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Granted, Nirvana revived rock, but the band has Britney to answer for too
SF chronicle ^ | Monday, April 5, 2004 | Aidin Vaziri

Posted on 04/05/2004 6:36:54 PM PDT by KneelBeforeZod

Everyone thinks Nirvana was the best thing to happen to pop music since Gerry & the Pacemakers.

Well, what about the part where they were responsible for Britney Spears and the return of teen-pop because they made everyone so miserable?

And who do you think is responsible for the Backstreet Boys, Bush, the Iraq war, gonorrhea, Avril Lavigne and everything else bad?

Looking back, Nirvana was just as useless as Adam and the Ants. So here's how Kurt and Co. ruined the world ...

... For Britney Spears: Before Nirvana, the battle lines were clearly drawn. The cool people liked the Pixies and Replacements, everyone else was a bunch of jerks. But after "Smells Like Teen Spirit" everything fell apart. Suddenly Terence Trent D'Arby fans were buying up copies of "Zen Arcade" and rock became pop -- fooling people into thinking that Hanson and Britney Spears were actually respectable. That or they just got tired of all the loud guitars and endless moaning.

... For Puddle of Mudd: About four hours after "Nevermind" came out, so did the clones. No one thought it could get any shoddier than Stone Temple Pilots, but then Bush arrived. Yet those thinking the worst was over were dead wrong -- there was still the wrath of the other bald tattooed men moaning about their miserable childhoods in bands like Staind, Puddle of Mudd and Creed. And what about the Vines? That's like if someone took Kurt Cobain's DNA sample, dropped it on the floor in some lint, and still made a clone anyway. Messed up.

... For Courtney Love: If Nirvana never got famous, then she wouldn't have married Kurt Cobain, he wouldn't have helped her write all the songs on Hole's breakthrough album, "Live Through This," and no one would have cared that she was such a desperate attention freak with a bad dye job and implants. But instead of fading into obscurity along with L7 and Bikini Kill, now we're forced to read about her antics every week in "Teen People."

... For Dave Grohl: He's the most boring rock star on the planet. Sure, he plays in every band from the Queens of the Stone Age to Probot, but imagine how wonderful the world would be without the dreary generic toss of the Foo Fighters. It's almost like that guy from the Lemonheads getting totally famous and making millions upon millions of dollars for sounding just like Blind Melon. It's just plain unfair. Plus he looks like Cojo.

... For flannel shirts: Here's a good idea -- let's all dress like lesbian trailer-park lumberjacks. Operating under the mistaken impression that rock stars should look poorer than their audiences, Nirvana dressed like hobos, inspiring everyone from Soul Asylum on down to follow suit. If the Spice Girls had never arrived, then our celebrities may have never gone back to a more respectable wardrobe of spandex and leather. Bless their hearts.

... For guitars: Before Nirvana arrived, everyone knew music after the year 2000 would totally be technological and rad -- just robots playing crazy drum 'n' bass with androids singing over it. People were totally sick of hearing lousy guitar rock by Eric Clapton and Tom Petty. But then Nirvana made guitars popular again, opening the gates for bands like the White Stripes and Nickelback to exist now. If it weren't for Bjork, we might as well all still be cavemen right now.

(Excerpt) Read more at sfgate.com ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous; Music/Entertainment
KEYWORDS: kurtcobain; nirvana
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
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1 posted on 04/05/2004 6:36:55 PM PDT by KneelBeforeZod
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To: LibertyGrrrl; bc2; marktuoni; itsamelman; Sam's Army; weegee; baltodog; I_Love_My_Husband; ...
music ping--- feel free to ping anyone else you might think is interested
2 posted on 04/05/2004 6:41:51 PM PDT by KneelBeforeZod (Deus Lo Volt!)
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To: All

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3 posted on 04/05/2004 6:45:31 PM PDT by Support Free Republic (Hi Mom! Hi Dad!)
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To: qam1
One for the Gen-X ping list, perhaps?
4 posted on 04/05/2004 6:55:10 PM PDT by KangarooJacqui (I FReep because I can...)
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To: KneelBeforeZod
I'll get flamed bad for this.

Nirvana killed rock.

Most grunge to me sounds like a bunch of woe is me weak, feel sorry for myself, whiners with boring guitar sounds. Before grunge, most rock was about partying, sex, drugs, drinking, or rock and roll.

Sure, sincerity and emotions are great for poetry slams at Laundromats, but nobody wants to hear it when they're driving back from work at 5 p.m. on Friday. They want to crank "Unskinny Bop."

LOL. Exactly, although "Nothing but a good time" is better.

5 posted on 04/05/2004 6:55:26 PM PDT by Dan from Michigan ("My governor don't got the answer")
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To: KangarooJacqui; ItsOurTimeNow; PresbyRev; tortoise; Fraulein; StoneColdGOP; Clemenza; malakhi; ...
I was wondering when a Nirvana post would show up.

Xer Ping

Ping list for the discussion of the politics and social aspects that directly effects Generation-X (Those born from 1965-1982) including all the spending previous generations (i.e. The Baby Boomers) are doing that Gen-X and Y will end up paying for.

Freep mail me to be added or dropped. See my home page for details.

6 posted on 04/05/2004 7:02:04 PM PDT by qam1 (Tommy Thompson is a Fat-tubby, Fascist)
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To: Dan from Michigan; cyborg
To be honest with you the whole Nirvana thing tears me up. Why? I abhor grunge and think it is a weird medley between the moaning of a social anxiety disorder induced moan and tomcats in heat screeching for the attention of a female cat (and with some scratchy guitar riffs reminiscent of sasquatch gurgles sounding in the background). And i will not even start on the attires grunge gave birth to (let it suffice to say that i lean toward GQ, hence dirty cargo pants really do not make my cup of tea).

However, with all that said, I love Nirvana! Yeah .....i even like David Grohl and the Foo Fighters (and there is a song by the Queens of the Stone Age that i even like). In essence Nirvana and Nirvana-esque stuff (as long as it is directly related to them ....hence wannabe bands get tossed out).

Ay caramba!

7 posted on 04/05/2004 7:21:42 PM PDT by spetznaz (Nuclear missiles: The ultimate Phallic symbol.)
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To: KneelBeforeZod
How could you slam Adam and The Ants? I loved Goody Two-Shoes.
8 posted on 04/05/2004 7:24:26 PM PDT by mean lunch lady (Better living through Chemistry.)
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To: spetznaz
I used to listen to 'woe is me, I'm wearing black and I cut myself' music. Eh...it was okay for a while but it did get annoying after a while LOL.
9 posted on 04/05/2004 7:30:28 PM PDT by cyborg (Frankenfreude radio death watch has commenced)
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To: Dan from Michigan
Nirvana killed rock.

Agreed. The reason they were so huge back then was because they were different, but with the passage of time, it's clear that the whole grunge movement was worse than what it replaced.

10 posted on 04/05/2004 7:35:03 PM PDT by Hawkeye's Girl
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To: qam1
I was a 20-yr-old sophomore in college the first time I heard Nirvana's odious, migraine-inducing cacophony. It was then and there, I officially decided I was getting old!

We were at a dance one evening in 1991, and the DJ played this absolutely wretched sounding monkey vomit. The few guys who knew how to dance to it were pumping fists, elbows and feet into the air—looking like a bunch of epileptics having seizures.

So yelling over the musicnoise just to hear myself, I asked my buddy Pete (who was big into music), “What is this crap?!?” and he told me it was “Nirvana.” So I replied something to the effect... “If this is the new direction rock music is taking, I want off the train! From now on, consider me a relic.”

Kurt Killbrain...what a genius!    «/sarc»

11 posted on 04/05/2004 7:36:08 PM PDT by TonyRo76 (Annoy a Leftist today become a monthly donor to FreeRepublic!)
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To: Hawkeye's Girl
but with the passage of time, it's clear that the whole grunge movement was worse than what it replaced.

Agreed, although as you can see from post #11, I hated grunge from the get-go.

12 posted on 04/05/2004 7:37:05 PM PDT by TonyRo76 (Annoy a Leftist today become a monthly donor to FreeRepublic!)
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To: TonyRo76
consider me a relic.”

Bob Seger, is that you?

"Call me a relic call me what you will. Say I'm old fashioned say I'm over the hill. Today's music ain't got the same soul. I like that old time Rock and Roll"

13 posted on 04/05/2004 7:51:32 PM PDT by Dan from Michigan ("My governor don't got the answer")
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To: cyborg
You mean I should give that up, too? :)

Ah, maturity... who needs it?
14 posted on 04/05/2004 8:01:16 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife (Help bring the end to Freepathons. Donate monthly.)
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To: KneelBeforeZod
Rot.

Grunge didn't start with Nirvana any more than the Beatles were the first rock and roll band of the 1960s.

The suits at the labels, stations, and networks largely purged rock and roll of the rock and roll in the late 1950s (when Little Richard retired, Jerry Lee Lewis came home in shame, Elvis was drafted, Eddie Cochran, Buddy Holly, and others died early, Chuck Berry was brought up on the Mann Act, etc.). They were all replaced by pop poster boy crooners. Even genuine rock and rollers like Johnny Burnette were castrated by the executives.

Nirvana was the package used to sell the new sound to the masses just as Elvis and the Beatles had been the faces who took their respective sounds out of the underground.

There was a quick embracement of grunge by the square world but they only ever actually acknowleged a handful of bands (and genuine pioneers like Mudhoney never became household names or chart toppers).

The death of Kurt allowed the squares to supress rock and roll energy once again. They replaced it with pop stars. Pop music didn't begin with Britney. The 80s gave us Debbie Gibson, Tiffany, the Backstreet Boys, etc. The 70s had it's own pop pap.

Meanwhile rock and roll continues on.

It took 20+ years for the Ramones to get any accolades from the mainstream. So it goes.

15 posted on 04/05/2004 8:01:18 PM PDT by weegee (No blood for ratings. CNN supressed reports of torture & murder in Iraq to keep their Baghdad bureau)
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To: TonyRo76
I actually liked Nirvana, Though I think their stature is way over rated, They were not Gen-X's Beatles nor was "Smells like Teen Spirit" (Which I don't particularly like) our "Stairway to Heaven".

And yes I can't stand the clones that folowed that whine instead of singing.
16 posted on 04/05/2004 8:01:19 PM PDT by qam1 (Tommy Thompson is a Fat-tubby, Fascist)
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To: Pan_Yans Wife
LOL! I still listen to modern rock but grunge has had it's day in the sun already. Kurt Cobain could have great, even legend but now he's dead. How sad.
17 posted on 04/05/2004 8:02:55 PM PDT by cyborg (Frankenfreude radio death watch has commenced)
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To: cyborg
Linkin Park is interesting. Better than Nirvana... I never really was into Nirvana. I guess I missed the opportunity of mourning with the rest of the generation.
18 posted on 04/05/2004 8:04:31 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife (Help bring the end to Freepathons. Donate monthly.)
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To: Pan_Yans Wife
I'm glad I grew up with the 'brat pack' and Revenge of the Nerds rather than generation X death culture. The first Woodstock was great but the rest went downhill LOL
19 posted on 04/05/2004 8:06:43 PM PDT by cyborg (Frankenfreude radio death watch has commenced)
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To: spetznaz
See the movie "Hype" about the Seattle music scene in the 1990s. Grunge "fashion" was a hoax but it came with the "crediblity" that gave the corporations something to market.

Poison 13 was another little ol' band from Texas (Austin). They put out several albums and had a quality that spawned immitators. They were a departure from the speed metal thrashcore sounds of the mid-1980s punk scene. Everything slowed down.

They covered blues songs, 70s punk, drunken party songs from the 1960s, etc. Everything from Joy Division to the Troggs, Richard Hell to Suzi Quatro, the Sonics to Buffy St Marie,

Sub Pop considered them enough of an influence on grunge that they issued a best of compilation.

1. One Step Closer
2. Seventh Son
3. My Biggest Mistake
4. Spoonful
5. Out on the Streets
6. Big City Lights
7. Die For Me
8. Codine
9. Grip on My Heart
10. Justice
11. When I Was Young
12. Blank Generation
13. Hellbound Train
14. First You Dream, And Then You Die
15. Strange Movies
16. Can't Cry
17. Parchment Farm
18. She's the One That's Got It
19. What a Way to Die
20. I'm Dangerous Tonight
21. Love Me
22. Strychnine
23. Warsaw

Rumor has it that Monkeywrench was formed to record more Poison 13 songs (even though the bands don't really sound the same at all). Monkeywrench is sort of a grunge supergroup.
20 posted on 04/05/2004 8:15:35 PM PDT by weegee (No blood for ratings. CNN supressed reports of torture & murder in Iraq to keep their Baghdad bureau)
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To: cyborg
The first Woodstock had it's problems (attendees burned down the food stands then too). Abbie Hoffman blackmailed the promoters into giving him $10,000 and a free table so as not to disrupt the event. Even then Pete Townsend had to whack Abbie with his guitar when Abbie tried to take the microphone during the Who's 3am performance.

The eco-generation left an environmental nightmare behind.

Altamont and the Isle of Wight festivals came with their own problems.

21 posted on 04/05/2004 8:20:32 PM PDT by weegee (No blood for ratings. CNN supressed reports of torture & murder in Iraq to keep their Baghdad bureau)
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To: weegee
true... you are right. The last one was a pure disaster and I think that's the last of Woodstock-wannabes.
22 posted on 04/05/2004 8:22:34 PM PDT by cyborg
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To: KneelBeforeZod
Nirvana didn't revive rock... it killed it.
23 posted on 04/05/2004 10:01:52 PM PDT by thoughtomator (Voting Bush because there is no reasonable alternative)
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To: Dan from Michigan
Didn't read your post before I posted, but we're definitely on the same page.
24 posted on 04/05/2004 10:03:45 PM PDT by thoughtomator (Voting Bush because there is no reasonable alternative)
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To: KneelBeforeZod
... For Courtney Love: [snip] But instead of fading into obscurity along with L7 and Bikini Kill, now we're forced to read about her antics every week in "Teen People."

Like Teen People would ever get it right anyway. If not Courtney it would be Britney or even Brabra Streisand moaning about President Bush.

...For Guitars: [snip] But then Nirvana made guitars popular again, opening the gates for bands like the White Stripes and Nickelback to exist now.

It may have been written in the spirit of satire but good satire has it's origins in truth. The White Stripes would still exist. They get their lead from Billy Childish, not Kurt Cobain. Just because American fools don't know who Billy is, he still is celebrated in England and elsewhere for having released 100 albums since 1978.

25 posted on 04/05/2004 10:10:27 PM PDT by weegee (No blood for ratings. CNN supressed reports of torture & murder in Iraq to keep their Baghdad bureau)
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To: cyborg
There are still large festivals around the world that occur without incident. They don't get the hype here. Also they seem to have gone more to older niche audiences (because face it, kids today are too lazy to make music themselves and won't seek out something other than what everyone else is already buying off the charts).

Touring festivals also diminish the need for some of the humongous ones.

Here's just a brief list of some of the more notable festivals these days:

Last year's Coachella Festival was stronger and included the first Iggy Pop & The Stooges reunion since the early 1970s.
http://www.coachella.com/lineup.html

All Tomorrow's Parties has a different "host" every year (last year's LA show was designed by David Bowie; Matt Groening also got to pick the line up one year). The Stooges played this one too.
http://www.atpfestival.com/index.php

The New Orleans Jazz Heritage festival contains a lot more than just that:
http://www.nojazzfest.com/

There's also the New Orleans' Voodoo Music Festival (which also hosted a Stooges reunion last year).
http://www.voodoomusicfest.com/

England continues to hold the Reading Festival
http://www.readingfestival.com/pages/index.asp

There are also some big multiband bills hosted in San Diego and I think Portland.

26 posted on 04/05/2004 10:44:44 PM PDT by weegee (No blood for ratings. CNN supressed reports of torture & murder in Iraq to keep their Baghdad bureau)
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To: KneelBeforeZod
You have to give Cobain credit for revitalizing Weird Al's career after a three-year absence!
27 posted on 04/05/2004 11:33:27 PM PDT by RightWingAtheist
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To: KneelBeforeZod
I was a Freshman in High School when Nevermind came out and I must say that to me it was a welcome relief. Up until that point most of people I knew listened to rap and that had suddenly changed. And there was finally an alternative to rap that wasn't the totally tacky hair bands I'd struggled to like in Junior High.

I don't know. Sometimes with music you've just got to be the right age in the right time and place to get it.
28 posted on 04/05/2004 11:56:34 PM PDT by MattAMiller
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To: KneelBeforeZod
May I add that one of things I love about FreeRepublic is that's the sort of place where you can find the most unlikely people writing short dissertations on the history of popular music inlcuding the impact of various rather obscure acts.
29 posted on 04/06/2004 12:00:31 AM PDT by MattAMiller
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To: cyborg
Yeah, i personally dislike depressive music (which is one more reason why i am surprised that i like Nirvana ....a lot of their stuff is brooding). 'Downer' music really can have an effect on a person. Nowadays all my music choices have to pass the 'happiness' test.

Love your way with words by the way.

30 posted on 04/06/2004 2:47:48 AM PDT by spetznaz (Nuclear missiles: The ultimate Phallic symbol.)
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To: spetznaz
LOL... well Wilfred D. Best advised better to use small words than big ones :-)
31 posted on 04/06/2004 5:02:31 AM PDT by cyborg
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To: weegee
Thanks for the links. My employer used to go to Reggae Sunsplash. Now she goes to the Essence Music Festival as well.
32 posted on 04/06/2004 5:03:53 AM PDT by cyborg
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To: qam1
Thanks for the ping. I definitely liked Nirvana, though less so now; probably because it's tough to get worked up with angst the more successful you become.

But, like a lot of people my age (mid thirties), I actually grew up drinking beer at bonfires listening to the real thing: seventies album rock. I'll take "Won't Get Fooled Again" over "Teen Spirit" as my anthem any day.

33 posted on 04/06/2004 5:13:28 AM PDT by Mr. Bird (Ain't the beer cold!)
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To: Dan from Michigan
Bob Seger, is that you?

LOL!! Actually, I like some Seger tunes. When it comes to rock 'n' roll, most of the stuff I prefer is about the same vintage as I am. From the Brit invasion to the breakup of Van Halen (ca. '65-'85) there was some really great music made.

Aside from those few shining rock 'n' roll moments, my favorite music is all Country/Western :)

34 posted on 04/06/2004 5:51:41 AM PDT by TonyRo76 (Annoy a Leftist today become a monthly donor to FreeRepublic!)
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To: qam1
"Smells like Teen Spirit"

I'm pretty sure that's the song the DJ was playing! My first taste of grunge (which was about as yummy as raw beets) :

"Stairway to Heaven"

Ah, the mighty Zeppelin. I'll tell ya, if there's any rock band that deserves to be in the pantheon of all-time musical greats, it is Led Zeppelin. Some of their work almost borders on symphonic! Their albums In Through the Out Door and Untitled/“IV” are IMO two of the pinnacled triumphs of the entire rock 'n' roll genre.

35 posted on 04/06/2004 6:00:04 AM PDT by TonyRo76 (Annoy a Leftist today become a monthly donor to FreeRepublic!)
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To: KneelBeforeZod; labowski; LibertyGrrrl; marktuoni; itsamelman; Sam's Army; RepoGirl; Redcoat LI; ...

I have decided to refute this tripe with a photo presentation, of sorts, to help articulate my points. Enjoy!

-----------

... For Courtney Love: If Nirvana never got famous, then she wouldn't have married Kurt Cobain, he wouldn't have helped her write all the songs on Hole's breakthrough album, "Live Through This," and no one would have cared that she was such a desperate attention freak with a bad dye job and implants. But instead of fading into obscurity along with L7 and Bikini Kill, now we're forced to read about her antics every week in "Teen People."

After seeing a rerun of Howard Stern's E! show last week while channel surfing, I can't disagree. This broad, and I use that term loosely here, is seriously out of her mind. The world would be better off without her. The only thing she ever got right was "Courtney Love Does The Math", her slam on record labels, their treatment of artists and fans, and the mp3 trading world.

... For Dave Grohl: He's the most boring rock star on the planet. Sure, he plays in every band from the Queens of the Stone Age to Probot, but imagine how wonderful the world would be without the dreary generic toss of the Foo Fighters.

Alright, with this I have to take offense. A skilled musician, looking back it was probably Grohl who enabled Nirvana to get as huge as they did. No doubt he had a large creative influence over the songwriting (for better or worse). In regards to playing with the Queens Of The Stone Age, I really only have one thing to say:

The Queens of the Stone Age kicks ass. With or without Dave Grohl. Period. (See QOTSA live at Reading Festival 2001).

It's almost like that guy from the Lemonheads getting totally famous and making millions upon millions of dollars for sounding just like Blind Melon. It's just plain unfair. Plus he looks like Cojo.

Indeed, Evan Dondo was kind of lame. I say this as I have a copy of "Come On Feel The Lemonheads" sitting on my desk. What can I say? "Rick James Style" kicks ass.

... For Mudhoney: Has there ever been a worse band in the history of humankind than Mudhoney? Yes, Sonic Youth. Either way, no one would have heard about either of them or bought their records -- only to sell them back for a fraction of the price at Amoeba -- if it weren't for Nirvana. Expecting a continuation of "Nevermind," people flocked to these grunge hangers-on, cluttering their CD collections with a bunch of under-produced, tuneless junk. Thanks a lot, Screaming Trees.

Oh boy, where to begin? Firstly, Mudhoney were pioneers. "My Brother The Cow" is still one of my favorites. Sonic Youth is also excellent, they were East Coast pioneers. Screaming Trees, another great band. Mark Lanagan enjoyed a 2 year stint in Queens of The Stone Age as well. (Am I sensing a theme here?) The author of this piece obviously hates everything that is cool. I'm surprised he didn't just come right out and start making fun of Husker Du and Bob Mould while they were at it! He already took pot-shots at the Pixies and the Replacements!

Not too much flannel there...

... For guitars: Before Nirvana arrived, everyone knew music after the year 2000 would totally be technological and rad -- just robots playing crazy drum 'n' bass with androids singing over it. People were totally sick of hearing lousy guitar rock by Eric Clapton and Tom Petty. But then Nirvana made guitars popular again, opening the gates for bands like the White Stripes and Nickelback to exist now. If it weren't for Bjork, we might as well all still be cavemen right now.

Rad? RAD? If some whiny rock critic ever described my band as "rad" I'd probably mail him a hate letter. Well, I'll give him Bjork. And also, both Nickleback and the White Stripes are jokes, sick twisted jokes played out on us by evil, evil people. But, if it's both guitars and robots the author craves, maybe we'll call in an old standby:


36 posted on 04/06/2004 7:46:45 AM PDT by bc2 ("Stay well - Stay safe - Stay armed - Yorktown" - harpseal)
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To: Dan from Michigan
>>>
Nirvana killed rock.
<<<

"Kurt Cobain -- the spokesman for a generation with nothing to say." -- P.J. O'Rourke
37 posted on 04/06/2004 8:01:31 AM PDT by Keltik
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To: bc2
Mondo Generator/Desert Sessions bump for your QOTSA reference.
38 posted on 04/06/2004 8:24:32 AM PDT by Sam's Army
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To: Sam's Army
Have you heard either of the Mondo records? I've heard a few of the tracks and I'm psyched to try and catch 'em this summer...

A big HELL YEAH for the Desert Sessions!

39 posted on 04/06/2004 9:06:30 AM PDT by bc2 ("Stay well - Stay safe - Stay armed - Yorktown" - harpseal)
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To: bc2
I've downloaded a few things from Mondo, but that's all right now. I have some Desert Sessions and IMO they (whoever's in the lineup at the moment) are the best thing going right now IMO.

'Cept maybe Pelican from Chicago.

40 posted on 04/06/2004 9:16:23 AM PDT by Sam's Army
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To: Sam's Army
Desert Sessions 1&2 and 5&6 are my personal faves... haven't heard too much of the new stuff except that new track with PJ Harvey that all the lamestream radio latched on to...

RIP - Man's Ruin Records
41 posted on 04/06/2004 9:20:48 AM PDT by bc2 ("Stay well - Stay safe - Stay armed - Yorktown" - harpseal)
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To: bc2
I'm with you on just about every point (although not a huge White Stripes fan I shiver to see them in the same sentence with Nickelback - eesh).

BTW: I hear Nick Oliveri is out of QOTSA(?).

42 posted on 04/06/2004 9:24:16 AM PDT by itsamelman ("Before I refuse to take your questions, I have an opening statement." -- R. Reagan)
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To: spetznaz
I agree - altho I don't like Nirvana, either.

I'm just a pop chick. And that goes for all decades, whatever's actually popular (and not the fringe stuff all the special people on the 'net make seem were the norm these days), I probably liked it.

If you can't dance to it, I don't wanna hear it. I don't care if you think it's cheesy or nerdy or geeky or "gay", if it's danceable in any possible way, I will probably like it. 1 of the reasons I like country, too. People *actually* dance in country places.
43 posted on 04/06/2004 9:30:13 AM PDT by the OlLine Rebel (Common Sense is an Uncommon Virtue)
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To: bc2
Well, count me as a late bloomer for the DS stuff, I am now going back to try to find all of the previous sessions and have had some limited luck downloading some earlier stuff. ("Up in Hell" from Vol 7 maybe?)
44 posted on 04/06/2004 9:32:16 AM PDT by Sam's Army
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To: bc2
Actually, the first Hole album Pretty On The Inside is some grade-A sonic squall. Courtney went rapidly downhill after that.

IMHO, if there was true justice in the universe, the big bands from Seattle besides Nirvana would not have been Pearl Jam and Alice In Chains, but Mudhoney and the mighty, mighty Tad!
45 posted on 04/06/2004 9:43:48 AM PDT by GodBlessRonaldReagan (Count Petofi will not be denied!)
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To: Dan from Michigan
Oh yeah, Nirvan at least cleared up this excrement


46 posted on 04/06/2004 11:59:46 AM PDT by ThreeYearLurker
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To: bc2
Memory Lane:

One Night. 3 Bands. I went to a concert at a place called 'The Cathouse' in LA, CA back in the day...Rikki Rachtman still has his hands in the Cathouse franchise at the time.....the word on the street was these bands were from Seattle...supposedly the new hotbed of talent in the music world.....and this was their first appearance in LA. Hairspray bands and spadex were still running rampant on the LA strip.....Lita Ford and her boyfriend from W.A.S.P, Chris, were drunk at the bar and cursing at each other, as usual. So, I was hoping for something...anything different. Two buddies of mine in A&R had stopped signing hair bands several months before and were looking for something original. Well, we got it! Through the stench of unwashed bodies and patchouli...obviously imported from the Seattle area along with some foreign substances usually grown in poppy fields.....post hippie depression complaint rock was born. I witnessed what I knew was a serious change in the music industry. Nirvana, Pearl Jam and Mother Love Bone...on the same stage....took our breath away (literally).

My best friend and I still mention it from time to time. What we usually refer to in that experience is the complete polarity of the situation...how everyone in the club that night was transfixed, mesmerized and bedazzled. We could tell Curt and the lead singer from MLB were heroine users and Eddie....well he was high on something.... ;) We had made a prediction that morning at about 4am in Canter's Deli that 2 out of the 3 would be dead from an overdose or worse within 5 years. Unfortunately, we were right....... and that's how legends begin....

47 posted on 04/06/2004 12:29:11 PM PDT by BossLady (What do your choices cost you?)
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To: KneelBeforeZod
I was sick of Nirvana before the end of 1991. Talk about something that got old fast! Nirvana was just predictable and whiny.

I'm still into much of the music that I was listening to when Nirvana came out: Testament, Metallica (before they sucked), Slayer, Megadeth, Overkill, Pantera, Nuclear Assault (mutants for nukes!), MOD, etc. You know, the classics! I've recently picked up on System of a Down and Fear Factory also.

Give me a hard beat and a loud, fast guitar any day.
48 posted on 04/06/2004 12:56:17 PM PDT by T.Smith
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To: BossLady
I though Pearl Jam was formed out of what was left of Mother Love Bone after the singer overdosed?
49 posted on 04/06/2004 1:02:41 PM PDT by T.Smith
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To: itsamelman
At this point in time, both Nick and Mark Lanegan have split from QOTSA. Nick got fired by Josh and Mark left right after he heard the news, so he could concentrate 100% on Mark Lanegan Band.

Basically I'll just post the interview with Josh, he explains the whole thing:

------

In a press release issued last month, the band's management stated that "a number of incidents occurring over the last 18 months led to the decision that the two can no longer maintain a working partnership in the band". The vague statement fueled speculation that rampant drug use was responsible for Oliveri's removal, but Homme said the problem wasn't a direct result of partying, but rather the way Oliveri behaved when he was wasted — and even when wasn't.

"Our whole band is full of hard partiers," Homme said. "We have put more people in rehab than Mardi Gras. But when you get drunk, you either get drunk with class, or you get drunk like a slobbering, toothless f---. And that's just an analogy. It's not just drinking, it's how you live your life."

Homme said there were dozens of times Oliveri got the band kicked out of parties or banned from hotels. Homme added that he played a major role in keeping Oliveri out of jail by "snowing his probation officer" and smoothing out countless other tense, volatile situations. "He's a tornado, and a tornado just destroys and goes on to the next city," Homme said. "I'm in the tornado cleanup crew, and all I ever see is his detritus and I'm sick of it.

"We used to have a thing we called 'Jekyll and Hyde' where, whenever Nick did something, we blamed Nick in the press, and whenever I did something, we blamed Nick in the press," Homme explained. "But I think Nick started believing our press and thinking that he's gotta be the next Sid Vicious or something. And I think Sid Vicious is a badass, but also I think Sid Vicious is a dumb drug addict who couldn't play bass and never wrote a song, and if he stayed alive most guys would have went, 'This guy's a worthless piece of sh--.' And so I don't think that's something to aspire to."

Homme said he was amused by Oliveri's antics for a while, but when the bassist became noticeably more mean-spirited, his amusement waned. When it became apparent to Homme that Oliveri's irresponsibility and cruelty was more than an act for the media, he realized the relationship couldn't continue.

"He really doesn't even know why I kicked him out," Homme said. "In the press, he admitted he threw bottles into the audiences, but he's saying, 'I do it for the fans. Isn't that what they really want?' But what Nick really did was come up to me between the first and second song and say, 'This audience isn't good enough — they're sh--,' and then he threw full bottles of Corona at them, like a baseball pitcher. Is that for the fans? That's not my style. I get drunk with the fans, I don't throw bottles at them."


The final straw came after a show in Australia in which Oliveri trashed all of his equipment, then later got the Queens banned from a hotel in Perth. "You can just put that in a box with the other hotels we've been banned from," Homme said. "You know Nick's been accused of a lot of things, and basically all of them are true, and I can live with the sh-- I've done, but I can't be tied to the sh-- I haven't done."

After Homme decided to part ways with Oliveri, he drove to the bassist's house to confront him. Even though Oliveri had caused Homme plenty of headaches, the two also shared lots of good times, and the frontman felt he owed his "bro" an in-person explanation. "He was bummed, man," Homme recalled. "It was the only time that an irrational guy was rational. He was going, 'I don't want this to happen.' But when you see a guy winging bottles at the audience, you eventually just say, 'F--- this!' If you don't, then you're just somebody's bitch."

Homme admitted that the musical chemistry between he and Oliveri helped drive the last two Queens of the Stone Age records, and he added that he'll miss touring with Oliveri and would be open to working him in the future if he can change his behavior. "I still love the guy, man. And Nick had a vital spot in the band," Homme said with a hint of regret. "Nick has great energy. He scares people, I guess."

A few seconds of silence followed while Homme pondered the statement. "You know what? I don't want to scare people," he finally said. "I want to enrapture people with music. And I want them to get the goose bumps when they hear our album. I don't give a f--- if they're scared about looking at us."

"I write 90 percent of the music. Which I never say, because I always try to stay mellow about it," he said. "I wrote most of the music and took care of all of the business, and kept it so our bass player could just play for an hour and a half a day and that's all he had to do. If you're wondering if Queens has no balls, you don't have to wonder. If you want to see balls, go see Nick with the Dwarves, because I understand he's playing with them again." Homme added that when Oliveri played with the band in 1997, he would expose himself.

------

So there ya have it. What he did isn't cool. If you've ever seen the video for "First It Giveth", you know what a bunch of maniacal freaks QOTSA really are. But, you can be a huge rock star, have the rock star attitude, and still be cool to people. You can get drunk as hell, pick fights with other bands, get naked, break all of your gear, and still not be a total 100% jerk. But, when you start talking sh!t about the kids who are coming out and paying $20 (or more at a festival) to see you rock out, you can't be a jerk to those people.

All in all I don't think Nick is a bad dude and I really hope that he can look at himself and say "what an asshole I was" and get over himself a bit. I mean dude, he is living everyone's dream of rock stardom! The least you can do is be cool to people who enable you to be a rock star. As he's said, the best band playing in the world today is finished, and it's too bad. Hopefully he can get it together and get back with QOTSA. I think that when Mark Lanegan joined up for vocal duties that they really had something goin'!

If you haven't seen the video for "First It Giveth", you've gotta get it! I have a copy.
50 posted on 04/06/2004 1:48:44 PM PDT by bc2 ("Stay well - Stay safe - Stay armed - Yorktown" - harpseal)
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