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VIRGIN MARY DEFILED ON “SOUTH PARK”
Catholic League ^ | December 8, 2005 | William Donohue

Posted on 12/09/2005 5:50:13 AM PST by NYer

Catholic League president Bill Donohue remarked today about last night’s episode of “South Park” (it will run again for the next three nights):

 

“A ‘South Park’ character gets a DWI and is ordered to attend AA meetings.  Told about the 12-step program, he concludes that he needs a miracle to cure him.  The plot then focuses on a statue of the Virgin Mary who is ‘bleeding out her ass.’  The Vatican dispatches a cardinal to investigate and he is sprayed with blood when he walks behind the statue.  He then declares this to be a miracle, which draws even more people.  The alcoholic, now in a wheelchair, is also sprayed with blood: he then claims he is cured and jumps out of his seat.

 

“Pope Benedict XVI goes to investigate.  He, too, is sprayed with blood when he walks behind the statue.  A reporter says, ‘The pope investigated further and determined that the statue was not bleeding out its ass, but its vagina.’  To which the pope replies: ‘A chick bleeding out her vagina is no miracle.  Chicks bleed out their vaginas all the time.’

 

“Comedy Central is a subsidiary of MTV, which is owned by Viacom.  On the board of directors of Viacom is a practicing Catholic and a distinguished public servant, Joseph A. Califano; he served under Presidents Johnson and Carter.  We are writing to him today requesting that he intervene in this matter.  We want a) an apology to Roman Catholics and b) a pledge that this episode be permanently retired and not be made available on DVD.  In the event Viacom does not cooperate, we are asking Mr. Califano to issue his own statement of condemnation.  We are asking our members to contact him as well.  Remember, they chose to insult Our Blessed Mother on the eve of the Immaculate Conception, and the holy day itself

“Joseph A. Califano is chairman of the board of The National Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse.  He can be reached at CASA, 633 Third Avenue, NY, NY 10017; phone, 212-841-5200; fax, 212-956-8020; email, employment@casacolumbia.org.”


TOPICS: Religion; TV/Movies
KEYWORDS: billdonohue; billdonohueisnuts; blasphemy; bleedingass; bleedingvagina; bvm; catholicleague; catholics; comedycentral; equalopptyoffender; getalifedonahue; itsashow; itzsatirefolks; mary; moralabsolutes; southpark; southparkrules; viacom
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To: Max7

Come on, that is a lame grievance.

Lets move on to the feats of strength! Best 2 of 3 falls! After that we can jump in the pool and see who can handle the cold weather!

I'm looking for a good sized pole, can't be too flashy or commercialized.


501 posted on 12/09/2005 11:38:21 AM PST by Central Scrutiniser (Christmas is annoying, Happy Festivus)
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To: Max7
So, by that estimation, we should just laugh at exactly whose reaction to the segment about the statue of the Virgin Mary? Our own?

If you're the type to think a bleeding statue will cure disease, and you'd wait in line to pray to it.... then yes... you're the reaction that they, and many of us, find humor in. :~D

502 posted on 12/09/2005 11:41:18 AM PST by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/ 1,000 knives and counting!)
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To: HairOfTheDog

Now who is the one jumping to conclusions? Now we've moved on to HEALING BY STATUES? I know you're trying real hard to deny MY point by insulting me, but I think you know exactly what I'm saying about this and you just don't want to give it any weight. But others who read this may.


503 posted on 12/09/2005 11:46:18 AM PST by Max7
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To: SittinYonder
I didn't read the whole thread so I'll take your word for it, and I'm honestly surprised that I was the first to suggest it.
504 posted on 12/09/2005 11:47:37 AM PST by Question_Assumptions
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To: Max7
Now who is the one jumping to conclusions? Now we've moved on to HEALING BY STATUES?

Those people who would flock to a bleeding statue or some other apparition of Mary in mold on a window, or in a piece of toast, are the only target for mocking in the episode.

If you don't like the show, that's fine... Matt and Trey will still eat tonight. I am merely correcting errors of fact that you, and others were making, in describing a show you haven't even watched.

505 posted on 12/09/2005 11:52:50 AM PST by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/ 1,000 knives and counting!)
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To: Question_Assumptions

You naughty Question_Assumptions. See the firestorm you created with just one little opinion? Good work.


506 posted on 12/09/2005 11:54:32 AM PST by Max7
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To: Question_Assumptions
I didn't read the whole thread so I'll take your word for it, and I'm honestly surprised that I was the first to suggest it.

You were the 20th person to suggest it, and you were all wrong. :~D LOL The response to you indicating you were was dripping with sarcasm along the lines of "Here we go again"!

507 posted on 12/09/2005 11:56:56 AM PST by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/ 1,000 knives and counting!)
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To: HairOfTheDog
The sarcasm didn't work because, well, I didn't read the thread.
508 posted on 12/09/2005 11:59:53 AM PST by Question_Assumptions
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To: Question_Assumptions

It worked well for those of us who did :~D

That's the thing. Sometimes you have to actually participate in order to understand the jokes :~D


509 posted on 12/09/2005 12:01:28 PM PST by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/ 1,000 knives and counting!)
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To: SittinYonder
I expect the reason the creators of South Park stay away from Muslims is because they are scared

Well that shows you've never watched an episode. Chef turns to Islam in Chef Goes Nanners (season 4) and then turns back IIRC. Matt and Trey make fun of anybody and everybody. The episode with Osama Bin Laden comes to mind as well

510 posted on 12/09/2005 12:01:39 PM PST by billbears (Deo Vindice)
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To: HairOfTheDog
"Those people who would flock to a bleeding statue or some other apparition of Mary in mold on a window, or in a piece of toast, are the only target for mocking in the episode."

But that is NOT what the argument is about. You clearly miss the point, that being that this statue is representative of the very real Virgin Mary, and for the sake of a few laughs at those who might "flock to a bleeding statue or a piece of toast", by showing blood pouring out of various orifices (whether statue or not), indicates a presence of sacrilege. And that's NOT NICE. And those who find the South Park episode/segment to be over the line have a right to feel that way, whether you miss their point or not. And you DO, and you ARE. Additionally, based on the various posts of others concerning this, including yours, is it really necessary for me to actually SEE the segment (we're not talking Gone With the Wind here, are we?) to offer an intelligent argument against ONE thing in it? I didn't realize we were talking about the entire series, were we?

511 posted on 12/09/2005 12:04:19 PM PST by Max7
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To: HairOfTheDog
By the way, as someone who generally stopped watching South Park when the crap started talking (literally -- it was just a bit too over the top for me), have they ever depicted Muhammed or the Koran on South Park. Because, honestly, the response I expected was that they've already done it. And if they haven't, I'd be curious why they haven't.
512 posted on 12/09/2005 12:04:32 PM PST by Question_Assumptions
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To: HairOfTheDog
I need to remember to be more careful with these subjects that some people take far too seriously. I probably should have listened to that little voice that said, "You know, I bet a few dozen other Freepers are going to say the exact same thing," and not posted.
513 posted on 12/09/2005 12:06:03 PM PST by Question_Assumptions
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To: billbears
Well that shows you've never watched an episode.

Well that shows you haven't read the whole thread.

514 posted on 12/09/2005 12:06:53 PM PST by SittinYonder (Flea, feather, bird, egg, nest, twig, branch, limb, tree, and the bog down in the valley - o.)
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To: Question_Assumptions
I didn't read the whole thread so I'll take your word for it, and I'm honestly surprised that I was the first to suggest it.

Don't take my word for it. ... I'm kidding. You weren't the first. ;-)

515 posted on 12/09/2005 12:07:41 PM PST by SittinYonder (Flea, feather, bird, egg, nest, twig, branch, limb, tree, and the bog down in the valley - o.)
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To: Question_Assumptions
have they ever depicted Muhammed or the Koran on South Park.

Yes, they have. Muhammed was depicted as one of the Super Best Friends in the episode of that name. During season 5, IIRC.

516 posted on 12/09/2005 12:08:19 PM PST by ecurbh ()()A Festivus for the rest of us!()()
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To: Question_Assumptions

The answer is they have. Many times. Not only in South Park, but in the movie Team America, they have made fun of the crazy elements of Islam and of characters like Osama Bin Laden.... not the religion, per se, but the nutty fringes of it and the things people DO. Which is really their point. They aren't making fun of the Catholic faith, or God, in this episode, they're making fun of people who believe in apparitions of Mary being real or having any healing or curative power if you pray to them. They assert that they are fake and that people are foolish to believe in them. And they do it in somewhat vivid and funny ways.


517 posted on 12/09/2005 12:10:43 PM PST by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/ 1,000 knives and counting!)
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To: mnehrling
I'm a proud member of both camps. I can take a joke (usually). ;-)
518 posted on 12/09/2005 12:10:43 PM PST by CounterCounterCulture (Tagline: (optional, printed after your name on post))
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To: HairOfTheDog

I looked at my festivus pole, and I saw the image of finely machined aluminium alloys. It was a miracle! I went out and bought some green and red peppers to celebrate!

Praise Festivus!


519 posted on 12/09/2005 12:13:03 PM PST by Central Scrutiniser (Christmas is annoying, Happy Festivus)
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To: SunnySide

You contradict yourself

You have condemned both the show and the viewers. Thought you were a bit harsh on the audience.


520 posted on 12/09/2005 12:16:45 PM PST by ConservativeGreek
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To: subterfuge

My sentiments exactly. Love the show but changed the channel at that point.

Yeah, it was creepy. Never felt that way with the program's attack before. This was "humorless."


521 posted on 12/09/2005 12:18:18 PM PST by ConservativeGreek
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To: george wythe

Good and most-relevant post.


522 posted on 12/09/2005 12:23:51 PM PST by CounterCounterCulture (Tagline: (optional, printed after your name on post))
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To: HairOfTheDog
Yes, I know South Park is a lot more thoughtful and nuanced than a lot of critics think it is (which is why I think I wound up on a South Park ping list -- which I don't mind). I'm just a bit tired of Fundamentalists and Catholics being bashed. It's old -- like my suggestion apparently was. Do something new already, like the NAMBLA episode.
523 posted on 12/09/2005 12:24:06 PM PST by Question_Assumptions
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To: SittinYonder
Don't worry, I'm getting a very important lesson from all of this. Don't make cheap obvious comments into controversial 500+ reply threads that you haven't read. :-)
524 posted on 12/09/2005 12:25:16 PM PST by Question_Assumptions
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To: SittinYonder

You haven't addressed the main part of my post. South Park creators have covered Islam more than once. So apparently they're not very scared of it.


525 posted on 12/09/2005 12:25:42 PM PST by billbears (Deo Vindice)
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To: Question_Assumptions
Do something new already, like the NAMBLA episode.

But they've already done that... it's no longer new :~D

This season they've hit a lot of areas they haven't hit before... Our religions represent a huge part of the culture.... It's just simple math that there are more opportunities for humor there than have yet been done. To ignore them would be the insult :~D

526 posted on 12/09/2005 12:29:51 PM PST by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/ 1,000 knives and counting!)
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To: Question_Assumptions
Do something new already, like the NAMBLA episode.

You mean the National Association of Marlon Brando Look-Alikes?

527 posted on 12/09/2005 12:36:17 PM PST by ecurbh ()()A Festivus for the rest of us!()()
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To: steve8714; rwfromkansas
Mary had other sons and daughters besides Jesus, so Mary didn't die a virgin.
528 posted on 12/09/2005 12:40:39 PM PST by CounterCounterCulture (Tagline: (optional, printed after your name on post))
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To: Max7
You clearly miss the point, that being that this statue is representative of the very real Virgin Mary, and for the sake of a few laughs at those who might "flock to a bleeding statue or a piece of toast", by showing blood pouring out of various orifices (whether statue or not), indicates a presence of sacrilege. And that's NOT NICE.

Well, leaving aside for the moment that it was cartoon of a statue of a woman whom we have no clue of how she looked, the point was quite clearly making fun of those who see miracles performed by statues of Mary.

If you believe those miracles are real, you are going to be offended. If you think those miracles are hoaxes, the result of an over-imaginative perception, or have natural explanations, you won't be. Plenty of Catholics fit into the latter categories.

The point you miss is that this wasn't a diss on Mary. It was a diss of statue miracles.

If you don't see the distinction, then you're a good candidate to believe in healing statue tears, grilled cheese sandwich miracles, etc.

529 posted on 12/09/2005 12:52:06 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: CounterCounterCulture

Would have been kindof a bummer of a deal for Joseph, anyhow.


530 posted on 12/09/2005 12:56:04 PM PST by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/ 1,000 knives and counting!)
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To: ConservativeGreek

You contradict yourself

You have condemned both the show and the viewers. Thought you were a bit harsh on the audience.
....

No, you're another one of those hyper sensitive liberals.


531 posted on 12/09/2005 12:57:00 PM PST by SunnySide (Ephes2:8 ByGraceYou'veBeenSavedThruFaithAGiftOfGodSoNoOneCanBoast)
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To: stuartcr
I guess this means you just can't answer yes or not, as to whether you believe a statue can weep or not, thanks anyway.

Statues can't weep, Bozo.

532 posted on 12/09/2005 12:59:04 PM PST by E. Pluribus Unum (Islam Factoid:After forcing young girls to watch his men execute their fathers, Muhammad raped them.)
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To: billbears
You haven't addressed the main part of my post

It wasn't the main part as far as I was concerned.

533 posted on 12/09/2005 1:01:20 PM PST by SittinYonder (Flea, feather, bird, egg, nest, twig, branch, limb, tree, and the bog down in the valley - o.)
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To: EveningStar

So what the hell are these supposed holier than thou Catholics doing watching South Park anyways?

I thought it was a hilarious episode.


534 posted on 12/09/2005 1:08:11 PM PST by StoneColdGOP (California GOP: Aim for Foot, Pull Trigger.)
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To: Central Scrutiniser

I haven't read the last few hundred posts to this Hedonists vs. Idolators thread, but have we had the airing of grievences yet?


535 posted on 12/09/2005 1:25:51 PM PST by BJClinton
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To: CounterCounterCulture
to rwfromkansas: Were you there when Mary lost her virginity? Mary had other sons and daughters besides Jesus, so Mary didn't die a virgin.

I am curious about something. In the original writing of the scripture in the original language, did it really say that Mary was a physical virgin (virgo intacta) or just young woman (almah). How much are we looking at the Word through the glasses of tradition versus accurate translation?

It is like a previous poster who still has the image of Jesus as a 'hippie', when in fact, he was actually of royal dynastic descent directly from King David (Nazrie ha-Brit or mistranslated Nazerene) who came 'not as a peacemaker but with a sword.' (paraphrased)

Are people offended that their religion was offended or that their tradition was offended?
536 posted on 12/09/2005 1:29:33 PM PST by mnehring (Peace Activism is an Oxymoron.)
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To: NYer

South Park is an equal opportunity offender.


537 posted on 12/09/2005 1:30:53 PM PST by mhking (The world needs a wake up call gentlemen...we're gonna phone it in.)
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To: BJClinton
I haven't read the last few hundred posts to this Hedonists vs. Idolators thread, but have we had the airing of grievences yet?

Of course. Post 496, for example.

538 posted on 12/09/2005 1:42:16 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: Dog Gone

I miss all of the fun 'cuase of this "work" thing.


539 posted on 12/09/2005 1:47:03 PM PST by BJClinton
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To: BJClinton

A little after lunch, I said to heck with this. I don't want to work anymore today and left the office. I've got vacation to burn...


540 posted on 12/09/2005 1:49:35 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: Dog Gone

We have an office party this evening so I'm stuck here 'til midnight. Upshot is I get to see my co-workers get drunk. That's usually good for a few embarrassing pictures/videos going around the office for months later.


541 posted on 12/09/2005 1:59:33 PM PST by BJClinton
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To: HairOfTheDog
I said new like the NAMBLA episode, which was pretty fresh when they did it. I suppose the recent Tom Cruise episode falls into that category.
542 posted on 12/09/2005 2:13:34 PM PST by Question_Assumptions
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To: mnehrling
I am not a biblical scholar, nor obviously a master of the orignal text in its original language(s), so somebody more knowledgable can add to the discussion about modern translations, but I will post what's in the Bible (NIV text) just so it's out here...

From Matthew 1...

The book of Mark doesn't go into the story, nor does the book of John.

Luke 1 starts with the story behind the birth John the Baptist, then...

Luke 2... An obvious cultural difference now is the definition of husband and wife, as matthew says how "His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph," (and there was to be no sexual relations until the actual marriage), yet Joseph was considered "her husband" and you can see the word "divorce" used as well even though they were not officially "married" as we view it today.

As far as the previous virginity of Mary (which I'll choose to believe), y'all can add to the debate and discuss all you want. The important thing is that whether or not Jesus is the true Son of God, showed us how to live a purposeful and righteous life as God wants for us, and that Jesus died on a cross for all our sins because He loved us so much.

Enough religious discussion from me for one day. :-)

543 posted on 12/09/2005 2:14:16 PM PST by CounterCounterCulture (Tagline: (optional, printed after your name on post))
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To: BJClinton

My wife has her Christmas party for the hospital where she works tonight. I'm invited, of course, but I don't care to see her co-workers drunk. So I'm not going. She's cool with that, but we'll see if she really goes or not.


544 posted on 12/09/2005 2:16:06 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: Dog Gone

She better go, it's usually poor politic to skip it, but I don't blame you for not wanting to go. Office parties are dreadful enough when you know the people. They're worse when you don't. :~D

My hubby ecurbh is at his right now.... it was a daytime lunch deal, so spouses weren't even invited and I lucked out that way :~D


545 posted on 12/09/2005 2:32:14 PM PST by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/ 1,000 knives and counting!)
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To: Dog Gone
"The point you miss is that this wasn't a diss on Mary. It was a diss of statue miracles. If you don't see the distinction, then you're a good candidate to believe in healing statue tears, grilled cheese sandwich miracles, etc.

Yes, I can see the distinction were there a distinction being made, and let me say that I do acknowledge your point. HOWEVER, and again, using the icon/statue/person of the Virgin Mary to show that SOME people "flock to a bleeding statue or a piece of toast" was not the best or only way to go to make the same point. That's all. Find something ELSE. Yes, it's offensive. Yes, there are worse things. Yes, I'll bet those writers had other ideas they probably nixed, thank (you'll excuse the expression) God. But they chose to have blood coming out of the Virgin Mary's "ass" (oh, how lovely). To those who do not find the Virgin Mary as anyone special, why would they care anyway? She's just a mythological person, etc. But not to everyone. Let's just agree to disagree. OK?

546 posted on 12/09/2005 2:36:11 PM PST by Max7
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To: ConservativeGreek
I'm with you on this....it reminds me of the Penn and Teller shows. I love some of it but some is too much for me to take. In fact, I'm pretty sure they compare notes from time to time. This episode was really similar to P&T's show on 12 step programs.
547 posted on 12/09/2005 2:42:58 PM PST by Uriah_lost (We aren't pro-war, we're PRO-VICTORY!)
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To: Dog Gone; HairOfTheDog; mhking

I have been watching South Park for only a few weeks now, and I must say, I have seen them diss numerous beliefs, things, situations etc...every one and every body is ripe for being blasted on South Park....I think some people do snicker and laugh when someone or something they detest or dont like is getting blasted, but then they get all uppity and huffy, when their particular belief that they hold is being blasted....one should realize that for South Park, nothing appears to be 'hands-off', and so if you are touch or very easily offended, just use that old remote, and change the channel...

And yes, what they were dissing was this hokey thing about the image of Mary, or Jesus, or some other entity being found in a box of cornflakes, or statues bleeding, and then the folks lining up around the block, to get 'cured'...years ago, someone in the old neighborhood we lived in in Chicago, had some tree trimming done...someone strolling by the cut down limbs, claimed that the image of Mary or Jesus could be seen in the saw off end of that tree limb...within a day, crowds were gathering, bringing flowers, and candles, and people were asking for cures...friends of mine told me it was quite the sight, all these folks pushing each other around, trying to near to that cut off tree limb...

As time went on and the end of the tree limb, began to heal and change with the weather, the crowds eventually went away, surely with none of them cured...

South Park may not be for everyone, but if you do watch, do realize that you may very well be offended, and if you are just change the channel...after all, that is what remotes are for...


548 posted on 12/09/2005 2:44:09 PM PST by andysandmikesmom
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To: Max7
HOWEVER, and again, using the icon/statue/person of the Virgin Mary to show that SOME people "flock to a bleeding statue or a piece of toast" was not the best or only way to go to make the same point. That's all. Find something ELSE.

They don't flock to miracle images of Barbara Streisand looking for cures silly... it's always a religous figure that has these apparitions or there's no appeal.

I'll concede that the source of the blood was intentionally crude.

549 posted on 12/09/2005 2:52:20 PM PST by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/ 1,000 knives and counting!)
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To: andysandmikesmom

well said :~D


550 posted on 12/09/2005 2:52:59 PM PST by HairOfTheDog (Join the Hobbit Hole Troop Support - http://freeper.the-hobbit-hole.net/ 1,000 knives and counting!)
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