle people who disagree with you exercising their freedom of speech ...
Are you being intentionally obtuse? I don't have a problem with people exercising their freedom of speech.

I can't handle people using the heavy hand of government through the enactment of legislation garnered by nothing more than political activism to force their personal religious beliefs on me against my will.

You might find North Korea more to your liking.
It sounds as if you might find it more to your liking than I.

Some cynically minded people need to get their heads out of their asses.
It's a good thing I'm not a cynically minded person.

35 posted on 03/05/2012 9:30:22 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: ArrogantBustard
Those miserable, worthless papists should just STFU about womens' choice, and reproductive rights, and gays' civil right to marry ...

I attended Mass at four different Parishes in 3 Diocees in 2008, and heard implicit calls for Parishiners to vote for Obama in each one. Keep out of politics.

36 posted on 03/06/2012 1:18:27 AM PST by South Hawthorne (In Memory of my dear Friend Henry Lee II)
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To: moonshinner_09
They're at it again...! From 2 year ago...

Tucson Bishop Kicanas Testifies Before Congress, Urges Federal Action on Immigration Reform (USCCB)

37 posted on 03/06/2012 4:11:05 AM PST by raybbr (People who still support Obama are either a Marxist or a moron.)
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To: ArrogantBustard
Those miserable, worthless papists should just STFU about womens' choice, and reproductive rights, and gays' civil right to marry ...

First thing you posted right. They SHOULD shut up about that vis-a-vis the law/govt. They SHOULD enforce the Church's law in their own purview - the congregation.

They give communion to people who publicly support abortion. They are hypocrites. They are doing this (illegal immigration support) because the peasants from south of the border go to their churches and give them money.

38 posted on 03/06/2012 4:47:32 AM PST by raybbr (People who still support Obama are either a Marxist or a moron.)
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To: raybbr

Nice ... thanks for the honesty.

What OTHER American Citizens would you like to silence?

Your attitude is disgraceful.


39 posted on 03/06/2012 5:59:54 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: philman_36
I don't have a problem with people exercising their freedom of speech.

Baloney. Your entire presence on this thread has been a bitchfest against people you don't like exercising their freedom of speech.

40 posted on 03/06/2012 6:02:51 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: South Hawthorne
OK ... are you a fan of abortion and faggotry, or are you incapable of reading?

I'm quite appalled by this thread. You folks seem unable to understand the first amendment.

41 posted on 03/06/2012 6:06:18 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: ArrogantBustard
Is what I'm saying simply too complex for you to actually wrap your mind around?
I don't think so. Disparagement seems more your game than comprehension.
42 posted on 03/06/2012 6:35:36 AM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: ArrogantBustard
I'll try this in another manner.

Is "social justice" a religious precept of the Catholic Church?

43 posted on 03/06/2012 6:38:11 AM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: All; ArrogantBustard
@TITLE I. THE OBLIGATIONS AND RIGHTS OF ALL THE CHRISTIAN FAITHFUL (Cann. 208 - 223)Can. 222 §1. The Christian faithful are obliged to assist with the needs of the Church so that the Church has what is necessary for divine worship, for the works of the apostolate and of charity, and for the decent support of ministers.
§2. They are also obliged to promote social justice and, mindful of the precept of the Lord, to assist the poor from their own resources.

44 posted on 03/06/2012 6:45:29 AM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: ArrogantBustard
@THE SOCIAL PRINCIPLES OF THE CHURCH
By Msgr. Luigi Civardi Nihil Obstat and Imprimatur, 1961
c) Social justice governs the relations between different social classes, between employers and employees, and distributes the benefits and burdens of society. Fees, salaries and pensions are the object of social justice, which is also called distributive justice.

You getting it yet?

45 posted on 03/06/2012 6:57:38 AM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: ArrogantBustard
@Handbook of Catholic Social Teaching - Social Justice1. How does Catholic thought view social justice?
"In Catholic thought, social justice is not merely a secular or humanitarian matter. Social justice is a reflection of God's essential respect and concern for each person and an effort to protect the essential human freedom necessary for each person to achieve his or her destiny as a child of God." U.S. Bishops. To Do the Work of Justice (1978) 8.
5. What is at the center of all Catholic social teaching?
"At the center of all Catholic social teaching are the transcendence of God and the dignity of the human person. The human person is the clearest reflection of God's presence in the world; all of the Church's work in pursuit of both justice and peace is designed to protect and promote the dignity of every person. For each person not only reflects God, but is the expression of God's creative work and the meaning of Christ's redemptive ministry." U. S. Bishops. The Challenge of Peace (1983) 15.

Legislation doesn't grant dignity to a person. A person gathers dignity upon themselves by their actions, words and deeds.
I'm not a member of the Catholic Church and I don't want their religious precepts forced upon me, or other American Citizens, through legislative acts! They violate my First Amendment freedom of religion when they push their "social justice" upon me through government legislation.

46 posted on 03/06/2012 7:10:24 AM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: ArrogantBustard
And in case you didn't know "distributive justice" comes straight out of the mind of Marx...see @"Communist Manifesto distributive justice"
47 posted on 03/06/2012 7:27:48 AM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: BlackElk

I should have added you to replies 43 - 47. They might help you understand this issue better too.


48 posted on 03/06/2012 7:43:39 AM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: ArrogantBustard
OK ... are you a fan of abortion and faggotry, or are you incapable of reading?

Really, you're not in the position to question anyone else's reading abilities.

The Church has turned a blind eye towards homosexualism, which led to the terrible homosexual priest scandal, and they've implicitly endorsed Barack Obama from the pulpit.

Or maybe you don't go to Mass in other parishes and dioceses to see what's really going on. Fortunately, for you, there are others here to tell you. Wake up.

49 posted on 03/06/2012 10:39:09 AM PST by South Hawthorne (In Memory of my dear Friend Henry Lee II)
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To: ArrogantBustard; philman_36
there's a real irony in American citizens objecting to the US Government violating their constitutional right to religious liberty, while at the same time exercising their constitutional right to free speech.

You do understand that no one is advocating the government silencing The Church, right? You understand the First Amendment, right?

"Congress shall make no law".

50 posted on 03/06/2012 10:45:25 AM PST by South Hawthorne (In Memory of my dear Friend Henry Lee II)
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