The South is Right!

Nolan Chart ^ | May 25, 2012 | Mark Voge

[Terry Mross]

Why should I study? You know everything and I’m sure you love to prove that to everybody every chance you get. So, will you explain to me what a smart ass is? Never mind. I did a little studying. Looked it up in the dictionary. It has a picture of you.

[donmeaker]

The so called southern anthem was written and performed in New York city.

The symbol recognized around the world is the US flag.

[gzzimlich]

The North had slavery, too, and Lincoln did not free the slaves, the 13th Amendment did.

***

The “party of Lincoln” line that was used for a while tickled me pink.

“I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races. I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people. And I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will ever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. … And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race.” – Abraham Lincoln in his fourth debate with Stephen Douglas in the campaign for the United States Senate on September 18th of 1858.

I also seem to remember a collection of narratives from some old ex-slaves (1930’s I think) in which many expressed an abiding reverence for their former masters that had withstood half-century of post-slavery experience.

Just sayin’..

[rockrr]

I had to chuckle at our thin-skinned Lost Causer buddies’ detritus here. Some folks just can’t figure out when it’s timne to move along.

[jmacusa]

Wealth was in owning another human being. How do you get around that?

[2ndDivisionVet]

I’m not a spokesman for the South, so I don’t have to “get around” anything. Did you read the article and assimilate the information it imparted or just respond to the headline?

[jmacusa]

Yes 2nd, I read the article and never read so much twaddle in my life. Do you really think we in the North are all God-less liberals? Do you really believe that? 150 years ago the South intended to preserve an evil system of an economy based on slave labor, it launched a war it couldn’t possibly hope to win and is responsible for the deaths of 660,000 Americans. I’ve no truck with any Southerner or any of my fellow citizens who considers themselves an AMERICAN as I do. I’m not a ‘’Northerner’’ or a “Yankee’’. My problem is with “Johnny Reb wanna-be’s who haven’t realized the Confederacy lost and the war is over.

[2ndDivisionVet]

I was raised in Southern California, South Florida and Central Iowa, so I’m not really a Southerner, either. I live in Mississippi and am moving back to the Dallas area in a few weeks.

[WKB]

A Southern man don’t need him around anyhow, ping

[duffee]

In the North it was “The Civil War”, to the Southern media and politicians it was “The War for Southern Independence”, to the those in the South who did the killing, the dying and the mourning, it was “The War Against Northern Aggression”.

[x]

In the North it was “The Civil War”, to the Southern media and politicians it was “The War for Southern Independence”, to the those in the South who did the killing, the dying and the mourning, it was “The War Against Northern Aggression”.

C'mon, that sounds an awful lot more like something wiseacres and malcontents thought up much, much later.

Didn't it sound a little comical the first time you heard it?

Google finds it used exactly once during the war, by a Northern General as something he wanted to refute.

It looks like the phrase really got started in the 1950s and took off in recent decades. Source

Nowadays, somebody's going to accuse somebody like me of saying Confederate soldiers were stupid if I point out that "War of Northern Aggression" was pretty highfalootin' for use in the trenches and encampments, but ordinary folks, North or South, would have felt pretentious talking that way.

I can't say that nobody ever said, "This is a war of Northern agression," but that wasn't what soldiers commonly called the war.

[duffee]

I’ve heard it all my life and “The War for Southern Independence” was used extensively by politicians and newspapers, “Ive also heard and seen in print “The War Against Northern Aggression” all my life and it probably didn’t come into use until after the war. Some of it’s origins are attributed to the fact that the “Cause” hadn’t attracted great numbers of enlistments, enough to fight a war until President Lincoln called for 75,000 volunteers to invade the South. It has always been known in the South that for many of those who participated it was not political. And yes I did make the statement with a degree of tounge in cheek, the same way I often ask a newcomer from the North if he’s a yankee or a damn yankee, this is part of our history and with it came great suffering and hardship of our people. The women of the South were bitter and held grudges for generations beyond the years when the vetrans of both armies would sit together and share stories. There were atrocities commited against the civilan populations, an example would be the shelling of the civilan population of Vicksburg as well as the shelling of yellow flag marked military hospitals in Vicksburg. I’ve not commented on slavery, secession, then or now, but only something that may offer a little insight into how this Southerner views the history of the war and the aftermath. Many of us had ancestors who served in this conflict and while most came home all didn’t and none including the civilans were unscathed.

[jmacusa]

Good luck with the move. How’s things been for you over all,everything ok? I visited Southern CA twice, Oceanside, when my brother was in the Marine Corp. Sure was nice. Long time ago though, late ‘70s.

[x]

There's an old joke. I don't remember the exact wording but it went something like this: "You know you're in the South when they call the Civil War 'the War Between the States.' You know you're really in the South when they call it 'the War of Southern Independence.' And you know you're really, really in the Deep South, when they call it 'The War against Northern Agression.'"

I thought it was something "Senator Cleghorn" the radio comedian came up with that some people took too seriously, but sure, it's possible that some Southerners actually used the phrase before the joke started circulating. Given the depth of bitterness after the war, it's wholly likely that some Southerners did use the expression in deadly earnest before somebody thought up the joke.

But now some people actually believe that Southerners who experienced the Civil War actually called it "The War of Northern Aggression" or "The War Against Northern Aggression" while they were fighting it. When you wrote "In the North it was “The Civil War”, to the Southern media and politicians it was “The War for Southern Independence”, to the those in the South who did the killing, the dying and the mourning, it was “The War Against Northern Aggression”" it certainly leaves that impression. But that isn't true. As you say, it was something that most likely came into use after the war.

The people who actually fought the war were less bloodthirsty and warlike than politicians and newspaper writers who didn't see action. That's true of most wars when people are actually fighting. Afterwards politicians and journalists may want to forget what veterans can't.

Also, when you're fighting a war you also don't have the time or the motivation to overthink things the way that people do after a defeat. There are more important things to do and to worry about than playing word games.

I don't have an opinion about the rest, except to say that it all happened a very long time ago.

[2ndDivisionVet]

Why are these rental trucks so dang expensive? I don’t want to buy the thing, just use it for 3-4 days!!

[duffee]

I left out of my response that the men in the trenches on both sides and the populace in the North and the South would simply refer to it as the war and probably even did so after the Spanish American War until WWI. But of course Mississippi is one of the Deep South States. The point is that there are many who believe that the bulk of the Southern Army consisted of men who were there not for political purposes but to stop the invasion of their homeland, as I pointed out the surge of enlistments came after the call for 75,000 volunteers to invade the South.
It did happen a long time ago and most of the time these things are kind of said tounge in cheek now.

[dixiechick2000]

“A Southern man don’t need him around anyhow, ping”

Granted, and bump!

“The South is about understanding that wealth is not money. Wealth is in the land, in the family, and in the things we produce. Money is a tool, not a source of value.”

This is true, though. Family values is the bedrock of the South, at least in the rural South.

Southern big cities are as as bad as any other big city...anywhere.

[dixiechick2000]

“In fact, in most of the Baptist Churches, about 40% of the congregation is all us Northerners. That was true of the 3 Baptist Churches I tied until I stayed in the last one for the last 18 months”

So, WHERE do you live? My guess is either Charlotte or Atlanta.