Skip to comments.WAS IT REALLY 2D MURDER?
Posted on 04/12/2012 6:43:08 AM PDT by shortstop
George Zimmerman is guilty.
But Im not sure its second-degree murder.
Unless there is some bit of evidence we dont know about, unless there is some smoking gun out there, there is nothing in the Florida statute on second-degree murder that sounds like what happened that night.
The special prosecutor got to strut for the cameras last night, but if she cant deliver the goods, and there is an acquittal, there is going to be hell to pay and riot police are probably going to get called out.
In a case that has turned out to be more about race politics than the events on the sidewalk of a Florida subdivision, you wonder what last nights announcement was really about. Was it mollification? Was it the considered opinion of a veteran prosecutor? Was it the first step in a political lynching?
Time will tell.
But heres what the law book says.
In Florida, there are two ways a person can be guilty of second-degree murder.
In the first, someone has to be killed by someone showing a depraved mind. There must also be the perpetration of an act imminently dangerous to another. If those two factors exist, without premeditation, in Florida, thats second-degree murder.
In the second, someone has to be killed by someone who is committing another felony crime. That list of specified felony crimes runs from arson and kidnapping to aircraft piracy and aggravated stalking. But none of the specified crimes including terrorism is anything like what George Zimmerman did that night. Specifically, he has not been accused of any other felony crime, so he could not be charged under this part of Floridas second-degree murder law.
Which gets back to the first part.
Did George Zimmerman commit an act imminently dangerous to another and did he do so with a depraved mind.
It is clear that shooting a gun at someone is an act that is imminently dangerous. But did George Zimmerman fire the gun with a depraved mind?
Thats harder to say, and maybe impossible to prove.
Was it depraved for a Neighborhood Watch guy to follow a young man down the street? Unwise and ultimately tragic, yes, but depraved?
Not in most dictionaries.
And then there is the aspect of self-defense. If George Zimmerman makes the argument that he was repelling an attack he thought endangered his life or limb, the whole situation changes. The prosecution would have to not only show that George Zimmerman was not in danger, and that no reasonable person would consider themselves endangered in that situation, but that he had a depraved mind.
Unless theres evidence that we dont know about, that goes to Zimmermans state of mind, thats a very high standard for the prosecution to meet.
That phrase beyond a reasonable doubt is a purposefully difficult level of evidence.
In this case, we only have one version of events George Zimmermans. We cant presume he is being truthful, but the prosecution will have to affirmatively prove that he is being untruthful. And that will be hard, largely because Trayvon Martin is not here to tell his side of the story.
According to press accounts, a witness verifies Zimmermans claim that Trayvon was on top of him hitting him. The enhanced video from the police station shows an injury on the back of his head.
Those things, though not conclusive, are supportive of George Zimmermans version of events.
And in the absence of another theory, and evidence to support that theory, youre not getting to beyond a reasonable doubt.
There are practical aspects of trying this charge that will be difficult and disruptive.
How, for example, do you seat a jury?
And what will the racial makeup of that jury be and will that ratio be satisfactory to the people and activists who have been shouting for justice? In the blood lust that is masquerading as justice, how does a trial on this charge lead to anything but chaos?
If George Zimmerman is acquitted, as there seems to be a fair chance he will be, is there a possibility of racial upset or riot? Its happened before, more than once.
Have we just found this generations OJ trial? Have we just found this generations Rodney King?
I will trust that this prosecution is not political. But I will have my doubts.
Dont get me wrong.
Its George Zimmermans fault that Trayvon Martin is dead. If Zimmerman had stayed home or in his vehicle, none of this would have happened.
There is clearly reckless endangerment here, and maybe there is some species of criminally negligent homicide or maybe even a manslaughter. But murder, thats unlikely, and even less likely of being proven.
So we got headlines last night.
And a show trial sometime down the road.
But after that we may have uncorked hell.
It won’t end well for Zimmerman, that is for damn sure.
Yes—It cuts both ways.
Apparently, that’s why there’s going to be a trial now—To figure out exactly what happened.
I knew there was a reason why I never read columns by Bob Lonsberry.
This crapola confirms the fact this moron is out of his mind.
I agree, but what if Zimmerman provoked Trayvon? There's a murky area in the story where we go from Zimmerman shadowing Trayvon to Trayvon pummeling Zimmerman. What happened in between? I'm wondering if the DA is going to try to prove that Zimmerman provoked Trayvon and started the whole mess....? What's the law concerning using deadly force in that case??
I would not bet the farm on an aquital.
The particuarsof the law are irrevelent at this point, my FRiend. The powers that be have decreed that there must be blood to calm the masses, and unfortunately for Zimmerman, that blood will be his. For now until the next “Zimmerman”.
Watch the BBC news this Spring and you will see unfolding the barry bastard raceriot strategy. The number of flash mobbings will increase as the training intensifies, the training of the riot dead souls with black skin who are the ‘cannon fodder’ little barry bastard needs to sustain a race riot atmosphere for the suppression of voter turnout. Floriduh will not be left to chance this time. The chaos and hate-filled atmosphere in Floriduh is being planned and this prosecutor is part of the startegy to inflame the gullible black voters AND lawless black who will ste the fires and do the murdering the black panthers want. I’m predicting, so take it or leave it, but the flash mob training is gearing up from the ‘community organizers’. Te affirmative action perp in the White House must be sustained in order to bring America down.
Watch the BBC news this Spring and you will see unfolding the barry bastard raceriot strategy. The number of flash mobbings will increase as the training intensifies, the training of the riot dead souls with black skin who are the ‘cannon fodder’ little barry bastard needs to sustain a race riot atmosphere for the suppression of voter turnout. Floriduh will not be left to chance this time. The chaos and hate-filled atmosphere in Floriduh is being planned and this prosecutor is part of the startegy to inflame the gullible black voters AND lawless black who will ste the fires and do the murdering the black panthers want. I’m predicting, so take it or leave it, but the flash mob training is gearing up from the ‘community organizers’. The affirmative action perp in the White House must be sustained in order to bring America down.
Yeah, I caught that too.
Given the showy nature of her grand speech I would think she is going to play this to the media.
Is there an AG or somthing in her neck of the woods up for re-election?
“I think it is because the prosecutor is simply FEARFUL for her life.”
I don’t She seemed happy to be getting all the attention.
One does not have the right to defend oneself against one of Holder’s People, period, my FRiend.Without surrering the consequences.
Right now, I don't see 2nd degree. Possibly manslaughter, but not 2nd degree.
This is not going to end up well for anybody.
I am now convinced this administration was looking for a case similar to this (although it is not as good as they would like but they will use it anyway).
It will be impossible for George Zimmerman to get a fair trail when the President of the US and the top law enforcement officer all but states he is guilty. Add to that the threat of riots in the streets if he is not found guilty and what do you have.
I also believe that the best laid plans do not always go as planned and that unintended consequences is a b****
It reminds me of that old saying, be careful for what you wish for, you may get it.
I was only listening so I didn't see her SMIRK.
I hope that the facts of what actually happened come out, and if she was pursuing this for career enhancement and a political goal, I hope it blows up in her smirking face.
Will either be 3rd, aquital, or hung jury.
Either there will be a reverse OJ jury (convict regardless of law and evidence) and a conviction, or an acquittal and riots with cities burning. Either way, Obama’s DOJ will push to have it close to November...
My take - the prosecutor will try to say that carrying a gun, while part of the neighborhood watch, was the reckless act.
I don’t think she’ll get much mileage though...its not like Zimmerman was on ‘patrol’...was just going about his daily business when he saw Martin...with a legally owned gun.
Or maybe the act of following Martin was the act...again not much mileage. Nothing wrong with following somebody around on private property, in order to tell the police where to go.
With the Zimmerman family, spouting details to the press at every turn, they invite interpretations by the prosecution and the press, that could lead to a conviction.
If they had any sense they would keep their mouths shut, at least until the trial is over.
“One does not have the right to defend oneself against one of Holders People, period, my FRiend.Without suffering the consequences.”
Yes, that is the REAL message the black racists and their self-hating, white progressive allies, such as the condescending POS Bloomberg in NYC, want to send to the rest of us.
“THIS IDIOT PROSECUTOR SHOULD BE DISBARRED”
I thought the same, when I first read about her decision.
I thought about it some more and have concluded the following.
She is simply buying time. She is well aware that they will never get a 2nd degree murder conviction. They now have 6-9 months to let the angry mob cool off. Any trial will be after the election so the left will have less incentive to throw more gasoline on the fire.
During this delay the defense and others will reveal more and more information. We will see the police,eye witness and par-medics reports; which will leave no reasonable doubt that Mr. Zimmerman was attacked and injured.
Additional negative information about the alleged victim will be revealed. We will learn more about his drug use, the incident where they found apparently stolen jewelry on him will lead to information showing he was at least a petty theft and possibly a burglar. His thug/gangsta wannabe persona will emerge. Possible previous assaultive behavior. Who knows.
I read elsewhere that before the murder trial there will be a hearing on whether this was self defense; where the standard will be preponderance of evidence. By the end of that hearing the public will have seen more than enough evidence for the large majority to realize that this was ultimately self defense.
Given the pathological anger hatred and denial of reality on the one side; it is hard to predict how they will react to having the true facts exposed.
My fear is, the desire on the part of white and black leftest activists, to see major cities burned and loot is so great; no amount facts or evidence will make a difference.
You can only hope that by then, there is a Republican in the White House to suppress those riots and protect the truly innocent.