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British National Archives show a son was born to Obama Sr. in 1961 in Kenya
gopthedailydose ^ | May 4, 2013 | Dr. Eowyn

Posted on 05/04/2013 7:35:39 PM PDT by bgill

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To: Nero Germanicus
Fascinating. I always thought that “natural born” referred to biological parents. I learn some thing new every day.

I would expect that "natural born" ought to apply to natural parents, but our legal system, borrowing that old English Common law stuff, says that a Marriage makes all children of the wife, his children, and it doesn't matter if he fathered them or not. Any children she has while married, are His children legally.

As I have been trying to tell you, the law is an ignorant @ss sometimes, and it makes ridiculous and absurd decisions because it is more interested in citing precedent then in arguing from first principles.

Without DNA confirmation, we don’t know for certain who anyone’s fathers are. There is a Constitutional provision under the Full Faith and Credit clause to accept official vital records as authentic and accurate while allowing for legal challenges to the accuracy of any vital record. Obama’s vital records have been challenged scores of times, but thus far not successfully.

"Challenged", in this case, is a euphemism for "not permitted to be challenged." Come off it. None of these judges ever cooperated in any attempt to get at real documents. It was a series of circus shows with no attempt to address what is the actual truth.

All of the Judges played the part of Obi-Wan-Kenobi.

"You don't need to see his identification."

101 posted on 05/05/2013 1:26:44 PM PDT by DiogenesLamp (Partus Sequitur Patrem)
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To: Nero Germanicus
Did I say that House Res. 593 “proved” anything?

By implication. What other point is there to citing 378-0?

The resolution might help to explain why the House has been so reluctant to hold hearings on the natural born citizen issue.

The Reluctance is easily explainable by politics. The Democrats absolutely don't care whether their guy is legit or not. The Republicans are terrified that they will be labelled "racists" by the national news media if they make an issue out of this guy's ancestry.

Neither side is motivated by any interest in learning the objective truth. They just want it to go away for their political well being. They are pragmatic, and resent anyone rocking the boat over some trivial principle.

102 posted on 05/05/2013 1:31:40 PM PDT by DiogenesLamp (Partus Sequitur Patrem)
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To: Lancey Howard
"...That child, smart enough to understand that he has been shuffled off by his own mother, and fully aware that his biological father could care less that he was ever born, might grow up thinking abortion is the greatest thing since sliced bread. Even murdering babies that survive abortion attempts would seem like a fine idea to such a bitter child.

The ultimate irony of "covering your own tracks," at which he excels mightily!

HF

103 posted on 05/05/2013 2:27:42 PM PDT by holden (Alter or abolish it yet?)
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To: DiogenesLamp

I’m guessing that you don’t really expect politicians to not be motivated by politics.
“All’s fair in love, war, and politics.” While politicians may intensely dislike the opposition and their policy positions, they all have a deep, abiding respect for whoever it is that goes through the entire grueling process and emerges on top in their chosen profession. They all know how hard it is to get elected to any position and most especially the presidency.
If there was anything to be uncovered, the hundreds of millions of dollars that The Koch Brothers, Donald Trump and Sheldon Adelson alone put into ridding us of Barack Obama should have uncovered a few scintillas of evidence. It didn’t.


104 posted on 05/05/2013 2:32:16 PM PDT by Nero Germanicus
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To: Greenperson

My point is that Kezia is reported to have been pregnant in 1961, even though her husband was in the USA. It’s the reason why BHO Sr. said he divorced her. What became of that child?


105 posted on 05/05/2013 2:58:54 PM PDT by Greenperson
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To: TigersEye; Kenny Bunk

Kenny Bunk, you meant bho already had a kid in Kenya in 1961, right?

Kezia ‘s

To: Kenny Bunk

OK,BHO,Sr. Had a kid in Kenya in 1961. Wouldn’t exactly be surprised. BFD. IIRC,he was married to a number of Kenyan Kuties at the time and left spawn all over the tribal areas.

And this one born in Kenya just happened to be born on the same day as Bhobo!?! LOL Okey dokey.

95 posted on Sun May 05 2013 14:55:06 GMT-0500 (CDT) by TigersEye (If babies had guns they wouldn’t be aborted) [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 67 | View Replies | Report Abuse]


106 posted on 05/05/2013 3:02:17 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: WildHighlander57

If that is what he meant then it was an entirely non-sequitur comment.


107 posted on 05/05/2013 3:18:48 PM PDT by TigersEye (If babies had guns they wouldn't be aborted)
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To: DustyMoment

Chester Arthur was not NBC

He was born in Canada and his father was born in Scotland...

or something like that...


108 posted on 05/05/2013 3:25:37 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana
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To: WildHighlander57

The claim is that the British National Archive records the birth of a son BHO Sr. in Kenya in 1961.

The thread article is total recapitulation of the article I posted awhile back (with no new information) which was helpfully posted up-thread in comment #45:

OBAMA’S KENYAN BIRTH RECORDS DISCOVERED IN BRITISH NATIONAL ARCHIVES
The Daily Pen ^ | July 18, 2012 | Dan Crosby

Posted on Thursday, July 19, 2012 8:28:21 PM by Seizethecarp

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2908395/posts?q=1&;page=1#1

45 posted on Saturday, May 4, 2013 11:52:49 PM by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)


109 posted on 05/05/2013 3:32:15 PM PDT by Seizethecarp ((Defend aircraft from "runway kill zone" mini-drone helicopter swarm attacks: www.runwaykillzone.com)
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To: Greenperson

http://www.doctorzebra.com/imprez/44tree.png

Roy/Abongo was the first of the kids BHO and Kezia had.

Family tree is in the link, and the kids have numbers next to to their names.

Greenperson wrote:

My point is that Kezia is reported to have been pregnant in 1961,even though her husband was in the USA. It’s the reason why BHO Sr. said he divorced her. What became of that child?


110 posted on 05/05/2013 3:50:08 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: Fred Nerks

Wondering if only Kenyan citizens can inherit from their fathers estate.


111 posted on 05/05/2013 4:10:21 PM PDT by ObligedFriend
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To: Greenperson

Since the british national archives show a son was born to Obama SR in 1961 in kenya, its not Roy/Abongo .

That family tree link I posted leaves out the dates, but I believe this 1961 kid is the Barack born to Stanley Ann.

If she went to Kenya in 1961 and couldn’t get back to the u.s. due to flight restrictions on flying-while-more-than-8-months-pregnant , that kid was probably Barack Hussein Obama.

And Stanley Ann being 18 at the time of the birth couldn’t convey u.s. citizenship per Section 301 a) 7) of 1952 INA rules; she was married to bho SR.

So then the British citizenship rules apply and he’s listed in THEIR archives.


112 posted on 05/05/2013 4:15:00 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: DiogenesLamp
Anyone can assert that some bit of text or information is somewhere in some document which we aren’t seeing, but when the image of the document itself is posted, no one can argue about what is written thereon.
Unless they post an image (or a link to it.) of the document upon which this claim is based, i’m calling fake.

Stop the presses--we agree about something! One question I have that seeing the page might answer is whether it says the 1961 child was born in Kenya. All the story says is

The hand written line records first discovered in 2009, indicate several events were registered to the name Barack Obama (appears to be handwritten and spelled “Burack” and “Biraq”) beginning in 1953 and include two births recorded in 1958 and 1960, a marriage license registration in 1954 and a birth in 1961.
I could easily see the colonial officials recording a "vital event" pertaining to BHO Sr. even if it didn't happen in Kenya.

Besides (and here I suspect we part company), why so much trust in Kenyan handwritten records that don't even spell the man's name the same way each time? Would anyone here accept a handwritten entry from Hawaii that "Biraq" Obama had had a son there as proof of BHO's story?

113 posted on 05/05/2013 4:21:06 PM PDT by Ha Ha Thats Very Logical
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To: Seizethecarp

See #110 and 112; #110 should serve to sort out all the kids.

The big thing is, the kid is in the British archives because his citizenship came from his dad, not his mom.

Agrees with what the fightthesmears web site said (before somebody got to it and dumped that info) about 0’s nationality being governed by bho SR ‘s.


114 posted on 05/05/2013 4:21:48 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: Greenperson

Another thought, what if Kezia had a kid out of wedlock in Kenya while bho was away....

Need those dates & do a timeline on the wives :0

(Aargh!)

“To: Greenperson

My point is that Kezia is reported to have been pregnant in 1961,even though her husband was in the USA. It’s the reason why BHO Sr. said he divorced her. What became of that child?

105 posted on Sun May 05 2013 16:58:54 GMT-0500 (CDT) by Greenperson [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 98 | View Replies | Report Abuse]


115 posted on 05/05/2013 4:33:38 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: ObligedFriend
Wondering if only Kenyan citizens can inherit from their fathers estate.

The information that Mark inherited from his father comes from Dreams, so one needs to retain reservations. If you read the various articles out of Kenya that describe the life of the kenyan student after his marriage to Ruth broke down, he had nothing to leave. He drove a broken down Ford sedan that had been in a number of accidents, he had spent a year sleeping on a friends couch, and if you can believe his daughter Auma's account, there was no food where he was living at the time she went to visit him in Nairobi.

What Mark inherited would seem to be his personal belongings. I imagine that would include his documents and letters and any photographs...there were some photographs the kenyan sent home while he was in the US, which ended up in the hands of Daphne Barak, the photo journalist who visited 'granny' Sarah in the village. Other photographs ended up with Mark, some of which came from Ruth, and Mark showed these in a video.

It's complex. The kenyan had an older brother according to a teacher at the school in Maseno, records show that his name was recorded as Joseph. The students were apparently given english names at this Anglican school. Thus Joseph would have been Yusuf.

Just as Barak (or Barrak) would have been named an english equivalent, and the closest would have been BERWICK. That could be why he insisted on having his name pronounced as BEARIK.

Yusuf is shown as a son of Onyango and Sarah. Wiki has him as being born circ 1950's. Yet Malik (Roy Abongo) introduces him as UNCLE and he is described in an article out of Kenya as as small man with a moustache but that article, although it still exists, has had the photograph of the uncle removed.

As an uncle of Malik, this Yusuf is of the same generation as Barak/Berwick - although they had different mothers. The teacher at Maseno clearly states that JOSEPH was the elder of the two.

As the elder of the two brothers, it is JOSEPH/YUSUF who would inherit the land of his father ONYNAGO. And while he is still alive, Sarah holds a cultural position of authority in the Clan, and is able to refuse Malik, the son of Barak/Berwick permission to erect a mosque on the land, and when Malik became too demanding, she threatened to have him evicted.

Do you follow? If Barak Hussein Obama, son of Onyango, was actually the ELDEST SON of Onyango, Malik would have inherited. He would not have been in altercations with the second wife of his father. She would be beholden to Malik.

Why there's a need to keep the elder son out of the picture beats me, it might have something to do with Barak having been expelled from Maseno? It might be that the year of birth he quoted on his early INS documents, 1934, was actually the birth year of the older brother.

In any case, there's something not right. And that should not surprise any of us. Why would the deception and subterfuge commence with his arrival in Hawaii? The entire scenario, including the airlift story and the friendship with Tom Mboya is also a fabrication.

Did you get more than you asked for? Yes. That's because the devil is in the detail. One day, after Yusuf passes away and joins his ancestors, the position of Clan Elder will pass to Malik - and you will know when that happens, you'll see Malik wearing the cap and carrying the whisk, as the current Clan Elder does now:


116 posted on 05/05/2013 5:15:37 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Ha Ha Thats Very Logical; DiogenesLamp

1953. ????

1954 marriage to Kezia?,

1958 birth of Roy/abongo?,

1960 birth of Auma?

1961 birth of bho?

Post #110 doesn’t have dates , but has the birth order.


117 posted on 05/05/2013 5:19:10 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: WildHighlander57

“My point is that Kezia is reported to have been pregnant in 1961,even though her husband was in the USA. It’s the reason why BHO Sr. said he divorced her.”

I haven’t seen any evidence to support that claim and there is evidence that refutes it up through at least May 1962:

http://www.wnd.com/2010/11/226349/

begin quote

A letter Barack Obama Sr. wrote in 1962 raises new questions about the veracity of the official Obama nativity story related by Barack Obama Jr. in his autobiography, “Dreams from My Father.”

In a May 1962 letter he wrote from Hawaii to his political benefactor in Kenya, Tom Mboya, Barack Obama Sr. discusses his “wife,” but without mentioning Ann Dunham, his Hawaiian bride and the mother of the future president.

Toward the end of the letter, Obama wrote, “You know my wife is in Nairobi there and I would really appreciate any help you may give her.”

Clearly Obama Sr. is referring to his first wife, Kezia Aoko, whom he had married in 1954 at age 18 while she was pregnant with their first child. Obama left Kenya in 1959 to study in Hawaii.

He instructs Mboya that his wife Kezia was then staying with her brother, Wilson Odiawo, in Nairobi.

end quote


118 posted on 05/05/2013 5:28:55 PM PDT by Seizethecarp ((Defend aircraft from "runway kill zone" mini-drone helicopter swarm attacks: www.runwaykillzone.com)
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To: Greenperson

Greenperson,

Per the foia’ed INA docs for bho SR , the ina was starting to ask about the wife (kezia) back in Kenya.

If I recall correctly, the ina at the time was concerned about “good moral character “.

“,.......Dr. Eowyn makes a very good point: If BHO the elder had acknowledged the birth of a US citizen son to the INS,that “anchor baby” would be his ticket to stay in the USA. Why didn’t he use that son as an argument against his own deportation,several years later,when he was kicked out of the USA? Barry was supposed to be living in Hawaii at the time,with his mother. Even though they were estranged,his “son” was still his son,wasn’t he?”


119 posted on 05/05/2013 5:39:48 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: Greenperson
My point is that Kezia is reported to have been pregnant in 1961, even though her husband was in the USA. It’s the reason why BHO Sr. said he divorced her. What became of that child?

Have you ever seen an actual, genuine, provenanced family tree for the Onyango Clan from the village of Kogelo? Do we know what year the kenyan student was born? Can we be a 100% certain that it was Barack Hussein Obama who was born in 1934 who came to Hawaii, or might it have been his brother?

According to articles out of Kenya, one of the two was expelled, one of the two was arrested. Either of these events would have prevented the acceptance of a scholarship at a US university, as the applicant students were vetted by Tom Mboya himself. The kenyan student wasn't an AASF (African American Students Foundation) Grantee. He didn't pass muster. Elizabeth Mooney apparently paid for his airfare. His sponsors are shown as Elizabeth's employer: The Laubach Literacy Fund.

Cora Weiss, acting in some secretarial position for the AASF maintains that organisation sponsored him. Yet the kenyan never listed the AASF on his list of sponsors. He does list the Stokes-Phelps Fund, that was associated with the AASF. But he doesn't acknowledge their contribution as sponsor until he was already at Harvard.

Cora Weiss and Maloolm X met the first contingent of 81 students at Idlewild in September 1959. That was ONE MONTH after the kenyan student had already arrived in Hawaii. He boarded an aircraft in London and landed in New York in August. Kezia famously said that her son was six years old when she saw him off at the airport in Nairobi. Granted, that sounds like a mistake, but all things considered, trying to pin-point when Kezia's numerous offspring were born and who their father/s might have been, could be an exercise in futility. She maintains he came to visit her a number of times when she was working in Mombasa...while he was living in Nairobo with Ruth. How romantic. It didn't bother her who he married in the US she said, because she would always be his first wife. And she didn't need to add, any children she might have had while he was in the US, were also his.

120 posted on 05/05/2013 5:43:18 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: WildHighlander57

Do you really believe that the kenyan was married to a woman in 1954 and they didn’t have a child until 1958?

If they were married in 1954, their first very well could have been six years of age when the kenyan got on that aircraft in 1959 in August.

There’s nothing provenanced about who is who and when and what their real names were/are. I just cannot get over how everyone tries to apply their own culture to tribal africa.

Local talk (in an oral society, that’s like a newspaper) had it that the student who graduated from Maseno, the one who had good grades, went to the US for his education when he graduated.

So, from that, would you be prepared to say you know for certain which one of the two brothers graduated, left Kenya soon afterwards, and which one married Kezia in 1954?

I sure can’t.


121 posted on 05/05/2013 5:57:54 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: WildHighlander57

I’m aware of those alleged children of BHO Sr. (”Alleged” because even BHO Sr.’s stepmother Sarah, who was in Kenya and witnessed many of these births, doubted herself that all of the children credited to him were truly his.)

None of the children in that family tree are reported to have been born in Kenya in 1961—not Roy, Auma, Abo (Samson), or Bernard.

Even though BHO II himself claimed that honor via his publisher, for 17 years.

Are we to believe that every child of Kezia’s is listed there, especially if the circumstances of one’s birth are potentially shameful or at least very inconvenient?

Are we to believe that all the children listed there are truly BHO Sr.’s children? Is doctorzebra the final word on Obama family trees?

At the link I gave previously ( https://wtpotus.wordpress.com/2011/11/14/obama-mystery-theater-kezias-baby/ ), there’s evidence from a friend of BHO Sr.’s (Leo Odera), who reported to a biographer of the so-called president that Kezia became pregnant by another man while BHO Sr. was in Hawaii. That, he says, is exactly why BHO Sr. stopped writing to Kezia, why he claimed that he divorced her (the Muslim way), and why he started to look for another wife.

If it’s true that Kezia became pregnant, and if she subsequently gave birth to a son in Kenya in 1961, then that son might have been reported to the government as BHO Sr.’s child because Kezia was still listed as his legal widow in Kenyan government records after his death.

Was that child Barry?

He may have been Barry: an inconvenient child who was shipped off for adoption by Stanley Ann after a hurriedly arranged marriage to BHO Sr. It’s a possibility.


122 posted on 05/05/2013 5:58:28 PM PDT by Greenperson
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To: Fred Nerks

“Have you ever seen an actual, genuine, provenanced family tree for the Onyango Clan from the village of Kogelo?”

I’ve seen NO ACTUAL, GENUINE, PROVENANCED documentation for ANY of these people, but in particular the person who calls himself our president. That’s the conundrum from the beginning.

All we’re left with are myriad tidbits from numerous people (friends, purported relatives, various obot (or not) biographers, etc.).

From all that circumstantial and/or hearsay evidence, we have to deduce the probabilities to try to arrive at some narrative that is more likely than not to be true.


123 posted on 05/05/2013 6:07:51 PM PDT by Greenperson
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To: Greenperson
...If it’s true that Kezia became pregnant, and if she subsequently gave birth to a son in Kenya in 1961, then that son might have been reported to the government as BHO Sr.’s child because Kezia was still listed as his legal widow in Kenyan government records after his death.

She could have had a child a year and they would all be recorded as the children of her absent husband.

124 posted on 05/05/2013 6:08:03 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Greenperson

Only if Kezia encountered a non black guy.

If the guy in the white hoiluse is the son of Kezia and some African non black guy then he most certainly isn’t a us citizen.


125 posted on 05/05/2013 6:09:23 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: Fred Nerks

“She could have had a child a year and they would all be recorded as the children of her absent husband.”

I believe that’s likely to be true. It could explain why an exasperated Sarah might have made that statement about how none of them were BHO Sr.’s children.


126 posted on 05/05/2013 6:11:31 PM PDT by Greenperson
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To: WildHighlander57

There were whites in Nairobi, and nobody said anything about who her paramour was, so anything’s possible. That is, if you believe wholeheartedly that Barry’s half white, which I’m not ready to believe. The truth is out there; we just don’t know what it is. There could have been a son born in Kenya in 1961 who was named BHO II. Usually a second is NOT a son. A son is a junior. But I digress ...

Maybe just the identity was taken. Maybe the child sent to Hawaii to be adopted into the Dunham family was replaced by another child at some point. Maybe even a homeless foundling from somewhere in Java. Anything’s possible when we have no evidence to work with.


127 posted on 05/05/2013 6:19:30 PM PDT by Greenperson
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To: Fred Nerks

Lets keep things in the context of the British Archives, we have an entry in there for BARACK OBAMA (first name is phonetically spelled) and birth events for 1958 & 1960, and some sort of event in 1961.

Need birth dates for kezia’s two children; and when she married bho sr.


128 posted on 05/05/2013 6:26:23 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: WildHighlander57
Lets keep things in the context of the British Archives, we have an entry in there for BARACK OBAMA (first name is phonetically spelled) and birth events for 1958 & 1960, and some sort of event in 1961.

You want to limit the focus to something that isn't documented, and some sort of event in 1961

Need birth dates for kezia’s two children; and when she married bho sr.

Sorry, I can't help you, been looking for that since 2008. Now it's your turn. I'm just trying to show you how many questions there are.

CLICK THE LINK: Keziah Obama: My life with Obama Senior The Standard ^ | 11/11/2008 | John Oywa Posted on Thursday, 15 October 2009 2:59:50 PM by Red Steel

ANOTHER ONE WITH DIFFFERENT DATES

Poor Kezia, she was so confused, the first time she met Stanley Ann Dunham, she thought the woman was RUTH!

129 posted on 05/05/2013 6:40:25 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Seizethecarp

Thanks for the clarification and the date of kezias marriage!

(BTW,
This quote was from greenperson:

“My point is that Kezia is reported to have been pregnant in 1961,even though her husband was in the USA. It’s the reason why BHO Sr. said he divorced her.”)


130 posted on 05/05/2013 6:43:31 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: Fred Nerks
Your post #61.

Thank you for your informative post. I had kept out of the subject of the birth of Barack Obama Jr for some weeks. I have to say from the point of view of any family historian it is a fascinating subject. At the same time I believe much is at stake. My trepidation is not so much fixed on President Obama himself, but on the radical ideas and doctrines that he has within his soul. That he has been exposed to these ideas from an early age is found in the book "Dreams From My Father".

I went to Indigo/Chapters Books, a Canadian book supplier and was pleased to see available the book you quote from.

The Other Barack Obama:
The Bold and Reckless Life of President Obama's Father.

Sally Jacobs.
Australia.

Twenty dollars is quite reasonable. I do not wish to nay say, about the expectancy that the birth of the now president can be traced to Kenya. You will no doubt be aware of the concern attributed to Barack Hussein Obama Sr. regarding Kezia. Whether or not this is yet another false lead, I don't know.

It seems in his absence in America, Kezia was seeing men in night clubs. It may seem a bit fanciful, but a theory was that she did have a child (not his) in 1961. The explanation about a cover up, was that a high ranking official such as Barack Sr. would not want it known. It would diminish his stature with that kind of cultural outlook.

All this is just speculation and I - after much study and research are none the wiser. (chuckle).

131 posted on 05/05/2013 6:47:10 PM PDT by Peter Libra
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To: WildHighlander57
We did our best here, but nothing adds up, the years keep changing and so do all their ages, in one Kezia is 67 in 2008, then in 2009 she's 71. Roy (Malik) varies between 50 years of age in 2008 and 46 elsewhere, it's no wonder one astute freeper made the following comment:

Something not quite right about the dates. Malik was six in 1959 when Obama senior left for Hawaii. Now, 2008, he is 50 and Obama II is 47? Someone who tracks these issues should double check, but barring some mystical event, Obama II should therefore be around 42. How did Barack II gain 5 years on Malik?

THREAD LINK. YOU'LL NEED A SHARP PENCIL

132 posted on 05/05/2013 6:56:02 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Fred Nerks
To answer your question : YES A follow on to your point about Kezia kids birth dates and her marriage date: British archives mention BHO SR marriage year of 1954. BOTTOM LINE: Need British freepers that will go to the British archives and check tthese entries out. Also to do research on census, marriage records, etc. on obaba SR. Actual flight time and legwork. Sneak the pics and post em :D (My writings In post quoted below are in << >>) To: WildHighlander57 <>. You want to limit the focus to something that isn't documented,and some sort of event in 1961 <> Sorry,I can't help you,been looking for that since 2008. Now it's your turn. I'm just trying to show you how many questions there are. CLICK THE LINK: Keziah Obama: My life with Obama Senior The Standard ^ | 11/11/2008 | John Oywa Posted on Thursday,15 October 2009 2:59:50 PM by Red Steel ANOTHER ONE WITH DIFFFERENT DATES Poor Kezia,she was so confused,the first time she met Stanley Ann Dunham,she thought the woman was RUTH! 129 posted on Sun May 05 2013 20:40:25 GMT-0500 (CDT) by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!) [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 128 | View Replies | Report Abuse]
133 posted on 05/05/2013 7:07:13 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: WildHighlander57

I know what you need. It’s what we have been trying to make sense of for five years. Writing here what you NEED isn’t going to get it for you. I don’t understand your attitude, I was brought up to believe if you want or need something, you have to learn to look under the rocks yourself.
I provide links. Have a look to see if we missed something. And you’ll get nothing out of the archives, not after Hillary has been there.

ps. Why bother to repeat my entire post back to me after your reply? It’s just messy and makes your comment hard to read.


134 posted on 05/05/2013 7:15:59 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Fred Nerks

My #133 got totally messed up by my ‘puter :0 so disregard it.


135 posted on 05/05/2013 7:21:26 PM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: Peter Libra
...The explanation about a cover up, was that a high ranking official such as Barack Sr. would not want it known. It would diminish his stature with that kind of cultural outlook.

Frankly, I have grave doubts that he was married to Kezia at all, yes, there is a photograph of him sitting with Elizabeth Mooney, Kezia who has a young child with her, and a male person, at a picnic...but that woman and her child could also belong to an absent older brother of the kenyan student, and Elizabeth Mooney's relationship with the kenyan student wasn't exactly squeaky clean either, Nairobi gossip was apparently rife with the pair going for long country drives and going dancing together. He visited her in her home, she took photographs of him. There has to be a reason why he used two birth years, and why the older brother who attended school with him at Maseno was 'disappeared' and why his birth year shows as circa 1950's on wiki, when he was patently of the same generation as the kenyan student...

All this is just speculation and I - after much study and research are none the wiser. (chuckle).

And to be totally honest, neither am I...a high ranking official he certainly wasn't. He worked for Shell Oil in Nairobi, he didn't enter the Finance Ministry until AFTER MBOYA WAS ASSASSINATED.

The 75-year-old adds he knew Obama Sr when he worked for BP/Shell in Nairobi. “One of his friends was President Kibaki. One day when I was walking with him in Nairobi, Kibaki, then the Minister for Finance stopped his car next to us and offered him a lift,” says Tolo. He adds: “The President rode with him to his office and I am told that was the day he got a job in the Treasury as an economist.”

SOURCE

136 posted on 05/05/2013 7:36:34 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Peter Libra

BOOK EXCERPT

... What Obama found in Mooney was more complex. Part of her appeal for him was certainly the job. Working at the Literacy Center provided both social standing and the opportunity to rise. But Mooney and Obama also spent time together outside the office, enjoying rural drives and attending some of the popular evening dances. And that association brought a different kind of benefit for Obama. Among a certain kind of African man, just keeping company with a white woman provided considerable social status...

So you see, why I might wonder, just what was that missionary woman thinking, she encouraged him to write letters to various US universities seeking a scholarship, she, or the Laubach Literacy Fund, paid for his airfare to Hawaii, she contributed toward his living expenses during the early period in Hawaii, he only had enough funds for one semester, according to himself at an early interview...and all this, while he had a wife who was pregnant and a young child when he left Kenya. Is that how a missionary would behave? Encourage a young man to leave his wife and family...JUST WHO DID SHE ASSUME WAS GOING TO SUPPORT THEM?

137 posted on 05/05/2013 7:54:45 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Greenperson
I believe that’s likely to be true. It could explain why an exasperated Sarah might have made that statement about how none of them were BHO Sr.’s children.

And I think that would have posed a very serious problem for the author of 'Dreams' - one day that was going to surface, so better to be pre-emptive and include it in the narrative, that gave them the opportunity to accuse 'granny' Sahra of acting out of jealousy. (Which is how it was handled in the book, through words put into the mouth of Auma, the daughter of Kezia.)

However, one then needs to ask, what motive would the second wife of Onyango have, to feel jealous? None at all, if it were to turn out that the elder son YUSUF was the same Joseph who attended school with the kenyan student. The elder son would have had first rights to inherit from his father Onyango. And as his mother, the mother of the eldest son, Sarah retained her position as queen bee, so to speak. Nothing has transpired in recent times to show otherwise. The Elder, who wears the cap and carries the whisk, is the CLAN LEADER, and Malik has not inherited anything. It was Malik who had to ask Sarah's permission to build a mosque on the land, and she refused. When his behaviour became problematic, she apparently asked local authorities for help and he was warned he would be removed from the village.

I guess I need to find the links again...but I think you get the picture...makes one wonder, didn't Yusuf ever marry and have children? (Or was he the husband of Kezia all along, and that's where all the children came from...lol!)

138 posted on 05/05/2013 8:12:23 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Fred Nerks
I can only say at this point, that things get "curiouser and curiouser". One should have thought Barack Obama Sr would have been in a seventh heaven being able to attract women and handsome ones at that.

Anyway, off I shall go tomorrow to order this book. I have only just ordered another book recommended on FR. It is "Karl Marx: A Nineteenth Century Life" by Jonathon Sperber. A good thing I just found a fifty dollar gift certificate given at Christmas. (laughs).

139 posted on 05/05/2013 8:20:44 PM PDT by Peter Libra
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To: Fred Nerks

Is it just me or do all these white women resemble each other? SAD, Mooney, and Ruth Baker?


140 posted on 05/05/2013 9:15:55 PM PDT by Greenperson
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To: Fred Nerks

Ah yes, I do remember that thread.

Zoomed off into the far reaches of outer space.


141 posted on 05/05/2013 9:26:26 PM PDT by little jeremiah (Courage is not simply one of the virtues, but the form of every virtue at the testing point. CSLewis)
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To: Greenperson

I have noted that, too! The deep jaw on all...


142 posted on 05/05/2013 9:55:13 PM PDT by Seizethecarp ((Defend aircraft from "runway kill zone" mini-drone helicopter swarm attacks: www.runwaykillzone.com)
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To: Greenperson

Looks like she gave birth to her first child not long after she arrived in Kenya, so Mark's birth year would be 1965...not that he's ever said when he was born.

143 posted on 05/05/2013 10:05:07 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Greenperson
Last one for today:


144 posted on 05/05/2013 10:16:36 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Greenperson

Dreams From My Father - excerpt:

...”It’s this business with the Old Man’s estate. Sarah is one of the people who has disputed the will. She’s been telling people that Roy, Bernard, myself — that none of us are the Old Man’s children.” Auma sighed. “I don’t know. A part of me sympathizes with her. She’s had a hard life. She never had the chances the Old Man had, you see, to study or go abroad. It made her very bitter. She thinks that somehow my mum, myself, that we are to blame for her situation.”

“But how much could the Old Man’s estate be worth?”

“Not much. Maybe a small government pension. A piece of worthless land. I try to stay out of it. Whatever is there has probably been spent on lawyers by now. But you see, everyone expected so much from the Old Man. He made them think that he had everything, even when he had nothing. So now, instead of getting on with their lives, they just wait and argue among themselves, thinking that the Old Man somehow is going to rescue them from his grave...”


145 posted on 05/05/2013 10:48:46 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: SaraJohnson

I can agree with your take on Cruz as to being up front as a politician except for the endorsement as POTUSA. For me Cruz does not satisfy my belief that the requirement the Founders intended as to POTUSA being a ‘natural born citizen’. Our Constitution is much more valuable and important than any one individual no matter what the individual’s personal political persuasion is. There are too many persons ,50%+or-, who have burdened the USA with Obama because they make the same choice as to their wishes.


146 posted on 05/05/2013 10:55:40 PM PDT by noinfringers2
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INHERITANCE LAWS - SEE CASE STUDY - KENYA

...The law does not apply to Muslims, and exceptions of farmland, crops, and livestock in certain districts result in the application of customary law to this property. Under Kenya’s patrilineal system, the estate goes to the deceased’s sons; where there are no sons, the deceased is treated as unmarried, thus excluding the widow in both cases...

http://www.endvawnow.org/en/articles/767-inheritance-laws.html


147 posted on 05/06/2013 4:04:04 AM PDT by Fred Nerks (Come Visit Tasmania!)
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To: Fred Nerks; Peter Libra; Seizethecarp

Fred, all

I looked over that thread you linked to; I too am stumped.

Would the new info from the foia’d INA docs, that BHO SR was born in 1934- not 1936- help clear up any confusion about that five year gap?

Does the dates 1954 marriage, 1958 birth, 1960 birth, help peg the Kezia timeline better, since they relate to a national archive entry?

Then we have the 1961 event to figure.

If this 1961 event is tied in with the 1961 Kenya info found in that out of the way library (light yellow typewritten paper) showing number of people came to the us from kenya, then that frames things.

I’m talking about starting with national archives and govt beancounter ‘database’ entries and use those to adjust the interviews.... the archive type data is contemporaneous, while the interviews rely on peoples memories which may get the dates off.


148 posted on 05/06/2013 6:34:10 AM PDT by WildHighlander57 ((WildHighlander57 returning after lurking since 2000))
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To: Nero Germanicus
If there was anything to be uncovered, the hundreds of millions of dollars that The Koch Brothers, Donald Trump and Sheldon Adelson alone put into ridding us of Barack Obama should have uncovered a few scintillas of evidence. It didn’t.

This is a variation on the theory that "If there was anything to be found, Hillary would have found it." It is a type of fallacy known as a "non-sequitur."

From what I have been reading, the State governmental officials of Hawaii hold all the keys, and so far attempts to use the legal system to force them to divulge their records have been futile.

This is not the same thing as "PROVING" there is nothing there. It only proves that we can't get at evidence because of the stupidity and recalcitrance of our legal system. I have long argued that an article of the US Constitution should be an automatic trump over any lesser law, including state privacy laws, but our courts have routinely held that the State Privacy laws occupy a superior position than does constitutional law.

Of course they don't say it like that, but this is the decision spoken by their actions.

Regarding Hawaii, I have read numerous articles which accuse Hawaii of having run an American citizenship market for the entire pacific rim, and that this practice was blatant starting in the 50s and continuing all the way to the present. Hawaii's birth certificate laws allow for a great deal of abuse if state officials are so inclined to use them that way.

Of course this little tidbit never seems to register with people.

149 posted on 05/06/2013 7:55:47 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp (Partus Sequitur Patrem)
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To: Ha Ha Thats Very Logical
Besides (and here I suspect we part company), why so much trust in Kenyan handwritten records that don't even spell the man's name the same way each time? Would anyone here accept a handwritten entry from Hawaii that "Biraq" Obama had had a son there as proof of BHO's story?

I have no faith in the Veracity of records purported to be from Kenya UNLESS they are part of a known body of documents which left Kenya long ago, and exist in the archives of a reputable organization. English records might fit this requirement provided we can look at the actual records, not what someone is claiming is in there.

150 posted on 05/06/2013 8:06:23 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp (Partus Sequitur Patrem)
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