Skip to comments.Time to settle on one green path
Posted on 04/07/2009 9:54:34 AM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach
We need better policies and plans -- now. Everyone agreed, from the chief executive of Duke Energy Corp. and the head of the Environmental Protection Agency to the leader of the Evangelical Environmental Network. We're not energy-efficient and the challenges of becoming so are bold and grave.
We need to produce somewhere between 28 and 35 terawatts of energy by 2050 to power our growing population and consumption. How are we going to nearly triple our source of energy in less than 50 years?
(Excerpt) Read more at marketwatch.com ...
These are self-righteous jerks with an urge to power. Power to make YOU, one of those who doesn’t see the world through their particular set of beer goggles, relent his ignorance and cussed stubbornness and TOE THE LINE. And these guys don’t have the slightest sense of humor.
They are hard after the power of law, since they know they can’t manage with just the power of persuasion.
ineffective ways to address climate change.
Those terms are 100% in conflict.
>> Daniel Nocera, a Massachusetts Institute of Technology professor and director of its Solar Revolutions Project, points out... We could build a nuclear plant every 1.5 days for eternity, and even that wouldn’t be enough to satisfy our energy needs, according to Nocera.
I searched the web page source. That is the only time the word “nuclear” appears, and the statement is such patent bullcorn that I’m shocked it’s coming from the mouth of a grade school teacher, let alone an MIT professor.
Thomas Kostigen is the author of You Are Here: Exposing the Vital Link Between What We Do and What That Does to Our Planet and the coauthor of the New York Times bestseller The Green Book. He writes the "Ethics Monitor" column for Dow Jones Market Watch and the Better Planet column and blog for Discover magazine. He is a longtime journalist and former Bloomberg News editor. Kostigen has been writing about global warming, the environment, social issues, and government policies for two decades. He lives in Santa Monica, California.
The One and Only True Green Path: Nukes.
Compact. Reliable. Renewable.
Check the stock holdings on these A***h***...
>> Nuclear Power.
The utter failure of the greens to embrace nuclear power is all the evidence you’ll ever need that their agenda is not really about energy independence or about climate change or about “saving the planet”.
It’s 100% about subjugating the US and transferring wealth to the UN.
Most greens are too stupid to have an agenda. The girls are there because it “feels good.” The guys are there because the girls are easy.
Its the Green leadership that’s Evil. And the more you look at them, read what they write, observe what they do, the more you realize it. And its not little “evil” its big “Evil.” They’re as Evil as the Committee for Public Safety was during the Terror. They intend to reduce the number of people to a “sustainable” level.
Bottom line: We are wasting a lot of time, money and effort worrying about climate change, period.
We could solve a whole range of real problems by rounding up the enviro-whackos, and grinding them up for dogfood, fertilizer, and cement additive.
“harness the sun” Ummm, will a troika do or will it require a four-in-hand.
I'll have to give my solar array a test tonight to see how it works in the dark.
Down in the Sunshine State, Florida Power and Light has an uprating program going on that will add about 400 MW of nuclear capacity for a cost of about $1.5 billion. They are also adding 75 MW peak (18 MW average) solar thermal power capacity (this is the Sunshine State after all) for a cost of $476 million.
I will leave it as an “exercise for the student” to run the numbers and tell us which one makes more sense.
Dateline "Santa Monica" for a Colorado meeting.
Pretty appropriate as the Communists who infested California in the 1940s and 50s are still alive and well.
Maybe some products worth buying? Offer stuff to get my power bill down and I'll buy.
SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) -- Shares of Applied Materials Inc. tumbled Tuesday after the chip-tools maker drastically slashed the value of a major solar-power deal as a result of the global market slump.
a $1.9 billion agreement to supply solar-power equipment to an unnamed customer has been cut to roughly $250 million as a result of the economic downturn.
meanwhile we have this clown:
And he wants to use only Solar...nothing else.....
Sure would like to know who canceled the order.
Posted date: 2/11/2009
By DEBORAH CROWE
Southern California Edison said Wednesday it signed contracts with Google-backed start-up BrightSource Energy for the supply of 1,300 megawatts of clean solar thermal power. The companies claim the agreement is the world's largest solar deal.
Southern California Edison, a unit of Rosemead-based Edison International, said the 20-year deal calls for Oakland-based BrightSource to build and place in commercial operation seven projects. The deal will require approval from the California Public Utilities Commission.
The agreements are part of Edisons effort to comply with a state mandate to fight global warming by requiring utilities to produce 20 percent of their power from renewable sources such as wind and solar by 2010. SoCal Edison said this agreement combined with earlier deals will more than meet the mandate.
These contracts represent a significant addition to our renewable portfolio, which is already the nations largest, Stuart Hemphill, SoCal Edison vice president for Renewable and Alternative Power, said in a statement. This innovative solar technology helps to further our position as the nations largest purchaser of solar energy, as well.
SoCal Edison claims the full 1,300 megawatts of projects will produce 3.7 billion kilowatt-hours of clean energy and avoid more than two million tons of carbon dioxide emissions annually the equivalent of removing more than 335,000 cars from the road.
The first Edison-BrightSource solar power plants, to located in the Mojave Natural Preserve community of Ivanpah, could be operating in early 2013 and are expected to produce 286,000 megawatt-hours of renewable electricity per year.
photo: Lin via flickr
With the Department of the Interior making a loud and public commitment to developing renewable energy on public lands, some conflict over what land was too ecologically important was bound to happen sooner or later. In this case, sooner. California's Senator Dianne Feinstein has indicated that she will push legislation to make some 500,000 acres of the Mojave Desert into a national monument, preserving it from wind or solar power development:
Solar Power Plants Could Destroy Desert's Ecosystem
The land in question is referred to as the former Catellus lands, and is located in the southeast corner of the state, in between the Mojave National Preserve and Joshua Tree National Park. The push for the federal purchase of the land was led by The Wildlands Conservancy from 1999-2004, which says that solar power projects planned for the land (currently 14) would harm the area's desert tortoise population and "destroy the entire Mojave Desert ecosystem."
So what do TreeHugger readers think? Keeping in mind that we know all of you value protecting wild spaces, what's the best way to balance the imperative to develop large amounts of renewable energy as quickly as possible and preserving intact ecosystems?
BrightSource to Build 500 Megawatts of Solar-Thermal Power in Mojave Desert
1,300 Megawatts of Solar Thermal Power to be Developed in Mojave Desert by BrightSource Energy
850 MW Solar Thermal Power Plant Seeks California State Approval
by Michael Graham Richard, Gatineau, Canada on 04. 2.08
The press release (pdf) is dated April 1st, but this is no joke. Because of California law, PG&E needs to get 20% of its electricity from renewable sources (not including big hydro) by 2010, so it has contracted with Brightsource Energy for 3 new solar-thermal power plants in the Mojave desert, one of the best spots for solar power in the world.
"Solar thermal energy is an especially attractive renewable power source because it is available when needed most in California during the peak mid-day summer period," said Fong Wan, vice president of energy procurement at PG&E. These first three plants will add up to 500 megawatts of capacity, but PG&E has also signed contracts for options on an additional 400 megawatts, which could bring the total to 900 megawatts.
The first of these solar power plants, sized at 100 MW in Ivanpah, California, could be operating as early as 2011 and is expected to produce 246,000 megawatt hours of renewable electricity per year. BrightSource will build and place in commercial operation each of its plants as quickly as permitting and infrastructure allow.
The next two power plants will be 200 megawatts each.
For more on the subject, see ::Solar Thermal Power: Not Forgotten
photo: Ian Munroe via flickr
Here's a seriously gigantic renewable energy project that's moving forward, despite hard economic times: What could well turn out to be Europe's largest wind farm has won approval from regional authorities in Norrbotten, Sweden. Should the Swedish government also grant approval (which could take up to 12 months), construction on the $6.9 billion project could start in two and a half years, and be completed in ten:
by Michael Graham Richard, Gatineau, Canada on 05.28.08
Norway and Wind Power, Sitting in a Tree...
What's the best thing you could buy with oil money right now?
Norway's Oil and Energy Minister, Aaslaug Haga, seems to think that wind turbines is a good bet. The scandinavian country is the 5th biggest exporter of oil in the world, but it also has the longest coastline in Europe and lots of strong wind. A 30-page report vy the Energy Council, comprising business leaders and officials, says: "Norway ought to have access to up to 40 terrawatt hours of renewable energy in 2020-2025, of which about half would come from offshore wind power."
Turning Oil Into Renewable Energy
Sufficient wind parks -- totalling 5,000 to 8,000 megawatts installed capacity -- would cost between 100 billion Norwegian and 220 billion Norwegian crowns ($43.89 billion) assuming prices of 20-28 million crowns per installed megawatt. The energy would be equivalent to up to about eight nuclear power plants.
That's a lot of money, but that's also the value of about half a year's oil output for Norway. It would be kind of a giant offset scheme.
Wind Power Even When the Wind Doesn't Blow
One thing that makes Norway - like Quebec - particularly well suited for wind power is the presence of hydro. When the wind blows, you can slow down the flow of water and accumulate it behind the dams, and when the wind doesn't blow, you can open up the valves. And since Norway has about half of Europe's reservoir capacity, it could keep producing even with long periods without wind (which is fairly rare offshore).
RFK Jr. - advisor, front man
Thousands of mirrors track the sun in two dimensions and reflect the sunlight to a boiler that sits atop a tower. When the concentrated sunlight strikes the boilers pipes, it heats the water inside to 550°C more than 1000° F creating superheated steam at the temperature necessary to achieve the industrys highest operating efficiencies. This high-temperature steam is then piped from the boiler to a standard turbine where electricity is generated. From here, transmission lines carry the power to homes and businesses. Nothing is wasted in this process. In order to conserve precious desert water, the steam is air-cooled and piped back into the system in a closed-loop, environmentally-friendly process.
The LPT 550 heliostats consist of two flat-glass mirrors, a support structure, a pylon and a tracking system. The mirrors are mounted onto the pylon and track the sun in two dimensions, reflecting the sunlight onto a boiler atop a tower.
BrightSources smaller, flat mirrors are more efficient, simpler to manufacture, and cost less to install than parabolic mirrors used in solar troughs. The heliostats are highly accurate and have over 35 years of longevity with practically zero maintenance with the exception of cleaning.
The ability to follow the sun in two dimensions enables the power system to track a greater percentage of the suns energy and achieve a much higher efficiency than other solar thermal technologies. Each heliostat, with a reflecting area of 14.4 m2, is individually installed and controlled with optimization software, resulting in greater flexibility in site configuration, and requiring much less site preparation. The pylons are placed directly into the ground, eliminating the need for concrete pads used with other solar thermal technologies and reducing the systems environmental impact.
The average 100 megawatt BrightSource Energy solar plant will consist of 50,000 heliostats.
I think Pelosi has money into the wind power of T. Boone Pickens....
and now DoE head Salazar wants to build a huge wind farms off the east coast .. but probably not off Cape Cod , of course.
Plus over 1100 separate generators, each of which has to be managed, tied to the grid, and maintained, versus one unit to manage and connect and maintain. Having been in the regional dispatching center for a power company, I know which one the dispatchers would rather manage.
This whole business is beyond crazy. They're spending godawful amounts of time, money, and trouble scraping up a few MW capacity here and there from these minuscule, unreliable, chaotic sources, when the 800 pound gorilla of an answer is right in front of us.
I think it is a money making scheme by certain elites...but now they can’t decide which one to have the taxpayers support.
From "Primer on supercritical steam"
Dr. Martin Alf and John Kern
Siemens Power Generation
"Thermodynamics govern the ultimate performance of Rankine cycles whether they are used in a coal fired steam power plant or the bottoming cycle of a combined cycle plant. In order to increase the efficiency of those cycles, higher pressure and temperature steam conditions are desired. As a result, many coal fired steam plants being built and planned around the world today utilize "supercritical" steam conditions to achieve higher efficiency. To learn about this subject, EL&P spoke to Dr. Martin Alf and John Kern with Siemens Power Generation."
"Typical steam parameters used in sub-critical reheat steam plants are 2400 psi/1000°F/1000°F while modern supercritical units are operating at steam conditions above 3900 psi/1075°F/1110°F. These more advanced steam conditions result in a net plant efficiency of up to 45 percent, which is a 3.5 percent improvement over a subcritical unit. Higher steam conditions yield higher efficiencies, which means that less coal is used to generate the same amount of electricity, compared to a subcritical unit."
Steam power Plants (Rankine cycle), regardless of how the steam is generated (coal, gas, oil, nuclear, or solar), are all limited in there thermal efficiency by the following equation: Efficiency = 1 - (Tc / Ts)
where "Tc" is the absolute temperature of the low temperature "sink" and "Ts" is the absolute temperature of the heat source. This equation is based on a theoretical thermodynamic cycle (Carnot cycle) and represents the maximum thermal efficiency attainable between the temperature limits as noted above. A real world system such as a steam power plant can only approach this value as a theoretical limit.
Lets use the 1000° Fahrenheit which is 1459.67° Rankine for the source and lets assume 200° F or 659.67° Rankine for the sink temperature. The limiting thermal efficiency is then
1 - (659.67/1459.67) or about 55% of the energy being input into the process is available to do useful work, the balance is rejected to the environment. That is the theoretical best you can do with a thermal process 45% of the heat input has to be dumped through cooling towers or water cooled heat exchangers.
So think about that when you are planning the siting of multiple megawatt solar power plants. Something like one half or more of the power collected will have to be rejected to the local environment. I don't think the Mojave desert has a big supply of cooling water so this whole project may turn out to be pie in the sky.
PS We have a dinky couple megawatt coal fired peaking plant just south of us. It has a 24" water pipe running out to lake Michigan to bring in water for the forced draft cooling towers that evaporate 6500 or so gallons of water every hour to cool the condensers. The vapor cloud creates local weather during the winter.
In order to conserve precious desert water, the steam is air-cooled and piped back into the system in a closed-loop, environmentally-friendly process.
There is not a functioning power plant on the face of the earth that currently uses "air cooled"condensers". The only reason I can think of is that they would be enormous and would require forced draft fans that would eat up a large chunk of the generated power. Current coal fired power stations use about 7% to 10% or more of generated power internal to the plant to run the fans and pumps. (Have you ever seen a 12,000 horse power electric motor? It's as big as a suburban house!)
Oh yeah?!? Poopie-head. ;’)
We need better policies and plans -- now.Okay: #1, dump the phony anthropogenic climate change demagoguery into the dustbin of history, and reclassify its advocacy as hate speech, making that a death penalty offense; #2, build the fence along the Mexican border; #3, stop running open irrigation canals across the altiplano; #4, open the north slope and our continental shelf to drilling, and drop all fuel excise taxes except on imports and exports ($10 or $20 a barrel either way); #5, require clean diesel technology on freight haulers and on diesel passenger cars; #6, eliminate the EPA's dozens of different formulations of gasoline and go back to one, but require zero sulfur content; #7, oh, I just want to go to bed now, #7, impose actual fuel economy requirements, instead of the stupid toothless CAFE BS, and eliminate the so-called Clean Air Act; #8, develop the methane gas hydrates on the ocean floor; #9, fund multiple lines of research into development of ambient temperature superconductors for use in the electrical distribution infrastructure (and then some); #10, fund multiple lines of research into development of fusion reactors for power generation (multiple lines, because no one knows how to do it, and it's not unlikely that it's impossible); #11, bore a downhill hole from the Qattara Depression into the Mediterranean, in order to drain off the supposed meltwater rise in the world sealevel (which hasn't risen these past 150 years) and other activities with a view to eventually refoliating the Sahara.
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