Skip to comments.Trayvon Martin case: George Zimmerman "quiet and cooperative" back in Fla. jail
Posted on 06/04/2012 1:32:52 AM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
George Zimmerman, the former neighborhood watch volunteer charged with murder in the killing of Trayvon Martin, surrendered to police Sunday and was booked into a central Florida jail two days after his bond was revoked.
Zimmerman's legal team said in a tweet Sunday afternoon that he was in police custody. Circuit Judge Kenneth Lester revoked Zimmerman's bond on Friday, saying the defendant and his wife had lied to the court in April about their finances so he could obtain a lower bond.
About 40 minutes before the 2:30 p.m. Sunday deadline to surrender, the Seminole County jail website listed Zimmerman as an inmate....
(Excerpt) Read more at cbsnews.com ...
—He lied to the judge.—
I’m not as sure about that as you are.
Surely the judge knew about the Paypal account. Everyone else in that courtroom and across the country knew that there was a Paypal account. Why didn't he ask how much money was in it directly??? Where was that question in his repertoire??? Was he really misled or was he just being willfully ignorant about it so as to make an issue about it later when more monies accrued to the account.
And the critical fact that they did not mislead the court about is that GZ and his wife are still destitute dependent upon the charity of others -- Paypal account or not. So before this judge gets on his high horse he should get real with himself.
Is the purpose of the bond to guarantee his appearance in court, or to punish him? I believe that in this case, Zimmerman has demonstrated that he’s not planning on ‘skipping out’ on the trial. This is just legal harassment.
We're all being trained. The lesson is: don't shoot black thugs. Even if you are 100% justified, the mob will make your life hell. The left believes black thugs are allies and deserve occupational safety like the rest of us. The judge and prosecutor know there is no legal chance of conviction but this is an election year. America is increasingly a banana republic run by thugs.
For the accusation of murder, the bail process has these steps:
Thanks for your informative post. The conditions of Zimmerman's first bail were he can't drink, can't posses a weapon, has a curfew, and must wear a location monitoring device locked to his ankle. It's identical to being on probation which is a punishment. Zimmerman has been denied his civil right of innocence until proven guilty. He has been denied multiple civil rights. The voters wanted change and the change we got is: we're not in America anymore.
The law is funny that way. A person can be jailed for contempt, to induce them to testify. The action, being jailed, is the same action used as punishment, yet jailing to induce testimony is viewed as "not punishment" because the witness has the keys to his jail cell.
So, on the conditions for bail, the monitoring device isn't imposed to restrict his location, ostensibly its function is further security that he will make himself available to the court.
I too find the curfew, no alcohol, and no weapon conditions unreasonable; but those are the standard unreasonable conditions imposed once the state gets its hooks into you.
-- Zimmerman has been denied his civil right of innocence until proven guilty. --
Not really. He's been improvidently charged, in my opinion, but he's "free" on bail (or was, and will be after working through this temper tantrum by the state). He has the presumption of innocence before the judge, and as far as I can tell, Lester isn't going to take any crap from the state, either. Corey and company are not going to be able to sell their "not self defense" position, to a "more likely not self defense, than was self defense" standard. They lack the evidence, and Lester isn't going to fall for smoke and mirrors.
What is your take on the issue at hand: Zimmerman’s purported misrepresentation? Should Zimmerman’s wife have volunteered to inquire further? Should the judge have asked her or Zimmerman’s counsel to do so? Do you think that the judge set up Zimmerman?
I really don't know what my take is - odd as that sounds. If Zimmerman's saw the funds as "ineligible" for use as bail (which seems to NOT be the case, based on their phone conversation), then they had no reason to feel obliged to mention the account/income to the court. Sort of like not mentioning your accrued Social Security or pension because they are out of reach for the purpose at hand, even though they are assets.
It may be that they aren't exactly sure why they acted the way they did. I suspect they harbor distrust of the government, and, having been financially strapped for awhile, felt some comfort in being able to pay off debts, and didn't want to lose that comfort to a bail imposition.
-- Should Zimmerman's wife have volunteered to inquire further? Should the judge have asked her or Zimmerman's counsel to do so? Do you think that the judge set up Zimmerman? --
I think Shellie should have said she was aware of $100,000+ coming in via the website; but that's based on hindsight and my state of mind. She'll get to explain why she did what she did, and it might be an embarrassing explanation.
I do think that the judge, de la Rionda, and O'Mara did not perform well on this point. The existence of the website was known on April 20th, Shellie was asked about it. A couple questions asking to bracket the amount would have done the job. Is there over ten thousand dollars? More than fifty thousand? More than a hundred thousand? Etc. It would have been best to have the questions come from O'Mara, as that makes the defense appear most forthcoming with "damaging" information.
I think de la Rionda and Corey "set up" Zimmerman with this short notice accusation of lying to the court. I don't fault the judge for not acting sooner (e.g., during the bail hearing on April 20, or during the press hearing on April 27, when the website funds of $200,000 was noticed to the court), because he hadn't any evidence, then, of what Zimmermans knew on April 20th.
I think the judge made a legal error in revoking bail on June 1st, but nothing will come of that. He only heard one side of the story, and IMO, the most he can do absent a finding of danger to the community or flight risk is increase the bail. He denied Zimmerman due process before re-incarcerating him, and did not make a finding that supports revocation of bail.
All that said, Zimmerman demonstrated that he is not a flight risk, etc., and in general seems to act as somebody who is confident his actions (on Feb 26th) were justified, and that he is not afraid to face "the system." IOW, he acts as though he has nothing to hide, and he'll be honest with the court.
O'Mara touched on this on June 1st, noting that Zimmerman hadn't even taken the money from the website to pay bail, and was planning to allow his parents and grandparents to borrow money against their homes for that purpose. Zimmerman didn't go out and buy a car or otherwise spend frivolously.
I think it is possible that Zimmerman comes out ahead on account of all this. Depends on what he says and how he responds to examination and cross examination during the upcoming bail hearing. The judge may find Zimmerman to be honest and credible, even if he is confessing the embarrassing fact that he was "hiding" bail.
While Mr. Zimmerman acknowledges that he allowed his financial situation to be misstated in court, the defense will emphasize that in all other regards, Mr. Zimmerman has been forthright and cooperative. ...
The audio recordings of Mr. Zimmerman's phone conversations while in jail make it clear that Mr. Zimmerman knew a significant sum had been raised by his original fundraising website. We feel the failure to disclose these funds was caused by fear, mistrust, and confusion. The gravity of this mistake has been distinctly illustrated, and Mr. Zimmerman understands that this mistake has undermined his credibility, which he will have to work to repair.
At the point of the bond hearing, Mr. Zimmerman had been driven from his home and neighborhood, could not go to work, his wife could not go back to a finish her nursing degree, his mother and father had been driven from their home, and he had been thrust into the national spotlight as a racist murderer by factions acting with their own agendas. None of those allegations have been supported by the discovery released to date, yet the hatred continues.
Going the ‘beg for forgiveness’ route eh?
Hopefully it will put the matter to rest quicker.
I agree with you. George Zimmerman should be strung up with his own intestines.
(OK, /s, a little.)
Finally O'Mara speaks up for his client.
They do discuss the bond in the 4:32PM call, but what is said is inconclusive. In fact it makes little sense.
George: If the bond is more than 15, pay the 15. If more than 15, pay the 10% to the bondsman.
Shelly: You don't want me to pay the $100
George: I don't know
Shelly: All right just think about it.
George: I will.
It seems to show that they thought the funds could be used to pay bail or a bail bondsman. The decision being discussed seems to be whether to pay the bail directly (which in the end, gets all your money back), or to pay 10% to a bail bondsman (which is money down the rathole).
It's in Zimmerman's interest to have bail set low; and by sandbagging the court, he stands to retain control of more loot. I suppose he is uncertain of how successful future fundraising will be, and so is reluctant to commit and/or lose the funds he has. E.g., if the court sets a million dollar bail, he's stuck sending 100 grand down the bail bondsman rathole.
That would presuppose a knowledge of the bond structure and willingness to commit perjury in order to maintain ready access to his windfall. We both know that's not the case since he turns it all over the O'Mara a few days later.
General knowledge of the bond structure is pretty easy to come by, and by this time he'd had discussions with O'Mara about getting out of jail.
The upside issue isn't just ready access, it's also how much money he will be sending down a rathole. Whatever doesn't go down the rathole can be used to pay living expenses and lawyers.
I do agree about the perjury and other risks (like the one he's up against now), and perhaps naivete about how aggressive the state can be in searching "private" affairs like bank accounts; and how much abject hatred Corey has, played into Zimmerman's risk taking.
-- We both know that's not the case since he turns it all over the O'Mara a few days later. --
Mission accomplished - low bail. Maybe change of heart, cold feet, maybe a little smarter - still doesn't change what happened on April 20th, or between April 12 and April 20.
We'll see how the judge handles it. I think Zimmerman's story -now- is quite credible, in part because it admits something in the nature of wrongdoing, aims to explain his state of mind without saying he was justified. I also like that O'Mara is making the point that the state has failed, so far, to produce evidence in support of its charge. "None of those [racist murderer] allegations have been supported by the discovery released to date," which he does to sort of explain Zimmerman's state of mind. But that statement also implies that the prosecution is a bunch of liars, too.
Yes, but as we get to know George, it's become clear that ease of finding the information may not equate to understanding the information. Honestly, I think he's Forest Gump'd his way through this to remain as clean as he has.
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