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Edward Snowden: Russian Agent, Chinese Agent, or Russo-Sino Agent?
Wall Street Journal via The Streetwise Professor ^ | May 10, 2014 | Wall Street Journal via The Professor

Posted on 05/10/2014 8:23:46 PM PDT by No One Special

Edited on 05/10/2014 8:34:10 PM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]

I will take credit for being one of the first to point out the fact that Snowdenís whistleblower narrative was a total crock because after the initial flurry his leaks had little to do with NSA surveillance of individuals, but instead revealed information that was highly damaging to US national security and foreign policy. The only question in my mind was when he was when he became a Russian asset. I still donít know, but as I also pointed out a while ago, the fact that collected disproportionately such national security-related information made it very plausible that he was tasked to collect this information, and given the identity of the ultimate beneficiary-Russia-it was also plausible that he was Russiaís witting or unwitting tool from the get go.


(Excerpt) Read more at streetwiseprofessor.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; Russia; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: propaganda; snowden

1 posted on 05/10/2014 8:23:46 PM PDT by No One Special
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To: No One Special

If the US intelligence community targeted Americans MORE than non-Americans, does it even MATTER if Snowden was working for the Russians or Chinese...?

I’m not sure it does.

It’s an interesting intellectual exercise to ponder it, but...to what end, exactly..?

The principle of it...?

Let’s say you were a loyal trooper and over the course of a full career you aided in dismantling EVERY aspect of America that made her exceptional and a good, free place to live:

Would your loyalty have proven to be a good thing?


2 posted on 05/10/2014 8:30:13 PM PDT by gaijin
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To: No One Special

“I will take credit for being one of the first to point out the fact that Snowden’s whistleblower narrative was a total crock because after the initial flurry his leaks had little to do with NSA surveillance of individuals, but instead revealed information that was highly damaging to US national security and foreign policy. “

I call BS on this. Even if it were true, the author is just making this up...


3 posted on 05/10/2014 8:34:40 PM PDT by babygene ( .)
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To: gaijin

A good point when you consider how the leftists have given so much technology over to the reds in Russia and China and the Islamic terrorist movements in the middle east. I believe that Snowden is much less dangerous than all the democrats and rinos in DC who have destroyed America.


4 posted on 05/10/2014 8:36:44 PM PDT by kindred (They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy. Salvation by Lord Jesus only!)
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To: babygene

[I call BS on this. Even if it were true, the author is just making this up...]

I suspect this also, even the fact that he refers to himself or herself as professor raises suspision as all self respecting conservative knows how that the left love titles and lying.


5 posted on 05/10/2014 8:40:17 PM PDT by kindred (They that observe lying vanities forsake their own mercy. Salvation by Lord Jesus only!)
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To: No One Special

Let’s discuss Snowden instead of the turn key police state being built by our politicians. Remember Binney and his warnings a decade ago. Was he a turncoat too? Perhaps he was a Martian or simply a bad man.... Snowden proved him correct in the end, which is why we must attack Snowden to ignore the federal behemoth nobody has the balls to take down.


6 posted on 05/10/2014 8:48:26 PM PDT by drunknsage
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To: No One Special

Perhaps something went on between Russia and China regarding Snowden that involves stuff Golitsyn wrote about.


7 posted on 05/10/2014 9:15:38 PM PDT by Thunder90 (All posts soley represent my own opinion.)
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To: No One Special

If Snowden had done his thing when Bush was in the White House, are there any conservatives who would not have (accurately) marked him out as a traitor? Obama Derangement Syndrome has caused a lot of conservatives to make common cause with America’s enemies.


8 posted on 05/10/2014 9:19:45 PM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: No One Special

Obama Administration agent


9 posted on 05/10/2014 9:26:10 PM PDT by rdcbn
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To: Zhang Fei
If Snowden had done his thing when Bush was in the White House, are there any conservatives who would not have (accurately) marked him out as a traitor?

Just about every nation on the planet was appalled by what Snowden showed the world that the US government was doing. Just about every nation. He was a traitor to a corrupt government and a hero to the world. And it would not matter at this point if Santa Claus was the President.

10 posted on 05/10/2014 9:53:45 PM PDT by justa-hairyape (The user name is sarcastic. Although at times it may not appear that way.)
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To: justa-hairyape
Just about every nation on the planet was appalled by what Snowden showed the world that the US government was doing. Just about every nation.

Right. They all adhere to the principle that "Gentlemen do not read each other's mail". And there is a Santa Claus. Their crocodile tears are amusing to behold, but I'll believe them when they dismantle their intelligence agencies.

11 posted on 05/10/2014 9:56:49 PM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: Zhang Fei
Obama Derangement Syndrome has caused a lot of conservatives to make common cause with America’s enemies.

Neocon Derangement Syndrome has caused a lot of "conservatives" to think America has "ENEMIES".

Bill Kristol (among others)is the traitor. Snowden is a great American hero.

12 posted on 05/10/2014 10:04:08 PM PDT by Forgotten Amendments (Peace On Earth! Purity of Essence! McCain 2016)
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To: No One Special

> . The only question in my mind was when he was when he became a Russian asset.<

What?


13 posted on 05/10/2014 10:47:31 PM PDT by Lil Flower (American by birth. Southern by the Grace of God! ROLL TIDE!!)
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To: justa-hairyape

Stand back for a minute and look over the ‘vast’ level of maturity in Snowden. He never finishes high school...GED guy. He goes off to the Army, but is let go at some point because of physical issues, so we are told. He retreats to his hometown area around Fort Meade, where he becomes a security guard...mostly because he has a security clearance left over from the Army episode he never finished.

Snowden signs up for some computer classes locally, and eventually is picked up (no degree, just a couple of classes) as a IT-expert for a company doing gov’t work. Then, the CIA steps in and hires him to do an assignment in Switzerland. No one ever explained this giant step....a high school drop-out with a GED certificate...no real demonstrated history....hired by the CIA.

So he goes off and discovers the whole job is about getting into the banking structure of the Swiss banks. Manipulation, breaking into personal email accounts, blackmail, etc. Based on comments....Edward was severely disenchanted with this mission, and felt morally corrupted by it. Everything would point to Snowden likely corrupted at this point as being anti-US gov’t.

My personal guess is that Ed is a gamer, and some Russian KGB happened upon this whole circumstance in Switzerland and wandered just how far they could drag Ed along and get him into the right positions. So a gaming ‘friend’ was established, and kept working on Ed to follow a certain trail.

Ed comes back to the US....gets himself into positions with access, and the rest is history.

On the maturity scale....Ed is thirteen years old. I don’t see any woman desiring a relationship with the guy. From a hiring prospect....why would you ever hire the guy? He’d come in on day one to get the right passwords and get deep into your company’s secrets. He is mostly standing there to be adored by the Germans, and one day wake up to realize that he’s led mostly a loser life.


14 posted on 05/10/2014 11:55:56 PM PDT by pepsionice
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To: No One Special

None of the Above???

IMO, he is an “Anonymous” admirer, who saw himself as the good-guy in some Hollywood movie, like “Enemy of the State”, or something.


15 posted on 05/11/2014 12:00:35 AM PDT by tcrlaf (Q)
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To: Zhang Fei

Our country has held ourselves up to be better than the rest of the world. We’ve suffered a major loss of face.

If the CIA and FBI spent more time on our enemies and the real threats, they wouldn’t bother spying on us.


16 posted on 05/11/2014 12:26:28 AM PDT by CorporateStepsister (I am NOT going to force a man to make my dreams come true)
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To: pepsionice
Re: “On the maturity scale....Ed is thirteen years old. I don’t see any woman desiring a relationship with the guy.”

Actually, he had a girlfriend in Hawaii who is really cute in some of her pictures, but not so cute in others.

According to her friends, she fell really hard for Snowden and was devastated when he bolted to Hong Kong and then Russia.

Photos:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2341691/Edward-Snowdens-girlfriend-Lindsay-Mills-feels-betrayed-world-caved-in.html

17 posted on 05/11/2014 12:29:17 AM PDT by zeestephen
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To: pepsionice

” the CIA steps in and hires him to do an assignment in Switzerland. No one ever explained this giant step....a high school drop-out with a GED certificate...no real demonstrated history....hired by the CIA.”

Maybe they hired him because he looked unobtrusive and would blend in well with the rest of the people he would be working around. He’s certainly a drifter through life, I’ll say that.

The alienated type who apparently are ripe for manipulation.


18 posted on 05/11/2014 12:29:53 AM PDT by CorporateStepsister (I am NOT going to force a man to make my dreams come true)
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To: zeestephen

Looks like government apologists and prevaricators are all over this thread.


19 posted on 05/11/2014 12:31:53 AM PDT by antceecee (Bless us Lord, forgive us our sins and bring us to everlasting life.)
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To: CorporateStepsister

>> If the CIA and FBI spent more time on our enemies and the real threats, they wouldn’t bother spying on us.

What makes you believe the agencies are not focusing their time and resources in a way that best serves the Country’s security and liberties?

FWIW, I haven’t lost faith in the NSA nor the CIA despite the data gathering concerns — not something I’m dismissing as irrelevant. And I don’t consider either tools of the current regime.


20 posted on 05/11/2014 12:34:18 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: Gene Eric

I just hope, for his sake, that the Russians and Chinese aren’t just using him for personal gain and will then betray his trust by murdering him one night in his own bed.


21 posted on 05/11/2014 12:37:30 AM PDT by CorporateStepsister (I am NOT going to force a man to make my dreams come true)
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To: gaijin

>> does it even MATTER if Snowden was working for the Russians or Chinese... I’m not sure it does.

It’s highly relevant; however, it doesn’t matter as it’s not a requirement for reckless behavior.


22 posted on 05/11/2014 12:43:05 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: CorporateStepsister

I hoped Snowden would have come home to possibly Congressional hearings — hearings that may have given him some immunity, at least temporarily, so things could be sorted out.

This is a difficult case to judge from the outside.


23 posted on 05/11/2014 12:46:48 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: zeestephen

If you notice...Lindsay Mills...is the only person ever admitting any dating or relationship with Ed. Her resume? A arts grad from University of Maryland. Jobs? Other than pole dancer, you can’t find much of anything else. Her only known talents? Exhibition photos and blogging. Maturity level of Ms Mills? It’s hard to say if she was anymore mature than Ed and may simply have saw Ed as a stable earner of income and had a nice apparent lifestyle. In essence....another empty suit...just like Ed himself.

Again, you just don’t see depth with Ed, his history, or the people around him. Empty suits.


24 posted on 05/11/2014 12:51:49 AM PDT by pepsionice
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To: pepsionice
On the maturity scale....Ed is thirteen years old. I don’t see any woman desiring a relationship with the guy.

Whatever.

Of course, I don't have access to Anna's BAC when she posted that.

But she's not just any random hottie. She has also been linked to higher-up boyfriends, such as the emcee of 9May's military festivities in Red Square.


25 posted on 05/11/2014 1:01:03 AM PDT by cynwoody
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To: Gene Eric
What makes you believe the agencies are not focusing their time and resources in a way that best serves the Country’s security and liberties?

Little things like:

  1. The wholesale disregard for the 4th amendment.
  2. The wholesale disregard for the 5th amendment.
  3. The wholesale disregard for the 6th amendment.
  4. The painting of dissenters (pro-life, state's-rights, etc) as possible terrorists — with heavy implication 'possible' is probable.
  5. The willingness to use what would be illegitimate information in court as if it were legitimate information. (Search parallel construction.)
  6. The willingness of our elites to suspend Habeus Corpus — allowing indefinite 'detention'.
    (It's 'detention' that way they can say it's not prosecution, so the 6th doesn't apply.)
  7. The willingness to seize property; often with little recourse.
  8. The willingness to selectively enforce the law.
  9. The fact that such agencies have little to no interest in uprooting corruption [among out elite].
  10. The fact that they gain power by [the FedGov] being unconstrained by the Constitution — those in power are disinclined to surrender it.
What makes you think that they are serving the interests of liberty and the country's safety?
26 posted on 05/11/2014 1:01:33 AM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: No One Special

Red flags went up immediately with Snowden. How could a young high school dropout land such a gig without someone/others pulling strings behind the curtain?


27 posted on 05/11/2014 1:03:21 AM PDT by fso301
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To: pepsionice
On the maturity scale....Ed is thirteen years old.

I think you should watch this interview.
Then come back and tell me if you still believe that it's a thirteen year-old's maturity.

28 posted on 05/11/2014 1:05:42 AM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: No One Special

I’m also making note to not follow links to this blog again that cites but does not link to external sources.


29 posted on 05/11/2014 1:08:36 AM PDT by fso301
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To: OneWingedShark

The NSA and/or CIA have committed the crimes you enumerated?


30 posted on 05/11/2014 1:10:50 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: Zhang Fei
If Snowden had done his thing when Bush was in the White House, are there any conservatives who would not have (accurately) marked him out as a traitor? Obama Derangement Syndrome has caused a lot of conservatives to make common cause with America’s enemies.

Or maybe having a lawless administration like this one has opened a lot of people's eyes to the fact that our own government is a much more immediate threat to our freedom than any foreign power. I'm glad Snowden helped do that, regardless of his motives.

31 posted on 05/11/2014 1:17:11 AM PDT by Hugin
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To: Gene Eric

Aye, Some of them — my point was about the “spirit” of our government... it is not benevolent.
I can think of *no* federal government agency that has, as its primary concern, either “The Constitution for the United States” or “Liberty” as its priority.


32 posted on 05/11/2014 1:27:46 AM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: Zhang Fei
If Snowden had done his thing when Bush was in the White House, are there any conservatives who would not have (accurately) marked him out as a traitor? Obama Derangement Syndrome has caused a lot of conservatives to make common cause with America’s enemies.

Hey Mr. Fei, I have yet to decide IF Snowden is the devil incarnate. But there is no such thing as Obama Derangement Syndrome For all I know Snowden is a progressive democrat and is on some liberal 1% payroll. America's worst enemies are now ruling over America.

I think you are at best masquerading on a 'conservative' website, given your particular choice of words.

33 posted on 05/11/2014 1:30:40 AM PDT by Just mythoughts (Jesus said Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.)
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To: fso301
Red flags went up immediately with Snowden. How could a young high school dropout land such a gig without someone/others pulling strings behind the curtain?

Some high school dropouts are much more equal than others. Including PhD holders and idiot WSJ authors, LOL!

34 posted on 05/11/2014 1:31:21 AM PDT by cynwoody
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To: CorporateStepsister

If the FBI was serious they would be profiling Muslims, especially those who travel abroad. But they’re too worried about not offending muslims. The Russians specifically told the FBI that Tamerlan Tsarnaev was a likely terrorist, and what did they do? Nothing. Major Nidal Hasan was telling anyone who would listen he supported the jihadis. Everyone was afraid to do anything about it for fear of being accused of Islamophobia. And even after the shooting, Army Chief of Staff General George Casey said the MOST IMPORTANT THING is that there is no anti-Muslim backlash. Yet these people will somehow “keep us safe” by knowing every call everyone in the country made and where they were when they made it?


35 posted on 05/11/2014 1:33:53 AM PDT by Hugin
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To: pepsionice
Again, you just don’t see depth with Ed, his history, or the people around him. Empty suits.

On the other hand, reviewing the material Snowden exposed reveals time and time again the government cheating and lying and crossing over the bounds set for it with mendacious glee. Should we care that he's not Mother Teresa? Your effort to smear Snowden reveals more about you than him.

36 posted on 05/11/2014 1:48:49 AM PDT by no-s (when democracy is displaced by tyranny, the armed citizen still gets to vote)
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To: no-s

If Ed had one real beef over one serious incident or program, and walked out with the info to tell that story...he’d be the mythical hero that you dream of. Ed didn’t do that...he basically carted off every single detail over thousands of programs and episodes, and these will be used to cherry-pick the right times to trip up the US on some relationship, or take down the right foreign government or party. At best, Ed has an understanding of maybe one-tenth of one percent of the files that he took.

I should add....since 1945....what US government has not cheated or lied? Democrat or Republican....it doesn’t matter. You see, that’s the funny part about announcing this list of terrible things. People think that Ed’s work will correct or fix all of those terrible things. Sadly, names will change, IT intrusions will evolve, and life will go on. All Ed did...was make the system evolve, and probably question IT administrators they hire for the NSA operations, with extreme audits conducted over their monthly operations and behavior. People will tire of the intrusions created by Ed-patrol, and turnover of high-security administrators will be a regular event of the future.


37 posted on 05/11/2014 2:18:47 AM PDT by pepsionice
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To: No One Special

Snowden was late to the game. Wired Magazine has detailed disclosure March 2012.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=wired%20magazine%20nsa%20article&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCUQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wired.com%2F2012%2F03%2Fff_nsadatacenter%2F&ei=tm9vU8K-KMipsQT134HICg&usg=AFQjCNH49KCfhSukvCRzZzHORdVGS8V0qg&bvm=bv.66111022,d.cWc

Snowden is a brave individual, I hope he survives.


38 posted on 05/11/2014 5:45:31 AM PDT by FlyingEagle
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To: pepsionice

How do you know what files he took? (other than those he released to various news outlets)


39 posted on 05/11/2014 5:45:53 AM PDT by free me
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To: OneWingedShark

>> my point was about the “spirit” of our government... it is not benevolent.

I agree, especially given the current thrust of Marxism.


40 posted on 05/11/2014 7:36:54 AM PDT by Gene Eric (Don't be a statist!)
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To: Zhang Fei
So when you are caught with your hand in the cookie jar, the appropriate response is to say everyone steals cookies ? Just like Putin said, America is no longer exceptional.
41 posted on 05/11/2014 8:09:13 AM PDT by justa-hairyape (The user name is sarcastic. Although at times it may not appear that way.)
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To: pepsionice

Could care less about Snowden’s personal life. Just want to know when the NSA data base containing information on law abiding US citizens will be destroyed.


42 posted on 05/11/2014 8:33:18 AM PDT by justa-hairyape (The user name is sarcastic. Although at times it may not appear that way.)
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To: pepsionice
he’d be the mythical hero that you dream of

Perhaps Just as irrelevant as the hero worship is the thesis that because the guy is not a paladin the incident must be about him and not about the corrupt reality he exposed. You rail on and on about the guy and imply we are attempting to put the guy on a pedestal. But as we've seen time and time again this is a diversionary smear at best and and utterly irrelevant. Hello! The US developed an intelligence-gathering apparatus that intentionally undermined the security of freedom, and has crossed the line and gained power which is essentially corrupting, asserting un-examinable authority. The continued embezzlement of the integrity of our national interest can really have no successful outcome. Everyone everywhere could speculate about what was going on and the sheer number of participants meant it was never a perfect secret. At some point the purview expanded to include everyone in the world and all justification became permanently self-serving.

There is no excusing it really. And there was no perfect way to expose it. People operating the government felt the Constitution really didn't mean what it said, what it implied, and what Congress had set forth to ensure operation with the limits of power. They deliberately set about undermining freedom and gathering power. It's purely criminal. The facade has slipped permanently - we know the truth.

Your credibility slips every time you attack Snowden, not because you are right or wrong, but because you are obviously trying to engage us in a diversionary justification of the misdeeds committed by government officials. Attacks on Snowden are clearly either mendacious or stupidly foolish. You can't justify it, and it will never be relevant except to out an attacker as mendacious or foolish, or both. Whether it plays into the hands of the Russians is irrelevant, because we were asked to excuse a crapload of criminality with a thesis of "trust us, it's national security, we know what we are doing better than you ever could", but it wasn't true, wasn't ever true, and was just a disguise for naked abuse of power. What the Russians or any other actor gains is truly irrelevant compared to what was lost by the actions of government officials who impeached their oaths.

We ain't buying no pig in a poke no more. Sadly, your kind will keep coming back to see if we've changed our minds in a moment of weakness...

43 posted on 05/11/2014 7:45:36 PM PDT by no-s (when democracy is displaced by tyranny, the armed citizen still gets to vote)
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To: Just mythoughts
I think you are at best masquerading on a 'conservative' website, given your particular choice of words.

At best. Really it's dreadfully obvious someone is running an astroturf enterprise here. At best. Maybe they want to see who will speak out against this nonsense, so they can identify who to target...I have a hazy mental outline of some disinformation team bent to the task of ticking off objectives in some standard exercise.

We're probably suckers to even bother to speak out against this instead of polishing our skills at self-organizing criticality.

44 posted on 05/11/2014 7:57:38 PM PDT by no-s (when democracy is displaced by tyranny, the armed citizen still gets to vote)
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