Skip to comments.$83,046 For A 3 Hour Hospital Visit - Why Are Hospital Bills So Outrageous?
Posted on 09/08/2012 11:04:18 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
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WHY?? Because allthe ILLEGALS that have no insurance uses them for EVERYTHING and they are NEVER asked to pay a CENT!!!
A friend who is in medical billing says its all “software.”
Costs are assigned to procedures. An accounting program that does a straight calculation of costs plus depreciation, profit, etc... will come out with such ridiculously high outputs
Of course, no one ever actually pays that. Other layers of the accounting and billing software then have the actual agreed charges for insurance companies, Medicaid, etc...
It’s cost shifting - her bill is higher to pay for those who do not pay.
Let the government fix it. They really know how to turn businesses around.
One change fixes it all. Loser pays and the suing attorney has a 33% stake in the suit.
The reason for these costs is: third party payer
The solution is easier: pay for your own normal costs, but maintain catastrophic insurance... and if everybody had to pull it out of their pockets, they would know the true costs and raise hell...
Strict loser pays is a horrible system. It’s essentially a shield against suit for anyone with deep pockets. In Texas, we’ve done it right. If you lose a lawsuit AND it’s deemed to have been frivolous, loser pays. If you lose a lawsuit and it’s not frivolous, meaning that a trial was deemed legitimately necessary to weigh the merits, then the loser pays nothing, as it should be.
When the government got involved with Medicaid and Medicare and started messing with market forces, that’s when it all went downhill.
Agreed..my husband is going in for outpatient plastic surgery on Monday to remove 4 skin cancer lesions..he’s had skin cancer before but last time a dermatologist removed & insurance covered but this time since plastic surgery involved, $1200 out of pocket. Using plastic surgeon this time because 2 are located on his face.We confirmed that they’re billing as medical rather than cosmetic & they basically said it’s the insurance on why cost is so high..
Because those of us who can pay subsidize those who don’t as well as drugs for the world.
US drug consumers pay for poor around the world to get drugs cheaper
sad irony...most can’t afford even that we subsidize
that and because health insurance is now medical care period when it used to be just for major medical
IMHO, why the high bills
- lawyer tax - having to pay the dr’s liability insurnce
- illegal tax - pay for the illegals who rack up medical bills
One of the big problems is lack of transparency on pricing. It would be like if walked into a McDonald’s where there no prices on the board and they rang you up for a $500 Big Mac after you ordered. Nobody asks how much will this cost before they ask for a procedure nor do hospitals post any prices for treatments so people can make rational care decisions.
it soaks in and then hits all abnormal skin cells over the whole body
it is amazing stuff but makes ya sick as hell and the lesions go bananas...looks like post Nagasaki burns everywhere there is anything
it is a reminder to go ahead and get pre cancerous little basal cells zotted first chance before they grow and it gets deadly or expensive
my buddy was a charter captain in the Gulf for decades and had skin tone like a Swede..ripe for all that skin stuff
I had a blue mole on my shoulder last month, my wife's botox doc just froze it off and cultured it...nothing
What you said! Everything they touch turns to crap.
I always just assumed the costs were so high because so many people, legally and illegally here are required to be given medical care, and have no intention of paying for it.
Since most patients do not pay out of pocket there is surprise but little outrage when they get the bill. Whether it be insurance or govt the third party payer system creates no incentive to hold down costs and even encourages their growth. If you look at medicine the only areas of real cost competition are elective cosmetic surgery, lasik surgery, and veterinary medicine. Why does competition exist in these? Because there are few if any third party payment systems in these areas, and no govt payments.
Many years ago, my daughter had an emergency appendectomy. I accused the hospital of performing the surgery at the civic auditorium....... cuz their facility wasn’t big enough to hold all the people who sent me bills.
That bill of $83/k is sooo outrageous off the charts. Wouldn’t pay a penny of it until it is reworked. Earlier this year I had an ER bill of $3.5/k for a 1.5 hour visit.
I contested as much of it as possible to chop a few hundred dollars off. Still feel like they chumped me out of big $.
All I had was BP checks and vitals, IV, blood for labs, CT exam and some pain meds to ease passage of kidney stone.
Insurance companies and lawyers.
Last summer, I spent a few days at the Cleveland Clinic...My bill was $387,000.
That stinks. A $6 dollar bottle of Passwan would have stopped the pain in an hour and dissolved the stones in about 24.
I dunno. The only thing I know is that my last 3-day ER stay at the hospital was $10,000. $5,000 for the hospital stay and $5,000 for a full body MRI. I had no clue that a MRI was so costly. And that same year I had the test where they run a camera through your arteries to check for blocks. I am just thankful for my insurance coverage and I wasn’t out of pocket for all those costs. I had the best of care, and I certainly would like to keep it that way.
RE: My bill was $387,000.
How was the bill paid?
If you paid off everything, you must be among the 1% of this country...
1. Give the patient enough time to tell him possible diagnoses and explain the tests that seem a) necessary and b) could possibly be helpful
And allow the patient to decide which he wishes to pay for.
This would mean NO FRIVOLOUS LAWSUITS for malpractice — will definitely need tort reform for this.
But I’d like to see the patient in the driver’s seat, rather than the doctor’s CYA. Now you will be undergoing MRI’s for tummy aches in case it could theoretically be a tumor. Allow the patient to turn down tests if he doesn’t wish them and still be able to be seen by the doctor, as long as doc has given his advice. Doctors should be required only to INFORM and not control the decisions.
And if you can’t prove you are here in this country legally, resident, tourist, or citizen, forget it. No treatment other than immediate life saving. Die on the doorstep. You shouldn’t be here. I can’t expect Antarctica to let me live just because I want to be there in a bikini!
A small local hospital had a banner on the front “80% off for cash”. What does that tell you?
That works for me.
Simple besides the theft; we are each paying for about 5 illegals.
First, insurance is a big part of the problem . They way we use medical insurance as a price control, hospitals charge huge amounts knowing the insurance has negotiated a much lower price — but those without insurance get confronted with the bill. If you fight it, you’ll get a lower price.
The cost from the manufacturer for this drug? “Hospital markups are the other driving force in the cost of Anascorp. Rare Disease Therapeutics sells the drug for $3,500 to a distributor, which then charges hospitals $3,780.”
This is expensive, but most is the hospital markup.
The drug company spends the same amount to get this drug through the FDA as any other drug. But they only sell a few thousand doses a year — so they have to spread the regulation costs, which can be millions, across a very small number of sales.
The FDA also charges a large amount of money to this drug, even though there are almost no sales — FDA gets funding by taxes on the drugs it regulates.
But in the end, this is what insurance has to be about — paying for the drugs that HAVE to cost $3,000 a dose, because they sell so few doses. And this is why you should always have health insurance, unless you are independently wealthy.
And why in a sane world, we’d be allowed to buy our own health insurance with high deductables.
The people who balk at paying $80,000 for a drug that just saved hteir life — would they be upset if their house burned down and the construction company wanted to charge $200,000 to rebuild it? Of course not. They have insurance that covers it.
And if they didn’t have insurance, they would be out the $200,000. That’s why they buy insurance.
Patients have been patterned somehow to feel it’s not their business or responsibility to consider costs before buying medical services, because:
1) they assume someone else (insurance co., Uncle Sam) is paying; and,
2) they are often in medical duress when the service is needed, and are focused on surviving.
3) the itemizing systems make it hard to understand, and hide the magnitude of the rip-off by making all the components seem just a bit outrageous.
4) they want things they can’t afford.
If you don’t want socialism, shoulder responsibility. People should review their medical bills, getting comparable cost information, and calling BS on ridiculous claims — just as you would if a mechanic tried to charge you $80,000 to change the oil in your car. Paying actual costs plus reasonable overhead and profit for anything you buy is fair and proper. But if someone wants to charge you $6,000 each for an medical item that you believe costs them $100 all in, offer $125, and ask for the same explanation that they would be making to a judge (if they can make a compelling logical argument for $6,000, you should pay it). If you have private insurance, advise you company when bills look fraudulent, and request in writing a complete review and explanation.
That said, I suspect many “outrageous cost anecdotes” grossly inflate the amounts charged by oversimplifying what was actually included. State troopers don’t haul people away in cuffs for overdue bills — that is either total hoo-ey, or there was a lot more to the story than reported.
In 1994 when we were fighting off Hillarycare they said it was 16%. So in the last twenty or so years, it has not increased much, especially given the concurrent aging of the population and our increasing expectations of the system.
Today we perform an abundance of hip and knee replacements eg, which were not nearly so common twenty or thirty years ago, not to mention organ transplants. We are accustomed to the routine availability and use of high tech instruments, often less accessible or unavailable in other, more 'economical' countries, even though they cost a fortune to the hospitals buying and operating them.
Is it worth a bit more of the GDP to be able to get an MRI within hours, on demand, rather than waiting six weeks as in some other countries I know? or for thousands of people to be able to walk, on new knees or hips, than to be confined to a wheelchair? Obama says no, it's not worth it to him for you to have these options. I say yes. If only because I might need them one day.
It is time to admit that the "crisis in healthcare costs" is merely another of the many manufactured "crises" of the Left, designed to drive people to the government for a solution. I believe few if any of the horror stories are fully accurate, and I don't think healthcare costs too much.
Pardon me if I don't want to go Forward! to scarcity and rationing along with the Usurper and the leftwing foundations who produce this dreck.
The entire cost of my birth in 1964 (Doctor, hospital room, delivery, medicines etc) was around $85.
It is due to Gov’t regulation and gov’t method of paying for healthcare. Take on of those $88,000 hospital bill and Medicare will pay about 35% or about $30,000. Medicaid will pay about 10% to 20%, or about $10,000 to $15,000. Commercial Insurance will pay about $35,000 to $40,000. about 15% to 20% of the population will not pay anything due to either being a bad debt or legally required free care. Probably less than 10% of the population gets stuck with having to pay full charges with no discounts. This is required by Medicare regulation that all payors get charged the same price for the same service. Discounts are allowed but there must be a justifiiable economic reason for giving a discount to a broad classification of patients, otherwise it is classified a fraud. It is illegal for a Dr. of Hospital to not charge a patient for their deductibles or coinsurance. You cannot give free or discounted care unless the patient meets pre determined financial criteria.
Hospitals are doing what is required to survive and continue to provide care is a very highly regulated industry.
If you do not like your hospital bill, go talk to your congress person and tell them to get the gov’t out of healthcare while you still have a chance to do so.
1) Anascorp is an orphan drug.. The mfg will never recover the costs of development.
2) Mexico didn’t pay a dime for the research.
I had a doctor tell me he couldn’t take cash payment, because some people will sue if they think cash payers get better care.
I paid $185,000 for an 8 day visit. Quite a bit more than the funeral I would have had otherwise and the nurses were cute!
RE: The entire cost of my birth in 1964 (Doctor, hospital room, delivery, medicines etc) was around $85.
Using the Inflation calculator here,
That would be about $591.00 in 2010.
How much does a normal baby delivery cost today?
When the government started limiting the number of hospitals and medical schools and people started paying for insurance instead of out of pocket, and a bunch of other things.
Actually I vaguely remember an article at the Mises website that detailed some of this but I haven’t been to that site in ages.
My wife had open heart surgery in May,2 weeks in the cardiac ICU after surgery.You don’t want to know what the total bill was.
Yes...definitely part of the problem. The solution that hospitals use is called “cost shifting,” and that is one reason for the high costs to insurers and the public. Otherwise, hospitals would have to close their doors.
It used to be illegals were the reason but now, illegals and insurance companies never want to pay, so the billing is adjusted accordingly to force the uninsured citizen using hospital services to pay the bulk of expenses.
Insurance is a part of the problem. The rates they pay are significantly less than the list price but that alone will not solve the problem.
The govt regulations the healthcare industry has to comply with is truly amazing.
Health insurance didn’t come into widespread use till the 60s and 70s.
If they had to pay the first $5000, they would demand itemized bills that weren't just based on the fraudulent DRGs the government uses, which were never intended to be used for billing purposes.
Which explains why health care costs were only 5% of GDP in the 50s, but are almost 20% now.
Insurance paid the majority of the bill (I had open heart surgery for removal of a Myxoma tumor).
Some of the bill was written off by the Clinic because one of their doctors screwed up a routine heart cath so bad I required 3 additional surgeries to repair the damage, two months on a wound vac, and a visit from a home health nurse every other day for the duration of the wound vac.
And I’m still being seen by their vascular dept for that mess.
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