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Texas: Another Bogus Open Carry "Disorderly Conduct" Arrest
Gun Watch ^ | 27 January, 2014 | Dean Weingarten

Posted on 01/26/2014 7:04:24 AM PST by marktwain



Michael Keoughan was exercising his right to bear arms in Texas last Wednesday (22 January).  He is part of a Texas group of second amendment supporters that demonstrate that the second amendment means something by legally carrying rifles slung across their back.   They openly state that they are educating people about their rights under the Texas and Federal Constitutions.

Before the Civil War (or War Between the States), Texas had a strong right to keep and bear arms clause in its constitution.  After the Confederacy lost the war, the reconstruction government created a new Texas constitution.  The new Texas constitution had a "soviet style" right to keep and bear arms.  That is, they listed the right, but made it irrelevant by saying that the legislature could ignore it when they thought they needed to stop crime.   The reconstruction legislature immediately made the bearing of arms illegal.

When the reconstruction government was kicked out, a new constitution was written and passed.  It reinstated the right to keep and bear arms, but failed to completely remove the legislature's ability to modify it.   They left in a phrase saying that the legislature could regulate the "wearing" of arms.  The legislature never removed the reconstruction ban on wearing pistols or large knives.

That is why the right of Texans to openly carry rifles and shotguns is protected by the constitution, but open carry of pistols and large knives is not.

Come and Take It, the second amendment group that Mr. Keoughan belongs to, aims to restore the right to openly carry pistols and other weapons to Texans.  It has held numerous open carry demonstrations around Texas, and is in the process of planning another for Andrews.    Mr. Keoughan was checking out the rout of their rally when he was arrested for openly carrying his rifle strapped to his back.   This is the second time that an Come And Take It member was arrested in Andrews for open carry.  The Police chief, Jones, was notified that the rally would be taking place, and still says that he will support it.

The ruse that the police used to arrest Mr. Keoughan was "disorderly conduct".  There is a provision in Texas law that defines disorderly conduct with a weapon as: 

“DISORDERLY CONDUCT. (a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally or knowingly…(8) displays a firearm or other deadly weapon in a public place in a manner calculated to alarm.”
The problem for the police is that Mr. Keoughan and Come and Take It adamatly state that their actions are not "calculated to alarm" but are meant to educate.    It is difficult to argue their point when the vast majority of people that they meet on the street are not alarmed.  From newswest9.com:
"I had great interactions throughout the entire day until the police showed up," Keoughan said.
  Police Chief Jones disagrees:
"We didn't know who he was, had no clue but we started getting a mass number of phone calls," Chief Jones said. "By displaying the weapon, he caused undue alarm."
Some people were alarmed.  We do not know how many, or how alarmed, because from past experience with these events, the calls are often an inquiry asking if the open carry is legal, which is exactly the sort of education Come And Take It is attempting to achieve.

The Chief is wrong to presume that causing alarm is the same as "calculated to alarm".   If merely "causing alarm" were sufficient to arrest, then the entire constitutional guarantee of bearing arms in Texas could be voided by anyone claiming that they were "alarmed" by seeing someone bearing arms.

The quote in newswest9.com may be taken out of context, but he seems to imply that checking someone out is the same as arresting them:
"This is the issue that they don't want to address that we have to address," Chief Jones said. "When we get a call about a person with a gun, do we ignore it? Walking down the street? They're alluding to the fact that we don't have any right to make contact to them because they're not doing anything wrong. I beg to differ with them."
 No one is saying that the police cannot drive by someone that a citizen finds suspicious, or talk to them.   Police know that criminals almost never openly carry guns, and that those who are working to restore second amendment rights often do.   We can contrast what happened in Andrews with what recently happened in Fond du Lac Wisconsin:
“It was basically just a unique display of (the gun owners’) right to bear arms under the state’s open carry law and the U.S. Constitution,” Meyer said. “In a similar incident in Appleton, police engaged the individuals and caused additional turmoil. Our police observed them, making sure that they weren’t a threat to public safety.”
 It is difficult to square Chief Jones assurance that he supports the First, second,fourth and fifth amendments, with Mr. Keoughan's arrest:
 "I can't emphasize enough that we support their right," he said.
The police, after determining that Mr. Keoughan was exercising his rights, did not have to arrest him.   In fact, it appears that they arrested him without legal cause to do so.

The leading candidate for Governor,  Greg Abbot, has said that he supports legalizing open carry of handguns in Texas.

©2014 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice is included.
Link to Gun Watch


TOPICS: Education; Government; Politics; Society
KEYWORDS: banglist; comeandtakeit; opencarry; texas
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Second Amendment fought this battle over bogus "disorderly conduct" charges in Wisconsin and Michigan, and won.
1 posted on 01/26/2014 7:04:24 AM PST by marktwain
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To: marktwain

Well once wendy davis gets elected governor we’ll put a stop to all those kind of awkward arrests. (She says she owns a pistol.) Right? Right?


2 posted on 01/26/2014 7:10:27 AM PST by rktman (Under my plan(scheme), the price of EVERYTHING will necessarily skyrocket! Period.)
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To: rktman

Wendy Davis is getting hammered by revelations about her life right now. I wonder if she will even get the nomination. It would be interesting if conservatives will knock her out of the race before she is even nominated, as the “progressives” did to man conservative candidates in 2012.


3 posted on 01/26/2014 7:17:17 AM PST by marktwain (The old media must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: rktman

Her girlfriends attest that “Windy’s” a cunning linguist.


4 posted on 01/26/2014 7:17:50 AM PST by Ancient Man
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To: marktwain

“man conservative” should be “many conservative”.


5 posted on 01/26/2014 7:18:05 AM PST by marktwain (The old media must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: marktwain
The Chief is wrong to presume that causing alarm is the same as "calculated to alarm".

Precisely! If intent is ignored, and the fear exhibited by an un-informed public is the only requirement, the right has been neutered.

6 posted on 01/26/2014 7:19:10 AM PST by deoetdoctrinae (Gun-free zones are playgrounds for felons.)
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To: deoetdoctrinae

Where’s the NRA lawyer ?


7 posted on 01/26/2014 7:30:37 AM PST by Eric in the Ozarks ("Say Not the Struggle Naught Availeth.")
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To: marktwain

We in Texas are actively confronting and winning over many in law enforcement. Most of these charges are later either dropped or thrown out of court. With the exception of some liberal enclaves district attorneys don’t want the hassle and political ramifications of being on the wrong side of this. Greg Abbott the most likely next governor campaigns for open carry of handguns as well!!


8 posted on 01/26/2014 7:48:33 AM PST by ontap
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To: marktwain

Well now, that would just prove that the “conservatives” are indeed waging a war against women. LOL! She needs to be booted. But, she’s just doing what demokkkrats do with, more than likely, no damage done. I mean, who would ever have thought that someone could get elected after they admittedly used weed and cocaine? Just the mere implication that GW “might” have been associated with it almost cost him the nomination. Maybe “they” just gain street creds for admitting their failings. Weird, I know.


9 posted on 01/26/2014 7:55:43 AM PST by rktman (Under my plan(scheme), the price of EVERYTHING will necessarily skyrocket! Period.)
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To: marktwain
I am absolutely amazed at the fact that the right to carry crowd fails to profit by the American towns of Deadwood, Dodge City, Wichita, Bodie, Abilene and Tombstone. They all were "Open Carry" and it worked so well that the people of those days were the ones who passed laws controlling the bearing of arms.

I can just see everybody carrying arms. Remember everybody includes "Ole Hoss" in the bar drunk as hell brandishing his two .44 magnums. He then fires in his alcoholic state and the bullet passes through the bar wall killing ten year old Susie walking by the bar on her way home from school.

Further, in the days of Dodge City there was a greater chance that the people involved in an "Open Carry" situation knew or were at least acquainted with each other. Today is very anonymous and there would be no moderating factor of personal knowledge.(Which did not stop the carnage resulting from "Open Carry."

Well regulated carry, with permits, no guns in bars even if have a permit, guns ok in ones house or place of business. Even to get a permit to carry one must show good cause such as carrying large sums of money, drugs etc. When going hunting or target shooting the gun is placed in the trunk and the ammo in the glove box. All the aforementioned are sane rules.

I'm glad the cops arrested the turkey in the photo. He is an idiot and should not even be allowed to have a gun. Unrestricted carrying is a bad policy.

By the way I have owned guns hunted and gone target shooting since the early 1950's. I support the Second Amendment

10 posted on 01/26/2014 8:02:17 AM PST by AEMILIUS PAULUS (It is a shame that when these people give a riot)
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To: marktwain

Irrelevemt what the State Constitution says. Once a State joins the Union, “shall not be infringed” applies via “laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding” and “privileges and immunities”.

Past due time for the Courts to remember this.


11 posted on 01/26/2014 8:06:09 AM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS

What a contorted way to admit you approve of gun control...


12 posted on 01/26/2014 8:08:36 AM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: Ancient Man

“Her girlfriends attest that “Windy’s” a cunning linguist.”

LMAO at that one.


13 posted on 01/26/2014 8:11:19 AM PST by Rannug
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS
Even to get a permit to carry one must show good cause such as carrying large sums of money

Not in a "shall issue" state, which most states are..........I don't think you really know gun laws at all and to say you support the 2nd Amendment is laughable.

14 posted on 01/26/2014 8:12:53 AM PST by Hot Tabasco (Miss Muffit suffered from arachnophobia.....)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS
Unrestricted carrying is a bad policy.

More hogwash.....Michigan is an open carry state and there has never been a shooting as a result of our right........

15 posted on 01/26/2014 8:15:48 AM PST by Hot Tabasco (Miss Muffit suffered from arachnophobia.....)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS

Contrary to your statement, you do NOT support the 2nd Amendment.

You support infringements upon the right of free people to keep and bear arms. You support RULES and MODIFICATIONS to the 2nd Amendment.

C


16 posted on 01/26/2014 8:16:32 AM PST by Chasaway (Where are we going and why am I in this handbasket?)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS
Even to get a permit to carry one must show good cause such as carrying large sums of money, drugs etc. When going hunting or target shooting the gun is placed in the trunk and the ammo in the glove box. All the aforementioned are sane rules.

Common sense gun control, in other words? You know where you shove that drivel I assume.

17 posted on 01/26/2014 8:17:24 AM PST by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS

Sorry, you’re just another Zumbo-Fudd without a clue on the meaning of “shall not be infringed” while trying to create an excuse for government control over natural rights.


18 posted on 01/26/2014 8:17:48 AM PST by T-Bird45 (It feels like the seventies, and it shouldn't.)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS
I support the Second Amendment

With all due respect, it does not sound like you do so. What part of "shall not be infringed" do you fail to understand? I think you've bought in to the leftist drivel about firearms; the constant repetition may have programmed your thinking.

19 posted on 01/26/2014 8:19:16 AM PST by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed & water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: marktwain

What. An. Idiot.

I hope the police hassle fools like this every time they do something so stupid. Yes, it may be legal to openly carry a gun. But for the residents of the area, they have no idea if this maybe crazy fool is legally carrying or not. Their first responsibility is to their family, to their children. You better believe that I would be calling 911 if I saw some stranger strutting down my street prominently displaying a firearm.

As my mom taught me: Just because you CAN do something doesn’t mean that you SHOULD do something.

Too bad police can’t give tickets for being stupid because that’s what this idiot should have been ticketed for.


20 posted on 01/26/2014 8:21:56 AM PST by ConstantSkeptic (Be careful about preconceptions)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS; All
Most states allow legal open carry. The scenarios that you imagine do not take place. The regulation of open carry in the cowtowns was against cowboys ending cattle drives, and was a source of income for the towns, who levied a fine against the cowboys. Here is the current state of open carry:
21 posted on 01/26/2014 8:24:25 AM PST by marktwain (The old media must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: ConstantSkeptic

“But for the residents of the area, they have no idea if this maybe crazy fool is legally carrying or not.”

Your preconceptions are tripping you up.


22 posted on 01/26/2014 8:29:42 AM PST by marktwain (The old media must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS
By the way I have owned guns hunted and gone target shooting since the early 1950's. I support the Second Amendment

You don't seem to know what the 2nd Amendment is for.

23 posted on 01/26/2014 8:34:32 AM PST by Paine in the Neck (Socialism consumes everything)
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To: marktwain

This is completely bogus. In Texas, it is legal to open carry a long arm. However, certain localities will arrest you for ‘disturbing the peace”. The charges never stick. It is just an intimidation tactic in more liberal areas like San Antonio. This is wrong. If it is legal on a state-wide basis, no city should be able to outlaw it. Hopefully, the next legislative session will fix this inconsistency.

For the record, I prefer concealed carry for a number of reasons. The main reason is that I do not want other people to know that I am carrying. I feel that this would give me the “tactical advantage” should I ever be put in the unfortunate situation where I would need to defend my life or the life of someone else


24 posted on 01/26/2014 8:41:34 AM PST by 3Fingas (Sons and Daughters for Freedom and Rededication to the Principles of the U.S. Constitution...)
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To: Dead Corpse; AEMILIUS PAULUS

I don’t see anything contorted about it. AP is a straight-out gun-grabber (except for his, though. He’s “special”).


25 posted on 01/26/2014 8:43:29 AM PST by Cyber Liberty (H.L. Mencken: "The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule.")
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To: marktwain

What preconceptions????

Are you saying that the residents DID have an idea that this fool WAS legally carrying?

The residents who reported this idiot were the sane, responsible adults in this situation, protecting their families, their children.

Good Lord! Haven’t you any more sense than him? Would you strut around your town carrying your gun? After all, it’s legal. While you’re at it, carry on an open affair with your co-worker and don’t hide it from your wife. After all, it’s legal. What, your wife shouldn’t react???

As I said, just because you CAN do something, doesn’t mean that you SHOULD do something. The idiot openly carrying a gun obviously has no common sense. And I don’t trust people without common sense to use their gun in a responsible manner.


26 posted on 01/26/2014 8:46:22 AM PST by ConstantSkeptic (Be careful about preconceptions)
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To: Cyber Liberty

Agreed.


27 posted on 01/26/2014 8:50:36 AM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: ConstantSkeptic; All

“Are you saying that the residents DID have an idea that this fool WAS legally carrying?”

Yes. Out of the many he saw, I will bet that very few were “alarmed” or called the police.

“Good Lord! Haven’t you any more sense than him? Would you strut around your town carrying your gun? After all, it’s legal.”

Yes, I do it all the time. Except, I do not “strut” (there go your preconceptions again).

No one objects any more. I live in Arizona. We had to fight this battle 15 years ago, and we prevailed.


28 posted on 01/26/2014 8:51:42 AM PST by marktwain (The old media must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: ConstantSkeptic

Let me get this straight... You HOPE the cops come and hassle someone doing something perfectly legal?

What other Rights do you want arbitrarily restricted?


29 posted on 01/26/2014 8:53:25 AM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: ConstantSkeptic

No. More than likely it was some Bloomberg-sucking jackass wanting to harass a legal gun owner for daring to exercise his Rights.

Can’t have that. People might get the idea that they don’t need nearly as much government as government thinks they do...

And yes, I “strut” around town carrying a gun. Only gun hating idiots give crap...


30 posted on 01/26/2014 8:56:00 AM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: ConstantSkeptic

“The residents who reported this idiot were the sane, responsible adults in this situation, protecting their families, their children.”

I see your comments and just cringe. Growing up in small town Iowa, small as in a town of 35,000, I used to take my .22 rifle at age 13, with a box of rounds and head out to the outskirts of town on foot with friends doing the same.

The only words we received from the “sane and responsible adults in the room,” were to be careful and to always know what was beyond what we were shooting at. Local cops would sometimes stop alongside us and ask what kind of rifles we were shooting. They might even offer up a, “Don’t do anything stupid boys.” Oh, and our high school had a shooting team, so I regularly took my rifle and ammunition to school.

You can commence with the smelling salts and changing your underwear now.


31 posted on 01/26/2014 8:56:14 AM PST by Bshaw (A nefarious deceit is upon us all!)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS; JRandomFreeper

“Unrestricted carrying is a bad policy.”

Your page doesn’t say in which state you live. Texans with concealed carry permits right now are carrying guns. They could take them out and kill people right now but that doesn’t happen. Open carry means they don’t have to keep them hidden anymore. If you think keeping guns concealed means safety and showing them means people will shoot each other at the drop of a hat, you are not thinking clearly. Perhaps it scares you to see a gun. If you are not from Texas then don’t come here if you don’t want to see a gun.


32 posted on 01/26/2014 8:59:20 AM PST by Marcella ((Prepping can save your life today. I am a Christian, not a Muslim.))
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To: marktwain

GA is “shall issue” as opposed to “may issue”.

Constitutional carry is currently in the legislature and has not yet come up for a vote.


33 posted on 01/26/2014 9:06:41 AM PST by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS
Pound sand, statist. You need to go to DU or North Korea, where they appreciate your strict gun-control stance.

/johnny

34 posted on 01/26/2014 9:15:29 AM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: ConstantSkeptic
I hope the police hassle you for speaking out every time you do something so foolish as to open your mouth.

Just because you have to right to speak your mind, doesn't mean you should do it.

/johnny

35 posted on 01/26/2014 9:16:49 AM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: Marcella

Nice comment.

It is a learning curve. The statists have been indoctrinating us for so long, that people have forgotten that it was only 50 years ago that people openly carried long guns in New York City and were not hassled about it.

We have been undergoing indoctrination for a long time.

It takes a while to think things through.


36 posted on 01/26/2014 9:25:18 AM PST by marktwain (The old media must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: marktwain
I've said it before and I'll say it again. I'm not a physically large man. Concealed carry is physically uncomfortable for me in the best circumstances, and forget it in summer.

I need open carry to be able to carry in a comfortable manner.

/johnny

37 posted on 01/26/2014 9:29:25 AM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: marktwain

We need to turn Texas GOLD!


38 posted on 01/26/2014 9:32:53 AM PST by Jane Long (While Marxists continue the fundamental transformation of the USA, progressive RINOs assist!)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS
I support the Second Amendment

You do not.

39 posted on 01/26/2014 10:17:40 AM PST by cpdiii (Deckhand, Roughneck, Mud Man, Geologist, Pilot, Pharmacist. THE CONSTITUTION IS WORTH DYING FOR!!!!)
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To: Bshaw

Riiight. Because some strange man walking through the middle of town with a rifle slung to his back is exactly like local teenagers on the edge of town going out to shoot squirrels. /snark

BTW, I grew up in Iowa. 35,000 is NOT small town Iowa.


40 posted on 01/26/2014 12:00:58 PM PST by ConstantSkeptic (Be careful about preconceptions)
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To: ConstantSkeptic

Someone running around with a backslung rifle is exactly ZERO threat to you.

You DO know how firearms work right?


41 posted on 01/26/2014 12:07:23 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: Dead Corpse

So... he’s making a fashion statement?


42 posted on 01/26/2014 12:28:32 PM PST by ConstantSkeptic (Be careful about preconceptions)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS
AEMILIUS PAULUS said: "All the aforementioned are sane rules."

According to you, then, the "right" referred to in the Second Amendment is subject to "sane rules" passed by the government. Is that what you think the Founders meant?

Or were the Founders intentionally trying to deprive the government of the ability to disarm the people, as they did in occupied Boston and attempted to do in Lexington and Concord?

If you and I don't agree on one of your "sane rules", what then? Let the government decide?

43 posted on 01/26/2014 12:36:51 PM PST by William Tell
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To: ConstantSkeptic

He’s exercising his Rights in a manner that is no threat to anyone.

It’s embarrassing to have to continue pointing this out to you.


44 posted on 01/26/2014 12:40:26 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: Dead Corpse

I know you keep saying that. But the reality you studiously avoid is that rifles have the capability of killing. Or people armed with rifles have the capability of killing. I don’t care how you word it. The reality is that an armed person is a real threat in a way in which an unarmed person isn’t.

How about this? Imagine that it was not a middle-aged white stranger toting that rifle. Imagine instead that it was an 18-year old black stranger carrying a rifle through your local neighborhood with your daughters playing jump rope in your front yard. Would you be so cavalier about that stranger exercising his rights? At least I would call both of the rifle toters idiots.


45 posted on 01/26/2014 1:03:07 PM PST by ConstantSkeptic (Be careful about preconceptions)
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To: ConstantSkeptic; All

So, if he put the gun in a case, where he could get at it just as quickly, and it would be just as deadly, but people would not know it was there, that would make it better?

Please explain how.


46 posted on 01/26/2014 1:03:17 PM PST by marktwain (The old media must die for the Republic to live. Long live the new media!)
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To: marktwain

Every day you encounter strangers. Part of basic human survival is that you evaluate strangers based on first impressions. Most strangers pose no threat. But still you look at their actions - are they angry looking, furtive? Do they look like they belong in this neighborhood? Are they scoping out the houses, possibly looking to come back later to rob a home?

If I see someone toting a gun, I’m going to evaluate their threat level different from someone carrying a case with unknown contents. That’s just human nature. If someone’s carrying a gun, they will stick out like a sore thumb in my neighborhood. So I’d wonder what their problem was. Since my neighborhood is very safe, are they looking for trouble? Are they delusionally paranoid?

You’re right. The person with a concealed gun can be just as dangerous as the fool who feels he has to display a gun. The difference is that he’s at least intelligent enough to not unnecessarily alarm folks.


47 posted on 01/26/2014 1:41:39 PM PST by ConstantSkeptic (Be careful about preconceptions)
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To: ConstantSkeptic

I have the capabilit to kill. Right now. Right here. With my bare hands.

Or with a fork, or a wooden stick, or a wood axe, or shoe laces, or...

The reality is that a law abiding person doing nothing wrong will contiue to do nothing wrong regardless of your bullsh*t arguments and hoplophobia...

Our Rights don’t end where your unreasonable fear begins.

Get help.


48 posted on 01/26/2014 2:14:30 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: ConstantSkeptic
If I see someone toting a gun...

Better run off in fear now....

49 posted on 01/26/2014 2:19:19 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: Dead Corpse

What gun?


50 posted on 01/26/2014 3:48:22 PM PST by piroque ("In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act")
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