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12ga Autoloader Shotguns: Any Recommendations?

Posted on 12/28/2008 6:14:14 PM PST by GusBreacher

I'm looking to buy a 12ga, autoloader/semi-auto 12ga, and I'm needing some sage advice.

I've read that the US Military has used these. Beyond that, I know zip about shotguns, except that I have my Grandpa's 10ga, single barrel, cracked stock, which hasn't been fired in 50+ years. (A gunsmith is going to work that piece long before I ever do. It's a "mantle-hanger", for now.)

Can anyone offer me some firsthand experience, or opinions on some units to try/buy?

Price? I'd like to stay under $1,000 if possible, including sight, case, cleaning kit, 500rnds.


TOPICS: Hobbies; Military/Veterans; Sports
KEYWORDS: 12gauge; autoloader; banglist; homedefense; shotgun; shotguns
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1 posted on 12/28/2008 6:14:14 PM PST by GusBreacher
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To: GusBreacher

Okay, make that 50 rounds. I’d rather have more shotgun than shells. Sorry.


2 posted on 12/28/2008 6:15:34 PM PST by GusBreacher
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To: GusBreacher

The brands to look at are Benelli, Beretta and Remington.


3 posted on 12/28/2008 6:16:37 PM PST by omega4179 (Ramos and Compean)
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To: omega4179

Can you get a Benelli for under a grand?


4 posted on 12/28/2008 6:17:47 PM PST by SIDENET (Hubba Hubba...)
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To: GusBreacher

Check this out:

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=srVsZd9xe_E


5 posted on 12/28/2008 6:17:57 PM PST by do the dhue (They've got us surrounded again. The poor bastards. - One of General Abram's men)
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To: omega4179

Find a Japanese made Browning A-5. They’re no longer in production but there are plenty of these “humpbacks” still in circulation.


6 posted on 12/28/2008 6:18:39 PM PST by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: GusBreacher

Well, this one won’t have any snob appeal, but I like my Saiga (Russian) semi-auto 12 gauge. The feature of five-round detachable magazines is mighty useful. Also cheap and very reliable.


7 posted on 12/28/2008 6:19:06 PM PST by Mogwai (Palin/Santorum 2012!)
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To: GusBreacher

Here is a link to winchester SX3 12 shots in 1.44 seconds. Amazing.
http://www.winchesterguns.com/services/press/detail.asp?id=45


8 posted on 12/28/2008 6:19:06 PM PST by Robbin
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To: GusBreacher
The first link I sent is the a-12. check out the aa-12

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=hhstuvzMiB0&feature=channel_page

9 posted on 12/28/2008 6:19:40 PM PST by do the dhue (They've got us surrounded again. The poor bastards. - One of General Abram's men)
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To: GusBreacher

Benelli makes some very fine autoloaders, as do Beretta and Browning. It’s important to get one that fits you, and that feels good to you. I’ll put in a recommendation for the Benelli Montefeltro, which I own. Very reliable, not too heavy, points well, just an all around fine gun.


10 posted on 12/28/2008 6:20:14 PM PST by Stevenc131
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To: GusBreacher
A Benelli M4 works for me. But dealers tell me that a recent run on tactical weapons left warehouses empty until about March.
M4

When the U.S. Marine Corps went shopping for a combat shotgun, they bought a Benelli. That’s because a combat shotgun has to function the first time, every time. The Benelli M4 does it for the U.S. military, and now can be the centerpiece of your own home defense plan.

11 posted on 12/28/2008 6:20:32 PM PST by Milhous (Do unto others as you would have others do unto you.)
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To: GusBreacher
I have not seen an auto loader I like better than my old Browning A-5 .
12 posted on 12/28/2008 6:21:41 PM PST by kbennkc (For those who have fought for it freedom has a flavor the protected will never know F/8 Cav)
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To: Milhous

Whats MSRP on that one.


13 posted on 12/28/2008 6:24:06 PM PST by omega4179 (Ramos and Compean)
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To: GusBreacher

Saiga-12....research it. Semi-auto, box magazine or 20-round drum fed. Check out the Tromix website or Saiga-12 com. It’s an AK -47 shot gun. Nothing better for home protection!


14 posted on 12/28/2008 6:25:05 PM PST by woofer2425 (You will all be using Macs within 10 years)
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To: GusBreacher

I understand the desire for a semi auto, but for practial application, a nice pump works just fine. You can get a decent one plus the extras for well under $300, and for less than a full scale military op, it will serve you just as well.

Bonus: That sound of loading a round is truly chilling to a perp. They will run away just from hearing it. Trust me on this, I’ve been there.


15 posted on 12/28/2008 6:25:14 PM PST by piytar
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To: GusBreacher

Kel tec RFB Carbine 308 bullpup

Mossberg 590A1 shotgun

Mossberg bullpup shotgun

and if you can find one :

Remington 300 Automatic Shotgun


16 posted on 12/28/2008 6:26:10 PM PST by hamburglar (Do Unto Obama As Liberals Did Unto Bush)
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To: do the dhue
Interesting video. It has a "logo" all over it that says "Law enforcement and military sales only".

I guess my question is that if you have bought and paid for a "full auto" license for a true auto fire weapon, would it allow the ownership of this type of shotgun as well?

Thanks.

17 posted on 12/28/2008 6:26:15 PM PST by willgolfforfood
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To: GusBreacher

In a non-tactical shotgun, the Berette A390 or A391 is VERY difficult to beat. It is a gas-operated gun, but the gas system is pud-easy to clean. There are four parts, and they’re all big. Price should be $700 or thereabouts new. 3 shot mag, one in the pipe is plenty for most hunting purposes. They’re utterly reliable.

Benelli recoil-operated shotguns impress me, especially their most recent models. No gas system means that you can mount a mag extension tube on them. These are going to set you back about $1100 new, so look around pawnshops and gun dealers for used ones.

Both of these Italian scatterguns can take 3” magnum rounds. You don’t need 3.5” mags any more with the newer heavy non-lead shot when hunting.

Browning gas-operated semi’s have lots of fiddly little springs and valving balls in their gas system. Don’t like them.

I have several friends with Charles Daly guns; these are simply no reliable and they need a lot of TLC and cleaning. Give these a miss.

The older Remington and Winchester semi-autos are OK, and rather inexpensive, but they require more cleaning and TLC than the Italian guns.


18 posted on 12/28/2008 6:27:35 PM PST by NVDave
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To: piytar

I have a Winchester 1300, 8 shot pump. Pretty sweet. I think I paid 350 for it.


19 posted on 12/28/2008 6:29:55 PM PST by y6162 (ater)
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To: willgolfforfood

“I guess my question is that if you have bought and paid for a “full auto” license for a true auto fire weapon, would it allow the ownership of this type of shotgun as well? “

Only if it was made before 1986.


20 posted on 12/28/2008 6:30:31 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: do the dhue

Isn’t that aa-12 going to need a tax stamp etc? about 5-6mos of waiting time? and jan 20th is only weeks away. (shiver) I need to get something quickly, plus 500 rounds to feed it.


21 posted on 12/28/2008 6:32:30 PM PST by GusBreacher
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To: willgolfforfood
I don't think you could get the a12, but I do believe you could buy the aa12.

The a12 is a lot more compact then the aa12 is.

22 posted on 12/28/2008 6:32:39 PM PST by do the dhue (They've got us surrounded again. The poor bastards. - One of General Abram's men)
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To: Mogwai

Another vote for the Saiga.


23 posted on 12/28/2008 6:33:20 PM PST by ChuteTheMall (Tagline: If you're reading this, I'm influencing your mind.)
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To: GusBreacher; willgolfforfood

I jsut saw were, we the people can’t buy the aa-12 unless we have a class 3 dealers license.

I guess the guvment doesn’t trust we the people.


24 posted on 12/28/2008 6:36:51 PM PST by do the dhue (They've got us surrounded again. The poor bastards. - One of General Abram's men)
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To: GusBreacher

I think any of the ones made by the major manufacturers would be good.

I personally would not recommend the Benelli. I had an M1 Super 90 which was beautifully made and looked really wicked. The problem was it was the worst kicking shotgun I have ever fired, even worse than a lightweight single barrel. They are incredibly reliable tho.

For some reason that short recoil system seems to magnify recoil. The advantage is it is incredibly clean, since no gas is bled off to operate the action.


25 posted on 12/28/2008 6:36:54 PM PST by yarddog
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To: GusBreacher; willgolfforfood

Dealers can buy them to sell to Law Enforcement only.


26 posted on 12/28/2008 6:37:55 PM PST by do the dhue (They've got us surrounded again. The poor bastards. - One of General Abram's men)
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To: GusBreacher
Remington 1187 Police.


27 posted on 12/28/2008 6:39:05 PM PST by Pistolshot ("Democrats don't show respect, they just demand respect " - ClearCase_guy)
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To: Milhous

$1600 for a neutered 6 shot version-barf


28 posted on 12/28/2008 6:40:33 PM PST by omega4179 (Ramos and Compean)
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To: GusBreacher

Mossberg 930 SPX.


29 posted on 12/28/2008 6:40:43 PM PST by SVTCobra03 (You can never have enough friends, horsepower or ammunition.)
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To: omega4179
Looks like America's tactical weapon shortage caused a budget busting price hike. :( This guy's asking $2000 for a supposedly slightly used M4 with options.
30 posted on 12/28/2008 6:40:48 PM PST by Milhous (Do unto others as you would have others do unto you.)
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To: ChuteTheMall

Saiga 12 is the most bang for the buck compared to the italian masterpieces.


31 posted on 12/28/2008 6:42:02 PM PST by omega4179 (Ramos and Compean)
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To: omega4179
"The brands to look at are Benelli, Beretta and Remington."

Benelli is king of the automatic combat type shotguns. For a pump, I'd go with the tried and true, inexpensive Mossberg 500. I love'em.

32 posted on 12/28/2008 6:42:52 PM PST by KoRn
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To: GusBreacher
The Benelli semi-autos have what they call an 'inertial' action which means a more sophisticated sort of a blow-back mechanism which actually locks, but it cannot shoot the lighter kinds of skeet shells reliably. My own preference is the Beretta Xtrema-II which involves a very sophisticated gas mechanism with a heavy spring, a bypass valve, and a piston RING if you can believe that; they claim it's self cleaning and it isn't much of a lie: cleaning the piston and the chamber it moves in is a ten second deal and you still have to clean the barrel. It's ungodly strong and can shoot 3.5" shells if you want to.

On Gunbroker


33 posted on 12/28/2008 6:45:44 PM PST by wendy1946
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To: GusBreacher
including sight...

You don't use sights on a shotgun. Nobody does. Using shotguns properly is a pure hand-eye deal like tennis or baseball: if you ever tried to watch any part of a tennis racquet or baseball bat while using it you'd never hit anything with it. With shotguns, you watch the target 100% and the gun zero percent.

34 posted on 12/28/2008 6:49:56 PM PST by wendy1946
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To: GusBreacher
http://www.auctionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?itemnum=8939162

Saiga AK-47 12 Gauge 19” BBL Semi Auto Carbine $595 new

35 posted on 12/28/2008 6:55:37 PM PST by HuntsvilleTxVeteran (Obama, Change America will die for.)
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To: wendy1946

I like my Winchester Model 1300 defender. It’s great.

Affordable, dependable, up to 3 inch shells if you want them.

Don’t get too fancy with your shotguns; they are such devastating weapons and have such a proven technology that the choice really is what type of action do you want.

Choose pump, and practice, IMHO.


36 posted on 12/28/2008 6:56:40 PM PST by mountaineer1997
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To: GusBreacher

What is the intended use of the gun?

The Benelli is the top of the heap right now. It benifits from improvements in materials and design over many of the other offerings available today.

But, even though the Benelli’s design is 100 years newer than the Browning A5, it is doubtful you could tell a difference in the operation and handling of the two guns.

Very few autoloader shotties have the speed-feed feature found on the A5. I am not sure the Benellis will do it, and that would be a deal breaker for me.


37 posted on 12/28/2008 6:56:43 PM PST by wrench
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To: GusBreacher

The way you worded that may get you a visit


38 posted on 12/28/2008 6:58:55 PM PST by al baby (Hi mom Mr. Obama, are you aware that Sarah Palin took on her own party’s establishment in Alaska a)
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To: wendy1946
With shotguns, you watch the target 100% and the gun zero percent.

Then what's the bead for?

39 posted on 12/28/2008 6:59:51 PM PST by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: DuncanWaring

Shooting fowl at a distance not blowing a bad guy up across you living room


40 posted on 12/28/2008 7:02:11 PM PST by al baby (Hi mom Mr. Obama, are you aware that Sarah Palin took on her own party’s establishment in Alaska a)
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To: al baby

Actually even shooting bad guys at close range requires you to actually point the shotgun right at the target not just in the general vicinity. While it is not necessary to aim to the degree of a rifle, you do look down the barrel, using that bead.


41 posted on 12/28/2008 7:06:15 PM PST by yarddog
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To: omega4179

We have had a few Brownings and have loved them. 12 gauge Slug guns for deer hunting, one that shot 3 1/2 inch shells for Turkey and a 20 gauge upland. All have worked flawlessly with cheap and high quality shells.


42 posted on 12/28/2008 7:07:06 PM PST by Scotswife
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To: GusBreacher
Why limit yourself to auto's? Have you looked at pumps? I think the military also uses the Mossberg 500 12ga pump, Just FYI. WAY cheaper and will never let you down.

With auto's, you have to find the ammo the the gun likes. I prefer to choose what I like!

12ga pumps eat what they are given, bird shot or buck, no complaints. If it short cycles, its operator malfunction!

Remington 870 or Mossberg 500, take you pick.

43 posted on 12/28/2008 7:08:48 PM PST by MrPiper
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To: wendy1946

I use the sights all the time with my shotgun but then again, I’m not using it like you do. I’m not shooting trap or skeet. I’m shooting targets in an IDPA manner with a ghost ring.

The next competitor complained I was taking too long to shoot my Mossberg 500 pump. I averaged about 11 seconds for twelve targets.

He missed. I didn’t.

I have to admit, I wish I had an autoloader. I can’t imagine how fast I could be without pumping the next round.


44 posted on 12/28/2008 7:09:33 PM PST by Shooter 2.5 (NRA - Vote against the dem party)
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To: yarddog

I live in a small condo


45 posted on 12/28/2008 7:12:33 PM PST by al baby (Hi mom Mr. Obama, are you aware that Sarah Palin took on her own party’s establishment in Alaska a)
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To: GusBreacher

Moosberg 500 Tactical


46 posted on 12/28/2008 7:17:52 PM PST by Mad_Tom_Rackham (The committed will surely dominate the complacent.)
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To: DuncanWaring

good question and dot sights are coming on a bit in popularity for shotguns also. mine are all beads but I am going to try out a dot soon.


47 posted on 12/28/2008 7:18:34 PM PST by bobby.223
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To: GusBreacher
A poem:

Five Hunnerd Dollars and a Pump Shotgun by Dennis Dezendorf

It's all a tale of living, of what a man can be. I'll pass it on from my life, so maybe you can see. There's very few things that can't get done With five hunnerd dollars and a pump shotgun.

It's been passed on to me, from father to the kid. Sometimes you have to stand tall, sometimes you best be hid. But a man can always stand tall, he never has to run With five hunnerd dollars and a pump shotgun.

There's times when life is fearful, there's times that aren't so good. When a man does what he has to, when he does just what he should. But he can keep his house warm, his place there in the sun With five hunnerd dollars and a pump shotgun.

One night the prisoners broke out, a few had rushed the gate. And Daddy heard that they were coming, heading down the interstate. But they didn't stop at our house, they continued on the run Cause Dad was on the front porch with a pump shotgun.

Sometimes my Dad worked overtime, sometimes from out of state My Momma didn't worry when the old man got in late She knew where Daddy kept them, could grab them on the run She had five hunnerd dollars and a pump shotgun.

It didn't matter what the trouble, didn't matter what the cause, If a kid got sick or the roof blew off, it didn't give her pause. If a wolf got in the chickens, just trying to have some fun, Mom would greet him warmly with a pump shotgun.

And when I started my house, with a baby on the way Dad came by one evening, said what he had to say "Remember all your lessons, and do what must be done. Here's five hunnerd dollars and a pump shotgun."

48 posted on 12/28/2008 7:18:38 PM PST by MrPiper
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To: mountaineer1997

To my thinking you really don’t want to be shooting goose shells with any kind of a solid lockup gun.


49 posted on 12/28/2008 7:19:11 PM PST by wendy1946
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To: GusBreacher
just squeeze the trigger and keep pumping...

50 posted on 12/28/2008 7:19:20 PM PST by Chode (American Hedonist -)
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