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Why did the DHS just order 450 million rounds of .40 caliber ammunition?
Fellowship of the Minds ^ | Steve

Posted on 03/19/2012 6:39:45 PM PDT by angelcindy

DHS ALSO HAS A BID OUT FOR 175 MILLION ROUNDS OF . 223 OR M-16/

REQUIREMENT: The total requirement is to provide an estimated 33 million rounds of .223 Remington Caliber SD and 2 million rounds of .223 Remington Caliber EP ammunition in the base year and an estimated 33 million rounds of .223 Remington Caliber SD and 2 million rounds of .223 Remington Caliber EP ammunition in each of four option years in accordance with Attachment 2, Statement of Work for .223 Remington Caliber SD and .223 Remington Caliber EP Ammunition.

The Department of Homeland security has just executed an order for enough rounds of 40 caliber ammunition to kill every man, woman and child in the United States.

A shocking new defense contract entered by the Department of Homeland Security to secure a massive amount of ammunition, with the option for infinite supply and infinite delivery, raises the question of just what they are preparing for? Massive civil unrest? An invasion by a foreign power?

The order is to supply 450 million rounds of .40 caliber ammunition, which is more than one bullet for every single person in the United States.

The contract also comes with the additional caveat that the order is forward-looking, which means it can be revised upward or downward depending on a variety of factors, some of which also happen to contribute to civil unrest — including governmental spending, budgetary policies and economic conditions.

(Excerpt) Read more at fellowshipofminds.wordpress.com ...


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KEYWORDS: ammo; goverment
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I wish someone in the media would do their job and start asking all kinds of questions about this!!!
1 posted on 03/19/2012 6:39:53 PM PDT by angelcindy
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To: angelcindy

A) Target Practice.
B) Shoot People.


2 posted on 03/19/2012 6:43:21 PM PDT by ImJustAnotherOkie (zerogottago)
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To: angelcindy

I guess I need to go buy some more ammo tomorrow.


3 posted on 03/19/2012 6:43:29 PM PDT by BO Stinkss
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To: angelcindy

With that volume, it makes you wonder whether they might be trying to kill the supply chain for civilians.


4 posted on 03/19/2012 6:43:29 PM PDT by KoRn (Department of Homeland Security, Certified - "Right Wing Extremist")
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To: angelcindy

Because the media has Obama’s back.


5 posted on 03/19/2012 6:43:56 PM PDT by SkyDancer (Talent Without Ambition Is Sad - Ambition Without Talent Is Worse)
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To: angelcindy
Thousands of agents shooting qualifications several times a year. Use a lot of ammo.
6 posted on 03/19/2012 6:44:27 PM PDT by riverrunner
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To: angelcindy

The better to control the masses?


7 posted on 03/19/2012 6:44:27 PM PDT by doc1019 (Romney will never get my vote!)
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To: BO Stinkss

My same thought.


8 posted on 03/19/2012 6:44:55 PM PDT by Conservative4Ever (Waiting for the new tagline to download)
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To: angelcindy

Geez, that is even more than I have!


9 posted on 03/19/2012 6:46:35 PM PDT by expat1000
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To: angelcindy

Janet Napalitano gonna secure the border?


10 posted on 03/19/2012 6:47:16 PM PDT by umgud (No Rats, No Rino's)
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To: angelcindy

To shoot half of us 3 times each.


11 posted on 03/19/2012 6:47:50 PM PDT by FoxInSocks (B. Hussein Obama: Central Planning Czar)
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To: angelcindy

1. They didn’t “order” that much, they have a contract that locks the price in for up to 450 million rounds for an extended period of time. In other words, someone isn’t shipping 450 million rounds to someone this year, they are just locking in the price for future orders.

2. Sounds like a lot, but it really isn’t. Let’s just take the US Army for example. They have about 1.5 million active and 1.5 million in reserve. Let’s just use a clean 1 million number. If they blow off 50 rounds of pistol ammo per week in practice, you are looking at billions of rounds used.

3. I believe that some agencies are standardizing calibers to the .40 (mentioned this yesterday as having read this in several LEO forums). Over x number of years to replace the ammo plus practice, etc, you can burn through 450 million rounds rather quickly. Even considering the armed agencies that fall under DHS- FBI, Secret Service, Coast Guard, etc (not counting for if the contract extends beyond DHS).


12 posted on 03/19/2012 6:48:50 PM PDT by mnehring
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To: angelcindy

You don’t have 625 million rounds at the house?


13 posted on 03/19/2012 6:50:09 PM PDT by EEGator
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To: ImJustAnotherOkie
A) Target Practice.
B) Shoot People.

C) After they collapse the economy, 450 million rounds of .40 will 1) be good during the seige, and 2) become the new currency of the country.

14 posted on 03/19/2012 6:51:02 PM PDT by Migraine (Diversity is great; until it happens to YOU.)
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To: KoRn
With that volume, it makes you wonder whether they might be trying to kill the supply chain for civilians.

If that was their goal, they would be doing this to popular civilian rounds. (9mm, .38, .45, etc). Even the .380 is more popular than the .40.

15 posted on 03/19/2012 6:51:58 PM PDT by mnehring
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To: angelcindy

I would like some context before deciding what this means. How much ammunition did they buy each year over the past five years? Is this more, less or about the same? This isolated set of facts, with nothing to compare them to, tell us nothing.


16 posted on 03/19/2012 6:52:08 PM PDT by La Lydia
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To: angelcindy; All

Probably has something to do with that scary EO the Wan just signed Friday under the radar. Interesting article/thread about it just above this one - seems the current EO is a “new and improved” version of one Slick Willie had penned years ago.

This one includes the DHS.

Coincidence? Hmmm.......


17 posted on 03/19/2012 6:52:08 PM PDT by llandres (Forget the "New America" - restore the original one!!)
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To: angelcindy

Because they can’t handle 10mm?


18 posted on 03/19/2012 6:54:00 PM PDT by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: riverrunner
Thousands of agents shooting qualifications several times a year. Use a lot of ammo.

Sorry, that is a rational thought. Not allowed here.

19 posted on 03/19/2012 6:54:31 PM PDT by mnehring
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To: angelcindy

We use to make our own.

Was a lot cheaper. And it was for hunting deer that we ate all summer long in lunches and steaks.

It’s probably illegal now.


20 posted on 03/19/2012 6:55:00 PM PDT by TribalPrincess2U (Anyone not wanting an ID or purple thumb to vote isn't worthy of voting privilege.)
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To: riverrunner

“Thousands of agents shooting qualifications several times a year. Use a lot of ammo.”

Assume 20,000 agents (seems like a lot, though, doesn’t it?), 450,000,000 rounds, is 22,500 rounds per agent. Let’s say 10 times a year, so now they’re shooting 2,250 rounds each time. Even if they’re using 20-round magazines, they’re going through 112 clips each time....?

So is that a lot per outing, or is my agent estimate too low?


21 posted on 03/19/2012 6:55:20 PM PDT by treetopsandroofs (Had FDR been GOP, there would have been no World Wars, just "The Great War" and "Roosevelt's Wars".)
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To: BO Stinkss

http://www.luckygunner.com/federal-40-s-w-ammo-for-sale-40sw180hstjhpfedxm40hc-50

You can get the same ammo as TSA JBT’s.

If there are overruns now, why do they order more?


22 posted on 03/19/2012 6:56:09 PM PDT by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open (<o> ---)
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To: mnehring; angelcindy
They didn’t “order” that much, they have a contract that locks the price in for up to 450 million rounds for an extended period of time. In other words, someone isn’t shipping 450 million rounds to someone this year

You seem to have all the details.

Extended time? Not being shipped this year?

How long?

When is it being shipped?

US Army for example.... If they blow off 50 rounds of pistol ammo per week in practice

If ya think everyone in active duty/non-activy duty U.S. Army are blowing through 50 rounds every week, for target practice, you're in lala land.

23 posted on 03/19/2012 6:59:07 PM PDT by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
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To: angelcindy

because they have a whole bunch of .40 caliber guns?


24 posted on 03/19/2012 6:59:42 PM PDT by bigbob
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To: treetopsandroofs

LOL....


25 posted on 03/19/2012 7:00:31 PM PDT by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
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To: riverrunner
Thousands of agents shooting qualifications several times a year.

Because they need so much practice to kill dogs.

26 posted on 03/19/2012 7:00:53 PM PDT by unixfox (Abolish Slavery, Repeal The 16th Amendment!)
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To: treetopsandroofs

Even at 30,000 agents, that over 15,000 pistol rounds each...

LOL!


27 posted on 03/19/2012 7:03:38 PM PDT by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
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To: treetopsandroofs
So is that a lot per outing, or is my agent estimate too low?

You estimate is far too low as well as frequency. Let's just take DHS for example as they have the specific contract (but it isn't stated if that contract extends to other agencies like the DOD).

Just the 'armed' departments under DHS include: FBI, US Marshall Service, ICE, Federal Air Marshall Service, Secret Service, Layered Nuclear Defense Agency, National Fugitive Operations Service, Protective Investigation Service, Diplomat Security Service, US Coast Guard...etc.. (say close to 100K armed under this umbrella)

There also is the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center in which many State and Local law enforcement agencies receive training.

You also have to account that members of some of these agencies are practicing every week, not just a few times a year for qualification.

Then, take into account that the contract isn't a 1 lump sum 450 million rounds but simply locking in a contract up to five years for up to 450 million rounds at that price. They could buy one thousand rounds or one million rounds. It isn't a sale, just a pricing agreement.

It isn't as scary as people are making it out to be. Especially when one considers how many billions of rounds taxpayers buy for government agencies each year. (I'm sure the DOD umbrella burns through several billion alone).

28 posted on 03/19/2012 7:03:50 PM PDT by mnehring
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To: TribalPrincess2U
We use to make our own. Was a lot cheaper. And it was for hunting deer that we ate all summer long in lunches and steaks. It’s probably illegal now.

Not yet. Not a bad time to stock up on reloading supplies. You can still get some good deals at gun shows from private sellers.

29 posted on 03/19/2012 7:04:01 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: La Lydia

This isolated set of facts, with nothing to compare them to, tell us nothing.”

Patience Prudence - I am sure there is a whole slew of investigative reporters working on this story right now and they’ll be right back with all the details. /sarc


30 posted on 03/19/2012 7:04:31 PM PDT by Grams A (The Sun will rise in the East in the morning and God is still on his throne.)
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To: TribalPrincess2U

Not illegal yet. Getting pretty expensive but not illegal.


31 posted on 03/19/2012 7:05:17 PM PDT by dangerdoc (see post #6)
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To: ImJustAnotherOkie

C) Generate commissions and profits for Obama’s political allies.


32 posted on 03/19/2012 7:06:02 PM PDT by Rockingham
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To: bigbob
They'd wear out their freaking pistols before they burn through 450,000,000 rounds.

There is no way these people " target practice" this much, unless their each burning through *thousands* of rounds every damn week. Come on.

In fact, few people who are *totally* in pistol shooting, shoot anywhere near these number of rounds.

33 posted on 03/19/2012 7:08:40 PM PDT by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
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Comment #34 Removed by Moderator

To: mnehring
What's in it for the amo factors?

They could buy one thousand rounds or one million rounds. It isn't a sale, just a pricing agreement.

35 posted on 03/19/2012 7:09:25 PM PDT by DManA
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To: angelcindy

Meanwhile, the drumbeat of Dictator Baby-Doc Barak continues to grow louder - - .


36 posted on 03/19/2012 7:11:03 PM PDT by Graewoulf (( obama"care" violates the 1890 Sherman Anti-Trust Law, AND is illegal by the U.S. Constitution.))
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To: dragnet2

When my brother was in the army he told me he would go a long, long, time between going to the range.


37 posted on 03/19/2012 7:11:11 PM PDT by Vermont Lt (I just don't like anything about the President. And I don't think he's a nice guy.)
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To: DManA
What's in it for the amo factors?

High volume contracts irregardless of market circumstances.

38 posted on 03/19/2012 7:13:35 PM PDT by mnehring
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To: treetopsandroofs

It is a five year contract


39 posted on 03/19/2012 7:13:45 PM PDT by riverrunner
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To: mnehring

You just said they could buy as little as little as a thousand rounds. Did I misunderstand you? Did you misspeak?


40 posted on 03/19/2012 7:16:03 PM PDT by DManA
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To: ImJustAnotherOkie

without getting into too much detail about how i know,look at FLETC.gov.
a single agency can use up tens of thousands of rounds per week.


41 posted on 03/19/2012 7:16:13 PM PDT by airplaneguy
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To: DManA

No, they could, but when does the government every undercut its own budget? (think baseline budgeting, they will make sure to fill it over the five year period just so they can keep their department’s budget growing). It is a better ‘risk’ than a similar order to a private supplier.

The point is this isn’t a purchase, just a pricing contract.

People are going all chicken little over normal events. Stuff like this just keeps people living in fear instead of being empowered.

(Also, note that this seems to be an annual ‘fear’ people get. In 2009 people were freaking out over a similar order, 200 million to ICE - http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2407642/posts )


42 posted on 03/19/2012 7:20:24 PM PDT by mnehring
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To: Vermont Lt
Your brother was right.

Hell, when I was in the military, I shot my pistol maybe 10x per year, and just a few clips. That was it.

Everyone needs to ask themselves, when was the last time Department of Homeland security, fired even 100 stinking rounds during the course of their careers, in a real life situation?

Has DHS as a whole, in totality, even fired 100 rounds in a fire fight?

I must have missed it.

43 posted on 03/19/2012 7:20:35 PM PDT by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
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To: angelcindy

175 million? I guess they feel that only half of us are a threat to them.


44 posted on 03/19/2012 7:21:58 PM PDT by Brilliant
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To: angelcindy

,,,,,,,, THE OCTOBER SURPRISE ,,,,,,

CIVIL WAR and MARTIAL LAW . . .


45 posted on 03/19/2012 7:22:11 PM PDT by Lionheartusa1 (-: Socialism is the equal distribution of misery :-)
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To: riverrunner; treetopsandroofs
It is a five year contract

Big deal...You're talking *hundreds* of *millions* of rounds...For DHS???

Everyone needs to ask themselves, when was the last time Department of Homeland security, fired even 100 stinking rounds during the course of their careers, in a real life situation?

Has DHS as a whole, in totality, even fired 100 rounds in a fire fight?

I must have missed it.

46 posted on 03/19/2012 7:23:10 PM PDT by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
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To: mnehring
I just don't understand what the amo makers get out of the deal. Are they really afraid amo prices might drop? How can you plan your business if your prices are fixed but your sales are unpredictable?

The point is this isn’t a purchase, just a pricing contract.

47 posted on 03/19/2012 7:24:15 PM PDT by DManA
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To: dragnet2

Isn’t the Coast Guard part of DHS now having been moved from Treasury?


48 posted on 03/19/2012 7:24:59 PM PDT by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge)
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To: dragnet2
Has DHS as a whole, in totality, even fired 100 rounds in a fire fight? Just one more example, people forget the Coast Guard which is active in Iraq defending ports and securing vessels entering the controlled waters. Not a lot of men but considering it is an active war theater, large ammo orders are needed and a lot more 'practice' takes place. http://www.military.com/NewContent/0,13190,NI_Iraq_0803,00.html
49 posted on 03/19/2012 7:25:49 PM PDT by mnehring
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To: KoRn

“With that volume, it makes you wonder whether they might be trying to kill the supply chain for civilians.”

Bingo!


50 posted on 03/19/2012 7:26:21 PM PDT by GGpaX4DumpedTea (I am a tea party descendant - steeped in the Constitutional legacy handed down by the Founders)
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